Game-Warper's Optimization Challenge #2: Dragonwrought Kobolds are True Dragons

[Bronk]

That's where I stalled.

Y'all want e6. No prob.
Y'all want LA, cool.
Dragon 310 I see get mentioned a lot.

But doing LA changes what can be done with dragon 310.

I was going to compose the clone party idea, but it is too time intensive for me right now, and I refuse to use my phone to compose these threads.

E6 dragon 310? How do y'all feel about that? Flaws or no?

E6 (or even 8 or 10 as was mentioned earlier), 310, sounds great to me.

I'd like to use flaws, or do you mean adding dragon magazine flaws in general?

Is Dragon 310 the theme in itself, or did you have a more specific theme in mind?

[daremetoidareyo]

E6 (or even 8 or 10 as was mentioned earlier), 310, sounds great to me.

I'd like to use flaws, or do you mean adding dragon magazine flaws in general?

Is Dragon 310 the theme in itself, or did you have a more specific theme in mind?

Ua flaws

That was another stumbling block. The whole issue is acfs for mundanes. We could just allow the whole issue. The theme will be; E6 Beatsticks!

[Bronk]

Ua flaws

That was another stumbling block. The whole issue is acfs for mundanes. We could just allow the whole issue. The theme will be; E6 Beatsticks!

That sounds pretty awesome...

[Ripptor]

Sorry, I got behind on here!

I am inclined to agree with bronk on the congenial nature of the rules discussion set up occurred after this particular contest. There is something naturally oppositional to the dispute process. Whereas getting into the deep Wilds of raw discussion with less of a personal bias seems more conducive to deeper discussion.

I'm happy without a dispute process, I'm not here for the points I've had a good amount of judging mistakes on my last two builds that held them back, but I doubt it's been malicious, we just have different levels of experience with the rules. I'm having fun

I'd love to hear some thoughts from the other judges though! Especially if we're looking at a monstrous LA round next... Tauric could be useful there, and it would be great to know in advance how we all feel about it rules-wise... What does the template reading 'LA: Base Humanoid +3' mean? Is the base creature's LA ignored for a flat +3, or did they intend it to mean you keep the LA, and WotC just miscalculated and mistyped?

Actually, on that note, it would be great if more of the submissions were rules-legal... I was hoping for some DM-spiration to throw at my group, but I can't use most of the last two rounds of build ideas due to them being flat-out impossible, even with editing. That said, I'm not sure how to accomplish that... Perhaps the earlier suggestion for some pre-game rules clarification would help? IDK.

It appears that the people want some LA. Do we want an E6 werebeasts round (gestalt any racial hit dice and no la from lycan- or entoma -thrope templates)?

Or do we allow a certain amount of LA, and combine it with something like the martial Monk from dragon magazine, or unarmed swordsage or something?

That's where I stalled.

Y'all want e6. No prob.
Y'all want LA, cool.
Dragon 310 I see get mentioned a lot.

But doing LA changes what can be done with dragon 310.

I was going to compose the clone party idea, but it is too time intensive for me right now, and I refuse to use my phone to compose these threads.

E6 dragon 310? How do y'all feel about that? Flaws or no?

If i'm understanding this correctly...

E6 Gestalt:

• Six levels per track
• 1st track RHD + LA only (capped at 6 total)
• 2nd track classes only
• 10 Epic6 feats, after both tracks are filled
• Secret ingredient is Dragon 310, in it's entirety(?)
• Two flaws from Unearthed Arcana, at no penalty

If so, I'm down! Lets go nuts!

[Bronk]

I'd love to hear some thoughts from the other judges though! Especially if we're looking at a monstrous LA round next... Tauric could be useful there, and it would be great to know in advance how we all feel about it rules-wise... What does the template reading 'LA: Base Humanoid +3' mean? Is the base creature's LA ignored for a flat +3, or did they intend it to mean you keep the LA, and WotC just miscalculated and mistyped?

I know how I feel about it, but who knows, other people might want to use it too... it is fun. Maybe you could post it on the Q&A thread and see what the consensus is over there? If nothing else, it would be interesting to see their reasoning if the question gets picked up.

Spoiler: added edit

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(Edit: After looking at it more from a player's perspective, I'd say RAI it's meant to be LA+0, RAW probably LA+3 due to parsing out each sentence of the poorly worded update booklet separately because of the semicolons, but in both cases you'd still add in LA from both sides along with the RHD.)

That said, I'm not sure how to accomplish that... Perhaps the earlier suggestion for some pre-game rules clarification would help? IDK.

It looks like the iron chef people tend not to do that because they're afraid of their ideas being sniped. I don't know if it would work for us, or if it would just put potential arguments earlier in the thread. It looks like the OP didn't play this round... if they're going to sit out every round, maybe they could act as a DM and make rulings that we'd have to stick to, at least for the competition? (If so, the OP could also make a ruling on the tauric template for the competition..)

If i'm understanding this correctly...

E6 Gestalt:

• Six levels per track
• 1st track RHD + LA only (capped at 6 total)
• 2nd track classes only
• 10 Epic6 feats, after both tracks are filled
• Secret ingredient is Dragon 310, in it's entirety(?)
• Two flaws from Unearthed Arcana, at no penalty

If so, I'm down! Lets go nuts!

Hmm, I'd missed the gestalt bit. Interesting!

[Ripptor]

Oh, I'm also down for waiving the 2 LA on lycanthropy, the RHD is enough!

[daremetoidareyo]

The new comp is up!:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...9#post23580249

Sorry, no LA or RHD for this comp. I want to see what a more table legal dragon 310 can inspire yall to create. I promise that the werebeast competition with the gestalt RHD and free lycanthrope LA will be next time.

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Thank you all for a rousing round of theoretical optimization and discussion!