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    Default Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Circle of the Kami Guardian

    Kami are the ancient spirits of nature, created by the gods as guardians for those parts of nature that could not protect themselves. Immortal and powerful, kami rarely give thought to the tiny, short-lived mortal races. Once in a great while, though, a mortal catches the attention of a powerful kami and gains its favour through providing a service or otherwise honoring the kami.

    The kami, usually a Great Spirit who watches over an entire region of wilderness, bestows upon the mortal a gift disguised as a further service to the kami. He is charged with the lifelong protection of a minor kami spirit and its ward.

    The newly-made wardkeeper is granted amazing power by his Great Spirit patron and their new ward; power enough to protect his ward and empower any allies who may aid him.


    Kami Ward
    At second level you are given a minor kami spirit’s ward to protect. A Kami Ward can be any object made of wood or stone. It can be ornately carved, rough and unfinished, or just an untouched natural object. Its size can vary anywhere between fitting in the palm of your hand to having to strap it to your back to carry. The ward is weightless as long as the person carrying it is considered an ally by the kami, but otherwise weighs as much as an ordinary object of its size and material.

    You have a spiritual connection with your ward and always know its location, even if it’s on another plane. You can perform a ten minute ritual to summon your ward back to you from any distance.

    You gain a second ward with all of the same abilities at sixth level, and a third ward at 10th level. The kami inhabits all of your wards simultaneously.

    Blessed Ward
    Every day at dawn you can ask the kami spirit to grant a blessing on your ward. As long as you have the ward in your possession you gain the benefits of the blessing. You can choose a different blessing every morning. The blessings you can choose from are detailed in the “Kami Blessings” section at the end of this entry.

    You can perform a ten minute ritual to introduce another creature to the kami as your ally, after which they will also benefit from the blessing as long as they are carrying the ward.

    If you have more than one kami ward you can ask the kami to give each ward a blessing. They can grant the same blessing to multiple wards or different blessings to each. No creature can benefit from more than one blessing at a time. If you are carrying more than one ward, you are only affected by the blessing of the first ward you picked up.

    Talisman Magic
    The kami spirits have taught you how to infuse your magic into talismans. Starting at second level, when you prepare your spells in the morning, you can create a number of magical talismans equal to your proficiency bonus. As part of their creation you infuse each of these talismans with a druid spell you prepared of 5th level or lower with a casting time of one action or one bonus action, expending spell slots as though you were casting the spell to do so.

    Any creature holding the talisman thereafter can use an action to activate the spell if the creature has an Intelligence score of at least 6. The spell is cast using your spellcasting ability, targeting the creature that activates the item. If the spell targets more than one creature, the creature that activates the item selects the additional targets. If the spell has an area of effect, it is centered on the item. If the spell’s range is self, it targets the creature that activates the item.

    Talismans lose their magic and their spells are wasted if they are not used before the next time you prepare your spells.

    Spiritual Synthesis
    At sixth level the bond between you and the kami in your ward has grown unbreakable. Once per day as an action you can allow the kami within your ward to fuse with you, granting you great spiritual powers. This fusion lasts for one minute or until you choose to end it and it has the following effects:

    • Your kami wards do not grant blessings to the creatures carrying them and your talismans cannot be activated for the duration
    • You gain the benefits of all of your kami wards’ current blessings
    • You can cast any spell that you had also infused into a talisman the last time you prepared your spells as a bonus action
    • You can speak with animals and plants in the ancient language of forest spirits. At 14th level you can also speak with stones.

    Potent Talismans
    At tenth level you learn how to make your talismans so easy to use that your allies need not be touching them to activate them.

    Your talismans can be placed on an object or creature and then activated as an action by anyone within 60 feet by using a command word that you choose when you create the talisman. The object or creature becomes the talisman’s target.

    If a talisman is attached to an arrow, dagger, or other projectile or thrown weapon, the wielder can activate the talisman as part of an attack with that weapon, as long as the target is within 60 feet. The creature or object that is hit by the attack becomes the spell’s target. If the attack misses the talisman is destroyed and the spell is lost. Attaching a talisman is a bonus action. Only one talisman can be activated this way each turn.

    Final Ward
    By 14th level your protection has allowed the kami within your ward to flourish into a great protector. The kami chooses one acre of forest to be your Final Ward. The forest will be somewhere on the material plane and you do not need to be anywhere near it when the kami chooses it.

    While you are within your Final Ward you can cast Druid Grove at will.

    Once per day as an action you can teleport yourself and up to ten willing creatures within 30 feet to your Final Ward. If you do you will all be returned to the place you teleported from at the start of your next turn.

    You can do this at will by using a longer ritual instead. If you perform a ten minute ritual you are returned after one hour. If you spend one hour on the ritual you will return in 12 hours. If you perform the ritual for 24 hours you will be returned after a week.

    Kami Blessings
    Touch of the Kitsune Your shadow is fox-shaped. Your movement speed increases by five feet and you can add your proficiency bonus to initiative checks

    Blessing of Supernatural Skill Choose a skill. You are considered proficient in that skill. If you are already proficient, you can add double your proficiency bonus to checks with that skill.

    Touch of the Yukki Onna Your skin gains a bluish tint. You are resistant to cold damage and when this blessing is chosen you gain the effects of an Armor of Agathys spell cast with a duration of 24 hours. The level of the spell is equal to the highest level spell the owner of the ward can cast up to a maximum of 5th level.

    Blessing of the Hidden Self Your face is shrouded in shadow, even when standing in direct light. You can attempt to hide even when creatures you are trying to hide from are aware of you and you are in plain sight. You become invisible until the end of your turn to any creature whose perception check does not beat your stealth check. You must end your turn out of sight or in dark shadows to remain hidden.

    Blessing of the Powerful Mind You can add 1d4 to Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma based checks and saving throws.

    Blessing of Kami Sight Your eyes are a scintillating green. You can cast Detect Good and Evil and Detect Magic as 1st level spells at will and you always know if an object or area you see is a Kami Ward.

    Blessing of Focused Fury Choose a creature type. Your attacks deal an additional 1d4 damage against creatures of that type. The damage is of the same type the weapon normally deals.

    Touch of the Shinigami
    Your complexion grows pale. You have advantage on death saving throws and when you kill a creature that is not undead or a construct you gain temporary hit points equal to the creature’s challenge rating, with a minimum of 1.

    Touch of the Kama-Itachi You grow claws. Your unarmed strikes deal slashing damage equal to 1d6 + your strength modifier. If your unarmed strikes already deal more than 1d6 damage, you can instead add 1d6 slashing damage to one unarmed attack you make per turn.

    Touch of the Kappa Your hair is constantly wet. You can breathe underwater and gain a swim speed equal to your movement speed. You have advantage on Strength and Dexterity saving throws while completely submerged in water.
    Last edited by The Cats; 2018-12-19 at 05:17 PM.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Final Ward
    By 14th level your protection has allowed the kami within your ward to flourish into a great protector. The kami chooses one acre of forest to be your Final Ward. The forest will be somewhere on the material plane and you do not need to be anywhere near it when the kami chooses it.

    While you are within your Final Ward you can cast Druid Grove at will.

    Once per day as an action you can teleport yourself and up to ten willing creatures within 30 feet to your Final Ward. If you do you will all be returned to the place you teleported from at the start of your next turn.

    You can do this at will by using a longer ritual instead. If you perform a ten minute ritual you are returned after one hour. If you spend one hour on the ritual you will return in 12 hours. If you perform the ritual for 24 hours you will be returned after a week.
    I would personally connect the Kami with the Fey, and put this in the Feywilds. If having to go to the forest to protect it from some threat was meant to be a feature the location is fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Touch of the Yukki Onna Your skin gains a bluish tint. You are resistant to cold damage and when this blessing is chosen you gain the effects of an Armor of Agathys spell cast with a duration of 24 hours. The level of the spell is equal to the highest level spell the owner of the ward can cast.
    9th level Armor of Agythys at no other cost seems a bit strong.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Blessing of Kami Sight Your eyes are a scintillating green. You gain the benefits of constant Detect Good and Evil and Detect Magic spells and you always know if an object or area you see is a Kami Ward.
    Maybe break this into two blessings, each of which grants one of those spells at will and always allows you to see if an object or area is a Kami Ward?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Touch of the Shinigami Your complexion grows pale. You automatically succeed on death saving throws and when you kill a creature that is not undead or a construct you gain temporary hit points equal to the creature’s challenge rating.
    Considering the number of DMs that stop attacking players once they're unconscious, maybe only grant advantage on death saving throws? Its a similar effect, but it's still possible for you to die that way.

    You should probably also specify the minimum number of temporary hit points you get.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    I would personally connect the Kami with the Fey, and put this in the Feywilds. If having to go to the forest to protect it from some threat was meant to be a feature the location is fine.
    The DM can threaten your Final Ward regardless of which plane its on and travelling to the Feywild comes with a whole slew of issues (DMG p49-50). Also Kami aren't connected to the fey but that matters less than the other reason.


    9th level Armor of Agythys at no other cost seems a bit strong.
    Agreed. Capping it at 5th level. Note that there is always a cost to choosing any blessing: You can't benefit from any of the other blessings.


    Maybe break this into two blessings, each of which grants one of those spells at will and always allows you to see if an object or area is a Kami Ward?
    Why?


    Considering the number of DMs that stop attacking players once they're unconscious, maybe only grant advantage on death saving throws? Its a similar effect, but it's still possible for you to die that way.

    You should probably also specify the minimum number of temporary hit points you get.
    Stating minimum temp HP is a good idea.

    Keep in mind the kami blessings are the primary feature of this class. They are supposed to be on-par with Balm of the Summer Court, Natural Recovery, Combat Wildshape and Spirit Totems.

    They are powerful abilities that remain useful through all tiers of play and gain power as you level up (though in this case it's more 'distributing power' rather than gaining it).
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    The DM can threaten your Final Ward regardless of which plane its on and travelling to the Feywild comes with a whole slew of issues (DMG p49-50). Also Kami aren't connected to the fey but that matters less than the other reason.
    My thought was to tie them into existing 5e creature types, with the closest match being fey. Both being supernatural creatures tied to specific areas, creatures, places, and/or objects that commonly (but not necessarily) have a connection with nature.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Agreed. Capping it at 5th level. Note that there is always a cost to choosing any blessing: You can't benefit from any of the other blessings.
    When I wrote "no other cost," I probably should have been more explicit; I was thinking the original version would be fine if you added some other cost. I wasn't sure what other cost would work, so maxing it out there should be fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Why?
    I was initially thinking that it's stronger than similar abilities, as it grants you the effects of two concentration spells. On second thought, it might be more reasonable to let you cast both spells at will, instead of only being able to put one on a ward.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Keep in mind the kami blessings are the primary feature of this class. They are supposed to be on-par with Balm of the Summer Court, Natural Recovery, Combat Wildshape and Spirit Totems.

    They are powerful abilities that remain useful through all tiers of play and gain power as you level up (though in this case it's more 'distributing power' rather than gaining it).
    "If you drop to zero hitpoints and are left alone you automatically stabilize," is is noticeably more powerful. Especially if the DM isn't used to attacking unconscious PCs.

    Otherwise you've done a reasonable job keeping the class in line with the other subclasses. I'm not sure why talismans can't last until the end of your next long rest (when you'd get your spell slots back), but the class works fine.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    I was initially thinking that it's stronger than similar abilities, as it grants you the effects of two concentration spells. On second thought, it might be more reasonable to let you cast both spells at will, instead of only being able to put one on a ward.
    Yeah, the constant-effect was a bit much.

    "If you drop to zero hitpoints and are left alone you automatically stabilize," is is noticeably more powerful. Especially if the DM isn't used to attacking unconscious PCs.
    I disagree. The end result is saving your allies a single action, assuming they have no healing available, when you fall. If you hit 0 somewhere your allies can't get to you you're still unconscious and helpless for 1d4 hours. Lethality is always up to the DM. If you play with one who never hits when you're down not going to be rolling new characters much, if ever. You're also assuming "DMs never hit players when they're down" is a strong paradigm in the game. Maybe in your experience. Not in general.

    Otherwise you've done a reasonable job keeping the class in line with the other subclasses. I'm not sure why talismans can't last until the end of your next long rest (when you'd get your spell slots back), but the class works fine.
    Y'know, I had a really good reason for doing that but right now I just can't remember what that reason was. I'll change it.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    I disagree. The end result is saving your allies a single action, assuming they have no healing available, when you fall. If you hit 0 somewhere your allies can't get to you you're still unconscious and helpless for 1d4 hours. Lethality is always up to the DM. If you play with one who never hits when you're down not going to be rolling new characters much, if ever. You're also assuming "DMs never hit players when they're down" is a strong paradigm in the game. Maybe in your experience. Not in general.
    I'm not managing to parse this.

    Most relevantly, I'm not sure how any of your examples support your case. You're taking an action with particularly high stakes, and removing the stakes. I can't parse what you're comparing the second example to. And that blessing hamstring's the DM's ability to control lethality.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Y'know, I had a really good reason for doing that but right now I just can't remember what that reason was. I'll change it.
    If you do remember the reason and still find it convincing, please do change it back.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    I'm not managing to parse this.

    Most relevantly, I'm not sure how any of your examples support your case. You're taking an action with particularly high stakes, and removing the stakes. I can't parse what you're comparing the second example to. And that blessing hamstring's the DM's ability to control lethality.
    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you one of your allies must use an action within the next 3-5 turns to stabilize you.

    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore you your allies have to move much faster.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you one of your allies doesn't have to use an action in the next 3-5 turns to stabilize you.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore your allies still have to move much faster.

    If you hit 0 without the blessing away from your allies your chance of living depends on passing the majority of five DC 10 rolls and then whether the DM wants to do something to your unconscious body.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing away from your allies you don't have to worry about the DC 10 rolls but the DM can still do whatever they want with your unconscious body.

    If the DM is ignoring downed characters the stakes aren't particularly high. They have to pass 3/5 DC 10 checks which is statistically probable and takes up to five rounds to complete. If the DM's not ignoring you the stakes remain mostly unchanged. It might let you survive one more round if you would have otherwise been unlucky with your death saves. The blessing takes nothing away from the DM and saves the party a single action within 3-5 turns if the DM ignores you when you hit 0. This is a far cry from over powered.
    Last edited by The Cats; 2018-12-18 at 08:54 AM.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    I quite like a lot of what you have here. The Talismans are a bit situational and the Wards could use more specific descriptions, but it's sound. I do have some issue with the Blessings, as some are far more powerful than others and more powerful than even other class's abilities at the same level doing similar things.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Touch of the Kitsune Your shadow is fox-shaped. Your movement speed increases by five feet and you can add your proficiency bonus to initiative checks

    Blessing of Supernatural Skill Choose a skill. You are considered proficient in that skill. If you are already proficient, you can add double your proficiency bonus to checks with that skill.
    These are good. These are fine. Great job!

    Touch of the Yukki Onna Your skin gains a bluish tint. You are resistant to cold damage and when this blessing is chosen you gain the effects of an Armor of Agathys spell cast with a duration of 24 hours. The level of the spell is equal to the highest level spell the owner of the ward can cast up to a maximum of 5th level.

    Blessing of the Hidden Self Your face is shrouded in shadow, even when standing in direct light. You can attempt to hide even when creatures you are trying to hide from are aware of you and you are in plain sight. You become invisible until the end of your turn to any creature whose perception check does not beat your stealth check. You must end your turn out of sight or in dark shadows to remain hidden.

    Blessing of the Powerful Mind You can add 1d4 to Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma based checks and saving throws.

    Blessing of Kami Sight Your eyes are a scintillating green. You can cast Detect Good and Evil and Detect Magic as 1st level spells at will and you always know if an object or area you see is a Kami Ward.

    Blessing of Focused Fury Choose a creature type. Your attacks deal an additional 1d4 damage against creatures of that type. The damage is of the same type the weapon normally deals.

    Touch of the Shinigami
    Your complexion grows pale. You automatically succeed on death saving throws and when you kill a creature that is not undead or a construct you gain temporary hit points equal to the creature’s challenge rating, with a minimum of 1.
    All of these need another look. Some a lot more than others. Yukki-Onna is....well all I can say is 3 free castings of Armor of Agathys that lasts all day and is up to 5th level in all cases? And I can pass them out like candy to the party? WOOF! OH BOY! A single, regular casting of the spell per blessing (at level 2 if you like) would suffice.

    Hidden Self, or as I like to call it, Ranger's-Vanish-but-much-earlier-and-almost-better. Yeah. A bit much.

    +1d4 to Int, Wis, and Cha saves and CHECKS. If you kept it to saves, it'd be similar to the Paladin's Aura of Protection, which is a bit more balanced. As it stands it's also a Jack-of-All-Trades copy as well.

    Kami Sight is too much. That's the Paladin and Warlock super-sense abilities combined and made permanent. Just copying the Paladin's senses or the Warlock's with a small bonus (like a bonus to detecting lies).

    Focused Fury is pretty good. While it's a bit worrying to consider critical hits, overall I've changed my mind since placing it in this blocking. It's fine.

    Shinigami, however, is broken out the gate. Several other good ideas have been floating around the thread for how to fix this. I'd personally allow you Advantage to the first Death Save of the day.

    Touch of the Kama-Itachi You grow claws. Your unarmed strikes deal slashing damage equal to 1d4 + your strength modifier. If your unarmed strikes already deal more than 1d4 damage, you can instead add 1d4 slashing damage to one unarmed attack you make per turn.

    Underwhelming by comparison. Unarmed options are situational as all-get-out. You already get 1d4 Unarmed damage (check errata), so that's not all that good. And everyone who would benefit from this has better ways of getting more attacks and better attacks with weapons.

    Touch of the Kappa Your hair is constantly wet. You can breathe underwater and gain a swim speed equal to your movement speed. You have advantage on Strength and Dexterity saving throws while completely submerged in water.
    This is nice though. It's got an interesting condition to a couple of situational benefits.

    I might be very tired at the moment. So excuse me if I sound rough.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjadeadbeard View Post
    All of these need another look. Some a lot more than others.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats
    Keep in mind the kami blessings are the primary feature of this class. They are supposed to be on-par with Balm of the Summer Court, Natural Recovery, Combat Wildshape and Spirit Totems.

    They are powerful abilities that remain useful through all tiers of play and gain power as you level up (though in this case it's more 'distributing power' rather than gaining it).
    ¸

    Yukki-Onna is....well all I can say is 3 free castings of Armor of Agathys that lasts all day and is up to 5th level in all cases? And I can pass them out like candy to the party? WOOF! OH BOY! A single, regular casting of the spell per blessing (at level 2 if you like) would suffice.
    See above. Also, the entire point of the subclass is being able to boost your party members with abilities they wouldn't otherwise have. Also also:
    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats
    Note that there is always a cost to choosing any blessing: You can't benefit from any of the other blessings.
    Hidden Self, or as I like to call it, Ranger's-Vanish-but-much-earlier-and-almost-better. Yeah. A bit much.
    This is nothing like Vanish.

    +1d4 to Int, Wis, and Cha saves and CHECKS. If you kept it to saves, it'd be similar to the Paladin's Aura of Protection, which is a bit more balanced. As it stands it's also a Jack-of-All-Trades copy as well.
    Aura of protection grants a flat +3-5 (usually) on all saves. Jack of all trades grants +1-3 on all non-proficient checks including initiative and counterspell. A better comparison would be to call this a constant effect Guidance and Resistance that only hits half your saves and a few skills.

    Kami Sight is too much. That's the Paladin and Warlock super-sense abilities combined and made permanent. Just copying the Paladin's senses or the Warlock's with a small bonus (like a bonus to detecting lies).
    Divine sense is a ribbon. Kami Blessings are a primary subclass feature. Warlocks get 2 invocations at second level, increasing to 8. Kami Guardians get 1 blessing at 2nd level up to 3. Also it's been changed to remove the constant-effect.

    Shinigami, however, is broken out the gate. Several other good ideas have been floating around the thread for how to fix this. I'd personally allow you Advantage to the first Death Save of the day.
    I disagree and have already explained my reasoning on this. I think the importance of death saves is being inflated (Failing is a 9/20 chance that you have to make 3 times over 3-5 turns and there are already a ton of abilities that make success a near-guarantee or just let you just not bother with the saves at all tiers of play). I'm not changing it.

    Underwhelming by comparison. Unarmed options are situational as all-get-out. You already get 1d4 Unarmed damage (check errata), so that's not all that good. And everyone who would benefit from this has better ways of getting more attacks and better attacks with weapons.
    I was unaware of the errata. I'll change it.



    A lot of your concerns seem to stem from the idea that these should be comparable to abilities that are markedly weaker than a Druid's primary subclass ability. Please look over them again, keeping in mind what I said in the quote at the top of this post.
    Last edited by The Cats; 2018-12-19 at 09:50 AM.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjadeadbeard View Post
    Underwhelming by comparison. Unarmed options are situational as all-get-out. You already get 1d4 Unarmed damage (check errata), so that's not all that good. And everyone who would benefit from this has better ways of getting more attacks and better attacks with weapons.
    When did errata ever give 1d4 unarmed strikes? Last I recall, the only errata made it so all creatures are proficient in their strikes, and they're not on the weapons table.

    I also just checked the latest 2018 errata, and couldn't find anything talking about 1d4 unarmed strikes.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbando View Post
    When did errata ever give 1d4 unarmed strikes? Last I recall, the only errata made it so all creatures are proficient in their strikes, and they're not on the weapons table.

    I also just checked the latest 2018 errata, and couldn't find anything talking about 1d4 unarmed strikes.
    :0 note to self: don't believe everything you read on GITP forums. Still think I'll keep it at 1d6 though. Feels ok.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjadeadbeard View Post
    All of these need another look. Some a lot more than others. Yukki-Onna is....well all I can say is 3 free castings of Armor of Agathys that lasts all day and is up to 5th level in all cases? And I can pass them out like candy to the party? WOOF! OH BOY! A single, regular casting of the spell per blessing (at level 2 if you like) would suffice.
    Armor of Agathys has two conditions that end it; timing out and running out of temporary hitpoints. Particularly that it's a single casting at a set time, I think running out of temporary hitpoints is fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjadeadbeard View Post
    Shinigami, however, is broken out the gate. Several other good ideas have been floating around the thread for how to fix this. I'd personally allow you Advantage to the first Death Save of the day.
    I'm not sure this needs to be weakened that much.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    Divine sense is a ribbon. Kami Blessings are a primary subclass feature. Warlocks get 2 invocations at second level, increasing to 8. Kami Guardians get 1 blessing at 2nd level up to 3. Also it's been changed to remove the constant-effect.
    Removing the constant effect reduces it to matching the Warlock and Paladin. It's still on the stronger side for a subclass feature, which is why my initial suggestion was to weaken it further.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you one of your allies must use an action within the next 3-5 turns to stabilize you.

    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore you your allies have to move much faster.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you one of your allies doesn't have to use an action in the next 3-5 turns to stabilize you.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore your allies still have to move much faster.

    If you hit 0 without the blessing away from your allies your chance of living depends on passing the majority of five DC 10 rolls and then whether the DM wants to do something to your unconscious body.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing away from your allies you don't have to worry about the DC 10 rolls but the DM can still do whatever they want with your unconscious body.

    If the DM is ignoring downed characters the stakes aren't particularly high. They have to pass 3/5 DC 10 checks which is statistically probable and takes up to five rounds to complete. If the DM's not ignoring you the stakes remain mostly unchanged. It might let you survive one more round if you would have otherwise been unlucky with your death saves. The blessing takes nothing away from the DM and saves the party a single action within 3-5 turns if the DM ignores you when you hit 0. This is a far cry from over powered.
    I'm going to repeat you, looking at the experiential difference:

    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you then tension of the fight skyrockets

    If you hit 0 without the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore you the tension skyrockets even higher.

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM ignores you tension remains where it was (ie. there's no increase).

    If you hit 0 with the blessing near your allies and the DM doesn't ignore you the tension still skyrockets about as much.

    If you hit 0 without the blessing away from your allies there's a period of high tension after which your survival is up to DM fiat (which in some cases reasonably results in death).

    If you hit 0 with the blessing away from your allies there's no tension, because it's entirely up to DM fiat.

    Experientially, this is extremely strong, on account of how may actions it saves while party members are down. This isn't saving an action while the party is on an eight hour hike. This is an action while someone is unstable at zero hitpoints, without even having to spend a resource.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    I disagree and have already explained my reasoning on this. I think the importance of death saves is being inflated (Failing is a 9/20 chance that you have to make 3 times over 3-5 turns and there are already a ton of abilities that make success a near-guarantee or just let you just not bother with the saves at all tiers of play). I'm not changing it.
    Healing word uses spell slots. The Celestial Patron's and Circle of Dream's bonus healing are limited use. These abilities merely trade using an action for a bonus action. Spare the Dying only guarantees the action will stabilize the target. Relentless Endurance only works once a long rest.

    I really want to know what abilities you're looking at.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    Removing the constant effect reduces it to matching the Warlock and Paladin. It's still on the stronger side for a subclass feature, which is why my initial suggestion was to weaken it further.
    It is powerful, but it's also pretty situational. There are other blessing that are more useful in more (and more dangerous) situations so I'm ok with it being on the strong side.


    I'm going to repeat you, looking at the experiential difference: >snip<
    This is a very good argument. Besides the mechanical effect of death saves (which I still hold are not that important) the psychological effect is more powerful than I was considering. With this in mind, and since having advantage on DC10 checks is still pretty close to saying you automatically stabilize while keeping the dice roll, I'll change the blessing to your suggestion.

    Healing word uses spell slots. The Celestial Patron's and Circle of Dream's bonus healing are limited use. These abilities merely trade using an action for a bonus action. Spare the Dying only guarantees the action will stabilize the target. Relentless Endurance only works once a long rest.

    I really want to know what abilities you're looking at.
    They're all limited use, but how often are your players falling to 0?

    Besides what you mentioned:
    Orc's racial ability, Bear totem and Circle of moon granting enough effective HP that hitting 0 is much less likely, Zealots not caring about death and eventually not KOing when they hit 0, Periapt of Wound Closure, Bless ups the success chance (which is already 55%) by __ percent, as does bardic inspiration, as does paladin's aura or anything else that lets you add things to saves. Probably more, these are without digging through the books.

    So I'll concede that, if your party has no access to a few of the above abilities, and your Druid doesn't prepare any healing spells or has no slots left, and no one in your party can make a DC10 medicine check, then yes, death saves are mechanically intimidating if you get unlucky 3/5 times and Touch of the Shinigami is very powerful.

    (I'm being flippant but I just conceded a point I've been ranting against all week so just let me have this ok)
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cats View Post
    (I'm being flippant but I just conceded a point I've been ranting against all week so just let me have this ok)
    That's fair; I'll skip the nitpicking.
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    Default Re: Circle of the Kami Guardian (Druid subclass)

    XD what a pal.
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