The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #451
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    Re: armor, I hope at the very least they take a page out of ESO's book and make clothing 'light' armor, because as it is I never wear plain clothes even on my casters - it doesn't raise any of my skills.
    But you can enchant clothing in Skyrim, iirc. Can't you?

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Personally, i'd like to see some of the complexity added back into the game. If im a wizard, let me charm people into liking me, or even mind control them to make them outright my minion if im good enough at magic. If im a martial, give me more equipment options than just light and heavy armor and one and two handed weapons. Let me wear a breastplate over leather, make it harder to be stealthy in glass armor, interesting things like that.
    That's actually another thing I like about Kingdom Come, is that it does just what you've described. All told, I think there are twenty different equip slots, EG, your chest can afford an undershirt, a gambeson, a chainmail hauberk, plate, and a surcoat. Each affect both armor, visibility, noticability, noise, and charisma. For example, a black surcoat might protect just as much as a cloth waffenrock, but be much less likely to draw attention than a bright yellow-check hood.

    I still refuse to wear combat jupons, though, because it's very difficult to make a quilted T-shirt work with a gold-gilt chestplate, and a e s t h e t i c is as important to me as functionality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kesnit View Post
    This only works if the journal is worth a Septum. One reason I cannot play Morrowind is that the journal is horrible. "Go out of town and look for this thing." Yeah, not helpful. Or worse, "look for the thing east of town" (the thing is to the west). Given that the people making ES VI are the same ones who made Morrowind, I hope they don't go back to a journal-based system.
    The combination of journal+map marker is surprisingly effective. Having the journal allows for some more detail beyond your current objective--why am I getting these fire salts, and who sent me to get them?--and the map marker means that there's less faff about exact directions. F'r'example, one of the main quests in KCD sends you to scout out a massive bandit base; you can follow the directions of your informant and manage to get there, but the game also paints out an area waypoint on your map, which makes it much easier.
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  3. - Top - End - #453
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    My personal preference for map markers is to take you to a wide area, then have the journal guide you to the specific thing you need until youre within like 10 feet of it.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    But you can enchant clothing in Skyrim, iirc. Can't you?
    Yes but I can enchant armor too, and the armor raises my light or heavy armor skill when I get hit.

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    Yes but I can enchant armor too, and the armor raises my light or heavy armor skill when I get hit.
    That's true, but if your build doesn't need armor skills, then you don't really gain anything by getting increases in the skill. Dragonhide will get you to the armor cap just fine, and the alteration perk tree's got some pretty neat stuff in it.

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    That's true, but if your build doesn't need armor skills, then you don't really gain anything by getting increases in the skill. Dragonhide will get you to the armor cap just fine, and the alteration perk tree's got some pretty neat stuff in it.
    This is why I would like to see more effects attached to armor than just bringing you to the armor cap. Leather for stealth, elven or glass for adding in magic, dwarven for elemental resistance, stuff like that. Make it more than just a cosmetic choice or an automatic improvement.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    This is why I would like to see more effects attached to armor than just bringing you to the armor cap. Leather for stealth, elven or glass for adding in magic, dwarven for elemental resistance, stuff like that. Make it more than just a cosmetic choice or an automatic improvement.
    I remember one of the older Skyrim mods--not sure whether it was SkyRE or PerMa--had that effect, albeit in only a minor capacity. And I actually disliked it, which is weird considering what I've just said about KCD.

    Honestly, there's part of me that likes that the armor bonus for each set can reach the same effectiveness. It means that I'm free to dress myself however I please without needing to worry, "Dragonscale is objectively best for protection, but Orcish is ~pretty~."
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    This is why I would like to see more effects attached to armor than just bringing you to the armor cap. Leather for stealth, elven or glass for adding in magic, dwarven for elemental resistance, stuff like that. Make it more than just a cosmetic choice or an automatic improvement.
    Quote Originally Posted by Balmas View Post
    I remember one of the older Skyrim mods--not sure whether it was SkyRE or PerMa--had that effect, albeit in only a minor capacity. And I actually disliked it, which is weird considering what I've just said about KCD.

    Honestly, there's part of me that likes that the armor bonus for each set can reach the same effectiveness. It means that I'm free to dress myself however I please without needing to worry, "Dragonscale is objectively best for protection, but Orcish is ~pretty~."

    It pains me to admit it, but I agree with Balmas. :P

    I think it's a net positive that your aesthetics are just that: aesthetics. If you want to wear robes, you can, and you don't, you don't have to. Maybe it's my experience with City of Heroes, but I have always felt that how your character looks should be one of the most personal decisions you make, and in my opinion, the more you're able to personalize your character in a video game, the more attached to that character you can become. If I were designing some immersive game, I'd do transmog on steroids: Your look is up to you, within the context of the rewards you've unlocked/earned.

    Let me put it another way: When was the last time you looked at an action or adventure movie, and anyone paid attention to whether what they were wearing was armor? Typically that only comes up when someone's shirt is torn open, showing a trauma plate underneath (like Zoey channeling Frodo in Firefly).
    Last edited by The_Jackal; 2019-04-30 at 01:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Balmas View Post
    So, in the past few weeks, my life has been consumed with Kingdom Come: Deliverance. "So, why are you posting in the Elder Scrolls thread," you may ask? Well, I think that there are some lessons that the next Elder Scrolls could learn from how Kingdom Come handles navigation?
    There's a lot I liked in KC:D. The quest marker pointing to a general area rather than a specific spot, so you had to hunt around in that area. Buying a decent horse. Stealth that doesn't make you nigh invisible, and combat that always, always feels dangerous, so there really is an incentive to avoid it as far as possible. I was more than 10 hours into the game before I killed my first (human) enemy, and it's possible (there's an Achievement for it) to go all the way through without killing anyone. The lockpicking minigame, the weapon maintenance minigame - I couldn't get the hang of alchemy, but I like that there was a minigame for that too. And archery! My stars, actually hitting someone with an arrow is hard!

    The needs system - sleep and food - I also thought were well handled. (Well, mostly sleep. Food was never a problem, because you're never much more than five minutes' walk from a cooking pot that you can literally just walk up to and help yourself, without anyone minding.)

    And I liked not being a superhero, but just a reasonably average person caught up in events. In the end there is quite a lot of choice in how you complete the game, but you're never really making things happen, just - trying to help them end favourably. It's much, much more convincing - and thus immersive - than this Chosen One nonsense that all Bethesda games have going.

    What I didn't like was the melee combat. It was thrilling to never be sure that you could win (and be reasonably sure that you would definitely lose when faced with more than two opponents, even unarmed) - but the mechanics were a bit too Street Fighter for my liking. Hold the mouse this way, then flick it quickly over there and press... no. Too much like hard work for me.
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  10. - Top - End - #460
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Effectively what you're asking for is content which would only be available to characters which acquire certain skills or abilities. It's definitely doable in a non-voiced/animated affair, since you're effectively just writing some extra dialogue, but in the modern triple-A landscape, that's a very hard sell.
    Witcher 3 has no problem gating off content depending on how you complete certain quests, and neither did earlier Elder Scrolls games (e.g. Morrowind and earlier). If you have enough content, making some of it only accessible to certain characters isn't a problem. That's the real issue here, as we can see from Fallout 4--Bethsoft really can't be bothered to put all that extra content in, so they just make sure what little content there *is* doesn't get gated off for any character.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    That's true, but if your build doesn't need armor skills, then you don't really gain anything by getting increases in the skill. Dragonhide will get you to the armor cap just fine, and the alteration perk tree's got some pretty neat stuff in it.
    Not correct: I get more levels faster, and by extension more Magicka/HP/Stamina, access to higher-level loot sooner, more dangerous dragons to fight, certain quests unlocked faster, etc.

  12. - Top - End - #462
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Thing is... I like being able to not increase those skills. I'm a mighty wizard. I don't need armor. Or I might be a sword and shield fighter who simply eschews armor because I am that dedicated to using my shield.

    On the other hand, the pessimistic side of me figures that it won't matter, we'll get three skills, kill with a sword, kill with a magic, or Stealth Archery, and just have to run forward and hold the kill everything button.
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Balmas View Post
    The combination of journal+map marker is surprisingly effective. Having the journal allows for some more detail beyond your current objective--why am I getting these fire salts, and who sent me to get them?--and the map marker means that there's less faff about exact directions. F'r'example, one of the main quests in KCD sends you to scout out a massive bandit base; you can follow the directions of your informant and manage to get there, but the game also paints out an area waypoint on your map, which makes it much easier.
    Journal + map-marker is fine. Journal and no map-marker? That journal better be VERY detailed and correct. If I have to take a week (or a month) away from a game, I should be able to come back and, by reading the journal, be able to remember what I need to do. (I've never played KCD, so maybe the journal in that game does what I want. I know the journal in Morrowind did not.)
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Morrowind's journal was a bit weird because it separated the direction you were given from the quest journal, as every direction you could get would be given to you in a separate conversation when you clicked the right keyword. Technically, any direction you could get in the game was very precise (except for a particular quest where the directions were wrong), but you needed to ask them directly to people, then had to remember them as you traveled to your destination.

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Resileaf View Post
    Morrowind's journal was a bit weird because it separated the direction you were given from the quest journal, as every direction you could get would be given to you in a separate conversation when you clicked the right keyword. Technically, any direction you could get in the game was very precise (except for a particular quest where the directions were wrong), but you needed to ask them directly to people, then had to remember them as you traveled to your destination.
    And that is the problem. If I have to take a couple of weeks off between playing, I'm not going to remember all the directions I was given for all of the quests. (Esp since they are still vague.)

    I've been looking for a mod that either adds quest markers, or improves the journal in Morrowind, but have had no luck.
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by factotum View Post
    Witcher 3 has no problem gating off content depending on how you complete certain quests, and neither did earlier Elder Scrolls games (e.g. Morrowind and earlier). If you have enough content, making some of it only accessible to certain characters isn't a problem. That's the real issue here, as we can see from Fallout 4--Bethsoft really can't be bothered to put all that extra content in, so they just make sure what little content there *is* doesn't get gated off for any character.
    True, but at risk of playing Devil's advocate, Bethsoft games offer orders of magnitude more customization than The Witcher. In the Witcher, you can play... Geralt of Rivia. Two swords, sort ranged magical spells, you know, that guy. Skyrim has a much wider array of gameplay choices on order for you, and implementing and testing those aren't free. Now I concede that there are players who don't necessarily appreciate that difference, but I do. I don't want to play Andrzej Sapkowski's character. I want to play MINE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    Not correct: I get more levels faster, and by extension more Magicka/HP/Stamina, access to higher-level loot sooner, more dangerous dragons to fight, certain quests unlocked faster, etc.
    False economy. The enemies you fight in the world with you, and you'll kill them faster and easier with a focused build that does more damage, without diffusing your skill ups with other, non-combat skills. In point of fact, I usually find that in builds when I'm using armor, armor almost never gets leveled up, because it's not in my interest to let myself get hit in order to level it up. Whereas if you're running Alteration, you can train it and get rich at the same time, with transmutation. Look, my point isn't that one choice is right or wrong, only that they have trade-offs, and equivalency. Armor perks get you some cool things too, but so does Alteration.

  17. - Top - End - #467
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    I do wish shielding would raise the armor skill along with block.
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    True, but at risk of playing Devil's advocate, Bethsoft games offer orders of magnitude more customization than The Witcher. In the Witcher, you can play... Geralt of Rivia. Two swords, sort ranged magical spells, you know, that guy. Skyrim has a much wider array of gameplay choices on order for you, and implementing and testing those aren't free. Now I concede that there are players who don't necessarily appreciate that difference, but I do. I don't want to play Andrzej Sapkowski's character. I want to play MINE.
    To which I respond, so what? If you want to play a classic knight with no magic or thief abilities, go ahead, but I don't see why you should then expect to be able to see everything. If youre bad at lockpicking, you don't get to open boxes and doors. If youre bad at magic, you have to bribe people or be persuasive to get them to like you. If youre bad at fighting, you need to avoid being hit and facetanking things. Wheres the problem?
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kesnit View Post
    I've been looking for a mod that either adds quest markers, or improves the journal in Morrowind, but have had no luck.
    It's called Tribunal, which adds cross referencing and indexing to the journal. Honestly, at that point I have no difficulty with it at all. There is one instance I'm aware of where the directions are wrong, but even that adds to the experience. (It's happened to me in real life, why should people be infallible in a game?)
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    To which I respond, so what? If you want to play a classic knight with no magic or thief abilities, go ahead, but I don't see why you should then expect to be able to see everything. If youre bad at lockpicking, you don't get to open boxes and doors. If youre bad at magic, you have to bribe people or be persuasive to get them to like you. If youre bad at fighting, you need to avoid being hit and facetanking things. Wheres the problem?
    My point isn't FOMO, I fully appreciate the idea that having those kind of hidden options and easter eggs would be cool to have. My point is that Witcher III vs. Skyrim isn't a fair comparison. They're different games, with different features, strengths, and limitations. Every feature, every scrap of content in a video game, takes time and money to create, and it's my suspicion that while 'hidden' content is cool, content most players will never see is a hard sell to a game publisher. Also, every time someone brings up The Witcher 3, I'm tempted to point out that the median Software Developer salary in Poland is less than a THIRD of what you pay for one in the US. Is it consistent to simultaneously decry the working conditions of people in the gaming industry, while also demanding they meet they be three times as productive as someone working in a country with a much lower standard of living?

    Ultimately, when you say, "I want this" in your game, you need to also be able to say, "And I'm willing to sacrifice that." And personally, I wouldn't trade Skyrim for the Witcher 3. You may feel differently.
    Last edited by The_Jackal; 2019-04-30 at 07:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    My point isn't FOMO, I fully appreciate the idea that having those kind of hidden options and easter eggs would be cool to have. My point is that Witcher III vs. Skyrim isn't a fair comparison. They're different games, with different features, strengths, and limitations. Every feature, every scrap of content in a video game, takes time and money to create, and it's my suspicion that while 'hidden' content is cool, content most players will never see is a hard sell to a game publisher. Also, every time someone brings up The Witcher 3, I'm tempted to point out that the median Software Developer salary in Poland is less than a THIRD of what you pay for one in the US. Is it consistent to simultaneously decry the working conditions of people in the gaming industry, while also demanding they meet they be three times as productive as someone working in a country with a much lower standard of living?

    Ultimately, when you say, "I want this" in your game, you need to also be able to say, "And I'm willing to sacrifice that." And personally, I wouldn't trade Skyrim for the Witcher 3. You may feel differently.
    The different builds don't need to all be focused around a core skill set like they are in the Witcher. Bethesda has already demonstrated that they can make wildly different playstyles instead of just "click them with a sword" and "click them with magic".

    And do you know what those secrets only available to a mage character add? Replay value. You aren't just doing different things, youre seeing different things.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    I love how The_Jackal is completely ignoring that I said earlier Elder Scrolls games did this too. In Morrowind there were strict skill requirements for becoming leader of the various guilds, for instance, so someone who was rubbish at fighting couldn't become head of the Fighter's Guild. That effectively gated off the quests associated with that Guild if you were playing mage, and I had no problem whatsoever with that--if I wanted to see that content I just had to play again with a fighter character.

    So, this isn't a matter of trading Skyrim for The Witcher 3. It's a matter of taking the best aspects of both games and producing the best RPG ever made. I don't think ES6 will do that, but I can dream.

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    I hope TES 6 will completely remove the "class x guilds" and rename their questlines and in universe relevancy. Either that or gate the side quests again.

    Let me explain by taking Skyrim's four big guilds: Companions, College of Winterhold, Thieves' Guild and Dark Brotherhood.

    The Companions isn't really a "fighting" guild but they frown upon magic users. I wish they would drop the pretense, add a few spellblade NPCs (because you can't tell me magic isn't Nord because it works with Frea as a shaman too) and accept magic users. But then again I wished they made lycanthropy optional too. In TES 6, either go fighter's guild again (or if it is Hammerfell, Alik'r) or take an independant faction that does do "mercenary type" stuff but leave it to you how you deal with the problems.

    The College builds its magic lore up to a maximum and still let's in any dolt that can cast a minor spells. That being said, I assume the fact that your characters even HAVE a few spells known and a mana bar makes them special already. But honestly it would be 100% believable if they went: "Under normal circumstances I would kick you out but you know what. You are not an complete moron and you can cast simple spells, come on in" eventually resulting into "Hey you know what? You can't be the archmage, Tolfdir will be that; also because he is wise and around all the time while you travel. But you are our leader and champion because you are so awesome and helped us." afterwards.

    The Dark Brotherhood states it does not care how the murder is done, it is just that subterfuge is rewarded with bonus rewards. Which is entirely cool with me because at this point I was expecting a way to weasel out of every other contract the way you do with small jobs where you tell the victim to leave Skyrim and the Nightmother does not care. You can be the Listener for all I care but you should have the option to say No to the Nightmother, relegating this to Cicero. The brotherhood is a cult foremost but if you are just a assassin mercenary wanting money you likely don't want your soul bound to eternal darkness (and eventually turned into an edgy ghost summon).

    The "Thieves" guild...hoooh boy. The story is convincing but the whole thing doesn't do what it says on the lable. For one you are more a "cult leader of Nocturnal" than an actual thieves' guildmaster afterwards. Secondly you don't need to steal ANYTHING. Thirdly if you DO steal stuff, what do you get as major rewards during the quests? Gear that helps you kill people silently. ALL OF THE WHAT?! You get major OP magic gear starting out (a minor complaint with the DB and TG) but Skyrim's houses and holds are at some point not worth being robbed (I blame the broken economy past a certain hour of playtime), and you basically play a badly stolen version of a Thief game, only with the satisfying thievery removed and only the - albeit good - conspiracy plot still there. That's like ... playing Doom 3 but instead of being an action packed shooter, you play a turn based RPG in between main story quests.

    Hey, if TES 6 is set in Hammerfell, I would honestly love a set of the following:
    1) Alik'r mercenaries that accept anyone but have thieves and battle mages in their ranks as well
    2) A faction surrounding the Orichalc Tower (resisting the Thalmor) or a Thalmor faction. Major plot points would involve heavy magic use but you would not need magic to join since you are prophesied hero #6
    3) Dark Brotherhood or equivalent: Face the facts, the DB is famous and beloved by fans. There is no way we are not getting one of these. But maybe have it resurface on the surface and be integrated into society like the Morag Tong (much to the shagrin of the Nightmother who heavily opposes stepping out of the shadows). Heavy politics games aside, you could then murder in broad daylight and get away with it, maybe even have a bit of a two-path questline where you get other follow up quests when you stealthily or visibily murder someone (even if it's just a "xy saw you murdering kill them before proceeding"). But here I would be okay with an "old style" DB as well.
    4) Thieves can be organized and even be led by something like the Gray Fox. But at least incorporate banditry into their arsenal so people who prefer to kill and loot don't feel so out of place. You can still have thievery as a main subject. Maybe add a theme of grave robbery too (we do it all the time anyhow so why not just concede this and make an accessible "thieves" guild).
    Last edited by Spore; 2019-05-01 at 03:49 AM.

  24. - Top - End - #474
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    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Love your own lore and then just give me morrowind with combat that feels like DOOM (and UI that doesn't suck)


    Beth keems muting their own lore. Skyrim was half as crazy as it should've been.


    They don't need to pander to a wide demographic, they're making the freaking Elder Scrolls. People'll grab it for the brand recognition alone. They can afford to go Lore crazy and it's good marketing to do so. People will such that stuff up.

  25. - Top - End - #475
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Sporeegg... I hope they take absolutely none of your suggestions. Skyrim already had the issue of ensuring every single character could do absolutely everything and as much as I love Skyrim, it's one of the few bad design decisions I think they made. What you're suggesting sounds infinitely worse.
    I am trying out LPing. Check out my channel here: Triaxx2

  26. - Top - End - #476
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by Triaxx View Post
    Sporeegg... I hope they take absolutely none of your suggestions. Skyrim already had the issue of ensuring every single character could do absolutely everything and as much as I love Skyrim, it's one of the few bad design decisions I think they made. What you're suggesting sounds infinitely worse.
    Agreed. If im going to join the Dark Brotherhood, make me own the fact that im playing a crazy murder cultist. If im in the fighters guild, make progression require me to actually be competent at fighting. I think that was a real missed opportunity with the radiant quest system. If you didn't have the skills to progress, you could just have gone on radiant quests to level up until you got them. Give a relevant skill bonus as a reward. Recover a random tome for the College? Get a point of destruction skill. Beat up a giant for the companions? Get a point of heavy armor. Steal something? Get a point in lockpicking. Do enough of those and you can get the next quest, or just go adventure on your own and level your skills manually.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  27. - Top - End - #477
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    ElfMonkGuy

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    The thing is, with the story-based questlines of the various guilds, it wouldn't really make sense for it to be locked behind skill requirements. "Oh no, Ancano has unleashed magical entities all over Winterfell! But wait, you have to go level up one of your magical skills to 50 before we can let you take them out." "Cicero betrayed the Dark Brotherhood and took the Night Mother! But your Sneak isn't good enough, so we can't do anything about it."

    The solution I've personally thought of is to separate the storyline from the guild progression. The former would be like Skyrim- your missions are related to the guild, but don't require that you use magic, or sneak around, or use melee weapons. Even if you don't know a single spell, maybe the Mage's Guild just needs a convenient mercenary who ends up getting caught up in a magical adventure. The latter would be more like Morrowind, having skill requirements to climb the ranks, and having missions that are closer to the purpose of the guilds, like the radiant quests. Maybe some parts of the latter could be locked behind the former; you can't become the guildmaster until they die in the storyline.

  28. - Top - End - #478
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    BlackDragon

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by mythmonster2 View Post
    The thing is, with the story-based questlines of the various guilds, it wouldn't really make sense for it to be locked behind skill requirements. "Oh no, Ancano has unleashed magical entities all over Winterfell! But wait, you have to go level up one of your magical skills to 50 before we can let you take them out." "Cicero betrayed the Dark Brotherhood and took the Night Mother! But your Sneak isn't good enough, so we can't do anything about it."
    You could take the small amount of gatekeeping they *did* do further, so the level requirements become natural--e.g. you can't enter the dungeon that leads to the Staff of Magnus without casting a high-level spell on the door, for instance.

  29. - Top - End - #479
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    Griffon

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    I like the Oblivion gates. Sure there are only a few layouts, but the enemies in them are not always the same ones, and I'm not even sure they're always in the same places.
    The end of what Son? The story? There is no end. There's just the point where the storytellers stop talking.

  30. - Top - End - #480
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: The Elder Scrolls XV: This is my Thu'um Stick

    Quote Originally Posted by factotum View Post
    You could take the small amount of gatekeeping they *did* do further, so the level requirements become natural--e.g. you can't enter the dungeon that leads to the Staff of Magnus without casting a high-level spell on the door, for instance.
    Or even do what the Dark Brotherhood did and just say "We're working on setting up the next quest, go level up and we'll contact you when were ready" and then just send a courier the next time youre in town after hitting the level requirements.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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