Questionable Content 14: "I Deserve A Fancy Butt Emblem."

[Willie the Duck]

OK, I have a question. Are all rabid animals living on the East Coast? Or is rabies-spotting a sport there?

Of the major mesocarnivores that spread rabies (along with bats), raccoons are decidedly more common on the East Coast than elsewhere, and most of the rest (like skunks and foxes) are pretty evenly distributed. So AvatarVecna should have stipulated that he wasn't talking about human population (if you'll notice, the map on the top does not look like the one on the bottom), the basic concept is correct. Just 'population, for traditional rabies vector species.'

[Keltest]

My response at the time was, there is a difference between being unable to afford nice snackfoods and being unable to afford ANY snackfoods. I thought it was clear that Brun was referring to the latter; if you think that's unlikely, then I can only say... lucky us, for being in positions where that is hard to imagine?

Being unable to afford any snack foods means being unable to afford any food period. Snack foods are fairly commonly bought by people with little money in place of actual meals because theyre cheap and require little to no prep work to eat. Buy a bag of chips or a box of raisins and you have everything you need to eat them right in the bag/box. Beyond that, as others mentioned, raisins tend to be included in the lunches provided by schools for kids who otherwise wouldn't have anything to eat. Unless her family was literally begging on the streets for most of her childhood, its basically impossible for her to not have been able to have access to raisins. That's why people are saying it was just Jeph talking out of ignorance.

[Lethologica]

Why did this perfectly reasonable update become an excuse to thrash a previous argument to death?

[Mechalich]

Why did this perfectly reasonable update become an excuse to thrash a previous argument to death?

Because it contains a new example where Brun claims to have had a weird experience that is highly uncommon.

Touching bats is not something most people do. Direct physical contact is simply not part of the usual set of human/bat interactions. In order for you to touch a bat you have to either be in some sort of specialized program where you handle uncommon animals, or have a tendency to handle dying animals you find by the side of the road.

Most people, if told 'never touch a bat' would respond with 'good to know' and file that bit away in the realm of nearly useless trivia. That Brun's response implied that she not only has touched bats in the past, but presumably did so with some recency is just weird, and in the previous context of poorly handled treatment of Brun's past experiences, means the resulting speculation gets little benefit of the doubt.

[John Cribati]

Huh. I would have figured the main point of contention was about Brun not knowing that bats carry diseases, what that said about her intelligence, and whether or not it this lack of knowledge is due to her autism.

[Vinyadan]

If you go camping, and use a flysheet, you may find bats resting during the day between the flysheet and the roof of the tent. If you go cycling at dusk, you may hit a bat. And, if someone was hit by a bat and it got wrangled into long hair, she may need help getting it off her.

Children sometimes play with bats in Africa. They can make colonies in the hollow trunk of large trees near their homes. That's where the Ebola epidemic in West Africa probably came from.

[Fawkes]

Bare in mind that it was less than a week ago (in-comic time) that Brun found out what raisins were, after growing up deprived and impoverished to the point where a number of people on this forum couldn't seem to grasp the concept of being too poor to buy snack foods.

That's sort of my point, though. Jeph has stacked up Brun's character so that she is unfamiliar with basically everything. She's on the spectrum, so she has difficulty parsing people's motivations and social situations (except when she doesn't, but that's a different discussion), she grew up poor so she hasn't experienced things that the rest of the cast takes for granted, and she's also just generally ignorant of everything and makes poor decisions, to the point that the punchline of nearly every strip she appears in is 'Brun doesn't understand, cue laughter and/or pathos', and it's getting exceedingly repetitive.

To put a finer point on this, it is recommended not because bats are all that likely to be carrying rabies, but because of the high possibility that contact with a bat might include being bitten without even knowing it (whereas a raccoon or rat--if it bites you, you know it!).

Also, they're tough to catch and test for rabies after you've had contact.

On principle, I find that comparing human beings- especially someone if a minority group- to something that isn't a human being- especially if the comparison is made in a derogatory fashion, as was being done- tends to be seen as more offensive than not.

I think this is a difference in philosophy, here. I don't really register any of these comics characters as human beings. I don't see Brun as a human being belonging to a minority group, but as a fictional character designed to represent a minority group, written by an author who is not a member of that minority and has not done the research, but claims kinship on twitter.

Especially considering that, like Jeph himself, I also showed symptoms of neurodivergence in my childhood, but was never officially diagnosed with anything (presumably unlike Jeph, this was mainly because my parents decided to beat the majority of the "bad" behaviors out of me instead of taking me to a specialist that could confirm or deny a diagnosis). So it likely isn't accurate to call me neurotypical, either.

I'm really sorry that you went through that. Honestly, it sounds like in pretty much every circumstance, you're more qualified to write about or judge these social issues than I am (or Jeph is, for that matter), and I've usually found your takes on other discussions we've had to be the most well-reasoned. So if you really disagree with me, and think that Brun is a good and positive portrayal of a person on the autism spectrum, well, then I'll defer to your experiences and I'll drop that complaint.

Of course, that doesn't address my other issue, which is that I haven't really enjoyed this comic or its characters since Hannelore left, which means it's probably time for me to go.

[halfeye]

Bats may be dangerous in the America and Africa, but here they're generally not (there's no rabies), and I don't remember hearing about them being a problem in Europe or Asia.

[Traab]

Bats may be dangerous in the America and Africa, but here they're generally not (there's no rabies), and I don't remember hearing about them being a problem in Europe or Asia.

They arent dangerous, its not like bats are aggressive animals, its just they got a bad rap awhile back and so are treated like possums as some sort of horrible disease factory. But the reality is simple, much like any other wild animal, do not try to touch them.

[Shadow of the Sun]

On principle, I find that comparing human beings- especially someone if a minority group- to something that isn't a human being- especially if the comparison is made in a derogatory fashion, as was being done- tends to be seen as more offensive than not. I'm not sure what neurotypicality has to do with my response.

Especially considering that, like Jeph himself, I also showed symptoms of neurodivergence in my childhood, but was never officially diagnosed with anything (presumably unlike Jeph, this was mainly because my parents decided to beat the majority of the "bad" behaviors out of me instead of taking me to a specialist that could confirm or deny a diagnosis). So it likely isn't accurate to call me neurotypical, either.

The "person visiting another planet" or "alien visiting earth" is a pretty common metaphor for what it feels like to be autistic - specifically, the idea that everything is kind of strange and doesn't make perfect intuitive sense. I'm not offended by it, and I know a fair few autistic people who would also not be offended by it. Some probably are, but a lot of us aren't. My comment was more to specify that you can't speak for autistic people as a whole like that. We're just as varied as anyone else.

The "y'all neurotypicals don't make any damn sense" was humourous, but also supposed to support the previous paragraph in general, not specifically talking about you. Neurotypical people kind of confuse me at times. Rather like I was an alien visiting Earth for the first time, in fact.

[John Cribati]

The "person visiting another planet" or "alien visiting earth" is a pretty common metaphor for what it feels like to be autistic - specifically, the idea that everything is kind of strange and doesn't make perfect intuitive sense. I'm not offended by it, and I know a fair few autistic people who would also not be offended by it. Some probably are, but a lot of us aren't. My comment was more to specify that you can't speak for autistic people as a whole like that. We're just as varied as anyone else.

The "y'all neurotypicals don't make any damn sense" was humourous, but also supposed to support the previous paragraph in general, not specifically talking about you. Neurotypical people kind of confuse me at times. Rather like I was an alien visiting Earth for the first time, in fact.

The thing is, I wasn't responding to a metaphorical comparison, or at least it didn't come off as one the way I read it.

Furthermore, that comparison is something of a double-edges sword.

If Brun were being compared to, say, Starfire from the Teen Titans cartoon, or Spock or Data from Star Trek, I wouldn't see a problem, because those are characters who have beed coded as autistic to varying degrees, and in their own way, are people.

But the flippant comparison of an autistic character to an alien or a robot is impersonal, and I see it as more or less a dismissal of their humanity (and, by extension, to the humanity of IRL autistic folk).

[Gnoman]

except when she doesn't

There is a significant difference between a social situation and all the relevant cues being explained to you vs. having to pick them all up in real time on your own.

[John Cribati]

I meant to get on that too. The issue autistic people tend to have with social interaction is that a lot of the "rules" are intuited, and they tend to have poor intuition. But Brun, after hearing the situation, was able to see the logic in the actions Claire had taken, and that's what she focused on there.

[Keltest]

I meant to get on that too. The issue autistic people tend to have with social interaction is that a lot of the "rules" are intuited, and they tend to have poor intuition. But Brun, after hearing the situation, was able to see the logic in the actions Claire had taken, and that's what she focused on there.

I would also suggest that in this case, the act of explaining things to Brun was what Clinton needed far more than any actual understanding of the situation that Brun would provide.

[Kato]

Because it contains a new example where Brun claims to have had a weird experience that is highly uncommon.

Touching bats is not something most people do. Direct physical contact is simply not part of the usual set of human/bat interactions. In order for you to touch a bat you have to either be in some sort of specialized program where you handle uncommon animals, or have a tendency to handle dying animals you find by the side of the road.

A bat once flew in my flat and landed on my couch. So, I guess me carrying it out was also impossible / unreasonable ?

[Rodin]

I also think there's a fair bit of Early Character Weirdness going on there. Like how Hannelore wasn't in the least bit bothered by watching Marten pee into the sink in the ladies room, totally at odds with her later personality. We get a handwave of "the meds made me weird", but there's almost nothing identifiable as Hannelore in her early appearances.

I suspect that Brun was originally penciled in as "bartender, female" and only got a storyline and developed autism after Jeph decided he liked her.

[Mechalich]

A bat once flew in my flat and landed on my couch. So, I guess me carrying it out was also impossible / unreasonable ?

No. It was unlikely and random. Weird coincidences happen in real life, but deploying them in storytelling has a tendency to result in plot-derailing non sequiturs and also strains suspension of disbelief. If you asked an audience of 1000 people 'have you have touched a bat' probably around 10 hands would go up, and there probably wouldn't be any correlation between those people's experiences. So we have Brun making a claim to an unusual experience without any real justification (yet anyway, the possibility of bats living in the rafters of her residence is something I already mentioned), and that strains suspension of disbelief.

[Keltest]

Im going to be honest, while Brun having recently touched a bat is unlikely, I have to suspect the people who think this is a sufficiently implausible occurrence as to be comparable to the raisins thing don't actually commonly have bats where they live. If I actively wanted to find a bat, it would not be difficult. Touching it, only somewhat more so.

[Shadow of the Sun]

There's also a decent chance that this is Brun trying to make a joke.

My parents - who I've lived with for my entire life, more than two decades - can't tell when I'm joking due to how deadpan I am when I make jokes and because my sense of humour is a bit... odd.

[John Cribati]

Maybe she touched a bat at the zoo. When she was 9.

[Lethologica]

Brun having maybe touched a bat once if she was being serious is not an immersion-breaking implausibility, come on. Neither is Renee believing the common mostly-myths about disease association.

[Morquard]

Considering both Renee's and Clinton's comments, it seems fairly clear she was making a joke. Why are we still discussing this?

[Traab]

Some people are reaching dominic deegan levels of comic hate and looking for stuff to be upset by. Its basically a form of confirmation bias. Once you decide you dont like something, you start looking for anything that can further justify that decision. Even when it involve stretching to absurd levels to do it.

[Fawkes]

I assumed the next comic would be taking place shortly after Brun receives a rabies shot. Would be happy to be proven wrong.

welp

Anyway, I think Jed won this one, tbh. Motivational wingsuit speaker sounds like a pretty cool gig.

Time to unsubscribe!

[Beelzebub1111]

Wow! Bullies absolutely DESTROYED! That totally works in real life.

[georgie_leech]

Wow! Bullies absolutely DESTROYED! That totally works in real life.

Wow! Robots have MINDS! That totally works in real life.

[Comrade]

Wow! Robots have MINDS! That totally works in real life.

I don't know, I have an easier time buying a universe with sentient AI than one where high school bullies are actually unnerved by what Brun said as opposed to just going 'lol what a weirdo' and taking her lunch money.

[John Cribati]

It's called being roasted. It's a thing that happened in high school sometimes. Also past the elementary school years, boys are less likely to be physically violent if and when they bully girls (in public). Calling her names was basically all he had to offer in that scenario, and she one-upped him by basically telling him his life would amount to nothing, in what would seem a near-Shakespearean manner to someone that age.

[Kato]

I don't know, I have an easier time buying a universe with sentient AI than one where high school bullies are actually unnerved by what Brun said as opposed to just going 'lol what a weirdo' and taking her lunch money.

Yeah, I agree with this. (except for the lunch money) I don't see any bullies being impressed by that comment. A roast requires the roasted to grasp the meaning of the insult and to take it for full. I can understand Brun feeling better because she believes it to be true but I don't believe it to have such an impact, especially so fast on the three of them. Buuuut I guess Jeph has some issues to resolve, and this is not the worst way to do so.

[Vinyadan]

I mean, that's not how it really works: irl they would have mugged her, taught her how to dance, and then sold her into slavery. But whatever Jeff wants to portray, I guess.