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2019-03-21, 01:18 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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- Feb 2009
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Klotto Rubiini Kosketti
Orc magic is best magic! (Judges will decide if orc build is best build.)
Originally Posted by Klotto Rubiini Kosketti
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2019-03-21, 01:19 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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- Feb 2009
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Gobta
Does he make the worg shrink? (Geddit? Because "worg" is "grow" backwards? Eh? Anyone?)
Originally Posted by Gobta
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2019-03-21, 01:21 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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- Feb 2009
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Ekaterina Morovan d'Lyrandar
Maybe we should find a way to make filling tables easier to prevent this sort of thing from happening again.
Originally Posted by Ekaterina
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2019-03-21, 01:22 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Darkblood Malrell
Aaaand here's another one where I can't help but put the name to the tune of the SpongeBob theme song…
Originally Posted by Darkblood Malrell
The thunderous voice broke the petrified silence reigning in his bedroom. The hulking half-giant, complete with a shaggy black beard, a generous belly and, curiously enough, an umbrella, bore its fierce look right down in his eyes. That were, at this very moment, wide open with amazement.
Darkblood Malrell
"What...what is this about?" finally dared to ask the young illumian. He looked with dismay at the remains of the door, pulverized when the creature had made his forceful entry.
"Ah, yeh're no goin' to make it complicated. I'm glad. That'll be nice, af'er what I've come through to get his letter to the previous lad..."
His stare suddenly relaxing, he ruffled through his many pockets before delivering a piece of parchment. Proudly putting it in the hand of the bewildered boy, he gleefully bellowed:
"Yeh're a Wizard, Malrell!
...no, wait a minute, wha' is this..."
Squinting, the barrel-shaped intruder retrieved the letter from Malrell's hand before the Illumian had had the slightest reaction. A fine line in the back of the enveloppe had caught his eyes. As he kept on writing, his expression slowly decomposed.
"Oh...no. No, no, no, no...no."
Pain could be read on his face as he put the letter back in his pocket. Malrell felt his heart sink.
"I am so very sorry. Yeh're not a Wizard, lad. Yeh're a Sorcerer."
Spoiler: Build stubDarkblood Malrell (these randome racial name generators come in handy) is a male Uurkrau Illumian Lawful Good Divine Sorcerer 5/Mage of the Arcane Order 1. He has picked the Domain Access Sorcerer ACF at level 5, for the Planning Domain. He has a snake familiar (+3 to Bluff), Greenscale (any wizard worth his salt must have a familiar named by a contraction of an adjective and a descriptive name). He speaks Illumian, Common, Draconic, Elven and Celestial.
Spoiler: Ability scores
Strength Dexterity Constitution Intelligence Wisdom Charisma 8 15 ->16 at level 4 14 16 10 14
Spoiler: Build table
Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features Racial Features 1st Sorcerer 1 +0 +2 +2 +2 K: Arcana 4, Spellcraft 4, Concentration 4, Bluff 4, Craft (Alchemy) 4 Arcane Preparation(CArc p.73) Familiar (Snake) Luminous sigils, Glyphic resonance, Final utterance, +2 to saves vs [shadow] spells, Superior Literacy, Uur power sigil (+1 to Dex skills)2nd Sorcerer 2+1 +2 +2 +3 K: Arcana 5, Spellcraft 5, Concentration 5, Bluff 5, Craft (Alchemy) 5Krau power sigil (+1 CL up to character level), Uur
power sigil (+2 to Dex skills), Uurkrau power word (use Dex instead of Cha for bonus spells)3rd Sorcerer 3+1 +3 +3 +3 K: Arcana 6,Spellcraft 6, Concentration 6, Bluff 6, Craft(Alchemy) 6Extend Spell 4th Sorcerer 4+2 +3 +5 +4 K: Arcana 7,Spellcraft 7, Concentration 7, Bluff 7, Craft(Alchemy) 75th Sorcerer 5+2 +3 +5 +4 K: Arcana 8,Spellcraft 8, Concentration 8, Bluff 8, Craft(Alchemy) 8Extend Spell (bonus) -> Cooperative Spell (CArc p.76) Domain Access ACF (CC p.52): Planning domain (PGtF p.89)6th Mage of the Arcane Order 1 (CArc p.48) +2 +3 +5 +6 K: Arcana 8,
Spellcraft 9, Concentration 9, Bluff 9 (cross-class), Craft(Alchemy) 9Penumbra Bloodline (DC p.103) Guild member, Spellpool I
Epics feats:
1. Versatile Spellcaster 2. Craft Wand 3. Power in the Blood (if permissive DM) // Improved Sigil (Krau) (otherwise) 4. to 10. Extra Spell (see in "what he can do" for more details)
Spoiler: Spellcasting ability
Spells per Day/Spells Known
Spells per day Spells known (before Extra Spells) Level 0lvl 1st 2nd 3rd 0lvl 1st 2nd 3rd 4rd 1st 5 4 - - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Acid Splash, Prestidigitation Ray of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor 2nd 6 5 - - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Acid Splash, Prestidigitation, Mage Hand Ray of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor 3rd 6 6 - - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Acid Splash, Prestidigitation, Mage HandRay of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor, Grease 4th 6 6 4 - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Acid Splash, Prestidigitation,Mage Hand,Amanuensis (SpC p.9)Ray of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor, Grease Glitterdust 5th 6 6 5 - Read Magic, Detect Magic, Acid Splash, Prestidigitation,Mage Hand, AmanuensisRay of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor, Grease, Enlarge Person Glitterdust, Levitate 6th 6 6 6 4 Read Magic, Detect Magic, Light, Prestidigitation, Mage Hand, Amanuensis, MessageRay of Enfeeblement, Mage Armor, Grease, Enlarge Person, Obscuring Mist (bloodline) Glitterdust, Levitate, Darkness (bloodline)
Haste, Nondetection (bloodline) Evard's Black Tentacles (bloodline)
Spoiler: The trick
So Malrell finds himself not a prestigious, hard-working, deserving researchers that sweats for every inch of his power. Instead, he turns out to be one of those arrogantly gifted, foolhardy, vain spellcasters that do not understand their own power anymore than a centipede understand its own venom. Many a time, as a little boy, he has heard the story of The Illumian That Didn't Want to Do His Homework, and of its terrible moral, where the foolish youngster is turned into a Sorcerer by his bad habits. Many a time, he has told the joke of why Sorcerers always carry an anvil when they go aventuring in dungeons (so that when they face a Beholder, they can drop it and run away faster). Unable to embrace his destiny, and desirous to harmoniously fit in in his cabal, Malrell decides to hide the terrible truth. At least he's not a Warlock.
What do Wizards do? They are more intelligent than charismatic. Check. They wear heavy coats and look all serious and wise. Looking back at Malrell's profile picture up there...check. They prepare spells in their spellbook, they write fancy inscriptions with magical inks, they spend hours studiously poring over ancient tomes in the library. That, Malrell can fake. These skill ranks in Bluff opportunely provided by the Sorcerer class come in handy here - especially given the average Wis score and Sense Motive ranks of your run-of-the-mill Wizard. One might argue that Marlell's fellow Wizards see him as a Wizard, so to be conservative this a lie in the range of "The bluff is believable and doesn't affect the target much". That means a +0 on the Sense Motive check of the Wizard. As soon as level 1, given 4 ranks in Bluff, a Charisma of 14, a masterwork item (maybe a particularly convincing fake spellbook) and a +3 from his familiar Greenscale, Malrell can take 10 on his Bluff check for a result of 21, thus automatically beating any Wizard with 0 ranks in Sense Motive and a Wisdom of 10.
Malrell can prepare spells (thanks to Arcane Preparation), and RAW nothing prevent a non-wizard from owning a spellbook and scribing spells with all the requisite expensive inks, etc. He also knows quite the iconic midly optimized-Wizard spells: Grease, Glitterdust, Haste... Malrell has the ranks in Spellcraft for that. He cannot Scribe Scrolls though, but that's because, as he explains it, he took the ACF from Unearthed Arcana that swaps Scribe Scroll for a [fighter] bonus feat, and he chose Improved Initiative (which is impossible to verify in-game, and is somewhat emulated by his high Dexterity score and by the Uur power sigil giving +2 to Dex-based checks, including Initiative). At level 3 and 5, he appears to be a spell level late. Another Bluff check (now reaching 23 at level 3 when taking 10) will convince most that Malrell unfortunately got level drained by a Wight/has already spent all his 2nd (or 3rd) level spells for the day. His higher number of spell slots can be explained away as coming from the Focused Specialist ACF from Complete Mage: he has barred the schools of Evocation, Illusion and Enchantment, in pure Wizard optimization tradition. The Domain Sorcerer ACF he picked at level 5 is identical to the Domain Wizard that comes from the same book, Complete Champion, with the exception that Wizards do not gain the domain granted power. Malrell will then explain the mastery of the Extend Spell feat as the feat he took for his regular 1 HD feat. And to complete the trickery, Malrell aims at entering a prestige class specifically designed for Wizards: Mage of the Arcane Order. His various disguising stunts allow him to qualify. The illusion is then complete: who would ever suspect a respectable member of the Arcane Order to secretly be a Sorcerer, of all things?
Of course, the DM could pull off a nosy NPC ("How come I've only seen you cast so many different spells while your spellbook contains many more?"). Time to use one of those skill shards from the psionic SRD: a +10 shard costs 1k and grants a one-time +10 competence bonus to any skill check. Malrell can then pull off a more elaborate lie ("I do cast them, simply not when you're around") and get past the +10 modifier granted to the opposite Sense Motive check by "the bluff is hard to believe". But there'll inevitably come a time where the lie cannot hold anymore. Well, at some point (at level 6 to be more specific), Malrell finally accepts who he really is. He embraces his shadow heritage, the source of his innate sorcery, with the Penumbra Bloodline feat. And he comes to terms with the nature of the power it brings (hence closing a longstanding character development arc that has plenty entertained both the player and the DM). That is why he next chooses Versatile Spellcaster as his first [epic] feat, Something he cannot explain away as a Wizard (since he took Domain "Wizard" at level 5, barring him from the Spontaneous Divination ACF that usually allows Wizards to take that feat). At that point (in E6 at least) however, Malrell is among the mightiest spellcasters to have walked the earth. Added to a longstanding membership of the Arcane Order, alongwith the fact that he still perfectly qualifies for the class, means his fellow Wizards do not want to lose such a precious member of the Order (or maybe they do? Plot hook arises!).
Spoiler: The case of Cooperative Spell
Mage of the Arcane Order requires both Cooperative Spell and any other metamagic feat, as well as the ability to prepare and cast 2nd level spells. The latter requirement is handled by the Arcane Preparation feat. The former, however, is annoying. Cooperative Spell requires a preexisting metamagic feat to be chosen. Since Arcane Preparation occupies the 1st level feat slot, Cooperative Spell must occupy the 3rd level one, but there's no room for a [metamagic] feat somewhere before; Arcane Preparation unfortunately is not such a tagged feat. There are several ways around this.
- Play a Human or a Strongheart Halfling. Possible, but bland. Illumian is needed for the Uurkrau power word, allowing Malrell to get bonus spells without having to pump Cha and to emulate Improved Initiative somewhat (see above). Finally, I wanted the Penumbra Bloodline, for its useful spells that do not allow saving throws (especially Evard's Black Tentacles). Since Illumian fluff is linked to the plane of Shadow, there was some thematic mileage to get from that race here.
- Use a flaw. Super inelegant, and creates and unequal playing field when compared to the other builds.
- Use retraining. Malrell picks any metamagic feat at level 3, takes a level of Sorcerer as his character level 6, and chooses Cooperative Spell as his feat. He later retrains that level of Sorcerer into Mage of the Arcane Order. Possible, but quite cumbersome, and retraining a whole character level is less often accepted than retraining a single feat or some skill points.
- Swap a bonus feat for any other one for which Malrell meets the prerequisites when he already has the bonus feat. That's what I went with. Malrell chooses Extend Spell at level 3. The Domain Access ACF grants him a domain's power at level 5. We choose Planning, whose granted power is to give Extend Spell as a bonus feat. Since we already have it, we swap it for Cooperative Spell. Though definitively not RAW, I feel this is the workaround that would be accepted by most GMs (some of which wouldn't, in the same time, allow flaws despite their RAW status).
Spoiler: What he can do
Malrell can take advantage of Mage of the Arcane Order even better than a Wizard can. Here's the trick. Spellpool I allows him to cast any Sorcerer/Wizard spells of combined level 3 or lower once per day. In and of itself, this represents an immense amount of versatility for the Sorcerer, and a great way to bypass his limited selection of spells known. Besides, that requires him having a spell slot available, which costs him absolutely nothing, while a Wizard cannot similarly leave all of his spell slots open. The greater number of spell slots Malrell enjoys compared to a non-Focused Specialist Wizard means he can repay his Spellpool debt more easily.
Yes, he needs to spend a full-round action prior to casting the spell, so there's a cost in-combat. However, that is of no concern for out-of-combat spells like Rope Trick or Water Breathing. Plus, thanks to his Craft Wand feat, Malrell can craft...wands! There's that line saying "the creator must have prepared the spell to be storede (or must know the spell, in the case of a Sorcerer or Bard)"in the SRD. Now, by RAW, Malrell does not know the spell, nor has he prepared it. However, he is indeed capable of casting the requisite spell once per day of crafting, as asked by the rules. Most DMs I know would allow this. Thus, during off days, Malrell can enrol the Spellpool to help him craft wands that will greatly diversify his possibilities. Wands of Knock, of Shatter, of Arcane Lock, of Tongues, of Silent Image...many things are made available, and I'm only quoting Core spells (which will make the pill easier to swallow by the DM than if Malrell starts cranking out wands of Wraithstrike or of Wings of Cover). In case that really wont fly, well, another Extra Spell cannot go amiss.
Penumbra Bloodline grants some more diversity to Malrell in the form of spells known up to 3rd level. But there is a hidden benefit. Malrell gains spells known up to 9th level, actually. I did not write spells above 4th level because his Charisma of 14 prevents him from casting spells. In addition, Versatile Spellcaster allows him to combine spell slots to cast 4th spells, by sacrificing two 3rd level spells and casting Evard's Black Tentacles, that he knows thanks to Penumbra Bloodline. He can thus cast 4th level spells. Which means the Extra Spell feat can teach him up to new 3rd level spells.
Enter Power in the Blood. This feat, requiring that you already have a [bloodline] feat, gives you one extra spell slot, usable only to cast one of the [bloodline] spells you know. A spell slot of unspecified level. And you already know spells of up to 9th level. Yep. How do Greater Shadow Evocation or Etherealness look at level 6? Now, of course, this is quite silly, and the player shouldn't really expect the DM to let that fly. What can fly, however, is gaining extra 4th level spell slots, that can only cast Evard's Black Tentacles or metamagicked [bloodline] spells of lower level. Given that Malrell can already cast it thanks to Versatile Spellcaster, that seems more reasonable. These spell slots can, however, be sacrificed in turn for Versatile Spellcaster, either to cast something like an Extended Evard's Black Tentacles or, if Malrell has access to a Cloak of Charisma +2, Shadow Evocation, the 5th level spell of Penumbra Bloodline. In the latter case, that means Malrell can cast 5th level spells, and thus is allowed to learn new 4th level spells with Extra Spell, yummy! Otherwise Improved Sigil (Krau) linked to Evard's Black Tentacles can make it count as being of 5th level for the purpose of Extra Spell.
All these Penumbra Bloodline + Versatile Spellcaster + Power in the Blood/Improved Sigil (Krau) shenanigans allow our Sorcerer to learn and use spells of 4th level, which means he can box above his E6 category.
What spells to pick? Well, it dépends of the optimization level of the party, of the player, of the DM...here are some suggestions. Thanks to Arcane Preparation, Malrell has access to those sweet Sanctified Spells too, though the relative unavailability of Restorations in E6 makes him wary of abusing them. They coincide with the flavor of a Divine Sorcerer, too.
Epic feat Casual build Flavorful build Powerful build (lol) 4th Scry Dark Way (SpC p.58) Polymorph 5th Fly Legion of Sentinels (PHBII p.116) Animate with the Spirit (CoV p.52) 6th Dispel Magic Phantom Steed Solid Fog 7th Shrink Item Invisibility Sphere Orb of Fire (SpC p.151) 8th Wind Wall Shadow Conjuration Celestial Aspect (BoED p.93) 9th Stoneskin Control Darkness and Shadow (CoR p.29) Celerity (PHBII p.105) 10th Dimension Door Enervation Assay Spell Resistance (SpC p.17)
Malrell's moderately high Charisma means his save DCs won't be sky-high. Hence, he takes care to only learn spells that do not allow one (such as the excellent Evard's Black Tentacles, which allows pretty much Nothing, by the way) or have side effects even on a successful save (like Glitterdust). Besides, he can focus on buying a pair of Gloves of Dexterity before he needs a Cloak of Charisma +2, since he gains bonus spells from Dex, and enjoys the +1 bonus in Ref saves, AC, initiative and range touch attacks (like his Ray of Enfeeblement) more than the +1 to Bluff checks. Going from Dex 16 to Dex 18 offers an extra 4th level spell slot, though "a spellcaster must be of high enough class level to be able to cast spells of a given spell level". Most DMs will flat-out bar Malrell from gaining the extra spell slot here, unless the player is persuasive enough to argue that, after all, the Versatile Spellcaster trick etc. described above does need Malrell to be of 6th level to be pulled off. In a way, Malrell is indeed of high enough class level to initiate the trick that allows him to cast spells of 4th level. In case that does not fly, well, that means Malrell does not gain that much from that pair of Gloves of Dexterity, and he can invest these 4k into Wand crafting (if allowed) or into funnier stuff like Spellguard Rings (perfect alongwith our ever-so-useful Evard's Black Tentacles, though humble Grease or Glitterdust work here too).
Being a Domain (Planning) Sorcerer, Malrell has effectively one spell slot of each level that can only be used to cast, respectively, Deathwatch, Augury and Clauraudience/Clairvoyance. All spells that do not check for saving throws and add some welcome divination abilities. And let's not forget his high Bluff modifier, which grants him a modicum of social abilities, as well as Greenscale, a familiar with both a climb and a swim speed, and with which Malrell can speak starting from level 5, from some scouting capabilities. Also, if the wand crafting trick is deemed illegal by the DM, there's always Craft (Alchemy) for churning out useful toys such as thunderstones, silversheen and all the crazy imaginative stuff found in these kinds of lists.
Beat that, Potter.
Spoiler: Sources
BoED: Book of Exalted Deeds
CArc: Complete Arcane
CC: Complete Champion
CM: Complete Mage
CoR: Champions of Ruin
DC: Dragon Compendium
PHBII: Player's Handbook II
SpC: Spell Compendium
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2019-03-21, 01:24 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Seven's a good number of builds, I dare say! At least when I'm not judging. But hey, could be worse. Seven builds is enough to get some variety but not so much that it turns judging into an unworkable slog.
Judges, you know what to do! I'll try to slap together a table. Anyone gets one done before I do, you're awesome.
(You're all awesome anyway. Love ya, folks.)
Update: Table's in the OP! Everyone who stated their alignment was Lawful on the L-C axis. Kinda funny, huh?Last edited by Zaq; 2019-03-21 at 01:36 AM.
In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-03-21, 01:43 AM (ISO 8601)Nerdomancer in the Playground Moderator
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
here's what I had before i went to check on the rule clarification for something else and saw LA is banned in e6. boo and hoo. The very first thing i thought of was "MAKE A DRAGON!", because for e6 that would be epic right? Not to slight any of the other builds, but i wanted to not do a dwk nor a silverbrow. so, i set about making myself a dragon. racial 1st level sorcerer casting, apply practiced spellcaster to bring it up to 4th casting because HD cap, and then apply loredrake to that, giving you a full 6th level sorcerer tied onto a dragon's chassis for all the fun and goodness.
SIR NOT APPEARING IN THIS COMPETITION
Spoiler
Spoiler: Details
wrymling steel dragon, 4RHD/2LA
Size: Small, Speed 60/150 fly (avg)/30 swim, 1st lvl Sorc Casting, Alt Form 5/day, Acid immunity, poison resist 10, SR 16
40 ft Line of Acid, 20 ft cone of poison
Bite 1d6, 2x Claws 1d4
Alternate Form: Any Humanoid or Animal Medium or smaller in size, as polymorph but no hit points regained. Gain all (Ex) abilities of new form. Lasts until choose to change form again, or revert back to natural form.
Steel Dragon class skills:
Bluff, Craft, Conc, Diplo, Disguise, Escape, Intim, Knows, Listen, Profession, Search, Sense, Spot, UMD
Point Buy:
STR 8 DEX 14 CON 10 INT 10 WIS 14 CHA 18
Spoiler: Build
Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features 6th Wrmling Steel Dragon +4 +4 +4 +4 6+INTx7 Practiced Spellcaster, Skill Knowledge - Spellcraft Loredrake, Spells, Breath Weapon (Cone 1 CON/1 CON, Line of Acid 1d6) Alternate Form 5/day, Immune to Acid, Sleep/Paralysis, Poison Resistance 10, SR 16, Blindsense 60ft, Darkvision 120ft
Spoiler: Spells
Spells per Day/Spells Known includes bonus from CHA
Level 0lvl 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th 6th 6/7 7/4 6/2 4/1 - - - - - -
Spells Known:
0- Message, Prestidigitation, Read Magic +4 more
1- Charm Person, Grease, Magic Missile +1 more
2- Alter Self, Shatter
3- Fireball
Possible feats:
Invisible spell is a +0 LA metamagic feat from Cityscape (req 1 metamagic feat). It makes your spells... invisible.
Steam Magic – Storm93: no spellcraft check to use fire spells underwater
Celestial Sorcerer Heritage – PHB2 90: add protection from evil to 1st known, gain bonus to saves vs electricity/petrification equal to CS feats total
Celesital Sorcerer Aura – PHB2 90: expend spell slot to gain 20ft aura (WILL DC 10+slot+CHA) or -2 attack/checks/saves for 24 hours or until hits you
Celestial Sorcerer Lore – PHB2 90: add magic circle/evil, tongues to known spells
Draconic Aura – DragMagic 16: Senses +1 Listen, Spot, Init in 30ft aura
Skill Tricks to think about: Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy, Swift Concentration
Fun Items to get ahold of:
Ring of Wizardry: Doubles spell slots/day. 1st lvl: 20k, 2nd lvl 40k, but might be impossible to find in an e6 world.
Practiced Spellcaster: Spellcraft 4, Comp Divine 82
Sources:
Complete Arcane: Practiced Spellcaster p82
Dragons of Eberron: Loredrake p30
Dragons of Faerun: Steel Dragon p141
Monster Manual: True Dragons p68
Player’s Handbook: Sorcerer p51
Unearthed Arcana: Skill Knowledge p81
I was going down the rabbit hole that is alter self and alternate form when i was looking up that mentioned rule clarification and then my world came crashing down... boo, hiss, boo.
anyways, grats to all, I will have to look at all these more in depth later this week.
Originally Posted by Nifft
The Mod Life Crisis If you need me to address a thread as a Moderator, please include a link Originally Posted by Peelee
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2019-03-21, 03:28 AM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
I'll start judging, and expect to be done in a week or so barring any RL issues.
Last edited by DeTess; 2019-03-21 at 03:28 AM.
Jasnah avatar by Zea Mays
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2019-03-21, 07:50 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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- Behind Blue Eyes
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Some stiff competition this time around! I think I stand a fair chance. We shall see.
If you need me for anything, or I forgot about something, PM me and I'll see it.
Undead- er, undying gratitude to linklele for the avatar.
Originally Posted by frogglesmash
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2019-03-21, 11:33 AM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
I'm actually already almost done, but I'll need to do another review to properly grade power (so expect me to post stuff tomorrow). That having been said, can someone explain to me how Thrush gets two negative levels off off his spells before applying metamagic? Fell drain only does a single negative level (before things like twin and repeat come into play).
Last edited by DeTess; 2019-03-21 at 11:40 AM.
Jasnah avatar by Zea Mays
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2019-03-21, 11:41 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Randuir, WhamBamSam, and PoeticallyPsycho are our judges this round, correct?
If you need me for anything, or I forgot about something, PM me and I'll see it.
Undead- er, undying gratitude to linklele for the avatar.
Originally Posted by frogglesmash
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2019-03-21, 03:08 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Cohn makes me want to dust off the idea of a sorcerer who can't cast any spells, but abuses feats and alternate class features to spam extra abilities from spell slots.
For extra fun, use Extra Familiar from Dragon Magazine. Feats get take before class features. Trade multiple familiars for multiple alternate class features. Bonus: also works for wizards!
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2019-03-21, 03:25 PM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
This is pretty unusual, but I guess we have a response to this already: Originally Posted by Randuir
Originally Posted by Thrush
In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-03-21, 06:14 PM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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- May 2017
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Thanks for passing on the response (and thanks to Thrush for the quick clarification)! It doesn't happen often that something leaves me completely stumped, as I can usually identify an error happening, but Thrushes combo had enough moving parts that I couldn't rule out missing some interaction. Posting all the scores is still on track for tomorrow, so in about 12-14 hours. Originally Posted by Zaq
Last edited by DeTess; 2019-03-21 at 06:15 PM.
Jasnah avatar by Zea Mays
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2019-03-21, 11:54 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
I was wondering the same thing but had the same assumption that I had just missed something. Glad that’s cleared up. Originally Posted by Randuir
Originally Posted by Deeds
Originally Posted by Red Fel
Originally Posted by Venger
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2019-03-22, 08:05 AM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Well then, scores coming right up. Before I do so, I'd quickly like to share my method and some overall comments.
Spoiler: Method
Because of the importance of originality in this comp, and how this category is often harder to quantify than the other 3, I decided to make something of a grading rubric. The bonuses or penalties listed here are the maximum for that category, and smaller bonuses or penalties can be given.
Background and thematics
+0.5 for an interesting background
I’d like to rate this one higher, but it’s the most subjective of the bunch, so I won’t.
+0.5 for a fully thematic spell list
It’s easy to diverge of your build’s theme because you just want fly and dispel magic, for example, so this one rewards people sticking to the theme despite potential losses in power
Race choices
+0.5 for non-obvious pick
Races with no direct CHA bonuses or other sorcery important tricks, for example.
-1 for obvious super-synergistic picks
Having the dragonblooded subtype will likely get you a -0.5, things beyond that might get the full -1
Build
+3 for an unusual build direction
Just doing something that sorcerer’s usually don’t will get you a about a +1, while doing something really off the wall will get you the full +3
-1 for an obvious power-up PRC or feat picks
-2 for a synergy-feats build
That is, a build focused around stacking lots and lots of [tag] feats that increase in power the more of them you have, such as [Draconic] or [fiendish]. I'm calling this one out in particular, because for e6 it's a rather easy way to build a character, irrespective of the secret ingredient. As someone might be quick to point out, I've done this in the past as well, and it's something I believe I really should avoid doing.
Miscelanious
-2 for non-cohesiveness
[I]This one will only come into play if a build consists of disparate components, such as a barbarian, going into paladin, and then taking lots of [fiendish] feats, without attempting to get a decent justification in the background./I]
The starting score for originality is 5.5/10.
For both power and elegance, the starting score is 3/5. For power, I'll be looking at in-combat power, out-of-combat utility and ability to stay alive. Elegance is where I punish build mistakes, and occasionally praise elegant (and non-obvious) solutions to a particular problem.
I usually scale Use of Secret Ingredient of the amount of secret ingredient class elvels and how the features whre used. however, as everyone in this comeptition ahs effectively 6 levels of sorcerer casting, I'll start this one at 5/5, and apply penalties only when I believe you're doing something that could really have been done far better using another caster.
Now, for the two comments:
First of all, I've ignored any specific equipment listed for a character, unless the character was capable of making said equipment themselves. The amount of equipment and the amount of cherry-picking possible differs a lot per campaign, and not everyone provided an equipment list, so I can't judge characters on what they can do if they happen to find the right gear.
Secondly, though I know filling in the Table can be PITA, I'd still urge all contestants to do so, as it makes reading a submission far easier. And if you absolutely can’t, please use some other form of formatting, like spoiler tags, or even just bold-font section headings. I haven't penalized for this, as the only non-build related thing a judge can penalize for is the lack of a source list, but please don’t submit a build without formatting.
Now, with that out of the way, let's get to the scores!
Spoiler: Unis Sobek Neithson: 15.5/25
Originality
It’s a Kobold with greater draconic rite of passage(-1 on race) and a level in Sandshaper(-0.5 for obvious power-up PRC) in a sorcerer competition. Your lack of epic feats doesn’t really give me anything else to judge your originality on either.
4/10
Power
Thanks to sand shaper you’ve got a very wide pool of spells, including both direct damage, crowd control and summons, (+1) as well as all-day damage in the form of fiery burst if you need it.(+0.5) You don’t have much in the way of utility spells, like fly or invisiblity, however(-0.5).
4/5
Elegance
Greater draconic rite of passage requires the “draconic reservoir” feat. You’ve actually got feats to spare to spend on it, but it is still an oversight (-0.5)
2.5/5
Use of SI
You effectively can cast spells as a 6th level sorcerer. Your build is focused on casting spells like a sorcerer, not hitting people with greataxes like a barbarian. Congratulations, you’re a sorcerer!
5/5
Spoiler: Thrush, Slayer Mage: 18.5/25
Originality
I liked the old west flavour of your background and it fits well with your build’s style(+0.5). Silver-brow human is a fairly obvious sorcerer pick (-0.5)
Sorcerer’s usually aren’t the metamagic specialists (+1), but mage of the arcane order is a pretty obvious way to increase your spell versatility by a great degree (-0.5).
6/10
Power
Your fell drain based tactics are very useful, until you run into an opponent that’s immune to it, though even in that case you can still do passable damage with your magic missiles.(+1)
You’re also unlikely to do much combat in your actual sanctum, though the feat does still help push your metamagic’d spell level lower, which I assume is the main intended benefit.
The spellpool fills in most of your utility needs.(+1)
5/5
Elegance
Your build is legal, and despite my initial misgivings arcane thesis doesn’t forbid lowering any individual metamagic’s cost into the negatives, as long as the total spell level isn’t lower than that initial level.
It should be noted that you only get 1 negative level from fell drain, not two. That oversight isn’t penalized here, but for power I used the actual numbers.
3/5
Use of SI
You’ve effectively got 6 levels of sorcerer casting, but through your feats and playstyle, you’ve basically turned your sorcerer into a wizard (-0.5).
4.5/5
Spoiler: Sir Cohnium: 21/25
Originality
Ehm…wow. You’ve made a sorcerer incapable of casting spells that nevertheless has decent use for its spell slots in the later levels(+3), with a cohesive background for why all of this is the case(+0.5). Warforged is also not exactly the first pick for sorcerer (+0.5)
9.5/10
Power
You’re tanky(+0.5), and if you have a party with casters or a magic-mart, you should eventually be able to have a fairly versatile selection of wands that you can power with your own spell slots, though it’ll take you a while to even reach the level of other sorcerers. Problems occur if you play in a game where your wand selection is far more limited, even with your own crafting.(-1)
2.5/5
Elegance
Your way of regaining access to spellcasting and use your spell slots anyway despite not being able to cast spells normally is inspired (+1)
4/5
Use of SI
This is a tricky one. On the one hand, you’re not really using the sorcerer’s main class feature. On the other hand, I can’t think of a different class that’d allow you to do what you’re doing here, so full marks.
5/5
Spoiler: Klotto Rubiini Kosketti: 16/25
Originality
Your background neatly weaves both your draconic and necromantic heritage together (and it was an absolute pleasure to read) (+0.5). Your spell list sticks to your chosen theme very nicely (+0.5). Bloodline feats are a fairly obvious way to get around the sorcerer’s limited spells known, however (-0.5). On the one hand, half-orcs are a fairly non-obvious choice for sorcerers, on the other hand, sneaking in the dragonblooded subtype is (+-0).
6/10
Power
Your spell list and other abilities are solid for combat(+1), but between your low amount of skills and relative lack of utility spells, you’ll not be very useful outside of combat(-0.5).
Defensively, your AC and saves are also lacking between your low DEX, CON and WIS(-0.5).
3/5
Elegance
You’ve taken a flaw (-1), and your reflex and fortitude saves are listed as being +2 higher than they should be (treated as the normal values per the sorcerer class for the power calculation, no penalty here)
2/5
Use of SI
You’re a sorcerer, and do sorcery things.
5/5
Spoiler: Gobta, goblin worg rider: 15/25
Originality
This isn’t the ingredient I’d have expected someone to try and make a supermount build on (+1.5), and goblin isn’t the first race I’d expect to be chosen as a small sorcerer, but it is very flavorful (+0.5)
7.5/10
Power
Invisibility is broken when you cast a spell targeting a foe. This remains true if your familiar delivers the spell, as you’re still the caster and you’re still targeting a foe. It retains its usual out-of-combat utility, however
Worg will die really quickly to any AoE effects or anything else that doesn’t care about AC due to its low HP, and offensively it isn’t particularly impressive, even when buffed(-1).
2/5
Elegance
Martial stance requires you to pick a stance from a discipline you already know a maneuver in. You only know shadow jaunt (Shadow hand school) when you take that feat, so you can’t pick iron guard’s glare from the devoted spirit school (-0.5).
2.5/5
Use of SI
What you’re trying to do would be done far better using almost any other caster. You need items to get all the familiar buffing spells you need(-1), and the associated skills (ride, handle animal) are not class skills(-1).
3/5
Spoiler: Ekaterina: 17/25
Originality
An interesting backstory that fits the build, but the rest of the build doesn’t stand out for good or ill (+0.5).
6/10
Power
You’ve got a decent crowd control and blasting list, and access to a variety of elements, even though you specialize in electricity(+1). You’ve got a bit of out-of-combat utility with charm person. Defensively the lack of mage armor or a similar way to boost your AC above 11 will get you in trouble(-1).
3/5
Elegance
Do metamagics count to fill the prerequisites for clap of thunder and storm bolt? I’ll say yes, but this can be very DM dependant. No other complaints here.
3/5
Use of SI
You’re a sorcerer, and you ensorcel stuff.
5/5
Spoiler: Darkblood Malrell: 17/25
Originality
You do a pretty good job at emulating a wizard with your build (+0.5), and combined with your background (which got a good chuckle from me), you’ve got a nice build thematic going(+0.5). Illumian with the Krau sigil is a fairly obvious caster, however(-0.5), and mage of the arcane order and a bloodline feat together are pretty obvious ways of getting around the sorcerer’s limited spells known (-1).
5/10
Power
Please note that power in the blood only grants you one spell slot, and versatile spellcaster does not grant a spell-slot, merely the ability to cast a spell 1 level higher by using two lower level spell slots, so you can’t chain up past 4 (or gain extra spells of a level higher than 3). Even getting that 4th level slot is a stretch, but I’d rather not get into the ‘is minimum caster level a thing?’ debate here, so I’ll grant you that, given that you’ve invested quite a bit to get there in the first place.
All that having been said, between your normal spell allotment and your extra spells, you’ve got both decent battlefield control(+1) and utility, like fly and levitate(+0.5), and your defences are passable, but you’re definitely no tank.
dispute addition: Between improved power sigil (krau) versatile spellcaster and the bloodline 4th elvel spell, I can now see a case for the extra spell feat to be able to get you additional 4th level spells known, and you get an additional +0.5 points for power for that.
5/5
Elegance
AS far as I can tell you only get to replace a duplicate bonus feat with another bonus feat if the thing giving you that feat explicitly says you do, so you can’t use getting extend spell again from your domain to get cooperative spell.(-1)
I’d also like to note that your explanation that a reasonable DM might allow you to swap the bonus feat anyway means you’re technically violating a competition rule regarding knowingly violating RAW to make a build fit. It’s a relatively small thing in this particular case, but it is something you should very much avoid doing. I’d also like to note that your build, because of this explanation, requires a DM willing to deviate from RAW to let you qualify for the PRC, and then sticks to RAW religiously to let you get 4th level (or higher) spell slots, which seems highly unrealistic.
2/5
Use of SI
You’re a sorcerer, and despite being able to do what a wizard can to some degree, you’re not defined nor forced to do so by your build choices.
5/5
For Honorable Mention, I'm conflicted between Gobta, for taking sorcerer and turning it into a worg rider, and Klotto, for a really nicely written background.
Edit: I completely forgot to mention this! This round has been an absolute pleasure to judge for. My initial estimate of a week for judging was that I generally only go through 1 or 2 builds before getting distracted by something else, but this time around every single build was evocative and inspiring, which allowed me to keep going and go through all of them in basically one go.Last edited by DeTess; 2019-03-22 at 09:57 AM.
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2019-03-22, 08:46 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Thanks for a lightning-fast judgment, Randuir! Got a couple of quibbles here:
Originally Posted by Darkblood Malrell
Heya Randuir, thanks for such a fast juding
I got a couple of remarks about the judgement you made on my guy, Darkblood Malrell.
Yeah, well, you're right, this Power in the Blood thing is rather iffy. That's why unless the DM is generous, Improved Sigil (Krau) does the trick with no complicated RAW dispute attached. I mentioned Power in the Blood mainly for the fact that bam, a very permissive DM just granted you an 8th or 9th level spell slot, but in most applications, one will go with Improved Sigil (Krau). I should've made that clearer Originally Posted by Randuir
No complains.
That's entirely right, and I knew I'd get dinged in Originality no matter what. That's why I mentioned some alternate ways to go in case the DM doesn't like that. So either: Originally Posted by Randuir
-The DM sticks to RAW and RAW only. You then take a flaw, and the Power in the Blood thing flies.
-The DM prefers to adjudicate by himself more. The feat swapping trick is then OK'd, and you ditch Power in the Blood for Improved Sigil (Krau).
What I'm saying here is that I don't fully agree that I'm violating a comp rule, since I've provided a RAW way to do the trick (flaws); and also I don't fully agree that I'm reliant on some bizarre DM that would handwave certain things and stick to RAW for others (which, I fully agree, is quite unrealistic): maybe I didn't explain in very well, but I have two fully operational routes to take, depending on whether the DM is (consistently) more or less a RAW adept. Worst comes to worst, if the DM won't agree to the feat swapping and won't let Power in the Blood work either, flaw + Improved Sigil (Krau) is still OK.
Also, don't I get some recognition for all the various ways I have devised to fool Wizards into believing Malrell is one of them?
Despite what this kind of somewhat combative dispute can lead to think, I have no interest in endlessly nitpicking your judgement in multiple back and forths
I won't press any judgement dispute back after your anwser, and once again thanks for giving your time to the comp.In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
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2019-03-22, 09:55 AM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
If I believed you'd truly made a bad competition rule violation, I'd probably have taken some additional action, but I did want to point out that the way you represented the build as is wasn't quite right. If you'd done it the other way around , with a flaw and the extra feat in the table, and the 'permissive DM' option described as an alternative, I'd have had no complaint in that regard whatsoever (apart from penalizing you for using a flaw, which incidentally would have been the same penalty as I used you for your mistake, so no change to your elegance score. Originally Posted by Darkblood Malrell
Personally, I'd try to present the main tables of the build and the feat list, and then provide a separate 'permissive DM' section to clearly separate those out. However, after reading over power sigil Krau and extra spell, it seems that you might just qualify for learning extra 4th level spells, and the addition of a couple more of those do qualify you for an additional 0.5 point for power. Originally Posted by Darkblood Malrell
Point-wise, that's rolled into the 0.5 point background bonus, but yeah, I probably should have made a mention of that somewhere as these are the kinds of shenanigans that make a memorable character at an actual table. Originally Posted by Darkblood Malrell
Net result: Darkblood Marell power is now 5/5, with the total score being 17/25. Thiswill behas been edited into the original judging.Last edited by DeTess; 2019-03-22 at 09:58 AM.
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2019-03-23, 02:38 PM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
One more for the road:
Originally Posted by Ekaterina
In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-03-23, 03:25 PM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Half-elf isn't a super-unusual race in my opinion, especially because you went the Dragonmarked route. I didn't consider spell turning because the action point economy will differ lot per game, and is likely going to be pretty tight, so it's not really an ability you can depend on in my opinion. To be honest, I haven't seen it in play much myself, so my estimate that it'd be at best 1/day might be off. Originally Posted by Ekaterina
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2019-03-28, 05:00 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
So, are we having another judging in preparation?
VC XV, The horsemen are drawing nearer: The Alien and the Omen (part 1 and part 2).
VC XVI, Burn baby burn:Nero
VC XVIII, This is Heresy! Torquemada
VC XX, Elder Evil: Henry Bowyer
And a repository of deliciously absurd sentences produced by maddened optimisers in my extended signature
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2019-03-28, 05:33 PM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Since we had a couple people announce that they were judging, I’ll leave it open until at least 2 weeks after the reveal. I won’t leave it open terribly much longer than that (MAYBE a day or two if a committed judge pipes up and says that they’re nearly done), but we’ll at least go to this coming Wednesday or so.
In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-03-28, 10:50 PM (ISO 8601)Troll in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
My schedule isn't unfolding quite the way I thought it would, so I don't think I'll be able to judge this one.
Iron Chef Medals
SpoilerSir Driscoll Conia - Silver - IC L
Nick Snarespan - Gold - IC LIII
Lucy "Legs" Silvertail - Bronze - IC LXVIII
Bolfarg of Knoss - Gold - IC LXXVII
Ivarr Deathborn - Bronze - IC LXXVII
Ahmtel - Silver - IC LXXVIII
Tocke of Nessus - Gold - IC LXXIX
The Blessed Third - Silver - IC LXXXI
Galahad Galapagos - Gold - IC LXXXIV
Sai-don, Knight of the Tide - Bronze - IC LXXXIV
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2019-03-29, 09:06 AM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
That is unfortunate, but 100% relatable. Totally been there. Originally Posted by WhamBamSam
Do we have anyone else who’s actively judging right now? If not, I can try to wrap things up tonight or tomorrow.In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-03-29, 11:51 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
PoeticallyPsycho was the only other one who offered that I saw.
If you need me for anything, or I forgot about something, PM me and I'll see it.
Undead- er, undying gratitude to linklele for the avatar.
Originally Posted by frogglesmash
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2019-03-29, 02:48 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Hmm, until Wednesday? I can probably finish up this weekend.
Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
Optimization Trophies
Looking for a finished webcomic to read, or want to recommend one to others? Check out my Completed Webcomics You'd Recommend II thread!
Or perhaps you want something Halloweeny for the season? Halloween Webcomics II
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2019-04-03, 01:11 AM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Okay, my procrastination has come back to bite me. Two builds left to review.
Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
Optimization Trophies
Looking for a finished webcomic to read, or want to recommend one to others? Check out my Completed Webcomics You'd Recommend II thread!
Or perhaps you want something Halloweeny for the season? Halloween Webcomics II
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2019-04-03, 12:08 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
First, a brief summary of how I’m judging. I was initially going for an in depth breakdown in each category, but that was driving me crazy so I will instead give a full breakdown for Elegance only and a summary and score for the other categories. The starting scores are 3 for Power and UotSI, 5 for Elegance, and 6 for Originality.
Spoiler: Unis Sobek Neithson – 17.65Originality:
There is very little provided in the way of fluff, but what there is is at least interesting. Wasn’t expecting to see a Touchstone feat. I very much was expecting to see some variation of a draconic kobold.
6.5
Power:
I’m going to assume you actually did take a level of Sand Shaper, contrary to what the table says. This level gives you quite a bit of extra versatility for the low price of a few spell slots. Fiery Burst makes up that loss by giving you an at-will damage dealing ability. The extra level of sorcerer casting certainly helps out. However, the lack of epic feats really hurts you here.
4
Elegance:
Missing epic feats –0.5
Apparently didn’t perform Draconic Rite of Passage –0.5
Table error –0.1
Total: 3.9
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
At the end of the day, the single level of Sand Shaper is a much more significant part of your build than the 5 levels of Sorcerer. The build feels like a Sand Shaper that happened to be a Sorcerer. Making up that lost level of Sorcerer with GDRP earns you some points back.
3.5
Spoiler: Thrush, Slayer Mage – 21.5Originality:
The segment is short, but hints at a personality, backstory, and setting that are interesting enough to be worth some points. On the other hand, even I’ve heard of metamagic abuse with Arcane Thesis, and Silverbrow Humans are pretty common.
7.5
Power:
Arcane thesis, the versatility of Spell Pool, metamagic stacking, full casting… there’s more but that’s all you really need to know this build is very powerful.
5
Elegance
Huh. I was all set to ding you for Arcane Thesis having been errata’d, but on closer inspection as long as the final spell level isn’t lower than the original spell level, you can apply negatives with Cooperative Spell and Invisible Spell. Slight penalty for screwing up the negative levels. I debated adding a –0.1 penalty for only listing a few cantrips known, but they’re just cantrips so what the heck. Similarly, the flavor of Invisible Spell and the necessity of Cooperative Spell spare you penalties for cheesing Arcane Thesis. I am however very skeptical that you can use Cooperative Spell without, well, a cooperating mage.
–0.5 negative level snafu
–0.5 Cooperative Spell without partner
Total: 4
Use of the Secret Ingredient
Well, Sorcerer only has two class features, and you’re sure making heavy use of both of them!
5
Spoiler: Sir Cohnium – 22.5Originality:
Warforged? Wands? Melee? Noncasting?! … I can honestly say I was not expecting anything about this build, and if that’s not worth full points then what would be?
10
Power:
Okay, original as the concept is, you’re going to struggle at low levels. You’re a fighter without combat feats, a spellcaster without spells, and a tank that is exceptionally hard to heal. Once you get into the higher levels and epic feats your build really starts to come online, and can produce some quite respectable DPR, which earns you some points back.
3
Elegance:
The conservative rulings on your abilities may have hurt you a bit in the power section, but they’re helping you now. I can’t find anything sketchy here.
5
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
Making good use of your ACFs, your extra spell slots, and your spells known, even if you’re not actually casting any of those spells. A slight bonus for re-acquiring a familiar, another one for going sorcerer for all 6 levels
4.5
Spoiler: Klotto Rubiini Kosketti – 22.3Originality:
Dragonblooded half-orc with martial training, a mother cyst, necromantic bloodline, Corrupt Arcane Training, and a cohesive backstory that manages to pull it all together! Very nice.
8.5
Power:
You’re a competent gish, with plenty of extra spells known and other abilities from your well-chosen feats. I don’t know if Corrupt Arcane Studies was worth the nightmares costing you your spellcasting every other day on average, but between melee and turning you’ve got enough other abilities I’m prepared to call it a net zero.
4.5
Elegance:
I noticed the other judge dinged you for incorrect saves, but it looks to me like you’re including the ability modifiers. What I don’t get is how your BAB jumps from +1 to +3. You also have some errors in your feat section (the big one is missing Endurance, plus a few typos). Very minor penalties for both mistakes. Your backstory manages to gel well enough I’m forgoing any penalty for cramming so many different flavors into one character. Finally, while I allow flaws in all my campaigns (because I love using them myself, so it’s only fair), in a competition like this they create an uneven playing field.
–0.1 table error
–0.1 feat section errors
–0.5 Flaw
Total: 4.3
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
You’re certainly gotten a lot of class features out of a class notorious for lacking them, and are making pretty good use out of them. I’m tempted to inflict a slight penalty for focusing a chunk of your build on ‘racial’ abilities rather than sorcerer, but when those races are dragons and the undead (and you have Necromantic Bloodline) that seems unfair. Full points!
5
Spoiler: Gobta, Worg Rider – 20.5Originality:
I didn’t even know trading your familiar for an animal companion was an option. I certainly wasn’t expecting a mounted build, nor a goblin. You’ve also gotten several unexpected class features via feats. However, you haven’t provided any backstory at all.
8
Power:
Getting invisibility at first level is certainly a plus, giving you a viable method of scouting. You’ve also got a decent array of buffs for your familiar/companion. However, even with these, your companions don’t have particularly impressive damage or tankiness, and you can’t cast offensive spells without blowing your invisibility, which means the little tankiness your creatures have becomes irrelevant as your non-tanky self becomes the limiting reagent. All that said, you do have two of them plus yourself, so the sum is respectable. EDIT: Okay, shocking grasp does give you an offensive action while riding and slight boost to damage, which is worth a slight boost to the score.
4
Elegance:
While Iron Guard’s Glare doesn’t have any prerequisites, the feat Martial Stance does. You have to already have a Devoted Spirit maneuver/stance to take the feat for a Devoted Spirit stance. Aside from that everything seems to check out. It is also sketchy to use Iron Guard’s Glare while invisible, since it’s based on knowing you’re there, but since knowing you’re there doesn’t actually prevent the miss chance I’ll let that slide.
–0.5 Martial Stance
Total: 4.5
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
At first glance, this doesn’t feel much like a Sorcerer. At second glance, you’ve sunk quite a lot of feats into non-Sorcerer things as well. However, the core parts of your build are Sorcerer class features and Sorcerer spells, even re-acquiring ones you’ve traded away, so the build is more Sorcerer than it looks at first.
4
Spoiler: Ekaterina d’Lyrander, Heart of the Storm – 22Originality:
Sticks to the theme quite nicely, and I quite like the backstory. Mechanically, you’ve got some cool stuff going on with Dragonmarked Spellturning and Born of the Three Thunders, and I wasn’t expecting Dragonmarks.
8.5
Power:
You don’t have a whole lot going on until epic levels, but even before that, you’re still a full-casting sorcerer. Born of the Three Thunders and Dauntless Mark is a solid synergy, and lets you add a very powerful rider onto almost every offensive spell you cast. Even before that, with Metamagic Specialist you can throw out BotTT spells every turn as long as you don’t move. Favored in House gives you some nice utility and roleplaying power, as well
4.5
Elegance:
Using Energy Substitution/BotTT to count as having Electricity/Sonic spells available to cast is a little sketchy, but not enough to be worth a deduction. Aside from that, everything seems to check out.
–0.5 Missing skills
Total: 4.5
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
You’re a Sorcerer who does sorcery things. Metamagic Specialist does help your build, but you don’t actually mention it at all, so slight penalty there.
4.5
Spoiler: Darkblood Malrell – 22Originality:
A Sorcerer pretending to be a wizard, and the antics he needed to pull it off, is funny enough to have had me chuckling while reading through the entry. While you’re not doing anything especially interesting with your spells or feats (except the higher level spell slots, which I'll cover in Power), you are actually using your skills in an interesting way.
8
Power:
You’re a Sorcerer, with all the spellcasting power that entails. Spellpool gives you versatility. And the ability to cast 4th level (and arguably up to 9th level) spells is certainly worth some points.
4.5
Elegance:
–0.5 Extend Spell
Total: 4.5
Use of the Secret Ingredient:
While you spend all your time pretending to be a different class, you do so by making good use of your own class features, including class skills. Hmm. Let’s call it full points, and call it a day.
5
Last edited by PoeticallyPsyco; 2019-04-03 at 12:22 PM.
Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
Optimization Trophies
Looking for a finished webcomic to read, or want to recommend one to others? Check out my Completed Webcomics You'd Recommend II thread!
Or perhaps you want something Halloweeny for the season? Halloween Webcomics II
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2019-04-03, 12:44 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
- Location
- Behind Blue Eyes
- Gender
Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
I invite Zaq to quote this and fill in the chef names when the contest is officially called. However, since today was the final day and both offered judges have judged, here's the rankings. All scores are out of 25 potential points.
Chef Build Judge 1:
RanduirJudge 2:
PoeticallyPsychoAverage score Final ranking ??? Sir Cohnium 21 22.5 21.75 1st ??? Thrush, Slayer Mage 18.5 21.5 20 2nd ??? Ekaterina d'Lyrandar 17 22 19.5 3rd ??? Darkblood Malrell 17 22 19.5 3rd ??? Klotto Rubiini Kosketti 16 22.3 19.15 5th ??? Gobta, Goblin Worg Rider 15 20.5 17.75 6th ??? Unis Sobek Neithson 15.5 17.65 16.575 7th
Well, er... it appears we have a tie for Bronze?If you need me for anything, or I forgot about something, PM me and I'll see it.
Undead- er, undying gratitude to linklele for the avatar.
Originally Posted by frogglesmash
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2019-04-03, 12:54 PM (ISO 8601)Titan in the Playground
- Join Date
- Feb 2009
- Gender
Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
Thanks for judging, PoeticallyPsyco! I’ll leave the floor open for responses for a day or so, but I’d like to move on tomorrow evening. Maybe Friday at the latest unless we get into a real argument. But I’m sincerely hoping we don’t get any real arguments!
That table will be helpful, Kool, so thanks for compiling it! Ties for medals are far from unprecedented.
If anyone has strong feelings about voting for HM, now’s a good time to air your thoughts!In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers
My compiled Iron Chef stuff! Originally Posted by Doc Roc
~ Gay all day, queer all year ~
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2019-04-03, 01:12 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
- Join Date
- Sep 2018
- Location
- Seattle, WA
Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XV)
My pleasure!
Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
Optimization Trophies
Looking for a finished webcomic to read, or want to recommend one to others? Check out my Completed Webcomics You'd Recommend II thread!
Or perhaps you want something Halloweeny for the season? Halloween Webcomics II
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