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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Greetings!

    I have a player, who plays a Hexblade (Fey pact). He doesn't like to be a pawn of an Evil Fey, so he seeks a way out of this Pact. A have dropped a rumor that there is a secret society somewhere, who knows how to separate a Hexblade off his Master. This process should conserve his current magical abilities, but deprive him from gaining new ones in future, effectively cutting him off his source.

    We both like the idea, but I don't know how to achieve this goal. Even if the Hexblade pick a MC feat like Sly Dodge, then go through all the multiclass way to Rogue (Novice, Acolity, Adept power feats), and take a MC Rogue Paragon instead of a Hexblade paragon, he should be able to choose a plain Hexblade daily power at levels 15 and 19 (and Utility power at level 16, although it could be swapped to a Skill power). I don't see a way to completely switch that Hexblade from new Arcane powers to, for example, Martial powers.

    Any ideas? Direly need you help.

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    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    You could make the said PC become a hybrid warlock/whatever. They would still have their previous warlock powers, but would get weakened as a warlock by this pact-breaking ritual.

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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcloure View Post
    You could make the said PC become a hybrid warlock/whatever. They would still have their previous warlock powers, but would get weakened as a warlock by this pact-breaking ritual.
    I don't like hybrids, and I'm not sure I know how to make a Hexblade hybrid, not a Warlock one.

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    I can't think of a RAW way to do it. What I'd recommend is investing in another class right now, possibly including alt-rewards appropriate for the second class. Then a few levels later, rebuild the character to be primarily the new class with some warlock MC.

    Alternatively, homebrew a PP that lets you trade in arcane dailies for appropriately badass martial benefits.

    I've played in a game about exploring an unfamiliar continent with races and power sources completely different from the homeland. Over the course of a couple years of play, the character's mechanics gradually changed from eladrin wizard to void-genasi hybrid wizard|psion. If you change a little at a time, it's not difficult to RP or to justify in character.
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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Thank you, Dimers. So it seems the homebrew PP is the best option. Or just let the player to choose matrial dailies in place of the mandative arcane ones.

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    There is an epic destiny that lets you pick powers from any class when you gain a new power.

    Refluff it, it it happens at epic. You coukd nake thr process take all of paragon...

    A pact breaker feat shouldn't be hard either.

    Pact Breaker: (Multiclass) Requires:Warlock class, non-Warlock MC feat, MC power swap daily, utility and encounter feats.

    You break your pact with your patron. Whenever you would gain a Warlock Power from now on, instead gain a power from your MC class. Replace one level one warlock at-will attack power with a level one at-will attack power from your multiclass class. Each time you gain a daily or encounter attack power from your multiclass this way (so 4 times total) you gain a free feat that requires your multiclass class.

    ---

    You keep your warlock class features, lose all but one at-will warlock attack power over the next 10 or so levels, and have 4 feats (power swap and this one) compensated for with class-specific feats from your MC class.
    Last edited by Yakk; 2019-03-16 at 10:48 AM.

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    I know it's not what you're looking for directly, but you could also do a massive lore reveal : Pact Masters are only required at the "unlock" stage - everything after that is 100% "pactee".

    You could have this revelation come from those "Pact Breakers" and have it be as massive a plot twist/reveal as you see fit.

    No mechanical changes required, and plenty of story options.
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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Yakk,
    this feat seems more natural than a bunch of official feats.

    MoutonRustique,
    I thought about something similar, but I prefer more "Assuming direct control" type of Master-Warlock interactions (with Sorcerer-King Pact as sole exception). It plays an important part in my campaign, so... Thank you anyway, it could be a very elegant solution.

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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    If the character just wants to stop gaining hexblade powers, then I like the feat/paragon path that essentially switches your class idea. Depending how soon this is going to happen, you might want to let them retrain their existing feats to the required MC feats instantly when it happens, so they're not stuck in a weird limbo.

    An alternative solution is for the player to outmaneuver their patron, either killing them and assuming their power or securing their own freedom while still being contractually entitled to the patron's power (via loophole wizardry, getting the patron over a barrel to force them to renegotiate, an alliance with some other power, some combination thereof, etc.). The player either continues as a hexblade (but no longer beholden) or continues in another class like above, only forgoing the mechanical cost as a roleplay reward. Obviously, this one's a lot trickier, but if you can pull it off without it feeling arbitrary or contrived will almost certainly feel a lot more epic.

    Aside: How are you going to handle the already acquired hexblade powers down the line? I haven't played 4e in far too long, but I remember you eventually get to exchange your early career powers for higher level ones. The player's hexblade powers are likely to be the weakest and thus most valuable to trade away; will they have to trade them for high-level powers in their new class or could they trade the ones they have for their more powerful equivalents (from the hexblade list, that is)? The first probably makes more sense without a patron, but the second maintains the flavor and mechanics of being a hexblade. Not an immediate problem by any means, but one with the potential to bite you in the butt later.
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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Quote Originally Posted by PoeticallyPsyco View Post
    Aside: How are you going to handle the already acquired hexblade powers down the line? I haven't played 4e in far too long, but I remember you eventually get to exchange your early career powers for higher level ones. The player's hexblade powers are likely to be the weakest and thus most valuable to trade away; will they have to trade them for high-level powers in their new class or could they trade the ones they have for their more powerful equivalents (from the hexblade list, that is)? The first probably makes more sense without a patron, but the second maintains the flavor and mechanics of being a hexblade. Not an immediate problem by any means, but one with the potential to bite you in the butt later.
    I haven't thought about it yet, but preferably the first variant (trade for powers in a new class, "losing" or "forgetting" or "letting go" the old powers). If there are powers, which essentially are new better versions of the old ones, I don't mind to slightly upgrade them. A lot of training and practice, or just better understanding of how to implement the old abilities, that's the explanation.

    By the way, at the last game session, in the face of incoming animosity with the patron and his servants-officers, I've got a glimpse of an idea, how to explain drops of warlock magic even when the contract is terminated. In order to gain assistance of a secret society, who knows the separating ritual, our Hexblade should prove his motives by slaying one of his patron's servants, who had been overseeing him over the whole Heroic Tier. Why not to rob the creature (of course, he is a Fey like the Patron himself) of a strip of his power?

    I think I'll just wait and see, where we'll be drawn by the flow of story.

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    The last two posts reminded me of a plot element in the Black Company series ... Briefly put, one character had been getting power for being a megademon's agent, then was cast aside when she stopped being useful. But having foreseen that, she had managed to become a parasite rather than a symbiont. She kept leeching power from the demon, knowing that it couldn't end the connection without harming itself.
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    Kobold

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    Default Re: How to deprive a hexblade from gaining arcane powers?

    Alternatively since we are really already breaking the 4e mechanical mold have him pick another class and have him get powers from that class. Personally I find the system at times avoids an easy answer by making things really complicated costly for little reason (for instance paragon multiclassing was made more work than it needs to be IMO). Why make it more complicated?
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