The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #121
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by tgva8889 View Post
    Good match! Clearly showing my inexperience but a fun time.
    Another reason why I love this tournament and thread. Good sportsmanship and respect.

  2. - Top - End - #122
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    That was a fun match! I was a little surprised (but also not, I suppose, because of the state of the meta) that y'all shared half your team but appreciated that y'all did different things with 'em.

    And I like the upset!

  3. - Top - End - #123
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    There are so many varieties of Pokemon to choose from.

  4. - Top - End - #124
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Yeah, it seemed like my team was more balanced-leaning while Piggy's team was more offense-minded, with the Magma Storm Heatran and Greninja (who I assume was Ash but Piggy never needed to use it). I made some bad choices in the beginning and then it just snowballed from there. Also Mega Scizor was pretty not good against Piggy's Pokemon.
    Last edited by tgva8889; 2019-04-25 at 10:39 PM.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Definitely. The team structure was superficially almost exactly the same on both. Dual regen teams with FWG cores always look a little alike, but we had a lot of similarities beyond just that: both teams used SD Garchomp, Torn-T, a specially defensive Grass-type, Heatran and an offensive Steel-type mega. But as tgva mentioned, tgva's team took that basic structure in a balance direction with things like Scizor and Pex (although it was far from passive thanks to triple Swords Dance), while I used a team that shifted things offensively with four attacks Mawile, stallbreaking offensive Heatran and Specs Ash-Gren.

    I think I always had a decent matchup advantage just because four attacks Mawile is such a pain for balance teams to deal with, especially if Toxapex ever gets trapped by Heatran, and my own Heatran did really well against everything but Garchomp. For me most of the early game was about trying to get tgva's Garchomp and Heatran weakened or removed so that my Heatran and Mawile could come in strong, and once my HP Ice + EQ AV Tangrowth opened those up for me, I pretty much just stuck to making safe plays until I saw an opportunity to get one of those two in.

    Good game, tgva. Was a fun one.
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  6. - Top - End - #126
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    I have no doubt that Ash Greninja is good, but is it just that much better than Protean Greninja? Protean was always a boss as far as I knew, but now 2/3rds of every OU team I practice against have AG. Did some strategy develop that nerfed Protean so he's not used anymore?

  7. - Top - End - #127
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Piggy Knowles View Post
    Definitely. The team structure was superficially almost exactly the same on both. Dual regen teams with FWG cores always look a little alike, but we had a lot of similarities beyond just that: both teams used SD Garchomp, Torn-T, a specially defensive Grass-type, Heatran and an offensive Steel-type mega. But as tgva mentioned, tgva's team took that basic structure in a balance direction with things like Scizor and Pex (although it was far from passive thanks to triple Swords Dance), while I used a team that shifted things offensively with four attacks Mawile, stallbreaking offensive Heatran and Specs Ash-Gren.

    I think I always had a decent matchup advantage just because four attacks Mawile is such a pain for balance teams to deal with, especially if Toxapex ever gets trapped by Heatran, and my own Heatran did really well against everything but Garchomp. For me most of the early game was about trying to get tgva's Garchomp and Heatran weakened or removed so that my Heatran and Mawile could come in strong, and once my HP Ice + EQ AV Tangrowth opened those up for me, I pretty much just stuck to making safe plays until I saw an opportunity to get one of those two in.

    Good game, tgva. Was a fun one.
    Both of you have a great team. Also I just learn from my experience from this tournament that I have more fun enjoying myself.

  8. - Top - End - #128
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Karnitis View Post
    I have no doubt that Ash Greninja is good, but is it just that much better than Protean Greninja? Protean was always a boss as far as I knew, but now 2/3rds of every OU team I practice against have AG. Did some strategy develop that nerfed Protean so he's not used anymore?
    I seem to remember there being quite a lot of push back about putting Ash-Greninja up to S-Rank (which, given that it was upped at the same time as Zygarde, which was later banned to Ubers as overcentralizing, and bad-for-fun within the meta, to show how it was rated), and I have to query how or why it's considered to be at the level of Heatran or Lando-T.

    That said, it's still quite easily one of the most threatening mon in the meta, and it's ability as an offensive mon to lay down Spikes and fire off Dark Pulses (which are flinch happy even if it doesn't kill, and is enough to force a switch). Once Transformed, Water Shuriken obviates having the need for Scarf users on the team, especially with rain up. And all of that combined, means that it can force a switch, giving free Spike layers, which can be then followed up by an easy switch, and bang - easy 12.5-18.75% Damage straight away.

    I think one of the issues is that there is not an S- Tier. I think Ash-Gren is better than A+, but not as good as the other S mon. Still, OU Tiering team did what OU Tiering team wanted, and now every man and their dog builds teams from the rankings.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Once you go blue, nothing else will do. Once you go Quarian...someone will die.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    This match was fun. Same format (doubles ubers) as I usually do.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    I dont see the appeal in using more then one Battle Beasts or Legendary to be honest.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Good games all around. In a twist Piggy Knowles and boj0, who both came in second in their pool, move on to the finals, while Karnitis and tgva can challenge each other for third place.

    And while we're not done yet, I kind of like this tournament thing, even if it's a bit slower than just jumping in the ladder and playing a bazillion games in term of getting matches in. So if anyone wants to host another tournament, maybe in another format?, after the upcoming finals, count me in.
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  13. - Top - End - #133
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmerlaus View Post
    I dont see the appeal in using more then one Battle Beasts or Legendary to be honest.
    Honestly, I hate to agree but same here. I think it's an old-man thing from when I played Gen 1/2 and mewtwo, mew, lugia, etc were all seen as super powerful. I totally get that with 50+ legendaries/UBs there are bound to be duds.

    But I get salty because even the worst legendary/UB (Regigas, Articuno) has amazing BST and every new one has to have it's own unique move that is also, huge surprise, great.

    I would never hold it against an opponent to use multiple legendaries, nor say "You only won because you used X." But...yeah, I don't think I will ever do so myself, or see the fun/appeal in it either.

  14. - Top - End - #134
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Karnitis View Post
    Honestly, I hate to agree but same here. I think it's an old-man thing from when I played Gen 1/2 and mewtwo, mew, lugia, etc were all seen as super powerful. I totally get that with 50+ legendaries/UBs there are bound to be duds.

    But I get salty because even the worst legendary/UB (Regigas, Articuno) has amazing BST and every new one has to have it's own unique move that is also, huge surprise, great.

    I would never hold it against an opponent to use multiple legendaries, nor say "You only won because you used X." But...yeah, I don't think I will ever do so myself, or see the fun/appeal in it either.
    A MegaArticuno with Snow Warning and 20-30 points of additional speed and SpA to ping off perfect accuracy Blizzards would be lovely. Or giving it's base form Snow Warning and a Mega Form Magic Guard to let it bounce in and out. Wouldn't need to be Uber relevant but I'd like to see RU or maybe even OU at a push.

    Maybe something to make Hail viable. There needs to be better tank benefiting from hail though for that.
    Last edited by NatureKing; 2019-04-29 at 02:14 PM.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Agreed. I love ice-type, but they're better as a move rather than a pokemon

    The problem is hail is mono-type. Sandstorm helps/ignores ground, steel and rock. Rain dance is good for water & electric (and hurts no one) and Sunny day is for fire & grass (and hurts no one).

    I would like to say hail should immunify water or steel, but that would just make them dominate weather teams. IDK what other type logically would ignore/benefit from hail.

  16. - Top - End - #136
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Karnitis View Post
    Agreed. I love ice-type, but they're better as a move rather than a pokemon

    The problem is hail is mono-type. Sandstorm helps/ignores ground, steel and rock. Rain dance is good for water & electric (and hurts no one) and Sunny day is for fire & grass (and hurts no one).

    I would like to say hail should immunify water or steel, but that would just make them dominate weather teams. IDK what other type logically would ignore/benefit from hail.
    Ghost type? Hail lets ghost type hit normal, or boosts their Def or SpDef? Ghosts are associated with cold quite often.

    What if Hail slowed fire-types? The cold is getting to them?

    Oooh I got it! Fighting types! They ignore hail and it boosts their Def, because fighters training on the top of mountains and in the cold and breaking ice is canon. Creates nice symmetry with water/electric boosted by rain and fire/grass boosted by sun, both the type and its weakness get a boost.
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  17. - Top - End - #137
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    What if they just gave more Pokemon ice immunity abilities or made better ones? There's a healing one, what if that was on a non-Ice Pokemon? They put Sand Veil on the cactus. Plus you can still use some Magic Guard Pokemon like Reuniclus, Alakazam, and Clefable, so you get some little bit of mixing up types. But yeah, it's mostly that Ice is not a great type to be unless it helps you do lots of extra damage.
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  18. - Top - End - #138
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by tgva8889 View Post
    What if they just gave more Pokemon ice immunity abilities or made better ones? There's a healing one, what if that was on a non-Ice Pokemon? They put Sand Veil on the cactus. Plus you can still use some Magic Guard Pokemon like Reuniclus, Alakazam, and Clefable, so you get some little bit of mixing up types. But yeah, it's mostly that Ice is not a great type to be unless it helps you do lots of extra damage.
    The chip damage is secondary.

    Look at rain:
    - Water Damage Boost
    - Fire Damage Nerf
    - Most dangerous Flying type Move Accuracy Boost
    - Most dangerous electric type move accuracy boost
    - Speed Boosting Moves on an excellent type
    - Status Absorbing abilities

    Sun
    - Fire type damage boost
    - Water type damage nerf
    - 2 Turn move enhancer for Grass
    - HP restore move improving

    Sand
    - already mentioned

    Hail
    - Blizzard always hits
    - Minor Chip

    Hail needs to buff Ice type damage by 50% to remotely bring it in line with Rain/Sun. Alternatively, a 50% Phys Def buff for Ice types. This instantly puts mon like Protean Greninja pride of place, while also allaying some of the weaknesses that mon like Articuno or Weavile have. Hell, you could throw Mamoswine into much of the meta with how fat it becomes, and Mega-Abomasnow's 132 SpA 100% Accuracy Blizzards switching into Earthquakes becomes a thing.

    Other potential buffs: Hail sets a deep chill doing continually exponential damage to non Ice mon, similar to Toxic. Turn 1 deals 1/16, turn 2, 2/16, etc. It keeps it as a primary wall breaker type: any mon which stays in for 3 Turns taking +50% damage Boosted Stab Blizzards and losing around 30% Health from the weather massively changes its utility.

    By making certain types immune to that, say Fire and Ice, you have a much more narrow switch in opportunity, helping turning mon with particular counters

    If it empowered Hurricane, you now have Articuno able to send 100% Accuracy Blizzard and Hurricanes.

    Making all Ice type moves have the Freeze Dry effect to take on Water while Hail is up would switch things massively in Hail's favour, especially if it has the opposite effect and gives Water Half Power as it turns it to Ice.

    Giving more mon Slush Rush to take advantage of the Hail.

    Not all of these of course that would be ridiculous, but Ice in general needs some love, especially now Fairies are a thing.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    From a thematic perspective, hail should boost the physical defense of Ice types the way sand boosts the special defense of Rock types. That way it's all balanced: Rain and Sun boost the offensive damage of certain types and don't deal chip damage, while Hail and Sand boost the defensive stats of certain types and deal chip damage. Hail still wouldn't be all that great, since Ice is one of the worst defensive typings around, but at least it would make sense.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    I'm really enjoying playing Pokemon Showdown. It's a great website to play any type of Pokemon.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Riveting! IMO
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Hello, I'm wondering if anyone in the thread would happen to have one of the following Pokemon with hidden ability; Cranidos, Glameow, Tepig, Tyrunt and Patrat. If you do, I am currently breeding 5 IV, Timid, Snow Warning Amura and 5 IV Adamant HA Extreme Speed Dratini to trade for them (I currently have 1 of the former and 2 of the latter, more will come). If you have one of the Pokemon I'm looking for and would like something else let me know, odds are I can breed it for you
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    What's the story behind Shinies Pokemon? What are they anyway?

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    What's the story behind Shinies Pokemon? What are they anyway?
    Every time you encounter a pokemon on your journey you have an approximately 1 in 4000 chance that the pokemon encountered will have a different colour pallet than the standard. This is accompanied by a small star animation and chime when it appears in battle. And that’s all shiny pokemon are. Just a Cubone that’s green or a Haunter with a blue tongue. There are no stat differences outside the first couple games, and those were only because specific stat values determined shininess back then.

    But many of the methods of increasing your chance of finding a shiny also manipulate the stats. They’re just personal bragging rights.
    Last edited by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins; 2019-05-04 at 08:15 PM.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins View Post
    Every time you encounter a pokemon on your journey you have an approximately 1 in 4000 chance that the pokemon encountered will have a different colour pallet than the standard. This is accompanied by a small star animation and chime when it appears in battle. And that’s all shiny pokemon are. Just a Cubone that’s green or a Haunter with a blue tongue. There are no stat differences outside the first couple games, and those were only because specific stat values determined shininess back then.

    But many of the methods of increasing your chance of finding a shiny also manipulate the stats.
    Are Shinies Pokemon powerful than regular Pokemon?

  26. - Top - End - #146
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    Are Shinies Pokemon powerful than regular Pokemon?
    Exactly the same.
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by enderlord99 View Post
    Exactly the same.
    Ok. Anyway I'm enjoying Pokemon Let's Go Overused in Pokemon Showdown. I'm thinking of playing a Dragon/Steel Team.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Water Pulse has never been sound-based, despite its Gen 3 description.

    EDIT: This battle is one of my weirdest yet. Lotsa mind-games and such.
    Last edited by enderlord99; 2019-05-08 at 12:54 AM.
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  29. - Top - End - #149
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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Roost is a very annoying move if the Pokemon is a flying-type. That move irritates me when someone use a broken recovery move.

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    Default Re: Pokémon Thread XXIX: Sword, Shield, and Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    Roost is a very annoying move if the Pokemon is a flying-type. That move irritates me when someone use a broken recovery move.
    Roost is no worse than Recover, but this *is* why people specifically lay out spreads to make sure you can two-hit KO certain threats. Because a 3 or 4 hit KO can simply be Recovered off.
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