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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lyracian View Post
    It also says the Lich only has to feed the phylacytory 'periodically'. While that is not a defined time span I would expect it to be months not days and certainly not a single day. They are going to have problems focusing on there arcane plans if they have to go and get a mortal every day.

    I do have an amusing idea of a Lich buying slaves at market or taking the condemned prisoners from the city jail for his sacrifices. A Lawful-Evil I can consume these soles and get on with writing my book and you goody-too-shoes Players cannot stop me without breaking the law.
    "24 hours" is a period. Something done every 24 hours would be done periodically.

    Also, note that nothing says the consumed creature must be human(oid).

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Alternatively if this hasnít been said before. Let this be the start of a redemption arc for the Lich. Have the Lich start helping the players.
    Letís say the Lich can no longer cast magic so, the only use for it is knowledge. Have it start sharing its knowledge.
    Last edited by Garfunion; 2019-05-22 at 04:54 PM.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    RogueGuy

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackPhoenix View Post
    "24 hours" is a period. Something done every 24 hours would be done periodically.
    Also, note that nothing says the consumed creature must be human(oid).
    I would use the word daily for that. We have different views on what the word periodically means and no amount of debating English will change that.

    If a Lich had to feed its Phylactory every day it would be spending more time on maintenance than if it had just stayed alive and used a demi-plane full of Clones to live for ever. At least with it being a game my Lich can it 1 sole a year and yours can feed it one sole a day and we are both in line with what is in the rulebook.

  4. - Top - End - #34
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lyracian View Post
    I would use the word daily for that. We have different views on what the word periodically means and no amount of debating English will change that.

    If a Lich had to feed its Phylactory every day it would be spending more time on maintenance than if it had just stayed alive and used a demi-plane full of Clones to live for ever. At least with it being a game my Lich can it 1 sole a year and yours can feed it one sole a day and we are both in line with what is in the rulebook.
    Well, lich in my game would degenerate into a demilich quickly if he tried to eat soles, but then, it wouldn't be a big loss in the terms of intellect

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    Chimera

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackPhoenix View Post
    Well, lich in my game would degenerate into a demilich quickly if he tried to eat soles, but then, it wouldn't be a big loss in the terms of intellect
    If they always bought out an entire restaurant and ate a normal meal, would it count, since they were the sole eater?

    Alternatively, lichdom puts Charlie Chaplin in a whole new light.

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    DwarfFighterGuy

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trustypeaches View Post
    Is there a reason this lich needs to escape and reenter the story?

    To be honest, it sounds like the players were exceptionally clever, and you may want to question whether it's necessary to undermine that.
    I like this. I've been a culprit of it myself, with a constantly escaping/re-appearing enemy. It was a major nuisance and every time he showed up, a PC died. Once the players devise a clever plan and overcome this, don't take that moment away from them.
    Last edited by allthingslich; 2019-05-23 at 08:30 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Imp

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by allthingslich View Post
    I like this. I've been a culprit of it myself, with a constantly escaping/re-appearing enemy. It was a major nuisance and every time he showed up, a PC died. Once the players devise a clever plan and overcome this, don't take that moment away from them.
    As a DM, I wouldn't take that moment from them if the plan was actually clever.

    "Shoving the lich in the bag of holding" isn't incapacitating to the lich. Hell, nothing says it can't get out of it by the bag's opening while the PCs aren't looking.

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    In eberron there are two types of undead (relevant for reason's that will be clear later). The first kind is the traditional mabaran undead that are powered by negative energy from mabar. The second are deathless that are powered by positive life energy willingly given as a complex & irrelevant form of ancestor worshipish type thing. The Dragons view both as an abomination because it is a blight that drains life from the world itself with darksun defiler type implied wording here & there.

    That last part is the important part... it sure would be a heck of a shame if said light started to corrupt the enchantment on the bag of holding & shifted it from being linked to the astral to being linked to Mabar. It would specially be a shame since doing so would A: be like hooking the lich up the a nuclear power plant for liches and B: either allow something from mabar to climb out or cause the bag to start aging out of existence until either the lich steps out fully healed & ready to smash while possibly even creating a manifest zone to mabar in the process.

    If that happened in eberron, it would probbly be bad, but manifest zones are natural and can be dealt with.. if it happened in other settings it would be horiffic because the whole plot of PotA is largely about stopping cultists from effectively creating some manifest zones.

  9. - Top - End - #39
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    Chimera

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unoriginal View Post
    As a DM, I wouldn't take that moment from them if the plan was actually clever.

    "Shoving the lich in the bag of holding" isn't incapacitating to the lich. Hell, nothing says it can't get out of it by the bag's opening while the PCs aren't looking.
    I think one of the first things that I would do in this situation is make sure that my players and I had the same conception of what a bag of holding is, and how it works. My suspicion is that the players in the OP's scenario think that the bag is some kind of extradimensional 'other-where' that is effectively a prison, whereas the item according to the DMG description makes more clear that you are actually still in the bag and can come out the opening (or cut the bag open from the inside, etc.).

    I've certainly had players say they were stashing a bunch of looted weapon in the bag without mentioning scabbards or the like. I'm not a jerk, so I clarified. However, I'm pretty sure 1-2 of them hadn't ever thought that the BoH was just a bag that happens to be very big on the inside.

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    druid91's Avatar

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Contingency.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarZero View Post
    I like the "hobo" in there.
    "Hey, you just got 10000gp! You going to buy a fully staffed mansion or something?"
    "Nah, I'll upgrade my +2 sword to a +3 sword and sleep in my cloak."

    Non est salvatori salvator, neque defensori dominus, nec pater nec mater, nihil supernum.

    Torumekian knight Avatar by Licoot.

    Note to self: Never get involved in an ethics thread again...Especially if I'm defending the empire.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    Anderlith's Avatar

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Have them chew the side of the bag, gnashing their teeth to create a hole, spilling the contents

  12. - Top - End - #42
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    Imp

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    Default Re: The problem with the lich.

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie the Duck View Post
    I think one of the first things that I would do in this situation is make sure that my players and I had the same conception of what a bag of holding is, and how it works. My suspicion is that the players in the OP's scenario think that the bag is some kind of extradimensional 'other-where' that is effectively a prison, whereas the item according to the DMG description makes more clear that you are actually still in the bag and can come out the opening (or cut the bag open from the inside, etc.).

    I've certainly had players say they were stashing a bunch of looted weapon in the bag without mentioning scabbards or the like. I'm not a jerk, so I clarified. However, I'm pretty sure 1-2 of them hadn't ever thought that the BoH was just a bag that happens to be very big on the inside.
    Sure, explaining the issue when the PCs would know about it is good form.

    The gotcha game isn't fun for anyone on the receiving end.
    Last edited by Unoriginal; 2019-05-23 at 01:08 PM.

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