Pathfinder: Kingmaker Planning and Guides (SPOILERS WELCOME!)?

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Now that the final DLC and Enhanced Edition for Pathfinder: Kingmaker are out, I'm making plans of attack for my playthrough. I'm the kind of guy who likes to strive for 100% completion of quests and seeking the best endings for the game, barring specific mutually-exclusive stuff like romances or alignment-based branches, and so I like to do research and seek out spoilers and walkthroughs. Unfortunately, it appears that Pathfinder: Kingmaker doesn't really seem to have a lot of guides and stuff written for it the way games like the Baldur's Gate series or Neverwinter Nights games. Even the game's wiki has a lot of unfinished articles and dead links.

As a result, I'm at a bit of a loss as to where to begin, especially since there's a lot of moving parts with this game right from the start (Neverwinter Nights 2 for example, has Crossroad Keep but not really until the middle of the game's second act, whereas in this game you've got your kingdom right from the get-go after the "prologue" of dealing with the Stag Lord). In addition, alignment definitely seems to have MUCH greater impact on the storyline in this game than in any previous one, given how a lot of enemies can become allies only if you're Chaotic, which is kinda hard for me as a roleplayer, as my username implies. Add to that the DLCs and I'm not sure what to play first. Do I play Varnhold's Lot like a prequel, or can I start in with the base game and do it as I move along in-game? How do I utilize Beneath The Stolen Lands, since it's clear you're not necessarily meant to get the whole experience of that with your main character, and characters in that DLC are EXPECTED to die at some point?

So, how do I begin to approach this? How do I design my character to be best equipped to get as close to "the full Pathfinder: Kingmaker experience" as possible in a single playthrough? How do I build proper cities so I don't just impulsively build myself into a corner? Am I overthinking things the way I do for my play-by-post gaming? Thank you all in advance for your help and advice!

[Narkis]

RE: DLC: Varnhold's Lot is set approximately at the same time as Chapter 2 of the main campaign, so that's when I would recommend you to play it. Beneath The Stolen Lands is essentially two related modules in one, the first being the random dungeon that has nothing to do with the campaign, and the second being a specific dungeon you will encounter at some point in the campaign. (From what I've read. I'm only now starting a game with the Enhanced Edition and all DLC myself)

Re: Ending: Read this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_...ilers_by_free/

With some quick googling I also found this walktrough. Skimming the chapter titles some things seem to be missing, but it should help with what you want.

Your main character's class and race don't matter all that much, story-wise. Skills generally use automatically whoever in your party has the best modifier, but there are some parts in the game where your PC is alone and has to throw some dice. I'd recommend a good diplomacy (as befits a ruler), perception and whatever else fits your character. Most challenges have more than one skill that helps anyway.

I think they've changed how the kingdom works since I last played so I don't know how much I can help with that. It wasn't all that difficult though, as long as you were in your capital before the monthly tick and made sure to assign an advisor to all potentially harmful events.

The game has timers and it's serious about them. They're not a suggestion as in may other CRPGs. It gives you more than enough time to do the main quest and the sidequests if you're careful, but faffing about too much or especially 5-minute adventuring days can doom you. Resting is the biggest timesink. Never leave home without plenty of rations, hunting for the entire party takes too much time. And when someone tells you to hurry and do X because it's important, you should believe them. Quite a few sidequests can be failed quietly in the background if you take too long to get there.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

The game has timers and it's serious about them. They're not a suggestion as in may other CRPGs. It gives you more than enough time to do the main quest and the sidequests if you're careful, but faffing about too much or especially 5-minute adventuring days can doom you. Resting is the biggest timesink. Never leave home without plenty of rations, hunting for the entire party takes too much time. And when someone tells you to hurry and do X because it's important, you should believe them. Quite a few sidequests can be failed quietly in the background if you take too long to get there.

That's something that I'm worried about too. It's why I'm hesitant to play the original Fallout. I feel like I have to have all my plans ready before starting, because I can't jump back and forth between playing the game and reading my guides.

[tyckspoon]

That's something that I'm worried about too. It's why I'm hesitant to play the original Fallout. I feel like I have to have all my plans ready before starting, because I can't jump back and forth between playing the game and reading my guides.

Tangent, but the original Fallout doesn't really have a practical time limit - there's a few fairly easy to access things you can do to extend it, and even if you don't as long as you're actually trying to do stuff and aren't just wandering circles in the desert for random encounters (or I suppose spending days and days resting to recover HP instead of First Aid/Doctoring yourself, using Stimpaks, or having an NPC doctor treat you) you won't be at any significant risk of using it all. It's mostly there to add a sense of tension. Even wandering the desert pointlessly can be made fairly quick if you have a high Outdoorsman skill (Will admit I often use a save-file editor to cheat in extra Outdoorsman points and add in the 'you travel faster overland' Perks, because I haaate watching the hatchmark that is your character's world map marker crawwwwwwwl over a map square.)

[Aotrs Commander]

Ooh, is the EE out already?

Hah, spoiled for choice now, what with Spellforce 3's new DLC and still being... something over half/two-thirds the way through Deadfire.

My patience (I kickstarted!) shall be rewarded at last...!

[Winthur]

Tangent, but the original Fallout doesn't really have a practical time limit - there's a few fairly easy to access things you can do to extend it, and even if you don't as long as you're actually trying to do stuff and aren't just wandering circles in the desert for random encounters (or I suppose spending days and days resting to recover HP instead of First Aid/Doctoring yourself, using Stimpaks, or having an NPC doctor treat you) you won't be at any significant risk of using it all. It's mostly there to add a sense of tension. Even wandering the desert pointlessly can be made fairly quick if you have a high Outdoorsman skill (Will admit I often use a save-file editor to cheat in extra Outdoorsman points and add in the 'you travel faster overland' Perks, because I haaate watching the hatchmark that is your character's world map marker crawwwwwwwl over a map square.)

Echoing this to confirm you will absolutely never, ever run out of time when playing Fallout 1 no matter how much you fiddle-diddle around. You can even extend the time limit to the point where it's even less likely.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Are there any questlines I have to do at specific times or in specific chapters because the game doesn't let you go back to those areas when the act changes? Permanently Missable Content is one of my deepest gaming fears and the reason I seek spoilers so doggedly.

RRGH! It feels like this game has too many moving parts to keep track of!

EDIT: I'm starting to wonder if maybe I should be asking more specific questions.

• How much "Chaotic ally" content am I going to miss if I play something like a paladin, i.e. allying with Tartuk, Armag, etc.? Should I ditch the paladin concept and just play something like an Inquisitor or Cleric who can be Chaotic Good?
• Is there any particular magic items/weapons/armor I should be keeping an eye out for aside from Briar, which I'm not likely to keep, instead giving it back to Nyrissa? Are there essential items that necessitate building your character around them like the Silver Sword of Gith in Neverwinter Nights 2?
• When I asked about the Varnhold's Lot campaign, I was asking more about how it figures into the Main Story: if you start in the Main Story, do you suddenly get a new Character Creation screen when you reach the Varnhold's Lot content in it, and then jump back and forth between the Main Story and Varnhold's as thing progress, or do you need to play through the entirety of Varnhold's Lot separately on its own, and then import its results into your Main Story?
• Is there any "penalty" for beelining straight for quest objectives to avoid running out of time anytime I get a quest, or are there solutions that can only be reached when certain times are hit? What worries me in regards to the timers is the overall time-limit for whatever chapter I'm in getting eaten up while I'm running around making sure all the sidequests are done. Plus, my understanding is a lot of quests are "tangled" together, and I'm concerned the optimal solution for one sidequest will guarantee an unoptimal solution for another (for example, if I romance and save Nyrissa, does that mean I can't save both Octavia and Regongar and thus one of them is doomed?). Are there scenarios like that?
• While the fact that skill challenges always use that of the companion with the highest score is a relief, meaning my character doesn't have to do everything themselves like in Neverwinter Nights 2, are there any MUST HAVE skills or ability scores to max out or at least keep in mind when building my main character if I want to get the optimal results for each quest?

[Spore]

Are there any questlines I have to do at specific times or in specific chapters because the game doesn't let you go back to those areas when the act changes? Permanently Missable Content is one of my deepest gaming fears and the reason I seek spoilers so doggedly.

Spoiler: companions seems to be the only permanently missable content

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You have to roam the Northwest of the map to encounter a strong party of Technic League slavers who hold two potential companions captive, do so before tackling the Staglord. You have to free a cleric from a temple area (also in the west). At the start of the second chapter, when you're told to check something west of your city, you encounter an alchemist companion. You find a ranger at the Ruined Watchtower and a rogue during a quest involving Rovagug.

RRGH! It feels like this game has too many moving parts to keep track of!

Yes. I would personally let go for the 100% run because Kingmaker is crafted to make every playthrough a slightly different experience.

You can have different routes to take whether you succeed on tracking down Tartuccio after the encounter in the ruins or not. But it's not much difference besides roaming around the map instead of instantly following him.

[*]How much "Chaotic ally" content am I going to miss if I play something like a paladin, i.e. allying with Tartuk, Armag, etc.? Should I ditch the paladin concept and just play something like an Inquisitor or Cleric who can be Chaotic Good?

Kingmaker is before all a game of civilisation and law versus chaos and wilderness. If you go with the grain, obviously some things will be easier. (You can justify your LG paladin working with Amiri even though she is a CN barbarian murder hobo light but can you justify a CE magus? A NE undead inquisitor of the god of death? Or even the LN cleric of the god of making fun of depression and nihilism?)

Personally I can see two character choices working in the context:
1) chaotic nature-y type: Jamandi Aldori needs someone who knows the wilds. My barbarian was that someone. As a result I treat my settlement far more liberally than any close city would.
1) LG/LN Enforcer/dispenser of Justice: I picked an Aldori Defender because you can't just give me jobs for the Aldori family hint at the staglord being a former Aldori Swordlord, and drop another good item for said subclass in the first act and NOT expect my character to revolve around that. There are other cool exotic combat styles in the game but Dueling Swords are by far the most prominent.

[*]Is there any particular magic items/weapons/armor I should be keeping an eye out for aside from Briar, which I'm not likely to keep, instead giving it back to Nyrissa? Are there essential items that necessitate building your character around them like the Silver Sword of Gith in Neverwinter Nights 2?

Each chapter has a fragmented magical item that vastly buffs a specific role:https://pathfinderkingmaker.gamepedi...elic_Fragments

You don't NEED to build a character around that but you CAN. Much more important is the fact that you need some ways to deal with fey and their magic. Amiri for example has the problem in Act 1 that she has basically no defense and dies quickly. When she becomes a melee power house that kills enemies before they can hurt her, they hurl will saves at her (her worst save, with almost no way for a barbarian to buff those) so either have a cleric with Protection from Evil ready or die by HER sword.

[*]When I asked about the Varnhold's Lot campaign, I was asking more about how it figures into the Main Story: if you start in the Main Story, do you suddenly get a new Character Creation screen when you reach the Varnhold's Lot content in it, and then jump back and forth between the Main Story and Varnhold's as thing progress, or do you need to play through the entirety of Varnhold's Lot separately on its own, and then import its results into your Main Story?

Don't have it yet.

[*]Is there any "penalty" for beelining straight for quest objectives to avoid running out of time anytime I get a quest, or are there solutions that can only be reached when certain times are hit? What worries me in regards to the timers is the overall time-limit for whatever chapter I'm in getting eaten up while I'm running around making sure all the sidequests are done. Plus, my understanding is a lot of quests are "tangled" together, and I'm concerned the optimal solution for one sidequest will guarantee an unoptimal solution for another (for example, if I romance and save Nyrissa, does that mean I can't save both Octavia and Regongar and thus one of them is doomed?). Are there scenarios like that?

I have quit the game after chapter 2 but other than that you get bonus loot for finishing the first act in under 90 days no which is quite easy as long as you find your way through the wilderness.

[*]While the fact that skill challenges always use that of the companion with the highest score is a relief, meaning my character doesn't have to do everything themselves like in Neverwinter Nights 2, are there any MUST HAVE skills or ability scores to max out or at least keep in mind when building my main character if I want to get the optimal results for each quest?

Every skill is used at least once. But some are more useful than others.

Athletics is used to climb and barge through barred doors and whatnot. Mildly useful as there is always a way around that. I'd pick one point to activate the class skill on any STRONG character or any character that is flooded with points.

Mobility give an AC bonus like Tumble did back in NWN. It also allows to avoid opportunity attacks and has similar uses on the world map though it is more useful as you can climb or squeeze into some hidden loot caches. I'd max it with a melee character and utility monkey.

Stealth is mainly used to avoid combat on the world map and during rests which uses ressources and only gives little XP and no special loot. Personally I'd still take any encounter because bandits carry composite bows which is an easy 100 gp in the early game. You can however use it to scout and get the drop on the enemy.

Trickery is disabling traps. And yes, you will need it. The damage is deadly. I have Linzi on that and have "skill users get the XP for using skills" activated because having a bard level up a smidge earlier helps the whole party (as she is primary buffer, secondary healer and skill monkey).

Knowledge is weird.
Arcana is obscure and I had yet to run into problems solved by it. But I only played Chapter 1 so the mystical problems are rare at best.
World is only used for cooking as far as I know. My cooks always botch the food on the road anyways (one day I'll main char a halfling gourmet wizard!)

Lore
is much MUCH more useful. Nature is used to track enemies, used to skin animals, to hunt for food (unless you want to carry trail rations EVERYWHERE which saves on quest timers but is heavy).
Religion is fringe use at best. It's useless most of the time unless you find a temple or deal with undead. Then suddenly its the best skill in the world.

But you mainly deal with Fey and Giants in the latter game so no.

Perception is like in the tabletop sososososososososososo important. Have you wisdom caster take it whether the have it as a class skill or not. Have your skill monkey pick it. Have someone else pick it too. It is so important. The game does secret perception checks for you. You find loot hidden everywhere. And traps, you find traps just as often.

Persuasion is the KEY social skill. You just need one character with it, but he needs it BADLY. You have two persuasion queues to recruit party members instantly (instead of having to wait), you can turn away criticism pointed at you. And you are ruling a kingdom for christ's sake. Take thissssss!

Use Magic Device Invest in it if you want a specific wand to work on your character. It is praised by many players in tabletop but I never got the appeal.

[Narkis]

How much "Chaotic ally" content am I going to miss if I play something like a paladin, i.e. allying with Tartuk, Armag, etc.? Should I ditch the paladin concept and just play something like an Inquisitor or Cleric who can be Chaotic Good?

Generally the Lawful choice is to exterminate the trolls, kobolds, etc that threaten your kingdom. A paladin will restrict you in that regard. You should play something chaotic if you want to make peace with them. But no matter what you choose, some content will be missed. If you ally with Tartuk, you won't be able to finish Harrim's quest, iirc. You cannot 100% in a single playthrough.

When I asked about the Varnhold's Lot campaign, I was asking more about how it figures into the Main Story: if you start in the Main Story, do you suddenly get a new Character Creation screen when you reach the Varnhold's Lot content in it, and then jump back and forth between the Main Story and Varnhold's as thing progress, or do you need to play through the entirety of Varnhold's Lot separately on its own, and then import its results into your Main Story?

The latter. They are connected only at the beginning and at the end. When you begin Varnhold's Lot it asks you if you want to import a save from the main campaign and at the beginning of the main campain's Chapter 3 the game asks you if you have a completed Varnhold's Lot save to import to the main campaign. They are otherwise unconnected.

Is there any "penalty" for beelining straight for quest objectives to avoid running out of time anytime I get a quest, or are there solutions that can only be reached when certain times are hit? What worries me in regards to the timers is the overall time-limit for whatever chapter I'm in getting eaten up while I'm running around making sure all the sidequests are done. Plus, my understanding is a lot of quests are "tangled" together, and I'm concerned the optimal solution for one sidequest will guarantee an unoptimal solution for another (for example, if I romance and save Nyrissa, does that mean I can't save both Octavia and Regongar and thus one of them is doomed?). Are there scenarios like that?

There are no solutions that require you to wait, as far as I'm aware. There are solutions that get locked if you wait too long. The game can be trusted when it tells you to hurry, unlike most other CRPG's I've played. A few examples from the Chapter 2 are the missing kid, saving Delgado from the troll attack and the bald hilltop. The first two are sidequests where the NPC in question dies if you take too long to get there and the latter will destroy your kingdom if you ignore it after you learn it's started spewing forth monsters. The overall time-limit is forgiving enough that I was able to do all sidequests with time to spare. You just need to be efficient with your travels, and conservative with your rests. And there are many cases with mutually exclusive solutions. You cannot 100% a single playthrough.

While the fact that skill challenges always use that of the companion with the highest score is a relief, meaning my character doesn't have to do everything themselves like in Neverwinter Nights 2, are there any MUST HAVE skills or ability scores to max out or at least keep in mind when building my main character if I want to get the optimal results for each quest?

For your main character I'd say perception and persuasion are absolutely essential, knowledges and lores have their uses, and there are cases where you are called to make a mobility or athletics roll by yourself.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

This advice is incredibly helpful! Thank you!

Spoiler: companions seems to be the only permanently missable content

Show

You have to roam the Northwest of the map to encounter a strong party of Technic League slavers who hold two potential companions captive, do so before tackling the Staglord. You have to free a cleric from a temple area (also in the west). At the start of the second chapter, when you're told to check something west of your city, you encounter an alchemist companion. You find a ranger at the Ruined Watchtower and a rogue during a quest involving Rovagug.

What's the "arbitrary headcount limit" in this game? I'm curious as to how many companions I can bring with me at once, especially for the purposes of quest banter.

Yes. I would personally let go for the 100% run because Kingmaker is crafted to make every playthrough a slightly different experience.

I'm well aware of that, but does that mean that ACTUAL QUESTS are barred from you for pursuing certain paths, or can you potentially tick all the quest boxes off in a single game? Is it like Neverwinter Nights 2 where choosing to join the Guards or the Smugglers is a branching point in the story, but you ultimately get to the same place from either branch, or more like Jade Empire where your alignment basically meant you couldn't even DO certain quests because an NPC said "No, you're too Good/Bad" so the unfinished quest sat in your journal taunting you all the way until the end of the game?

Kingmaker is before all a game of civilisation and law versus chaos and wilderness. If you go with the grain, obviously some things will be easier. (You can justify your LG paladin working with Amiri even though she is a CN barbarian murder hobo light but can you justify a CE magus? A NE undead inquisitor of the god of death? Or even the LN cleric of the god of making fun of depression and nihilism?)

Well, Regongar barely counts as evil from what I've seen. Sure he's hedonistic and quick to pursue violence (especially when slavers are involved), and more importantly he can be helped away from that mentality. As for Jaethal...yeah, I see that as potentially problematic, but at the same time everyone else seems willing to at least give her a chance, and she can be steered away from the dark path as well (if only fatally). Harrim is Chaotic Neutral, but yeah, he's determined to be gloomy. But at least he doesn't go out of his way to harm people.

Personally I can see two character choices working in the context:
1) chaotic nature-y type: Jamandi Aldori needs someone who knows the wilds. My barbarian was that someone. As a result I treat my settlement far more liberally than any close city would.
1) LG/LN Enforcer/dispenser of Justice: I picked an Aldori Defender because you can't just give me jobs for the Aldori family hint at the staglord being a former Aldori Swordlord, and drop another good item for said subclass in the first act and NOT expect my character to revolve around that. There are other cool exotic combat styles in the game but Dueling Swords are by far the most prominent.

The latter was kind of what I instantly wanted to play as soon as Kingmaker came out, namely a paladin who later becomes an Aldori Swordlord themselves (originally conceived with Duelist in mind but now that the actual Aldori Swordlord PrC is in the game, so that's changed)!

Each chapter has a fragmented magical item that vastly buffs a specific role:https://pathfinderkingmaker.gamepedi...elic_Fragments

You don't NEED to build a character around that but you CAN. Much more important is the fact that you need some ways to deal with fey and their magic. Amiri for example has the problem in Act 1 that she has basically no defense and dies quickly. When she becomes a melee power house that kills enemies before they can hurt her, they hurl will saves at her (her worst save, with almost no way for a barbarian to buff those) so either have a cleric with Protection from Evil ready or die by HER sword.

Thanks for the warning! I'll keep that in mind.

Every skill is used at least once. But some are more useful than others.

Athletics is used to climb and barge through barred doors and whatnot. Mildly useful as there is always a way around that. I'd pick one point to activate the class skill on any STRONG character or any character that is flooded with points.

Mobility give an AC bonus like Tumble did back in NWN. It also allows to avoid opportunity attacks and has similar uses on the world map though it is more useful as you can climb or squeeze into some hidden loot caches. I'd max it with a melee character and utility monkey.

Stealth is mainly used to avoid combat on the world map and during rests which uses ressources and only gives little XP and no special loot. Personally I'd still take any encounter because bandits carry composite bows which is an easy 100 gp in the early game. You can however use it to scout and get the drop on the enemy.

Trickery is disabling traps. And yes, you will need it. The damage is deadly. I have Linzi on that and have "skill users get the XP for using skills" activated because having a bard level up a smidge earlier helps the whole party (as she is primary buffer, secondary healer and skill monkey).

Knowledge is weird.
Arcana is obscure and I had yet to run into problems solved by it. But I only played Chapter 1 so the mystical problems are rare at best.
World is only used for cooking as far as I know. My cooks always botch the food on the road anyways (one day I'll main char a halfling gourmet wizard!)

Lore
is much MUCH more useful. Nature is used to track enemies, used to skin animals, to hunt for food (unless you want to carry trail rations EVERYWHERE which saves on quest timers but is heavy).
Religion is fringe use at best. It's useless most of the time unless you find a temple or deal with undead. Then suddenly its the best skill in the world.

Most likely Mobility will be my next choice then...I imagine World also comes up in conversations. I'm trying to take into account the skills not just in their practical uses in-game, but in conversations as well (like how in Neverwinter Nights 2, you had a number of options you couldn't see unless you put a few points in the otherwise useless Appraise skill).

Perception is like in the tabletop sososososososososososo important. Have you wisdom caster take it whether the have it as a class skill or not. Have your skill monkey pick it. Have someone else pick it too. It is so important. The game does secret perception checks for you. You find loot hidden everywhere. And traps, you find traps just as often.

Persuasion is the KEY social skill. You just need one character with it, but he needs it BADLY. You have two persuasion queues to recruit party members instantly (instead of having to wait), you can turn away criticism pointed at you. And you are ruling a kingdom for christ's sake. Take thissssss!

Use Magic Device Invest in it if you want a specific wand to work on your character. It is praised by many players in tabletop but I never got the appeal.

I figured that Perception and Persuasion would be my two MUST HAVES. Especially since in these kinds of games your created character is usually the only one in the game who CAN put points in conversational skills.

Incidentally, are there conversation options that just require a stat to be at a certain place, like in games like Planescape: Torment or Pillars of Eternity where certain options required a WIS or an INT score of, like, 17 or something?

Generally the Lawful choice is to exterminate the trolls, kobolds, etc that threaten your kingdom. A paladin will restrict you in that regard. You should play something chaotic if you want to make peace with them. But no matter what you choose, some content will be missed. If you ally with Tartuk, you won't be able to finish Harrim's quest, iirc. You cannot 100% in a single playthrough.

Why are all the lawful decisions basically "I don't forgive you," or something? A paladin should give honestly repentant evildoers a second chance! One of your companions worships a deity that's all ABOUT that for crying out loud!

The latter. They are connected only at the beginning and at the end. When you begin Varnhold's Lot it asks you if you want to import a save from the main campaign and at the beginning of the main campain's Chapter 3 the game asks you if you have a completed Varnhold's Lot save to import to the main campaign. They are otherwise unconnected.

So I have to start the Main Story first, get to a certain point, then import that save to start Varnhold's Lot, play through that, and then return to the Main Story and import the Varnhold's Lot I just finished? If so, when's the best point to save and switch over to start VH?

There are no solutions that require you to wait, as far as I'm aware. There are solutions that get locked if you wait too long. The game can be trusted when it tells you to hurry, unlike most other CRPG's I've played. A few examples from the Chapter 2 are the missing kid, saving Delgado from the troll attack and the bald hilltop. The first two are sidequests where the NPC in question dies if you take too long to get there and the latter will destroy your kingdom if you ignore it after you learn it's started spewing forth monsters. The overall time-limit is forgiving enough that I was able to do all sidequests with time to spare. You just need to be efficient with your travels, and conservative with your rests. And there are many cases with mutually exclusive solutions. You cannot 100% a single playthrough.

So for the most part I should be fine as long as I know where I'm going and don't just wander around. It sounds like there are quests whose outcomes are dependent on the outcomes of other quests, like, say, an outcome for Quest B is barred if I already completed Quest A, so if I want the best outcome for B, I should wait to do Quest A until afterwards? How do I begin to untangle that web of which sidequests to do when? And how do I begin to make sure I get the Golden Endings for everyone? I don't want to get to the ending and find out I accidentally ruined some NPC's life by not getting their sidequest because some other sidequest barred it! It's bad enough that you can't save Linzi from dying even if you complete all her sidequests!

For your main character I'd say perception and persuasion are absolutely essential, knowledges and lores have their uses, and there are cases where you are called to make a mobility or athletics roll by yourself.

That's the general impression I got from Sporeegg's post as well. I think if I follow the required skills for Aldori Swordlord it should give me a good baseline.

Also, WHY are there only three options for a state religion (Abadar, Cayden Cailean and Asmodeus) and none of them are deities your companions ACTUALLY worship, so the only connection they'd have is if you yourself were a worshiper of them? Why can't you set up a Sarenite church for Tristian, or a Groetan shrine for Harrim?

[JadedDM]

What's the "arbitrary headcount limit" in this game? I'm curious as to how many companions I can bring with me at once, especially for the purposes of quest banter.

You can bring up to 5 people with you at a time, making a party of 6 with your main character included. (Although if you bring Ekundayo with you, you get to also include his animal companion, so you technically get 7).

Incidentally, are there conversation options that just require a stat to be at a certain place, like in games like Planescape: Torment or Pillars of Eternity where certain options required a WIS or an INT score of, like, 17 or something?

No, just skills and alignment. Some options are greyed out if you are not the right alignment.

Why are all the lawful decisions basically "I don't forgive you," or something?

Yeah, I had the same issue. I started as LG, but eventually shifted to NG because too many of the LG options were 'kill all wrong-doers, regardless of the severity or circumstances of their crime.'

Also, WHY are there only three options for a state religion (Abadar, Cayden Cailean and Asmodeus) and none of them are deities your companions ACTUALLY worship, so the only connection they'd have is if you yourself were a worshiper of them? Why can't you set up a Sarenite church for Tristian, or a Groetan shrine for Harrim?

That bugged me, too, as my character was a cleric of Sarenrae himself.

[Spore]

You can bring up to 5 people with you at a time, making a party of 6 with your main character included. (Although if you bring Ekundayo with you, you get to also include his animal companion, so you technically get 7).

Afaik it is also just one summon per group. But you CAN go overboard.

Spoiler: Kitty Rangers Hyper Pounce Force

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I am planning on removing Regongar for Ekundayo in the 2. act. Once Linzi reaches 5. level, I then have 4 animal companions, an barb, a ranger and a Cleric 1/Druid 4 wildshaping attacking, all with the bardic performance of +2/+2.

Alpha striking the enemy, and hard. The redhead is a Sylvan Sorcerer specializing in summons and buffs. she provides mage armor to ACs, Enlarge on my barb, Cat's Grace for ... well the cats. Another source of Heroism on third, and a Haster.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Would playing a paladin/Aldori Swordlord work okay? I like the concept, have liked it since Kingmaker first came out in print, but I worry I won't be able to do EVERYTHING, like I'm used to doing in RPGs like Neverwinter Nights 2 or stuff...

[VexingFool]

Would playing a paladin/Aldori Swordlord work okay? I like the concept, have liked it since Kingmaker first came out in print, but I worry I won't be able to do EVERYTHING, like I'm used to doing in RPGs like Neverwinter Nights 2 or stuff...

You should be fine, I played a LG Duelist on my main run and (other than a couple of bugged quests) don't feel like I missed anything.

I can't remember any content that is locked out due to alignment or class. Choices are the only thing that can lock you out from some rewards/quests. Even if playing a LG character you can still choose the Chaotic/Neutral/Evil option on occasion and not have it affect your alignment too much.

Tips
Make sure you have gathered all the companions before ending chapter 1. You should find them organically, especially if you are a methodical completionist, but some people have missed some. Before going to the capital and claiming your barony make sure you have triggered the Technic League ambush and rescued Octavia and Regongar from their camp. Talked to Tristian at the temple of the Elk. Released any unclaimed companions (Jaethal, Harrim, Linzi, Valerie) from prison beneath the Old Sycamore. You don't have to have them in your party but they should be at Oleg's.

Choose your advisor wisely. Some of the advisors will leave at a certain point and leave you high and dry for one of your Kingdom positions. This may be less important now that they have implemented mercenaries filling Kingdom positions. You will have to choose one of the Bolded options at the end of Chapter 1. The ones in Italics can only be recruited during the quests involving them and by generally acting in their favor.

Spoiler: Kingdom Positions Availability

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Regent: Octavia (CG), Valerie (LN), Lander (CN)
Councilor: Tristian (NG), Shandra (LN), Tsanna (CE)
General: Amiri (CN), Regongar (CE), Kassil (LN)
Treasurer: Jubilost (CN), Bartholomew (LE), Maegar (NG), Kalikke/Kanerah (N)
High Priest: Harrim (CN), Jhod (LG), Tsanna (CE)
Diplomat: Linzi (CG), Valerie (LN), Bartholomew (LE)
Warden: Ekundayo (LG), Regongar (CE), Kesten (LN)
Magister: Octavia (CG), Storyteller (N), Vordakai (NE)
Curator: Jaethal (NE), Linzi (CG), Storyteller (N),
Minister: Ekundayo (LG), Jaethal (NE), Jubilost (CN)

When the Troll Trouble starts head south as soon as possible and cross the ford. This should allow you to recruit Jubilost. If you dally too much you can miss him, but he will show up at court eventually.

There was an issue with ending of the Troll Trouble quest locking out the Troll Lair depending on who you sided with. Supposedly this has been fixed in the latest patch. But just to be safe you might make sure you have all the collectible relic items and have completed Harrim's companion quest before you leave the lair.

During the Season of Bloom quest it was possible to save both Jhod and Kesten if you moved quick enough. I guess this was a bug and has been fixed in the latest patch. You can still save them both if you pick a special neutral option in the final dialogue in Goblin King Fort.

Eventually on Bokken's masterpiece quest line he will ask you to test his formula on a nearby dog. If you refuse he will not finish his masterpiece. You can accept the quest and then lie to him about using it on the dog and the quest will continue. I screwed this up on two characters since the thought of experimenting on a poor doggie made me choose the NO! option. His masterpiece is a potion that gives +2 inherent bonus to all your stats.

Eventually you will have to decide between pursuing Tristian or aiding Amiri. Going after Tristian will cause multiple bad outcomes and you can only 'Save' him if you had a good relationship already. Going with Amiri will cause you to lose Tristian who may be your only option for the Councilor position. This is less important now as you can make a mercenary to fill the Councilor slot.

I would advise a main party size of 4-5 characters and use the other slots for doing companion quests. That way you don't have to reconfigure your party every time a companion has a quest that needs done. Just add them in, finish their quest and release them.

Just remember 'Perfect is the enemy of good'. There were several times I did not get the quest outcome I was hoping for and maybe different choices could have changed that. Eventually I accepted most of my choices unless there was an extremely bad ending.

[Inarius]

Would playing a paladin/Aldori Swordlord work okay? I like the concept, have liked it since Kingmaker first came out in print, but I worry I won't be able to do EVERYTHING, like I'm used to doing in RPGs like Neverwinter Nights 2 or stuff...

For what its worth you wont be able to do EVERYTHING no matter what class and alignment you choose. Certain things are exclusive.

As for the class combo itself that setup could work. Focus on dex and charisma then take the feats that let you use your dex for attack rolls and then for damage rolls. You may want to start as a swordlord though so you can start in on the feats for dueling blade from the beginning of the game.

My first run through of the game was a Swordsaint/Swordlord/Duelist combo that was neutral good alignment which worked out kind of insanely well. There were some choices that I wish I was lawful for but at the same time being neutral I had some cool options for being a peace broker and so I sort of roleplayed up that aspect of my character. Overall though I'd say there's a fairly even distribution of speech checks for them and its ok to occasionally stray from your characters chosen alignment.

During the Season of Bloom quest it was possible to save both Jhod and Kesten if you moved quick enough. I guess this was a bug and has been fixed in the latest patch. You can still save them both if you pick a special neutral option in the final dialogue in Goblin King Fort.

Take this with a grain of salt since its been awhile since I've played and maybe they changed it, but you have to be Lawful to save them both by ordering Kesten to head to the capital. Then you travel to the capital and you have to keep them both alive because if they die in the encounter they die permanently.

One other kind of big benefit of going Lawful is it lets you make billboards in your towns which give you a +1 to all of your rolls for kingdom events in those regions. Multiple buildings in the same settlement stack so it can be kind of beneficial to make a bunch of those in your kingdom to make harder events easier for your advisors to do.

[VexingFool]

Take this with a grain of salt since its been awhile since I've played and maybe they changed it, but you have to be Lawful to save them both by ordering Kesten to head to the capital. Then you travel to the capital and you have to keep them both alive because if they die in the encounter they die permanently.

You are right that option was there. I believe it was a LN option reminding Kesten of his duty that is only available to Lawful characters. But there was a way to do it if you didn't choose that option before.

Spoiler: Patch Notes

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It used to be possible to save both Kesten Garess and Jhod Kavken in Chapter 3 by coming to Lamashtu's Womb, talking to Kesten, and then going to the capital to save Jhod. This was a bug. Resolution: fixed. You can still save them both if you pick a special neutral option in the final dialogue in Goblin King Fort.

One other kind of big benefit of going Lawful is it lets you make billboards in your towns which give you a +1 to all of your rolls for kingdom events in those regions. Multiple buildings in the same settlement stack so it can be kind of beneficial to make a bunch of those in your kingdom to make harder events easier for your advisors to do.

Billboards are good and you should build one in every town. I tried not to cheese the building of multiple items to get high stats but always tried to use every adjacency bonus possible. If you keep your advisor's trained up you should not have trouble with any problem on Normal difficulty. I did struggle with getting my kingdom's Arcane stat up and might have benefited from building some duplicate arcane buildings to unlock my Magister quicker.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

I suppose I've been looking at this wrong. As it's clear I won't be able to do everything in the game, what I'm REALLY trying to get at by saying that is that I want to pursue a Golden Ending, getting the best possible endings for as many people as possible. Like I've said, I don't want to get to the "Where Are They Now?" Epilogue and find that a well-meaning decision inadvertently screwed someone over like they do in Dragon Age: Origins.

[The Glyphstone]

Since this appears to be the new Kingmaker thread:

Does anyone know of a well-written guide to building your villages/towns? There's so many options for buildings, with upgrades, and aside from the obvious synergies it's impossible to know what is useful. I don't even know how to 'specialize' a region the way the loading screen tells me I can.

[Narkis]

Since this appears to be the new Kingmaker thread:

Does anyone know of a well-written guide to building your villages/towns? There's so many options for buildings, with upgrades, and aside from the obvious synergies it's impossible to know what is useful. I don't even know how to 'specialize' a region the way the loading screen tells me I can.

I'm afraid I don't know of any guide other than the one I linked up in the thread, and that guide is quite incomplete. I wonder what happened to the people who used to write guides and FAQs ten years ago.

Region specialisations are unlocked when you upgrade your city, iirc. I don't remember if upgrading your capital unlocks them everywhere or if you have to upgrade the town on each region before.

[The Glyphstone]

I just found this actually:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfil...?id=1580642020

[Spore]

All this talk about the game's advanced mechanics and after 20h of gameplay I still cannot decide on a group and main character...

[Archpaladin Zousha]

I know!!! I have so many kewl ideas for both a Baron/Baroness and General, plus for Beneath the Stolen Lands parties, and I can't decide what to go with first! Especially since BtSL's regular mode requires you to be willing to "kill your darlings" like a real Rogue-like.

[Inarius]

I know!!! I have so many kewl ideas for both a Baron/Baroness and General, plus for Beneath the Stolen Lands parties, and I can't decide what to go with first! Especially since BtSL's regular mode requires you to be willing to "kill your darlings" like a real Rogue-like.

One thing to note that hasn't really been mentioned. If you plan on going with a full party of companions you should probably make your main character fairly tanky. There's only one decent frontliner among the early companions, the other melee fighters are just too squishy to hold the line and you really do want 2 tanky characters to share the incoming damage if you're playing on normal or higher.

Later on you do get access to a rogue with a stupidly high dex score that can sort of fill in as a frontliner, but even so I find that dex based tanks to be not quite as good as tanks with DR and high AC.

Alternatively you can make a merc to fill the role and just run around with 4 instead of 5 companions.

[Spore]

My dex based Aldori Defender would like to have a word with you. (but yea, generally I split tanking duty between a dex tank and a heavy armor tank.

[Narkis]

One thing to note that hasn't really been mentioned. If you plan on going with a full party of companions you should probably make your main character fairly tanky. There's only one decent frontliner among the early companions, the other melee fighters are just too squishy to hold the line and you really do want 2 tanky characters to share the incoming damage if you're playing on normal or higher.

Later on you do get access to a rogue with a stupidly high dex score that can sort of fill in as a frontliner, but even so I find that dex based tanks to be not quite as good as tanks with DR and high AC.

Alternatively you can make a merc to fill the role and just run around with 4 instead of 5 companions.

That's not necessary at all. I played as a wizard on challenging and Valerie was enough of a tank by herself. Yes, the rest of my frontline was squishier, but a combination of sending her first to grab aggro, buffs and cc where appropriate were more than enough to hold the line.

[Kish]

Yes, I'm with Narkis. You absolutely do not need to play a tank, or anything else specific.

Spoiler

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Valerie is the only dedicated tank, but both Amiri and Ekundayo's wolf can do quite a bit of tanking.

[The Glyphstone]

I'm running on Challenging right now and Valerie is more than capable of solo tanking. Her problem is only when there's so many enemies they wrap around her with leftovers to hit the backline, not the incoming damage - most of the time they need 20's with a Concealment check to hit.

[Inarius]

True you don't really need to play a tanky type, but having a second tank in the party makes things a lot easier due to there being a limit of around 5-6 enemies that can crowd around Valerie and most fights having more than that engaging you at once. It's less that Valerie can't tank it and rather that she cant cover all of the directions enemies come from in the hardest fights in the game.

My dex based Aldori Defender would like to have a word with you. (but yea, generally I split tanking duty between a dex tank and a heavy armor tank.

Mine waves back before getting ganked by a rogue out of stealth because I didn't have an alignment that allowed for easy access to uncanny dodge She worked great as an offtank but after around the Barb Tomb I wouldn't want to main tank with her heh.

[Zobo]

A quick tip to those who would like to compose their own party, which means mercenaries:

You should be hitting level 2 about the time of Oleg's trade post. Do not level up your main, do level up all the companions though.

Loot everything in the tradepost, sell everything you can to Oleg, and hire the mercenaries at level 1. You can (if you looted a lot) afford 5 level 1 mercs. 4 is pretty easy. Level your main when you have recruited all the mercenaries you want.

You just need to face one combat at level 1 when you could be level 2. Not horrible.

Then, don't play with them just yet. Or, only take two to fill up your party, because them being level 1 while everybody else is level 2 is a marked difference. It's going to be a notable difference till about 5-6 levels, after which the xp difference becomes almost neglible.

Yes, you will be missing the banter of the npcs, but you will be able to play using characters you create of classes you want to have in your party.

[Narkis]

I just came across this on Reddit. It's a list of all the best ending slides according to that user, and exactly what is needed to get each one. That should cover exactly what you were asking Archpaladin Zousha.