General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

[Lethologica]

Out of curiousity, what would you consider the best? To me, the only competition is My Hero Academia (which has the advantage of being written 20 years later), and Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood, which is unlikely to be beaten by anything ever.

So my list is #1 FMA, #2 HxH, and #3 MHA. DBZ, Bleach, and Naruto are all in a jumble further down the chain. Stuff like Fairy Tail doesn't even register.

I will admit that the Greed Island arc is the weakest point in the entire series. The dodgeball game is almost enough to redeem it, but not quite...and mostly because of how well the 2011 anime portrayed it. The dodgeball game is far less interesting in the 1999 version.

FMA is a pretty different show than most of these, and opens the door to a lot of shows that (IMO) could well supersede the long-running shonen action stuff on a list like this. Also, One Piece.

[Lord Raziere]

FMA is a pretty different show than most of these, and opens the door to a lot of shows that (IMO) could well supersede the long-running shonen action stuff on a list like this. Also, One Piece.

I mostly agree with Rodin, FMA, MHA and HxH are first tier, Naruto and DBZ are second tier, they're okay.

as for Bleach and One Piece, I don't think either of those are good personally. they are just bad on different ends of the spectrum. I will never be able to finish either of them.

but I like Fairy Tail that people claim is bad, so maybe my tastes are weird. never seen Black Clover.

I have yet to see an anime follow in FMA's footsteps though, so unless you can provide examples which I'd love to see...

[ellenate]

Out of curiousity, what would you consider the best? To me, the only competition is My Hero Academia (which has the advantage of being written 20 years later), and Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood, which is unlikely to be beaten by anything ever.

So my list is #1 FMA, #2 HxH, and #3 MHA. DBZ, Bleach, and Naruto are all in a jumble further down the chain. Stuff like Fairy Tail doesn't even register.

I will admit that the Greed Island arc is the weakest point in the entire series. The dodgeball game is almost enough to redeem it, but not quite...and mostly because of how well the 2011 anime portrayed it. The dodgeball game is far less interesting in the 1999 version.

well...

FMA is a pretty different show than most of these, and opens the door to a lot of shows that (IMO) could well supersede the long-running shonen action stuff on a list like this.

Like Lethologica says, i'd need a better clarification of what you'd deem as shounen. Not only that, Unfinished versus finished, isn't really fair.

Also, One Piece.

Yeah, one piece laughably decimates HxH...

I have yet to see an anime follow in FMA's footsteps though, so unless you can provide examples which I'd love to see...

FMA... brotherhood, works on the fact that it has the earlier show to cover its flaws. Also if Brotherhood fits the list's criteria, separated in a vacuum from the first series, i see it fighting to get into the top 10.


the beginning is rushed
the middle is boring/sluggish
no named characters surviving, ruining any sense of real stakes.


Its climax is great though.

[Zalabim]

For my own part, I think HxH peaked before it introduced Nen with all the training episodes throughout the series dragging down the show's overall quality, despite having some great arcs, and also the Chimera Ants. Greed Island would have been better off shorter, and I can't even imagine how to improve the Chimera Ants story, though step one probably would have been to introduce Kite more than a few minutes before killing him, which I understand the manga actually did by including the part the anime only has as a flashback. It's more mature than his previous work, but I think I prefer some of the more savvy antics that Yu Yu Hakusho played into more. Whatever you think is best in HxH, if you don't like the hunter exam arc it starts with, don't force yourself to continue.

[Lord Raziere]

I mean One Piece is just idiots having dark backstories then being cheerful in the present and never changing or displaying any depth after that, repeating the same arc over and over again: find new island, break rule on island, fight ensues, crew accidentally becomes heroes, sail into sunset, repeat. for like 400+ episodes that I've seen. so I don't see how it could ever be better than HxH.

[LaZodiac]

I mean One Piece is just idiots having dark backstories then being cheerful in the present and never changing or displaying any depth after that, repeating the same arc over and over again: find new island, break rule on island, fight ensues, crew accidentally becomes heroes, sail into sunset, repeat. for like 400+ episodes that I've seen. so I don't see how it could ever be better than HxH.

I mean there's a lotta nuance in there, you're just not seeing it and that's okay.

At least the protagonists in One Piece show up for and do things in their story arcs, on top of that

[ellenate]

I mean One Piece is just idiots having dark backstories then being cheerful in the present and never changing or displaying any depth after that, repeating the same arc over and over again: find new island, break rule on island, fight ensues, crew accidentally becomes heroes, sail into sunset, repeat. for like 400+ episodes that I've seen. so I don't see how it could ever be better than HxH.

don't fix what's not broken.

It's not breaking any boundaries but it more entertaining than what HxH has going on.



Like you want to talk about repeating, they basically repeated a tournament arc back-to-back. If you want to get loose with the definition, greed island was like the third tournament within 5 arcs.


It astonishes me that despite how detailed HxH world might be, the characters always feel like they have nothing to do.


Gon's only motivation is to find his father... it was boring in fallout 3, and it was boring here. The only character that seemed the least bit interesting was Kurapika-

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and he basically accomplished his life's mission within the first few arcs of knowing him.

the whole thing was so weird, he vowed his life for the power to stop these people, and like a month later it was rendered useless. yes i'm exaggerating a bit but that's basically what happened.


also. if i was actually more invested into the story at the time, i'm sure the way gon came back, would've bothered me too.

[Lord Raziere]

I mean there's a lotta nuance in there, you're just not seeing it and that's okay.

At least the protagonists in One Piece show up for and do things in their story arcs, on top of that

at least Hunter X Hunter acknowledges that someone other than the protagonists can do something about the problems and that sometimes the protagonists aren't even suited to solving them. (I mean what would've Kurapika even done in the Chimera Ant arc? persuade them all to join the Phantom Troupe then go to town on them? I don't think thats how his oath works.)

but thats okay, you just missing the nuance of HxH's power system.

@ ellenate: ah yes, the battlecry of stasis and stagnancy. Fitting I guess, since it matches the animes glacial pace.

[Mystic Muse]

I don't think we ever got far enough for the nuances to come up. I remember getting so annoyed by the repeated anticlimaxes I just lost all investment.

[Lord Raziere]

I don't think we ever got far enough for the nuances to come up. I remember getting so annoyed by the repeated anticlimaxes I just lost all investment.

I remember disliking all the main characters in One Piece so much that I remember them all as either jerks, annoying smiling idiots, both, lifeless, or the villains. there is just not a single person I can like in that show.

[Pendulous]

When does HxH kick into gear? I was pretty dissatisfied with the early going and let it drop.

So, like every show of its ilk? DBZ is the only one I can think of that started on pretty high energy. Black Clover takes about ten episodes just to get its cast introduced, Fairy Tail takes a few as well, and the first mini-arc is considered pretty weak (Tower of Heaven is where it supposedly gets good). I only watched about twenty episodes of One Piece, but that thing was moving so slowly, I doubt I would go much further anyway.

I'll leave my continued unpopular opinions on the subject alone, but Hunter X hunter is on my todo list. Maybe once Netflix gets the rest of the dub.

[LaZodiac]

at least Hunter X Hunter acknowledges that someone other than the protagonists can do something about the problems and that sometimes the protagonists aren't even suited to solving them. (I mean what would've Kurapika even done in the Chimera Ant arc? persuade them all to join the Phantom Troupe then go to town on them? I don't think thats how his oath works.)

but thats okay, you just missing the nuance of HxH's power system.

@ ellenate: ah yes, the battlecry of stasis and stagnancy. Fitting I guess, since it matches the animes glacial pace.

I see the nuance in HxH I just don't think it's interesting or good, or worth the clown {Scrubbed}being pushed as a protagonist we should like. And One Piece... does do that, all the time?

I mean, Kurapika could... and stop me if you heard this one before; maybe not be so much a Sasuke and remember other people matter. I get that it's his entire character that he cares about nothing but slaughtering the spiders who barely even acknowledge he exists, and I kinda like it, but spending an entire arc on basically no one we care about ad watching them die in horror movie fashion isn't actually all that compelling.

And I'm not getting into Gon's super mode again.

I remember disliking all the main characters in One Piece so much that I remember them all as either jerks, annoying smiling idiots, both, lifeless, or the villains. there is just not a single person I can like in that show.

She was talking about when me and her tried to watch Hunter x Hunter. We checked out after Gon fought Neutrino or whatever his name is on the blimp.

[Lord Raziere]

So, like every show of its ilk? DBZ is the only one I can think of that started on pretty high energy. Black Clover takes about ten episodes just to get its cast introduced, Fairy Tail takes a few as well, and the first mini-arc is considered pretty weak (Tower of Heaven is where it supposedly gets good). I only watched about twenty episodes of One Piece, but that thing was moving so slowly, I doubt I would go much further anyway.

and DBZ is only because it was actually just the latest arc of Dragon Ball, so....technically...for that you have to watch an entire OTHER SERIES for it to "finally get good"

which at this point, I'm starting to roll my eyes at that criticism. these series are kind of the anime equivalent of long epic fantasy books. should we skip the Fellowship of the Ring to start watching at the Two Towers as well? do people skip Harry Potter or Game of Thrones books? Wheel of Time had filler books, and it was long, do we skip out on the beginnings of Rands journey? and the "finally get good" is as shown is completely subjective and depends on who you ask, so its secondhand info,

I understand if someone don't have the time to watch it, but if thats the case, just say so. I can understand it for Goku, he is starting to become comic book-like in how media keeps revisiting the saiyan arc as if its his origin story, and I can understand if you want a show that skips straight to the action and good parts, I want one to, but these stories are very bildungsroman in how they are about growth and progress over time. its just kind of the nature of the genre for it to be a journey and for the journey to be long. but then again I rarely if ever want to skip any thing of a media I consume. I'm the kind of person who likes going on archive binges, watching episodes back to back so it all flows as a cohesive uninterrupted narrative, but I guess thats just my deep focus introvert brain that is able to read Way of Kings for hours on end without stopping, and other people simply don't have the patience, focus, time or the energy for that.

I see the nuance in HxH I just don't think it's interesting or good, or worth the clown {Scrub the post, scrub the quote}being pushed as a protagonist we should like. And One Piece... does do that, all the time?

I mean, Kurapika could... and stop me if you heard this one before; maybe not be so much a Sasuke and remember other people matter. I get that it's his entire character that he cares about nothing but slaughtering the spiders who barely even acknowledge he exists, and I kinda like it, but spending an entire arc on basically no one we care about ad watching them die in horror movie fashion isn't actually all that compelling.

And I'm not getting into Gon's super mode again.

1. its funny you make that comparison because Kurapika came before Sasuke and was the guy who inspired Sasuke in the first place. only Kurapika is better because your wrong, Kurapika clearly does value other people, he has friends in Leorio, Gon, Killua, and buck-toothed fat person I forget the name of, he is more intelligent, caring, sociable, than Sasuke ever will be and the measures he takes is to keep his charge safe even if he wants to go kill them, and makes his vow knowingly that will make sure his power will only be used for a just limited purpose rather than potentially allowing him to endlessly kill in hate. Kurapika is a great person, he is one of the most intelligent people in a show thats already more brainy than most shonen and one of the most moral people within it as well. he just becomes Terrifying Murderer in the presence of certain people who REALLY deserve it.

2. Hey, Hisoka is a horrible dude, thats obvious. but I'd still rather watch him in all his terrifying disturbing creepy clown glory than what passes for One Piece protagonists:
-Luffy: is the Tournament of Power Arc Goku personality, but all the time, stupider with added alien thought processes that make him so uncanny valley to watch, I never feel as if I'm watching an actual person do any of this, just some animal that somehow knows words trying to imitate humans and failing. every time I watch him I feel like I'm Abridged Freeza trying to fight Goku.
-Zoro: can't get over a childhood trauma and gets lost all the time. other than that,he has no personality or is a huge jerk who uses "honor" as a reason for his jerkness for no reason
-Sanji: Is a chauvinist consumed by perverted lust using "I was raised that way!" as an excuse, nothing more needs to be said.
-Nami: greed in the form of a woman, wow how (not) interesting.
-Chopper: so gullible he believes everything said to him. on someone who is otherwise smart.
-Usopp: so forgettable I remember Chopper before him and the most annoying wimpy and stupid out of all of them
-Robin: has the personality of a robot
-Frankie: has the personality of a child
-Brook: perverted old man personality but with bones

now some of these may be less horrible, but of all them. Sanji is the most horrible, Luffy the least comprehensible, and Usopp the most annoying. Hisoka at least some Joker charm to him.

[Rodin]

and DBZ is only because it was actually just the latest arc of Dragon Ball, so....technically...for that you have to watch an entire OTHER SERIES for it to "finally get good"

which at this point, I'm starting to roll my eyes at that criticism. these series are kind of the anime equivalent of long epic fantasy books. should we skip the Fellowship of the Ring to start watching at the Two Towers as well? do people skip Harry Potter or Game of Thrones books? Wheel of Time had filler books, and it was long, do we skip out on the beginnings of Rands journey? and the "finally get good" is as shown is completely subjective and depends on who you ask, so its secondhand info,

I understand if someone don't have the time to watch it, but if thats the case, just say so. I can understand it for Goku, he is starting to become comic book-like in how media keeps revisiting the saiyan arc as if its his origin story, and I can understand if you want a show that skips straight to the action and good parts, I want one to, but these stories are very bildungsroman in how they are about growth and progress over time. its just kind of the nature of the genre for it to be a journey and for the journey to be long. but then again I rarely if ever want to skip any thing of a media I consume. I'm the kind of person who likes going on archive binges, watching episodes back to back so it all flows as a cohesive uninterrupted narrative, but I guess thats just my deep focus introvert brain that is able to read Way of Kings for hours on end without stopping, and other people simply don't have the patience, focus, time or the energy for that.

I'd be really interested in seeing a "Dragon Ball Kai", where they remade those early episodes. I've seen bits of it here and there, but the show is unfortunately old enough that it hasn't aged well. I've never actually seen the stuff with the Red Ribbon Army that sets up Dr. Gero all those years later. I just found myself unable to really get into it, even the fighting. I'd kind of like to know what the deal is with characters like Fortuneteller Baba who spent the whole of DBZ sitting around Roshi's place.

[LaZodiac]

If you go into Dragon Ball proper, it's important to keep in mind it is primarily a comedy series for the most part. It's got it's action moments, but on the whole it's a jokey take on Journey to the West. So having taht proper mind set can help.

As for the Red Ribbon Army:

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They're basically a massive kingdom of soldiers organized by their leader, Red, to hunt down the dragonballs... so he can wish to be a couple feet taller. Not even like, to full normal height (he's as short as Goku as a child is) but just a couple feet taller. His second in command murders him when he learns this, and ends up being killed by Goku as a sort of incidental thing since Goku is immune to bullets even as a kid so he basically destroys their entire kingdom/fortress entirely.

And for Baba...:

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if I recall she's Roshi's sister, or someone he knew and used to date back when they were young and hot. I don't remember which of these is correct since it's been forever but it's one of the two. She's just a witch. There's nothing much else she's just a fortune teller and magic user. She makes Goku fight a mummy and a comedic parody of Devil Man, who's powerful Justice Beam kills you if you're not pure hearted.

[Lord Raziere]

I'd be really interested in seeing a "Dragon Ball Kai", where they remade those early episodes. I've seen bits of it here and there, but the show is unfortunately old enough that it hasn't aged well. I've never actually seen the stuff with the Red Ribbon Army that sets up Dr. Gero all those years later. I just found myself unable to really get into it, even the fighting. I'd kind of like to know what the deal is with characters like Fortuneteller Baba who spent the whole of DBZ sitting around Roshi's place.

I've seen SOME of Dragon Ball. not all of it, but I can answer to some degree.

Red Ribbon Army:
there isn't any Dr. Gero or his son in Dragon Ball. he is never foreshadowed. there there was android 8 who was friendly but never seen again, there was a cyborg commander in the army that inspired by the terminator call Major Metallitron, but he pretty much went down along with the rest of the Red Ribbon army during some tower fight, which was unrelated to the episode where Goku was on a rampage destroying pretty much their entire base and army in like two episodes (and the Rebd ribbon army was the most powerful military one Earth at the time- even more powerful than the world governments yup, even back then a single ki-user was more powerful than the entirety of the worlds strongest military). its more likely that Gero was created post-hoc to explain the cyborg commander since Toriyama is a improvising writer. and what I've seen of it, the aside from the cyborg, the army itself was basically a normal military, just evil and not having any government to answer to with some people in it having a few special tricks. its theme song literally sang about how evil it was. what little I saw was of General Blue (yes they were all named colors) getting easily defeated by Mercenary Tao. now the Red Ribbon army did have like, this 16 or 17% economic control as a rival to Capsule corp or something, implying it was military corporation, but other than that it was basically just there to be a threat other than Pilaf because he was already shoved to the side at that point. as for why they are seeking the Dragon Balls the reason is great, you'll love it, so much I have to spoil it because its so mind-blowing:

Spoiler: You ready? you sure? Ok here goes...

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Because Commander Red....wanted to become taller.

I know, beautiful isn't it?

Fortuneteller Baba:
these episodes I saw. basically in the arc she is intro'd, they have to go see fortuneteller Baba to find the last dragon ball after the Red Ribbon army died because the dragon radar didn't detect it for some reason, so Baba is like "either pay me or fight four dudes to get me to tell where it is" and they're broke so they fight various guys in her employ like a vampire, an invisible man and a mummy, and spike the devilman, who are less fights and more like three puzzle bosses and one hax guy who hits goku with the one insta-kill move that doesn't work on Goku, then she tells them where it is. yes vampires, invisible men, mummies and devils all exist in Dragon Ball. why we haven't gotten more villains out some of those most widely popular and easily modifiable monsters for Super, I'll never know.

so yeah thats basically what happened, what you missing is not any high speed action or whatever- the serious fighting is relatively down to earth for an anime, OG Dragon Ball's ridiculousness and appeal is more about all the goofy one-off stuff that is introduced as a gag then is spoken of never again even though they are technically still apart of the Dragon Ball universe today and something like Spike the Devilman could hypothetically make a return and explode Freeza's heart to prove that he isn't all talk or something.

[Lethologica]

and DBZ is only because it was actually just the latest arc of Dragon Ball, so....technically...for that you have to watch an entire OTHER SERIES for it to "finally get good"

which at this point, I'm starting to roll my eyes at that criticism. these series are kind of the anime equivalent of long epic fantasy books. should we skip the Fellowship of the Ring to start watching at the Two Towers as well? do people skip Harry Potter or Game of Thrones books? Wheel of Time had filler books, and it was long, do we skip out on the beginnings of Rands journey? and the "finally get good" is as shown is completely subjective and depends on who you ask, so its secondhand info,

I understand if someone don't have the time to watch it, but if thats the case, just say so. I can understand it for Goku, he is starting to become comic book-like in how media keeps revisiting the saiyan arc as if its his origin story, and I can understand if you want a show that skips straight to the action and good parts, I want one to, but these stories are very bildungsroman in how they are about growth and progress over time. its just kind of the nature of the genre for it to be a journey and for the journey to be long. but then again I rarely if ever want to skip any thing of a media I consume. I'm the kind of person who likes going on archive binges, watching episodes back to back so it all flows as a cohesive uninterrupted narrative, but I guess thats just my deep focus introvert brain that is able to read Way of Kings for hours on end without stopping, and other people simply don't have the patience, focus, time or the energy for that.

I didn't skip the beginning of HxH. I watched/read it and experienced it as dreck. If there is no commonly agreed break point in the series, then I am likely to continue experiencing it as dreck the whole way through, and there is no point continuing to watch at all. If there is such a point, then I can make the decision about whether to push on or skip ahead - and skipping ahead is a valid choice, not the bizarre blend of caricatures you've invented to justify your eye-rolling.

So, like every show of its ilk? DBZ is the only one I can think of that started on pretty high energy. Black Clover takes about ten episodes just to get its cast introduced, Fairy Tail takes a few as well, and the first mini-arc is considered pretty weak (Tower of Heaven is where it supposedly gets good). I only watched about twenty episodes of One Piece, but that thing was moving so slowly, I doubt I would go much further anyway.

I'll leave my continued unpopular opinions on the subject alone, but Hunter X hunter is on my todo list. Maybe once Netflix gets the rest of the dub.

Without pointlessly bogging down in details, no, not every show in the neighborhood of HxH dissatisfied me for 35 chapters or the equivalent in episodes.

[Excession]

In older stuff, I watched Btooom!. Wasn't too bad, but I wish there was more of it. Guess I'll have to read the manga for that.

Started watching No Game No Life. Art style is interesting at least, hard to judge much else from just one episode. I generally have a low tolerance of isekai though.

[Aotrs Commander]

Arbitrary See If Bleakbane Can Stand More Than Two Episodes Anime Theatre:

Children of the Whales

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(Perhaps prefunctoary report, but a) there's little to rant about and b) wargames show after-effects.)

Well, we have hit the two episode mark and I'm interested enough I'm going to watch the third episode, so it's already doing better than some.

Premise is somewhat interesting, pacing exists (unlike Knights of the Zodiac) and there is sufficient mystery to hold it up, at least thus far. VAs are good, I reckonise a fair few. Exposition is performed adequately, and while there is a fair bit of tell, there are not too many "as you know" moments and if it is only a twelve-episode run, there is likely not a lot of room to spare.

Now, granted, it might have a bit of the old hoary "war is teh bads" plot going on, but the execution is not so terrible I'm bored already, so give it credit.

It is, if it remains at this level, perfectly adequate Cleaning The Room Telly in the first couple of episodes.

We appear to be at the wham episode-slash-start of the heroes journey leaving the place sort of part by end of episode two, so we'll wee what I think going from there and see if it holds.

But it's reached that mark, so it gets a tip of the helmet.

(Now if we go we're going to do the "massecre all of the characters bar the two? Three? Protagonists" in this third episode, it might run the risk of nose-diving off, but we shall see...)

Arbitrary See If Bleakbane Can Stand More Than Two Episodes Anime Theatre: Children of the Whales: Pass.



Edit:

Spoiler: Third episode

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No, actually, they actually didn't massecre everyone on the Mud Whale (and that is a really undignified name, I tell you) like I'd half expected, just enough to get the point across. Heck, at least one dude I thought'd they'd killed survived despite being shot, which gets bonus points for avoiding the rather too-often "anyone who gets shot that's noit in the arm or leg dies" rule.

Good fight scenes, now we have them.

I was still a bit "eeeeh..." and then this pink haired bad guy showed up and he was AMAZING, like unholy excrement spheres cheerfully-insane and it was hilarious. Dude was like "this is a massecre, I'm so excited! Wow, we even get to kill little girls and cute aa this! I want to make you cry and then kill you! Aha, your brother who thought you wer dead is punsihing by leaving you in this place to see if you'll go insane or something, ahaha!" It was just... Wow! Yeah, so the eldritch horror that ties into all this might be making all the footsoldiers and everyone supposedly without emotions (which is why, one realises, they can all unflinchingly massecre civilians and children), but it's clearly not working on this bloke who is juts NUTS, in the best scenery-chewing fashion.

So, yeah, interest maintained. Good job Children of the whales, you're actually doing rather well.

[Pendulous]

In older stuff, I watched Btooom!. Wasn't too bad, but I wish there was more of it. Guess I'll have to read the manga for that.

Started watching No Game No Life. Art style is interesting at least, hard to judge much else from just one episode. I generally have a low tolerance of isekai though.

No Game No Life was super fun, but that art style was a bit jarring. The coloration was...weird. I have no desire to watch the movie though.

[uncool]

I watched a the first 4 episodes of NGNL, and...it's the kind of show that needs a coherent world, and very much failed to deliver.

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For a world where the precise bet taken matters, it makes no sense for Stephanie - who should have been trained to at least watch for stupid things like that - to accept the bet as it was. Worse, "Fall in love with me" isn't a small favor. And the one that kinda broke it for me was the "mandatory" rock-paper-scissors: there's no way in the pledges that demanding the ministers challenge him to rock paper scissors could have worked, for many, many reasons, unless the pledges are made so weak as to be useless.

[Ibrinar]

FMA is a pretty different show than most of these, and opens the door to a lot of shows that (IMO) could well supersede the long-running shonen action stuff on a list like this. Also, One Piece.

Imo One piece is decent to good entertainment, and it is hard to maintain that for so long but it ultimately it never goes higher than good and can't compare to stuff like HxH for long running or stuff like fma for shounen in general. So I wouldn't consider it when looking for the top of the food chain either.

Hmm I think I would place FMA over HxH, HxH has some great stuff and it is one of my favourites I just prefer stories with more of a main plot.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Vinland Saga 7
This show just keeps hitting a sort of uncanny valley for me, and I'm not sure how much of that is me as a manga reader coming into contact with the scenes I came to love and seeing them portrayed...differently. In part because as gorgeous as WIT's treatment is, the manga art is just supreme, but that unreasonable attention to visual detail is also part and parcel of the texture of the manga. Difficult to adapt in animation, though. I'm having that feeling where I'll see a big important scene, but it feels like a shell of the image I have of it.

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I'll also admit, having Thorfinn Naruto-run to the Frankish encampment just felt...incredibly weird. Just an odd little detail that felt a bit off, even though the series does have some of the hallmarks of shounen action.

In general, I paged back through the manga, and maybe I'll do a side-by-side later, but it's interesting how the framing of the panels in the manga is also very different. There's a certain claustrophobia to the attack on the fort, with the Frankish soldiers trying to force a battering ram through what looks like a wall of carnage. While the anime portrays the same scene, it actually pulls the framing back, which makes the bridge assault look a lot more hollow, with far less powerful imagery.

[LaZodiac]

I can't speak to the framing since I haven't seen it, but I seem to recall Thorfinn running like that in general... and like he's a small dude, running like that is aerodynamic, it's not actually a silly meme joke run it's actually a way to move quickly? So it's not that outlandish?

[Rynjin]

He runs like that primarily because he dual wields daggers, and probably doesn't want to stab himself.

Nothing about Thorfinn's fighting style is particularly historically accurate until later.

[LaZodiac]

He runs like that primarily because he dual wields daggers, and probably doesn't want to stab himself.

Nothing about Thorfinn's fighting style is particularly historically accurate until later.

Thorfinn's fighting style is "do everything a small person possibly can to kill someone larger than them, as crazily as possible" which isn't so much a style as it is a state of being.

[Mechalich]

So, I managed to catch a showing Funimation's rather restricted release of the live-action Kingdom film and it was surprisingly solid. The production values, action choreography, and performances are all very much in the range of your average pseudo-historical epic with a dash of wuxia with the only real difference between this film and the countless Chinese productions of this type that this one is in Japanese. Additionally, the casting costuming departments managed to absolutely nail the look of the characters as presented in the original manga, particularly Takao Ohsawa as Wang Yi and Masami Nagasawa and Yang Duanhe.

While it's not offering anything anyone hasn't seen before and the fights aren't the highest tier of cinematic martial arts, this one definitely goes into the the 'good live action adaptation' category and honestly, I'd consider it a better adaptation than any of the Kenshin films - my previous high-water mark. The only real complaint is that Funimation chose to subtitle the character names using the Chinese nomenclature, while the actors use the Japanese versions, which is a bit incongruous to actually watch play out. I'd definitely recommend trying to track down a showing if you live in a suitably large city for anyone who's read any of the Kingdom manga or just likes Chinese historical epic cinema in general.

[Bard's Requiem]

I would really love to join in these conversations about all of these different animes, but sadly I can't, because I only know JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.

[uncool]

I would really love to join in these conversations about all of these different animes, but sadly I can't, because I only know JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.

Don't worry. It turns out they're all elaborate Jojo references.

[Lord Raziere]

Don't worry. It turns out they're all elaborate Jojo references.

Yeah, the shonen series are all just references to Part 3. every single one of them.