The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #241
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    ...assuming life on these planets is carbon based like ours, even if the viruses ARE uniquely evolved due to the different environment, they'd still affect us as normal because we're both carbon-based life and thus can interact. It's actually a thing where moon rocks and Mars rocks are treated carefully since they COULD have ancient germs fossilized in them that could revive and **** us all up. IT's not impossible for the alien evironment to hurt us.
    That's not how viruses work at all. Very few viruses are capable of jumping between even two similar species on Earth. Pathogens tend to be very specific for what they can infect. I don't think what they ran into was a virus though, but a toxin, and one that had evolved into a very specific pattern with the local wildlife. The chances of that toxin having the same effect on alien life is quite small. I think it's more likely to be either instantly lethal because we haven't evolved the defences against that local life has, or it will do little or nothing because our biology isn't compatible. Even just between mammals, chocolate can kill dogs but we eat it for fun. Even a simple poison like cyanide might do nothing to an alien that used different chemicals for transporting oxygen in their equivalent of blood.

    An alien environment can easily harm us, but more likely from just having incompatible proteins or elements than by something intentional.

    The moon rock thing was just an over-abundance of caution, but harmless (except for astronauts being locked in a small room for a week) and worth doing just in case.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    But, let's back up a bit to what Zack said. Which... is EXACTLY what you said you wish he said. Zack plotted a route through all of space and they found the ONLY planets within range of each other that have livable by humans biomes, and are beelineing straight to them after getting enough food at bare minimum to make it. So yeah, they are definitely actually doing that exact thing, explicitly.
    I remember them saying something like "these are the planets we can use" but nothing about why. Maybe I missed that, but in general I think I want more of the why than can fit in a 20 minute episode.
    Last edited by Excession; 2019-08-13 at 07:14 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #242
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Between Dr. Stone and Lost in Space, I don't really care if the science isn't exactly perfect (though Stone probably has less excuse for being wrong, as a whole lot of it hinges on all of it being accurate). I just care about being entertained. If I had to spend minutes looking up a particular thing just to know that that thing isn't scientifically accurate, that's not really gonna affect how I view the show.

    Speaking of Demon Slayer, I am not watching it (and likely won't ever), but I am already annoyed at everybody who is. Apparently episode 19 is the greatest piece of work in anime ever, or something, because that's all anyone is talking about. I somehow doubt that is actually the case.

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Why do you need to be annoyed at people because they're enjoying something?

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    Speaking of Demon Slayer, I am not watching it (and likely won't ever), but I am already annoyed at everybody who is. Apparently episode 19 is the greatest piece of work in anime ever, or something, because that's all anyone is talking about. I somehow doubt that is actually the case.
    It is very beautifully animated.

    Not one single ****ing thing other than that is actually good though.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Why do you need to be annoyed at people because they're enjoying something?
    Not because they're enjoying something so much as how muvh they're hyping it up, I'd guess. Same as how everyone went insane for the first episode of Goblin Slayer because the violent imagery and the brutal rape scene "added a dose of realism to the standard fantasy world" or "showed how high the stakes are," or some nonsense like that. Even though I'm that first episode was essentially clickbait and nothing that violent or brutal ever really happens after that.
    Last edited by John Cribati; 2019-08-13 at 11:06 PM.

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  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    While I can't say one thing or another about Demon Slayer specifically, I can speak from experience when saying it's quite obnoxious to hear people talk about virtues a piece of media simply doesn't have even when it's something you like.
    Last edited by Mystic Muse; 2019-08-13 at 11:11 PM.
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by John Cribati View Post
    Not because they're enjoying something so much as how muvh they're hyping it up, I'd guess. Same as how everyone went insane for the first episode of Goblin Slayer because the violent imagery and the brutal rape scene "added a dose of realism to the standard fantasy world" or "showed how high the stakes are," or some nonsense like that. Even though I'm that first episode was essentially clickbait and nothing that violent or brutal ever really happens after that.
    Not AS dramatic, but there are other garbage ass scenes like that in other parts of the series. But we're not getting into that discussion today.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Like to me it sounds like a bunch of people saw something included for shock value and somehow managed to ascribe some kind of deeper meaning to it. Happens all the time. Is still annoying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by John Cribati View Post
    Like to me it sounds like a bunch of people saw something included for shock value and somehow managed to ascribe some kind of deeper meaning to it. Happens all the time. Is still annoying.
    Oh yeah no you're not wrong. The people who are into Goblin Slayer come in two groups.

    {Scrubbed}
    Last edited by truemane; 2019-08-14 at 09:54 AM.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Oh yeah no you're not wrong. The people who are into Goblin Slayer come in two groups.

    {Scrub the post, scrub the quote}
    Oh?

    I like the characters and the way they interact with each other. My two favorite scenes are the ice cream scene in Water Town, and the scene in the penultimate episode of season one
    Spoiler
    Show
    where the guild members decide to help Goblin Slayer.
    I also liked the short arc with the newbies who lost a sword while killing rats in the sewers.

    To me, the fantastic elements are a backdrop that informs the characters. I'm there for character moments between those characters.


    Which of your two categories does that put me in?
    Last edited by truemane; 2019-08-14 at 09:53 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harnel View Post
    where is the atropal? and does it have a listed LA?

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by gomipile View Post
    Oh?

    I like the characters and the way they interact with each other. My two favorite scenes are the ice cream scene in Water Town, and the scene in the penultimate episode of season one
    Spoiler
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    where the guild members decide to help Goblin Slayer.
    I also liked the short arc with the newbies who lost a sword while killing rats in the sewers.

    To me, the fantastic elements are a backdrop that informs the characters. I'm there for character moments between those characters.


    Which of your two categories does that put me in?
    The special third category of "I'm able to look past garbage because I think this part is neat", which is a special category reserved for basically all anime ever, not just Goblin Slayer, since there are a lot of series that have good parts that really, really aren't worth it.

    Also not for nothing but
    Spoiler: goblin slayer spoilers if you care
    Show
    I feel like the scenes you mention aren't earned at all. Nothing about Goblin Slayer's world makes me think the other heroes would ever care about him and his plight, and the idea that they do thanks to him acting so atypical of his normal sense is interesting and has some fascinating POTENTIAL messaging in it, but given the goblin army has naked women spread eagled and crucified to their shields and the actual event itself is a meaningless, pointless battle where nothing of interest happens I can't say it's actually good in any sense.


    But, to each their own.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2019-08-14 at 01:04 AM.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Count me as another that enjoyed watching Goblin Slayer. It wasn't deep, and I wasn't there for the shock value. I just happen to love a good dungeon crawl, and that's what pretty much the entirety of Goblin Slayer was. They even had a beholder, and made jokes about how they couldn't say it's name without bringing down the wrath of WotC. It just happened to be wrapped in an "edgy" fanservice wrapper.

    I've also been enjoying Demon Slayer. Again, it's not deep, but I likes me some anime fighting. It's no shallower than Naruto or Bleach were (although probably not as deep as My Hero Academia or Hunter X Hunter), and the fights are gorgeously animated against villains with inventive powers. And yes, episode 19 was awesome.

    Sometimes you just want to watch a dude decapitate demons with a water sword.

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rodin View Post
    Count me as another that enjoyed watching Goblin Slayer. It wasn't deep, and I wasn't there for the shock value. I just happen to love a good dungeon crawl, and that's what pretty much the entirety of Goblin Slayer was. They even had a beholder, and made jokes about how they couldn't say it's name without bringing down the wrath of WotC. It just happened to be wrapped in an "edgy" fanservice wrapper.

    I've also been enjoying Demon Slayer. Again, it's not deep, but I likes me some anime fighting. It's no shallower than Naruto or Bleach were (although probably not as deep as My Hero Academia or Hunter X Hunter), and the fights are gorgeously animated against villains with inventive powers. And yes, episode 19 was awesome.

    Sometimes you just want to watch a dude decapitate demons with a water sword.
    I mean by my understanding it's not even a water sword though it's just a sword and the fighting style he has imitates water so it looks like it's watery but there's no actual special powers involved.

    I don't begrudge someone for liking something I don't like, but I am going to prod you for "why" questions. Because... I mean, Naruto and Bleach kinda suck a lot in a lot of ways, but even those had some depth. Demon Slayer has... nothing, in a way I've never really seen before. His entire training montage is over in a page or two, and from that point on he's a really skilled demon hunter samurai, and we get basically nothing with regards to his trying to become stronger. He basically just gets elevated to the level of "really good" immediately.

    Also I can't say again how much I... feel like his sister being half demon, and also basically just a non-character who doesn't speak and barely acts and literally has a gag on her, feels really really ****ty.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2019-08-14 at 10:49 AM.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    and literally has a gay on her,
    Do you mean "gag?"
    Quote Originally Posted by Harnel View Post
    where is the atropal? and does it have a listed LA?

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by gomipile View Post
    Do you mean "gag?"
    I do in fact mean gag, my mistake. I'll fix that.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    So theres a new Isekai show- Do You Love Your Mom and Her Two-Hit Multi-Target Attacks? where a guy and his mother are trapped in a game, and judging from the title it seems like the mom is going to be the OP one except she has no idea what she's doing. Still, it looks like it can be funny, or at least interesting. I don't remember off the top of my head any Harem anime where the guy's mother was around to react to all the girls clinging to him, so I'm kind of looking forward to that.

    The OP had an uncomfortable lingering shot on the Mom Tiddies, and I guess if you're gonna go for MILF stuff this is the place for it, I'm hoping that stuff stats separate from the MC.

    The last thing I want tmis for this-or anything, mind you- to start a new Oedipal trend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    The creator of Mom's Two Hit Combo explicitly mentions it's Mom-Con. It goes there. It goes there hard. I have said as much before when it's come up in conversation here.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Well good thing I gave up half an episode in, then.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frozen_Feet View Post
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  19. - Top - End - #259
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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I mean by my understanding it's not even a water sword though it's just a sword and the fighting style he has imitates water so it looks like it's watery but there's no actual special powers involved.
    It's actually kind of unclear, since Zenitsu's lightning themed fighting style does seem to electrocute things around them. Also Tanjiro's water fighting style lets him do **** like breathe underwater, so...I dunno. Looks cool either way though.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I don't begrudge someone for liking something I don't like, but I am going to prod you for "why" questions. Because... I mean, Naruto and Bleach kinda suck a lot in a lot of ways, but even those had some depth. Demon Slayer has... nothing, in a way I've never really seen before. His entire training montage is over in a page or two, and from that point on he's a really skilled demon hunter samurai, and we get basically nothing with regards to his trying to become stronger. He basically just gets elevated to the level of "really good" immediately.

    Also I can't say again how much I... feel like his sister being half demon, and also basically just a non-character who doesn't speak and barely acts and literally has a gag on her, feels really really ****ty.
    Is the manga different? I haven't read it.

    His training montage is two episodes of the anime, and encompasses 2+ years of training. He rips ass through his first few demons but the current arc seems like it's ramping things up to the more challenging fights. He nearly gets killed by some schmuck who tries to kill him with Reddit downvotes, and every fight after that has been pretty intense. I haven't seen episode 19 yet but I'll probably watch it today.

    It's kind of refreshing to me to see a Shonen character with more of a Seinen starting point; he starts off GOOD, but there's plenty of room to grow, rather than a full Seinen action series where the character starts off as like the best or close to it, or your typical Shonen where the main character starts off as a wimpy scrub who's literally the worst at everything.

    The main issue with the series is tone whiplash (going from serious to slapstick on a dime) but it makes for an entertaining watch once you get used to it. Tanjiro himself and his powerset is patently ridiculous (my brother and I refer to the series as "Sniff-sniff boy and his amazing friends") but it doesn't hurt my enjoyment. Inosuke and Zenitsu are ****ing great and play off Tanjiro's dorky/sappy-ness very well. Tanjiro is definitely the weak link in his own series, but I do like what they're trying to do with his compassion (he genuinely feels sorry for the demons) without taking it to impractical extremes; he never hesitates to kill the monster, unlike some other pacifist/bleeding heart heroes of the past would.

    Re: Nezuko: Referring to her as a character who "barely acts" is kind of unfair. She doesn't SPEAK, certainly, but they do a great job of expressing her attitude and personality nonverbally. Anytime she's around she's ALWAYS doing something even when she's not center frame, even if it's something as silly as just playing around and pretending she's a caterpillar or something while people talk. The main issue is that she's rarely on screen, and I hope the series comes up with an excuse to have her out of the box more often in the future.

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Re: Nezuko: Referring to her as a character who "barely acts" is kind of unfair. She doesn't SPEAK, certainly, but they do a great job of expressing her attitude and personality nonverbally. Anytime she's around she's ALWAYS doing something even when she's not center frame, even if it's something as silly as just playing around and pretending she's a caterpillar or something while people talk. The main issue is that she's rarely on screen, and I hope the series comes up with an excuse to have her out of the box more often in the future.
    Wow the anime is REALLY different on this point. She's done a grand total of jack and ****ing squat in the manga, and I stopped reading at about where the anime currently is. She's a non entity who has like, one scene where she kicked a demon once, and otherwise has done nothing to express anything more than "I exist".

    Honestly the pig samurai and the neurotic samurai ARE characters who are interesting... except they end up feeling just kinda generic to me, and contrasted with the absolute plank of wood that is the main character, "alright basic characters" isn't really cutting it for me.

    While it can certainly feel refreshing to have a character who starts the series at lest semi-competant... I'm not seeing it at all? He seems incredibly skilled, mastering all the forms of the samurai style he's taking part of without basically any effort. He can kill basically anything other than high level demons, and while starting with the puzzlebox mansion the demons are actually interesting to see him fight, it ultimately doesn't account for much since he just has a skill for every encounter to end it almost immediately.

    Maybe the spider demons he fights in episode 19 make it more interesting, but I've completely lost the will to even continue with the series since it just comes off as bland and lifeless to me.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    As mentioned I haven't read the manga, so my entire working knowledge is anime only. Nezuko has so far contributed significantly to two demon fights (the one with the ball kicking demon who was working with the Upboat demon and the one before that with the one with three bodies) and as mentioned is generally shown puttering around doing stuff otherwise.

    I think given early days it's kind of unfair to drop a show JUST because the main character blasts through the bad guys. A lot of series do that before things ramp up, two of the former Big Three in particular. Absolutely nothing challenges Ichigo until he gets straight merced by Byakuya (which is like episode 18 or summat in the anime) and Luffy doesn't get challenged by an enemy until Crocodile in Alabasta which is episode 110. So I'm willing to give it a bit longer before I declare Tanjiro is a Boring Invincible Hero.

    If you don't like the characters, fair enough; they're kind of gimmicky and two dimensional, but I'm enjoying the gimmicks thus far.

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    As mentioned I haven't read the manga, so my entire working knowledge is anime only. Nezuko has so far contributed significantly to two demon fights (the one with the ball kicking demon who was working with the Upboat demon and the one before that with the one with three bodies) and as mentioned is generally shown puttering around doing stuff otherwise.

    I think given early days it's kind of unfair to drop a show JUST because the main character blasts through the bad guys. A lot of series do that before things ramp up, two of the former Big Three in particular. Absolutely nothing challenges Ichigo until he gets straight merced by Byakuya (which is like episode 18 or summat in the anime) and Luffy doesn't get challenged by an enemy until Crocodile in Alabasta which is episode 110. So I'm willing to give it a bit longer before I declare Tanjiro is a Boring Invincible Hero.

    If you don't like the characters, fair enough; they're kind of gimmicky and two dimensional, but I'm enjoying the gimmicks thus far.
    I mean your One Piece example is entirely wrong, but fair. I haven't seen the anime though, I've only seen the manga! And in the manga, 80 chapters have passed up to this point and nothing of any interest has happened beyond the doctor demon and her husband.

    Meanwhile in 80 chapters of One Piece... Arlong Park is happening, one of the best shonen arcs of all time. So you know. Comparisons.

    I want to clarify that I'm genuinely glad Demon slayer has an audience, because it IS a beautifully animated show from what I've seen of it. I just have no interest in it at all and unlike say, Hunter x Hunter, I don't feel bad about disliking it.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2019-08-14 at 05:36 PM.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Oh yeah no you're not wrong. The people who are into Goblin Slayer come in two groups.

    {Scrubbed}


    the more i see people bashing that show, the more i want to see it.


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Eh. I don't bash the show. I don't even have a major issue with the scene in question. I just want people to live their truth and admit they like the edginess for its own sake.

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by John Cribati View Post
    Eh. I don't bash the show. I don't even have a major issue with the scene in question. I just want people to live their truth and admit they like the edginess for its own sake.
    huh, define "edginess".


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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by ellenate View Post
    huh, define "edginess".
    Use of sexual content in a way that does not enhance the show in any way.

    Specific examples:
    Spoiler: content warning
    Show
    The series opens with a rape scene, there's another out of nowhere rape orgy because they managed to bean a paladin in the head with a small rock, I believe they need to violate women to produce more goblins, and the goblin army kidnaps and rapes women, the nails them to shields to use in battle during the big war scene at the end of the current anime.


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  27. - Top - End - #267
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    Aotrs Commander's Avatar

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Use of sexual content in a way that does not enhance the show in any way.

    Specific examples:
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    The series opens with a rape scene, there's another out of nowhere rape orgy because they managed to bean a paladin in the head with a small rock, I believe they need to violate women to produce more goblins, and the goblin army kidnaps and rapes women, the nails them to shields to use in battle during the big war scene at the end of the current anime.
    Note to self, permenent hard pass on that...

  28. - Top - End - #268
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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    As mentioned I haven't read the manga, so my entire working knowledge is anime only. Nezuko has so far contributed significantly to two demon fights (the one with the ball kicking demon who was working with the Upboat demon and the one before that with the one with three bodies) and as mentioned is generally shown puttering around doing stuff otherwise.

    I think given early days it's kind of unfair to drop a show JUST because the main character blasts through the bad guys. A lot of series do that before things ramp up, two of the former Big Three in particular. Absolutely nothing challenges Ichigo until he gets straight merced by Byakuya (which is like episode 18 or summat in the anime) and Luffy doesn't get challenged by an enemy until Crocodile in Alabasta which is episode 110. So I'm willing to give it a bit longer before I declare Tanjiro is a Boring Invincible Hero.

    If you don't like the characters, fair enough; they're kind of gimmicky and two dimensional, but I'm enjoying the gimmicks thus far.
    Also, Nezuko in episode 19:

    Spoiler
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    She saves Tanjiro first by body blocking the razor wire causing major damage to herself. Then when he's about to sacrifice himself in return by performing a mutual kill on the spider demon, she reveals her special demon blood power, destroys the silk wires, and adds power to Tanjiro's sword so that he's able to cut through the bad guy's neck.



    It's one of the things I like about the show - for the most part Tanjiro doesn't win the fights on his own. He would have been wrecked by the temari demon if Yushiro hadn't given him the spell that lets him see the arrows, and he doesn't wind up being the one to beat her - that's Tamayo. Tanjiro was on the ground with broken bones at the time. He might have beaten the swamp demon dude on his own, but he would have lost the people he was protecting if Nezuko hadn't fought to protect them while he was underwater. Even with the spider demons he was screwed because his sense of smell was overwhelmed - it took Inosuke using his beast senses to sniff out where the enemy was.

    And if you're just going off the manga I don't see how I can really explain why I watch the show. It's GORGEOUS, beautifully animated, and has haunting music with a "who's who" of shonen voice actors. I don't go back and re-watch Naruto or Bleach for the plot. Goodness me no. I go back and watch the fights, and the moments where the characters I loved did awesome things. Demon Slayer absolutely fits the bill here.

    I find it hard to look at Demon Slayer at less than 20 episodes and judge its depth against Naruto (700+ episodes) or Bleach (350+) or One Piece (nearly 900 and still going). At this point in Naruto he was still fighting freaking ZABUZA. Ichigo was recovering from his first meeting with Byakuya and we had yet to begin the arc that really gave Bleach legs as a show. I've never watched One Piece because I've never been able to get into it, so no comment there. Even Hunter X Hunter was still in Hunter Exam at this point, and that's the faster paced 2011 version.

    I will say that I'm bugged by the gag on Nezuko. I like how they've worked around it to give her character, but still...REALLY? I can't help but feel the show would be better if she had an actual speaking role. Heck, even her just being mute from the trauma would be an improvement.

  29. - Top - End - #269
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    Lord Raziere's Avatar

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by Aotrs Commander View Post
    Note to self, permenent hard pass on that...
    Did the same ever since the first I've heard of it, had no regrets.
    My Fan Fiction:
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  30. - Top - End - #270
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    Drascin's Avatar

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    Default Re: General Anime/Manga Discussion 16: In Another Thread With My Smartphone

    Quote Originally Posted by John Cribati View Post
    Eh. I don't bash the show. I don't even have a major issue with the scene in question. I just want people to live their truth and admit they like the edginess for its own sake.
    I, on the other hand, will happily bash the show. Not only is it exploitative as **** with all the cheap rape and violence, as well as edgy, misogynistic, waifu-baiting, and Hard Man-wanking, it is also incredibly dumb. Nothing about the worldbuilding makes any goddamn sense on the IC level. It's a "deconstruction" of fantasy tropes by a DM who only has the most passing knowledge of what fantasy tropes even are.
    Last edited by Drascin; 2019-08-15 at 08:49 AM.

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