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  1. - Top - End - #271
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    To be fair, Oko being the worst garbage ever is a very accurate depiction of old fae in modern media, so hard to begrudge him that. I always felt like he was supposed to be a villainous sort.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by tgva8889 View Post
    To be fair, Oko being the worst garbage ever is a very accurate depiction of old fae in modern media, so hard to begrudge him that. I always felt like he was supposed to be a villainous sort.
    I mean that's true, but he's the sort of bastard where it's like "okay yeah I'm not actually liking this". I get he's meant to be a villain but he's as charismatic as shoe leather.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Really wish this card was 'Bear Suplex'.

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    3G

    Sorcery

    Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature you control, then it fights with another creature you don't control.

    Adamant - If at least three green mana was spent to cast this spell, that creature you control gains indestructible until end of turn.

    From my limited ability to read simplified Chinese, I get 膂力过人, which is [Backbone] [Force/Strength] [Over] [Person]. It can translate to 'Exalted' or 'possessing extraordinary physical might'.

  4. - Top - End - #274
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Oni View Post
    From my limited ability to read simplified Chinese, I get 膂力过人, which is [Backbone] [Force/Strength] [Over] [Person]. It can translate to 'Exalted' or 'possessing extraordinary physical might'.
    I mean, that sounds like how I'd write suplex in simplified Chinese if it didn't have a symbol for supplex and I knew how to write simplified Chinese :P
    Last edited by DeTess; 2019-09-10 at 02:09 PM.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Oni View Post
    Really wish this card was 'Bear Suplex'.

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    3G

    Sorcery

    Put a +1/+1 counter on target creature you control, then it fights with another creature you don't control.

    Adamant - If at least three green mana was spent to cast this spell, that creature you control gains indestructible until end of turn.

    From my limited ability to read simplified Chinese, I get 膂力过人, which is [Backbone] [Force/Strength] [Over] [Person]. It can translate to 'Exalted' or 'possessing extraordinary physical might'.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Oni View Post
    Really wish this card was 'Bear Suplex'.

    From my limited ability to read simplified Chinese, I get 膂力过人, which is [Backbone] [Force/Strength] [Over] [Person]. It can translate to 'Exalted' or 'possessing extraordinary physical might'.
    Don't know if it is true, but someone wrote that it meant something similar to strength of a bear.


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    Great flavor, seems powerful enough, and it is the first usage of the word characteristics on a magic card.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Can I just say I love Adamant? It benefits monocolored decks which have fallen behind regularly.

    Also I'm trying to set up a few decks for my roommate and me. I bought the White vs. Red Spellslinger Starter Kit which includes boring cards, a lopsided duel and - ugh- the worst vanilla minions I've seen since I saw Oreskos Swiftclaw in the white starter deck in MTGA. White's creatures are either too expensive or too slow to benefit from aggro spells. And it lacks the removal to play a decent midrange.

    Also bought the Chandra planeswalker deck which is a lot more fun with a clear strategy: deal noncombat damage to buff your minions and win. I feel the other planeswalker decks are a good fit for duelling Chandra. None of the deck provide much value but it is an easy way to get going.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by DeTess View Post
    I mean, that sounds like how I'd write suplex in simplified Chinese if it didn't have a symbol for supplex and I knew how to write simplified Chinese :P
    From reading up on WWE terms being translated into Chinese, Suplex is normally rendered as 背摔, which translates more to '(over the) back throw' or maybe '(over the) shoulder throw'.

    Unfortunately, the card's official name is Outmuscle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjaman View Post
    Don't know if it is true, but someone wrote that it meant something similar to strength of a bear.
    Not really, because bear is xiong (熊), which doesn't show up in the card name.
    Last edited by Brother Oni; 2019-09-11 at 12:39 PM.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Im disappointed that they didnt make a good Robin Woods legendary creature...

    Something like:

    (1 colorless) and R/W/G

    P/T: 3/1

    Human Archer Rebel

    First Strike, Reach

    When Robin Woods enter the battlefield, one opponent at random become the Monarch.

    As long as Robin Wood is in play, if you would become the Monarch, create 1 food token and one treasure token instead.

    All Humans you control gain the Rebel subtype.
    Last edited by Emmerlaus; 2019-09-11 at 01:51 PM.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I mean there's multiple reasons that specific sort of idea wouldn't work.

    Also they did have a Robin Hood style card, and a white-red enchantment that just vomits Merry Men at you and it's great.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I mean there's multiple reasons that specific sort of idea wouldn't work.

    Also they did have a Robin Hood style card, and a white-red enchantment that just vomits Merry Men at you and it's great.
    Then I wanna hear it. Why wouldn't it work? lol XD

    EDIT: Im not saying the cards you mentionned arent great. Im just saying it would be wasome to have a Robin Wood card like the one I just described as commander with those two cards in the deck.
    Last edited by Emmerlaus; 2019-09-11 at 02:28 PM.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmerlaus View Post
    Then I wanna hear it. Why wouldn't it work? lol XD
    Monarch isn't in modern legal sets.
    Treasure tokens aren't in Throne of Eldraine.
    Rebels are not in Throne of Eldraine.
    Rebels is a subtype that matters in your deck, so giving it to humans on the board does nothing.
    What's green about Robin Hood besides living in the woods?
    It's super weak, letting your opponent draw a card every turn needs a massive upside.
    Being an archer can be his reach, or his first strike, being both is overkill.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Also they did have a Robin Hood style card, and a white-red enchantment that just vomits Merry Men at you and it's great.
    I'm really happy with both of those cards, as well as the synergy between them
    Last edited by Ninjaman; 2019-09-11 at 02:27 PM.
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  13. - Top - End - #283
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjaman View Post
    Monarch isn't in modern legal sets.
    Treasure tokens aren't in Throne of Eldraine.
    Rebels are not in Throne of Eldraine.
    Rebels is a subtype that matters in your deck, so giving it to humans on the board does nothing.
    What's green about Robin Hood besides living in the woods?
    It's super weak, letting your opponent draw a card every turn needs a massive upside.
    Being an archer can be his reach, or his first strike, being both is overkill.


    I'm really happy with both of those cards, as well as the synergy between them
    Dont get me wrong, both are fine cards, espcially he Merry-man one. I just wish there was a legendary card with synergy to both cards

    The fact that Rebels arent in Throne of Eldrain doesnt mean there couldn't be one. I put that ability on it to give human you control the Rebel subtybe as if there is a knight order, why woulnd't there be someone to oppose it?

    It would have being easy to include treasure tokens in the set.

    Robin Hood was about tradition, prosperity, Justice and respect of nature too if I recall right. And give back the ressources back to the people. Robin Woods was the hero of the community and the little people.

    If gaining your opponent get the Monarch is a major upside, dont you think players would want to be the monarch? It imply that the Monarch become the target of other players. EVERYONE want to draw more cards. Nobody want somebody else to be the monarch!

    Also, the upside is that when Robin Wood is summoned, you automatically gain a food token and a treasure token as well.

    As for First strike, maybe you are right. I'll give him Protection from Black instead. Its a legendary creature after all and one that cost 4 mana so I dont think its that bad.


    (1 colorless) and R/W/G

    P/T: 3/2

    Human Archer Rebel

    Reach, Protection from Black

    When Robin Woods enter the battlefield, target opponent become the Monarch.

    Everytime an opponent become the monarch, create 2 food token.

    Sacrifice a Food Token: Populate. You can only use this ability during your turn.
    Last edited by Emmerlaus; 2019-09-11 at 10:12 PM.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Sometimes a deck is just seven dwarves and every card you can find that creates a copy of target creature.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Sometimes a deck is just seven dwarves and every card you can find that creates a copy of target creature.
    A EDH clone deck then!

    Ludevic, Necro-Alchemist // Ravos, Soultender as commander! Or maybe Ludevic, Necro-Alchemist // Ikra Shidiqi, the Usurper (depending if you want the white color or the green).

    But if you want Bloodbond March for extra cheesiness, its going to be Ludevic, Necro-Alchemist // Ikra Shidiqi, the Usurper

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I mean, I don't... think that'd work as a commander deck.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2019-09-11 at 07:30 PM.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I mean, I don't... think that'd work as a commander deck.
    Depend of the power level of the group you play with. And beside, If you wanted Game Knight, Jacob brought a interesting deck at the table. Sure it wasnt that strong but as the opponent but it was interesting!

    It depends of your goal when making a commander deck. Some deck are more made to have fun then to win the game. A deck with Seven Dwarf definitly sound fun!

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmerlaus View Post
    Dont get me wrong, both are fine cards, espcially he Merry-man one. I just wish there was a legendary card with synergy to both cards
    Just because Robin Hood is a named character doesn't mean the card inspired by him needs to be.

    The fact that Rebels arent in Throne of Eldrain doesnt mean there couldn't be one.
    Yes it does. Rebel is a synergy based subtype, like sliver and ally. They do not appear as one offs.

    I put that ability on it to give human you control the Rebel subtybe
    I already explained that rebels care about rebels in the deck, so giving it to creatures on the board doesn't do anything, did you miss this point?

    as if there is a knight order, why woulnd't there be someone to oppose it?
    Robin hood was about opposing the corrupt king and the sheriff, he was not anti-knight.

    It would have being easy to include treasure tokens in the set.
    Treasures are not evergreen, they do not appear in every set, they appear when the mechanic is chosen to be one of the mechanics in the set. This is done to keep complexity of the set low to not have too much stuff going on.

    Robin Hood was about tradition,
    When was he about tradition?
    Even if he was, that seems like it was too small a part of his character to be relevant.

    prosperity, Justice
    Don't seem very green.

    and respect of nature too if I recall right.
    And that is a very weak reason to add green to something. I am glad they didn't.

    And give back the ressources back to the people.
    Not green.

    Robin Woods was the hero of the community and the little people.
    That fits squarely within red and white.

    If gaining your opponent get the Monarch is a major upside, dont you think players would want to be the monarch? It imply that the Monarch become the target of other players. EVERYONE want to draw more cards. Nobody want somebody else to be the monarch!
    Throne of Eldraine is a standard set, it is made predominantly for 1vs1 games, it does not include multiplayer only cards.

    Also, the upside is that when Robin Wood is summoned, you automatically gain a food token and a treasure token as well.
    And combined those two aren't even worth one card, much less one card every turn.

    As for First strike, maybe you are right. I'll give him Protection from Black instead. Its a legendary creature after all and one that cost 4 mana so I dont think its that bad.
    Protection is being used less these days because of how varying its usefulness is. It's also not generally a very nice design to have a three color card with protection against one of the other colors but not the other.


    (1 colorless) and R/W/G

    P/T: 3/2

    Human Archer Rebel

    Reach, Protection from Black

    When Robin Woods enter the battlefield, target opponent become the Monarch.

    Everytime an opponent become the monarch, create 2 food token.

    Sacrifice a Food Token: Populate. You can only use this ability during your turn.
    Populate is also not a mechanic in Throne of Eldraine.

    We have a share card design thread for this kind of stuff.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I am so hype for this set. I loved the flavor of original Innistrad and this feels like them doing that same thing for another popular media. I'm so happy to see things like Gingerbrute (you can only catch him if you're fast) and the flavor of Opportunistic Dragon capturing a Beloved Princess only for her to be rescued by the 3rd ability on Charming Prince (yes I know that's not a good play for the Opportunist Dragon player anyways). There's so much to like about this set, and I feel like we haven't even seen everything cool there is to see.

    Plus I'm digging all the knights and court stuff, which I wasn't sure how I would feel about. And the card names in this set are fantastic. My only hope is that the Limited format delivers too so I can enjoy that just as much.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninjaman View Post
    Treasures are not evergreen, they do not appear in every set, they appear when the mechanic is chosen to be one of the mechanics in the set. This is done to keep complexity of the set low to not have too much stuff going on.
    Totally on board with everything else you’ve said but it’s probably worth mentioning treasure has a much lower bar to clear than other mechanics to be in a set. For instance after being introduced in Ixalan, it appeared on a single card in Ravnica Allegiances (Smothering Tithe) and one in M20 (Rapacious Dragon).

    That said with food tokens in the set, you really wouldn’t want two different types of non-creature tokens in the set.

    Also, Emmerlaus, why do you keep calling Robin Hood, ‘Robin Wood’?
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    AH sorry... My birth language is French and I being translating it a bit too close to our French traduction that I should have. Here its the tale of " Robin des Bois ". The most literal translation would be " Woodland Robin ", aso explaining why I have difficulty imagining such character NO be in green.

    And Ninjaman, that was overkill as a explination but fine, I get it lol!

    Androgeus, thannk you for defending the Teasure mechanic at least, even if it might not be in this set because of the food token.

    Long story short: I was wrong in the card making departement. Moving on.

    =========

    Im a big fan of "Stolen by the Fey" for my flying ETB deck.

    Well, Im a big fan of a lot of cards in this set AND the flavor is just too awesome. Midnight Clock for my Toothy//Pir deck seem awesome. Cant wait to try it.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    So... I don't suppose anyone knows some articles/videos for learning the basics of stuff like strategy and deckbuilding?
    After coming back, I'm realizing I just don't quite get how to build decks or plan turns, etc. I've played stuff like Hearthstone, Yugioh, and Pokemon a lot over the years, but it doesn't translate quite as clearly to MtG as I'd hoped it might.
    Like, I know the rules, but I have yet to really grasp how to actually assemble a half decent deck, or how often/when to cast stuff.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Togath View Post
    So... I don't suppose anyone knows some articles/videos for learning the basics of stuff like strategy and deckbuilding?
    After coming back, I'm realizing I just don't quite get how to build decks or plan turns, etc. I've played stuff like Hearthstone, Yugioh, and Pokemon a lot over the years, but it doesn't translate quite as clearly to MtG as I'd hoped it might.
    Like, I know the rules, but I have yet to really grasp how to actually assemble a half decent deck, or how often/when to cast stuff.
    https://edhrec.com/

    Its the best website to look at strategy and cards to include. You can search via stratregy or cards.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Togath View Post
    So... I don't suppose anyone knows some articles/videos for learning the basics of stuff like strategy and deckbuilding?
    After coming back, I'm realizing I just don't quite get how to build decks or plan turns, etc. I've played stuff like Hearthstone, Yugioh, and Pokemon a lot over the years, but it doesn't translate quite as clearly to MtG as I'd hoped it might.
    Like, I know the rules, but I have yet to really grasp how to actually assemble a half decent deck, or how often/when to cast stuff.
    Is this specifically for EDH, limited or 60 card constructed? There are some major differences there.

    The thing that really makes MTG stand out is lands. A hearthstone deck wants to curve out, but is guaranteed to hit 10 mana by turn 10. This means the game weighs towards larger cards, and even aggro can play 5+ drops. In MTG you have to draw a land to get the mana for it, so every deck is a compromise between wanting to hit a certain sized card and wanting to hit cards that do something. If you play aggro you want relatively few lands and very cheap cards, and try to kill your opponent before they can accomplish anything. Control has far more lands, increasing the likelihood of drawing a land when they want removal.

    As a result aggro tends to be much better against control then in other games. Midrange is the compromise between them, beating aggro by using fewer but better creatures and removal. Combo in MTG is bad against control and is faster then aggro, reverse of in Hearthstone where control struggles with combo and beats aggro by grinding them out.

    When building a deck you effectively want 20 lands, plus 1 land for each cost in the highest cost card in your deck. If the CMC you want to hit is 5 you usually run 25 cards, etc. This is complicated by looting and cantrip effects, ie cards that let you look at the top of your deck and pick out a card to put in your hand. For every set of 4 1 cost card that draws a card (cantrips) you can remove 1 land from the deck because you increase the chances of picking a land. These decks usually play lost cost curves anyway, but even control runs cantrips for card selection.

    Explanation of some archetypes.
    Last edited by Tvtyrant; 2019-09-12 at 10:05 PM.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Togath View Post
    So... I don't suppose anyone knows some articles/videos for learning the basics of stuff like strategy and deckbuilding?
    After coming back, I'm realizing I just don't quite get how to build decks or plan turns, etc. I've played stuff like Hearthstone, Yugioh, and Pokemon a lot over the years, but it doesn't translate quite as clearly to MtG as I'd hoped it might.
    Like, I know the rules, but I have yet to really grasp how to actually assemble a half decent deck, or how often/when to cast stuff.
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  26. - Top - End - #296
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Tvtyrant View Post
    Combo in MTG is bad against control and is faster then aggro
    I am going to correct this statement whenever I see anyone making it. In what world is Scapeshift faster than Burn?

    The control beats combo who beats aggro who beats control mentality just doesn't actually hold up in practice, and I don't think continuing to repeat it is going to do anyone any good.

    When building a deck you effectively want 20 lands, plus 1 land for each cost in the highest cost card in your deck. If the CMC you want to hit is 5 you usually run 25 cards, etc. This is complicated by looting and cantrip effects, ie cards that let you look at the top of your deck and pick out a card to put in your hand.
    These numbers seem off. Going on mtg top 8 and looking at some decklist show that very few actually hold up to those numbers.
    Also I don't get why you include cantrips but not ramp spells when those are more important for your land count.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I get the cantrip information from the original turbo-xerox article here.

    https://magic.wizards.com/en/article...%99-2005-04-21

    I didn't address ramp as an archetype or prison, dredge, or tempo as a comprehensive post would be extremely long.

    Combo shoved aggro right out of Legacy, Modern has bad control so it bans good combo. The only good combo deck in modern is neoform, which as soon as it becomes consistent will be banned.

    The lands math part is true in spirit aggro, izzet Phoenix, jund, uw control, and at that point I lost interest in looking for more.

    All of these are supposed to be beginner rule of thumb. Feel free to post a better version.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Google search for Karsten's Mana base article and that'll give you a very good idea of what you need as far as lands.

    The issue that most controls decide face against combo is that a lot of people refuse to actually kill your opponent when they're building their control deck. If you've ever played Jeskai in modern vs something like Storm you'll understand why the referenced article says control is good against combo. This also holds up in standard in various iterations.

    The problem for a control deck is if you don't find your clock against your combo opponent, you eventually wind up drawing 4 blanks in a row and they just go for it and kill you because you gave them 15+ turns to have the perfect hand.

    Tldr: Kill your opponent. Whatever you're doing. If you give an opponent an exorbitant amount of time it doesn't matter what you have going you will likely lose to that combo.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Tvtyrant View Post
    I didn't address ramp as an archetype or prison, dredge, or tempo as a comprehensive post would be extremely long.
    I didn't talk about ramp as an archetype, I talked about ramp as a card type, that sees play in multiple archetypes.

    Combo shoved aggro right out of Legacy,
    There are more aggro decks in legacy than there are pure control decks. Most of the "control" decks are tempo.

    Modern has bad control so it bans good combo. The only good combo deck in modern is neoform, which as soon as it becomes consistent will be banned.
    Correction: The only fast combo deck in modern is neoform.
    Splinter Twin was undeniably good, but didn't push out aggro decks back when it was legal.
    Yes combo decks and aggro decks with little interaction tend to have good matchups against slightly slower decks with little interaction, and bad matchups against faster decks.
    What is good depends on what is fastest and how much interaction it plays. Death and Taxes was for instance a good legacy deck due to how much interaction it played.
    Workshop decks, which have been the best decks in vintage for a long time, are aggro decks.

    The lands math part is true in spirit aggro, izzet Phoenix, jund, uw control, and at that point I lost interest in looking for more.
    Looking at spirits on MTGtop8 I found one deck that played the 23 required for the math to be true, and about 10 playing only 21.
    True for Izzet Pheonix, not true for mono red pheonix, Who play a land less, two if you don't count Light up the Stage.
    Wrenn and Six allows Jund to play fewer lands, while Man lands mean they play more.
    UW control wouldn't cut a land if they cut their one-off Teferi.

    It's not true for:
    Burn - 20 lands, no draw power.
    Mono red Prowess - 17 lands, can play three less according to your rule, so they are two under par like burn.
    GW Eldrazi - 22 lands, cmc 5 if you count one off Batterskull, otherwise cmc 4. Plays one cantrip in ancient stirrings.
    Tron - 19 lands, cmc 10, can play 4 less lands with Stirrings, Sylvan Scrying and chromatics.
    Humans - 19 lands, cmc 3, no draw power.
    Death's shadow - Varies a lot, but usually three less lands than your method indicates.
    Hardened Scales - 20 lands, cmc 2/3, 1 less land due to Stirrings, still 1 or 2 bellow method.
    Merfolk - 20 lands, cmc 2/3, no draw power.
    Eldrazi Taxes - 22/23 lands, cmc 4/5, no draw power.
    UW death and taxes - 23 lands, cmc 5, no draw power.
    URZA - 20 lands, cmc 4, 2 less lands due to cantrips
    Mardu pyromancer - Varies, but typically 1 or 2 bellow, 3 if they're playing batterskull.
    Collected Company - Varies, but typically 21 or 22 lands, with cmc 4 spell.
    Elves - 18 lands, cmc 4, no draw power.
    Infect - 20 lands, cmc 2, no draw power.
    Neoform - 14 lands, cmc 3, 2 less due to cantrips.

    Some of these would fit your method better if you had counted ramp.



    All of these are supposed to be beginner rule of thumb. Feel free to post a better version.
    Easy. If you are just starting out, or starting again, and aren't playing competetively, which you aren't if you're building your own deck and need these tips, play 40% lands. Shave 1-2 off if you play cheap stuff, and add 1-2 if you play expensive stuff. Shave a few off if you play cheap card draw or ramp.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Thank you guys for the advice. It's been... sort of hard to figure out, but I think slowly I might be getting a better idea.

    Main format I have available is standard/whatever-you'd-call-Arena's-all-the-cards-mode-after-they-start-rotating-sets.
    I think the two main types of decks I've wanted to try are "something with goblins"(so... red and/or green, I think?) and "big green critters". I also have a fascination with alternate win conditions, buuut it seems like those are hard-ish to achieve with the current standard cards(except maybe mill. But I haven't had much luck in getting that to actually work, even despite the amount of Standard cards for it. I suspect learning some other deck types first would be good)

    I also managed to get a lot of "wolf" cards in a recent draft(the 2020 core set, I think?). But I'm not sure how viable that is as something to build a deck around.
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