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  1. - Top - End - #241
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Very false, since they're *very* likely to put a card on top of their library that they can use right away. You'd have to combine it with some sort of at-will milling, like Thought Scour.

    Scheming Symmetry only makes sense if the card you're tutoring for does so much for your gameplan that it doesn't matter what they search for, you'll still be on top afterwards. Generally you want to combine it with some sort of cantrip or draw spell, so you don't have to wait a turn to use it. Doomfall is a card that doesn't further any gameplan of your own, and it doesn't draw a card.
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  2. - Top - End - #242
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    Very false, since they're *very* likely to put a card on top of their library that they can use right away. You'd have to combine it with some sort of at-will milling, like Thought Scour.

    Scheming Symmetry only makes sense if the card you're tutoring for does so much for your gameplan that it doesn't matter what they search for, you'll still be on top afterwards. Generally you want to combine it with some sort of cantrip or draw spell, so you don't have to wait a turn to use it. Doomfall is a card that doesn't further any gameplan of your own, and it doesn't draw a card.
    I forgot it was a top-of-library tutor rather than a hand-tutor, then added "the following turn" once I remembered.
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  3. - Top - End - #243
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I think the best place for symmetry is in Tron, honestly. If Ancient Stirrings ever eats a ban it will be a decent replacement; find whatever you need, crack a star to put it in hand. Good early and late game, but riskier then stirrings so not as good as long as stirrings is an option.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Are you sure? Your opponent is going to tutor for Damping Sphere or whatever sideboard hate they brought in to react to it, I'm not sure you want that happening early on. If you're in a topdeck war in the late game, being Tron already gives you the edge - you hardly want to give your opponents a topdeck of their choice.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    Are you sure? Your opponent is going to tutor for Damping Sphere or whatever sideboard hate they brought in to react to it, I'm not sure you want that happening early on. If you're in a topdeck war in the late game, being Tron already gives you the edge - you hardly want to give your opponents a topdeck of their choice.
    I'm not entirely certain, and ancient stirrings might never see a ban so we might not find out. But tron can fight through hate really easily, force of vigor means you can even hit the hate cards for free. If I had enough money to buy all the decks in modern I would certainly play a few leagues like that, but I don't own a tron deck and don't have the spare capital for it.

    My thinking is that Tron basically has better cards, being an extremely consistent combo deck. Just wishing for a wurmcoil engine and playing it t3 lets it more consistently hit the exact hate it wants to win with, while them hitting hate cards is a speed bump. Usually questions are better then answers, and tron has the best questions.

    Edit: The other deck I keep thinking about with symmetry is Death's Shadow. With Street Wraith you can immediately draw the card you want, or even miracle's it on the opponent's upkeep. It also plays very low mana cards, and you can tutor for Force of X cards as free answers.
    Last edited by Tvtyrant; 2019-09-01 at 07:03 PM.
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  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Honestly there just isn't enough in black to draw you away from playing mono green. If stirrings eats it you just downgrade to Commune with Dinosaurs or Oath of Nissa.

    Can confirm, the best part of playing Tron is that you're the best topdecker in modern. 10+ cards in your deck cantrip and there's like another eight or so that are effectively tutors.
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  7. - Top - End - #247
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I might play Symmetry if I knew I was then going to Surgical Extraction my opponent, shuffling away whatever they searched for. Or, my favorite, nuke them with Archive Traps after.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tgva8889 View Post
    I might play Symmetry if I knew I was then going to Surgical Extraction my opponent, shuffling away whatever they searched for. Or, my favorite, nuke them with Archive Traps after.
    Milling does seem really good with Symmetry. Just play a land with a Hedron crab out and they're forced to give up their pick. Obviously not fast enough for Modern, but it seems fun in casual.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand



    New planeswalker. Disappointed he's not Sultai, but this looks pretty darn solid. Food, fyi, is an artifact token like clue tokens, but you get life instead of drawing a card.

    The fun thing then, is that Oko can uncook food, buy turning them into Elks!

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    The hilarious thing is he can unhook food back into an elk.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    The adventure mechanic is interesting.
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  12. - Top - End - #252
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Food is an artifact?

    At this point, is there anything that's not an artifact? As long as I have a living cow, it's a 1/1 creature, but as soon as I make a burger out if it, suddenly it's vulnerable to Shatter and Disenchant?

    I suppose you could argue that a burger is "artificial" because you have to butcher the cow and mince the meat and stuff. But an apple that falls off a tree is food as well. Animals live on food, there couldn't be anything more natural about that. Forget Mirrodin, there now isn't any plane in the multiverse in which living beings can survive without devouring artifacts on a daily basis. Potatoes? Artifact. Wheat? Artifact. Fish? Artifact.

    I know this is a "gameplay first" kind of thing... but that's a little absurd. I suppose Clue tokens kind of started us down that road, but at least clues could, with some effort, be reinterpreted as quasi-magical artificial objects within the context of Eldritch Moon. Using Enchantment would almost make more sense; you could argue that it's obviously enchanted food, like you find in fairy tales.
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  13. - Top - End - #253
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    True, I wonder why they havent made Food tokens to be enchantement... Then again, it would be too busted in enchantement decks and thatw ould make them harder to get rid off... I'll assume the food is the lifegain and the artifact part is the plate its in

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    You have to sacrifice it though. Where does the plate go? Do you eat that too?
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Muse View Post
    You have to sacrifice it though. Where does the plate go? Do you eat that too?
    There is a lowkey/Loki joke there somewhere.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Tvtyrant View Post
    There is a lowkey/Loki joke there somewhere.
    Nah, a Thor joke...

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmerlaus View Post
    Nah, a Thor joke...

    " Finish his cup " : That was good. ANOTHER! " smash the cup "
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    So, for those of you interested in the lore, I've finished reading The Wildered Quest. I'd say it's a good book, probably on par with the first Secretist (which I haven't read) that was mostly just Jace going to each guild and learning stuff. We learn a lot about Eldraine, there's some drama and action, it's a little confusingly written at time and it's partly intentional because of how The Wilds works, and all in all it was okay.

    Garruk gets the hedron removed and is also cured of his Chain Veil caused curse. He becomes the Kenrith's weird uncle. Their sparks ignite in this story, upon learning that their parents are ****ing garbage humans. The Kenrith twins are also... literally walking disasters. They're incredibly bad at doing basically anything. It's weird.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    So, trying Arena again and noticed two cards from the upcoming set seem to mention commanders? Like, as in EDH commanders? Are they adding the mode? Or?
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    They're adding Brawl, which is like Commander Lite. So yeah.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    It's...interesting.

    Having a creature that you always have access to, that you can choose to not go to the graveyard when it's destroyed. I'm not even sure how these "commanders" interact with bouncing effects, exiling, shuffling into deck, permanent theft, etc.

    Probably why it's best to start with preconstructed events I guess.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Food tokens being artifacts makes as much sense to me as treasures being artifacts.

    Because money can buy everything, even magical power. And Food tokens are not just any food. It's not a specific dish but its good enough to count as an artifact. I assume food tokens are stuff like gingerbread houses.

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex_Pariah View Post
    It's...interesting.

    Having a creature that you always have access to, that you can choose to not go to the graveyard when it's destroyed. I'm not even sure how these "commanders" interact with bouncing effects, exiling, shuffling into deck, permanent theft, etc.

    Probably why it's best to start with preconstructed events I guess.
    You can always choose to send them to the command zone instead of wherever else. Next cast costs 2 more though, so its probably better to let it go to hand than to the command zone (unless you cant cast from hand for some reason)

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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Sporeegg View Post
    I assume food tokens are stuff like gingerbread houses.
    Nope, check the food tokens, food is food. I think Maro’s excuse is artifacts are just things made by people (to be fair that is the literal definition), thus food is an artifact.
    Last edited by Androgeus; 2019-09-06 at 02:06 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silfir View Post
    Food is an artifact?

    At this point, is there anything that's not an artifact? As long as I have a living cow, it's a 1/1 creature, but as soon as I make a burger out if it, suddenly it's vulnerable to Shatter and Disenchant?
    I'd like to point out that by the same logic statues shouldn't be Artifacts, as they start as Lands. Plus, it is the best fitting permanent type and not worth creating a new one (sorry Tarmogoyf).

    As for the Wildered Quest, I felt it was meh. The story is sometimes confusing and many plot points were pure deus ex machine and overly abrupt nonsense, but the characterization was nice. I think that the poster above me is being a bit harsh on the Kenrith twins, and I especially think that they are being harsh on the Kenrith parents, who are overall pretty good people. One thing I will note is that it actually makes the commercial (which I think was better) non-canon, as Garruk is never captured and brought to Castle Ardenvale (and it feels highly unlikely (considering the events of the story) that he ever would be). I actually think that the lore wasn't as well done as it probably should have been. Also, it probably means that Battlebond happened well after WAR.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Quote Originally Posted by Personification View Post
    I'd like to point out that by the same logic statues shouldn't be Artifacts, as they start as Lands. Plus, it is the best fitting permanent type and not worth creating a new one (sorry Tarmogoyf).

    As for the Wildered Quest, I felt it was meh. The story is sometimes confusing and many plot points were pure deus ex machine and overly abrupt nonsense, but the characterization was nice. I think that the poster above me is being a bit harsh on the Kenrith twins, and I especially think that they are being harsh on the Kenrith parents, who are overall pretty good people. One thing I will note is that it actually makes the commercial (which I think was better) non-canon, as Garruk is never captured and brought to Castle Ardenvale (and it feels highly unlikely (considering the events of the story) that he ever would be). I actually think that the lore wasn't as well done as it probably should have been. Also, it probably means that Battlebond happened well after WAR.
    Yup, the idea is that Battlebond happens after.

    I'll admit I'm being harsh on the Kenrith's, but they do actually, legitimately, do nothing of consequence beyond kill some redcaps and attempt to save Garruk. The two of them have a powerful crush on their friend Titus and also Oko to a degree, and end up spilling every secret they can find their hands on to him because of it.

    The mom is mostly good, but the dad taking his wife's rightful place as High King because she, in a moment of sympathy, opted to take care of his dead children is kinda ****y though.

    I don't... really get the good characterization compliment myself. The Kenrith's come off well, primarly the twins since they're rambunctious idiots and it does feel like they're teenagers. The rest of their family is middling, with their stepmom being the best of them. Dad being basically a Monty Python character in how he reacts to everything once he's revived was... certianly a thing they decided to do. It was fun though. Garruk has some good character, as does Oko, though Oko's basically just the worst garbage fairy ever. Basically every other character was just kinda there or an *******.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    Good characterization doesn't mean Good characters. Also, while the queen probably deserved the title, the king didn't not deserve it. He was clearly a good king and she didn't begrudge him the title.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Personification View Post
    Good characterization doesn't mean Good characters. Also, while the queen probably deserved the title, the king didn't not deserve it. He was clearly a good king and she didn't begrudge him the title.
    True, but Oko's characterization makes him unlikable in a bad way for me, so I'd argue it's poor characterization. And the side cast aside from the Kenrith family were just kinda there or bad.

    That's true, but she probably should have.


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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I cede both points. I went in expecting nothing great and when I got it I was satisfied.
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    Default Re: Magic the Gathering Thread XXIV: *Slaps Roof* This Thread Can Hold So Many Chand

    I'm not saying I didn't enjoy it myself, I'm just saying I'm a writer myself so I get all nitpicky and ****.

    I will note, the book did not end up being AT ALL like I expected it. I had no idea from the marketing that it was an origin story for the twins.


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