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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Tawmis's Avatar

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    Mar 2004

    Default Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    So the party of three (A Fighter - Dave, A Cleric - Marcy, and a Wizard - Mark) all roll up to a small town after fighting some goblins.
    Weary, and in need of a long rest they pay the Inn Keeper's son 30 gold (each paying 10 gold from their recent battle!) and head up to the room.
    The Inn Keeper came out, scolded his son, because it was The Holy Moon (Eclipse) and says it's only 25 gold. Hands his son 5 gold to give back.
    As the son is walking back to the room, he realizes there's no even way to split 5 gold between the three party members, so he pockets two gold "for his troubles."
    He gets to their room and hands them back, each 1 gold coin.
    So now each of them has paid 9 gold, since they each got a 1 gold refund.
    So 9 gold x 3 party members is 27 + 2 gold the Inn Keeper's son kept is... 29 gold.
    So where is the missing gold coin?

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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Lord Raziere's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tawmis View Post
    So the party of three (A Fighter - Dave, A Cleric - Marcy, and a Wizard - Mark) all roll up to a small town after fighting some goblins.
    Weary, and in need of a long rest they pay the Inn Keeper's son 30 gold (each paying 10 gold from their recent battle!) and head up to the room.
    The Inn Keeper came out, scolded his son, because it was The Holy Moon (Eclipse) and says it's only 25 gold. Hands his son 5 gold to give back.
    As the son is walking back to the room, he realizes there's no even way to split 5 gold between the three party members, so he pockets two gold "for his troubles."
    He gets to their room and hands them back, each 1 gold coin.
    So now each of them has paid 9 gold, since they each got a 1 gold refund.
    So 9 gold x 3 party members is 27 + 2 gold the Inn Keeper's son kept is... 29 gold.
    So where is the missing gold coin?

    Thats.....not how that works.

    the innkeeper has 25 gold. the son has two, the three adventurers each have one. that adds up to 30, there is no missing gold coin.

    is the joke about how the innkeeper should have gave them all a 20% discount and thus give the son 6 six coins to split evenly but didn't? and why didn't he just not mention the discount if he is that greedy, he could just have all thirty coins.
    I'm also on discord as "raziere".


  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Tawmis's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    Thats.....not how that works.
    the innkeeper has 25 gold. the son has two, the three adventurers each have one. that adds up to 30, there is no missing gold coin.
    is the joke about how the innkeeper should have gave them all a 20% discount and thus give the son 6 six coins to split evenly but didn't? and why didn't he just not mention the discount if he is that greedy, he could just have all thirty coins.
    It's indeed a joke (that's why it has the D&D Humor tag on it) :)

    It's an old Math thing our teacher did to us way, way, way, way back in High School (that was a long time ago for me) but using dollars instead of gold... and in the 5e forum there was a debate about the size of something fitting into a bag of holding, which turned into a math question of physics, cubes, and dimensions of the bag's opening... which reminded me of this joke/riddle. That if you tell a math problem a specific way it sounds like there's a missing dollar (or gold coin).

    Because if each paid 10 gold/dollars.
    Then they all got 1 back as a refund, means they paid 9.
    Plus the 2 the bell boy kept.
    3 x 9 = 27 + 2 = 29.
    It looks like a missing dollar / coin.

    And when my math teacher first told it to the class (right before the bell rung for the day)... my mind nearly exploded trying to figure it out.
    Need a character origin written? Enjoyed what I wrote? How can you help me? Not required, but appreciated! <3

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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    I don't get why you're adding the two gold pieces that the innkeeper is keeping to the final amount. The 27 gp that the adventurers paid already include those 2 gp. 25 gp for the room + 2 gp for the trouble = 27 gp, which divided by 3 is the 9 gp that each paid. There's no missing coin because the amount now has changed to 27, not to 29.

    In fact, if the total amount was now 29, what we should figure out is where those two extra coins came from.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Tawmis's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSandman View Post
    I don't get why you're adding the two gold pieces that the innkeeper is keeping to the final amount. The 27 gp that the adventurers paid already include those 2 gp. 25 gp for the room + 2 gp for the trouble = 27 gp, which divided by 3 is the 9 gp that each paid. There's no missing coin because the amount now has changed to 27, not to 29.
    In fact, if the total amount was now 29, what we should figure out is where those two extra coins came from.
    Heh - it was a riddle the teacher told us.
    So the way he had phrased it...
    Three people go to an inn and pay 10 dollars (gold) each, for a total of 30.
    They go back to their room.
    Inn Keep gives 5 gold to the bellhop to return.
    Bellhop pockets 2 because you can't split 5 evenly between 3.
    So each who paid 10 now officially paid 9.
    So if they all paid 9 originally, and there was 3 of them - that makes 27 + 2 the bellhop kept is 29.
    So when it was originally phrased that way, it sounded like there was a missing dollar (gold coin).

    But obviously, if you look at it the other way - the inn keep has 25, he gave 5 to the bellhop, he kept 2 and gave 3 back.
    That's 25 + 3 + 2 which equals 30.

    It was a matter of how he stated the riddle to make it look like there is a missing dollar/coin.

    It's MUCH easier to figure out when you read it.

    But tell it to someone (so they don't have the numbers in front of them), they will focus on how you're telling it, and believe there's some trick to a missing dollar (gold coin).
    Need a character origin written? Enjoyed what I wrote? How can you help me? Not required, but appreciated! <3

    Check out my 5e The Secret of Havenfall Manor or my character back stories over at DMsGuild.com! (If you check it out - please rate, comment, and tell others!)

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  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    10 gold pieces for a room??? That is one expensive inn.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tawmis View Post
    Heh - it was a riddle the teacher told us.
    So the way he had phrased it...
    Three people go to an inn and pay 10 dollars (gold) each, for a total of 30.
    They go back to their room.
    Inn Keep gives 5 gold to the bellhop to return.
    Bellhop pockets 2 because you can't split 5 evenly between 3.
    So each who paid 10 now officially paid 9.
    So if they all paid 9 originally, and there was 3 of them - that makes 27 + 2 the bellhop kept is 29.
    So when it was originally phrased that way, it sounded like there was a missing dollar (gold coin).

    But obviously, if you look at it the other way - the inn keep has 25, he gave 5 to the bellhop, he kept 2 and gave 3 back.
    That's 25 + 3 + 2 which equals 30.

    It was a matter of how he stated the riddle to make it look like there is a missing dollar/coin.

    It's MUCH easier to figure out when you read it.

    But tell it to someone (so they don't have the numbers in front of them), they will focus on how you're telling it, and believe there's some trick to a missing dollar (gold coin).
    Oh! So the trick is in realising that the calculation are wrong, not in any mathematical principle?

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Technically, the gold coin is already calculated for in the original sum. You're supposed to add the 3 gold coins they saved, as the 2 the bellhop kept for himself is already part of the originally paid 30. It's not that difficult to figure out and is an obvious misdirection, but one that has caused massive problems in real life.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Troll in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSandman View Post
    Oh! So the trick is in realising that the calculation are wrong, not in any mathematical principle?
    Yes - exactly this. It is a very very old trick maths question.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Lord Torath's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tawmis View Post
    It's indeed a joke (that's why it has the D&D Humor tag on it) :)

    It's an old Math thing our teacher did to us way, way, way, way back in High School (that was a long time ago for me) but using dollars instead of gold... and in the 5e forum there was a debate about the size of something fitting into a bag of holding, which turned into a math question of physics, cubes, and dimensions of the bag's opening... which reminded me of this joke/riddle. That if you tell a math problem a specific way it sounds like there's a missing dollar (or gold coin).

    Because if each paid 10 gold/dollars.
    Then they all got 1 back as a refund, means they paid 9.
    Plus the 2 the bell boy kept.
    3 x 9 = 27 + 2 = 29.
    It looks like a missing dollar / coin.

    And when my math teacher first told it to the class (right before the bell rung for the day)... my mind nearly exploded trying to figure it out.
    Why are we adding 2 to the 27? We got to 27 by adding the 2 to 25! That's where the error lies. If you subtract the 2 from the 27, then you get to the 25 the innkeeper kept.
    Last edited by Lord Torath; 2019-07-19 at 11:15 AM.
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  11. - Top - End - #11
    Troll in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by caden_varn View Post
    10 gold pieces for a room??? That is one expensive inn.
    Could be the “adventurers’ special” as who else has platinum coins to plunk on the counter?

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0122.html
    Last edited by Particle_Man; 2019-07-19 at 09:14 AM.

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  12. - Top - End - #12
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Phhase's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Oh, this one is nice. I like this one. I'm gonna enjoy telling this to friends. Noone expects the true error point to be "So if they each paid 9"!
    Sometimes, I have strong opinions on seemingly inconsequential matters.
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  13. - Top - End - #13
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Tawmis's Avatar

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    Default Re: Someone is a thief... and I can't figure out who it is!

    Quote Originally Posted by Phhase View Post
    Oh, this one is nice. I like this one. I'm gonna enjoy telling this to friends. Noone expects the true error point to be "So if they each paid 9"!
    Prepare for your friends to hate you.
    Need a character origin written? Enjoyed what I wrote? How can you help me? Not required, but appreciated! <3

    Check out my 5e The Secret of Havenfall Manor or my character back stories over at DMsGuild.com! (If you check it out - please rate, comment, and tell others!)

    Subscribe to my D&D Channel on Youtube! (Come by and Sub)

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