The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by snowblizz View Post
    I immediately thought you should make the weather, air, literally and figuratively, the atmosphere seem off. Toss in some tidbits how strangers are just not well regarded and considered suspicious already say due to some quirk of the Imperial Creed practised. So ppl will treat them generally negatively but you got plausible denial.
    Yeah, definitely got that covered. The general theme of the campaign is exploring and exploiting a previously unexplored subsector of the Halo Stars, and this bunch is the largest of the human splinter empires in the area - settled by the crew of a Heresy-era Black Ship and its escorts, specifically. So they've been cut off from the Imperium proper almost since the Heresy began, and what flavor of diplomacy the PC's Dynasty employs in dealing with them will have big repercussions. They don't even know the Emperor is still alive, let alone that he's been deified. Witches or mutants of any kind are killed on sight, and those of Untouchable/Blank heritage are revered as holy/sacred in their culture - that instinctive revulsion non-Blanks feel around them is interpreted as a subconscious understanding of their own inferiority.
    Last edited by The Glyphstone; 2019-07-27 at 05:58 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards View Post
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Well.. thats kinda the point though?
    Blanks/Pariah isnt warp stuff. They are the opposite of warp stuff.
    So it should be limited just how different they can be. Except in the size of their zone.
    Much the same as the dark is not the opposite of light, it's the result of having no light, a Blank is still warp related since the warp is all about souls and the results of not having a soul is what the effects produce.

    As to the difference between Blanks and Pariahs, I always thought it was a case of Blanks having no soul while a Pariah has a ... void where their soul should be. A Blank is almost in the uncanny valley range, something is off and unsettling, but you can't quite place what (unless you're a psyker) so your mind interprets it is random unpleasant things, while a Pariah is a howling gale of warp nothingness that even those without warp attunement feel a powerful and inherant wrongness about.

    I'd liken it to a ship on the tides, regular souls are normal ships on a regular day, Blanks are various strengths of undertow and current pulling toward rocks or reefs but can be managed with a good boat and a strong crew while Pariahs are a whirlpool, with only their strength determining how deep and severe the vortex is, but all of them are avoided at all costs for to be anywhere near them is likely to end poorly at best for even the strongest of vessels.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Drasius View Post
    Much the same as the dark is not the opposite of light, it's the result of having no light, a Blank is still warp related since the warp is all about souls and the results of not having a soul is what the effects produce.
    The way that I have interpreted it is that they are similar effects, but caused from the "opposite directions".
    The random effects caused by psychic powers is just that - warp phenomena manifesting itself in places where the warp has been pulled through and allowed to exert itself directly. The effects that happen around blanks aren't caused by the blank directly, but rather by reactions of things to it. Being a blank doesn't inherently make people around you cringe and puke themselves inside out, but it triggers *a* reaction and that is the common form that it manifests, among others.

    As to the difference between Blanks and Pariahs, I always thought it was a case of Blanks having no soul while a Pariah has a ... void where their soul should be. A Blank is almost in the uncanny valley range, something is off and unsettling, but you can't quite place what (unless you're a psyker) so your mind interprets it is random unpleasant things, while a Pariah is a howling gale of warp nothingness that even those without warp attunement feel a powerful and inherent wrongness about.
    My source for this is Codex Daemonhunters, Codex Assassins and the Eisenhorn/Ravenor books, so if there's anything in Codex Necrons to contradict me I don't know about it. Just putting that there as a preamble.

    As far as it reads in those sources, pariah is just a nickname for a blank, same as people call psykers by the names of witches, wyrds, and so on. It comes from possessing the Pariah Gene, which is what causes them to be blanks; a quirk of DNA that makes them have no soul. Some blanks are more "powerful" that others - the most powerful being recruited as Culexus Assassins - but its all the same ability stemming from the same source. Possibly someone better acquainted with biology could explain it in terms of dominant and recessive genes, but that probably doesn't matter - it's fakey space magic and it just happens regardless of the how or why.

    The Necron unit of a Pariah is a blank who has been bred/captured and then infested with Necron technology to make them even more effective.

    Necron Pariahs and human pariahs are broadly the same thing. Again they both draw from the same source - the Pariah Gene - but the Necron version is technologically augmented to be horrific and terrifying as standard, in the same way that a Culexus Assassin (a blank) can focus its 'power' through the Animus Speculum to horrify those around it. Whatever else we can say about Mont'Ka, the Culexus' effect on the Tau as it walks by is an accurate representation of an amplified blank aura, which ALL Necron Pariahs exhibit.
    Whereas in unaugmented humans, that level of revulsion is possible but rare and special even among blanks.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Necron Pariahs really are the ultimate expression of the effect of the null field: they exhibit such a powerful aura of unease and revulsion that they managed to retcon themselves out of existence!
    Evil round every corner, careful not to step in any.

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    Much the same as the dark is not the opposite of light, it's the result of having no light, a Blank is still warp related since the warp is all about souls and the results of not having a soul is what the effects produce.
    Before your getting to highly up on your lecturing horse, opposite is a highly subjective term, that can shift a lot depending on your point of view.
    Warp Stuff/Psykers pushes the power of the warp into the physical realm to affect it.
    Blanks does the opposite, pushing the warp away making it impossible to affect the physical realm.

    Necron Pariahs really are the ultimate expression of the effect of the null field: they exhibit such a powerful aura of unease and revulsion that they managed to retcon themselves out of existence!
    Bwahahaha!
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Avaris View Post
    Necron Pariahs really are the ultimate expression of the effect of the null field: they exhibit such a powerful aura of unease and revulsion that they managed to retcon themselves out of existence!
    Nice one.

    Personally (given how much I like the Cain books) I'd like Necron Pariahs to be something that existed, but not for long, rather than having never existed. Something like:

    "The Sautekh Dynasty experimented with captured Pariahs, transferring their spirits into Lychguard bodies and using them as assault troops. The experiment was eventually declared a failure and discontinued".
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2019-07-28 at 06:13 AM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by lord_khaine View Post
    Before your getting to highly up on your lecturing horse, opposite is a highly subjective term, that can shift a lot depending on your point of view.
    Warp Stuff/Psykers pushes the power of the warp into the physical realm to affect it.
    Blanks does the opposite, pushing the warp away making it impossible to affect the physical realm.
    Is it considered lecturing to have an opposing viewpoint? Or just one that you don't like?

    Considering that you went from saying that blanks had nothing to do with the warp to saying that blanks interact with the warp in 2 pages, maybe you would like to check the basis for your position?

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Continued from the main 40k thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    So, in that case, you're saying that similar to say, Deathwing (Bone/White) or Ravenwing (Black), you're saying that the entire Blood Ravens 1st Company, being all Psykers, would therefore be all Librarians, therefore, they would be blue, not red. That's...Not what I wanted to hear. But it would make sense.
    Okay, so in typical form I told you what I know and then I went and checked it only to have proven myself wrong.

    Blood Ravens DO let their Librarians double-up in other roles, including Captains and even Chapter Masters:

    Quote Originally Posted by Index Astartes on the GW Website
    Notionally a Codex Chapter, the Blood Ravens' most obvious deviation from strict Codex adherence is the high number of Librarians in their ranks, as well as the practice of affording Librarians dual-roles as unit commanders (for example, as Company Captains or even Chapter Master as well as their Librarius rank). The actual commanders of the Blood Ravens are known as the Secret Masters, and as befits such a title, little is known of who these marines are or what positions they officially hold within the command tree.
    Source via the WayBack Machine.

    I was right about the second part though - they are still fully inducted Librarians, whatever else they are also, so they're probably going to be blue.

    But also, they have a Librarius, which isn't the 1st Company.
    This is Codex compliant. The Librarium is outside of the typical organisation and it's members are attached to Companies as needed; this also means that not all of the 1st Company are Librarians, but possibly that a lot of Librarians are attached to the 1st Company, therefore there will be some red/gold Veterans around.

    I'm not sure why you're saying that the entire 1st Company are Psykers, I haven't seen anything to support that?

    An alternative would mean that they do sometimes field squads of Librarians - the heretic hunting "battle-squads of Librarians" - in which case the Deathwing analogy is more accurate in that it's their own version of something already existing, though they're still not necessarily all 1st Company.

    http://www.giantitp.com/forums/shows...&postcount=941

    Unless the Psykers are also Veterans, which inducts them into the 1st.
    Arguably this would mean that they have a larger than average number of Episoltaries, if Librarians get attached to Companies and have their own internal ranks to denote Veteran-equivalent status?
    Last edited by Wraith; 2019-07-28 at 09:34 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    Blood Ravens DO let their Librarians double-up in other roles, including Captains and even Chapter Masters:
    Yep.

    I was right about the second part though - they are still fully inducted Librarians, whatever else they are also, so they're probably going to be blue.
    [...]
    I'm not sure why you're saying that the entire 1st Company are Psykers, I haven't seen anything to support that?
    ...You know what? ...I've been saying it for years, and now I can't find it either. There's an almost definite chance that I've been wrong the entire time.

    The only thing I can find is that the 1st does contain Battleline Librarians. Albeit not the entire 1st Company, as I have been led to believe...By nothing, apparently.

    So yeah. It's certainly canon that Blood Ravens do field entire squads of Librarians - so my GK!Blood Ravens, still checks out. It's just that instead of painting them red, I'll be painting them blue.
    Gross.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    The only thing I can find is that the 1st does contain Battleline Librarians. Albeit not the entire 1st Company, as I have been led to believe...By nothing, apparently.
    Shortly after the Chapter was founded, most of their 1st Company was wiped out and had to be rebuilt by Azariah Vidya, the first Librarian-Chaper Master. They also field large numbers of Librarians in dedicated squads. I can see where and how you might have conflated the two into being the same thing.

    Gross.
    On the one hand: I comparatively kind of like the idea of your Justicars being blue, so as to look like squads of Veterans being led by one of the abundant Librarians. It pays homage to the theme of Blood Ravens and also supports the Brotherhood of Brothers rule for Strike Knights, giving it a plausible reason for the 'squad' to have the <Psyker> tag.

    On the other; I generally dislike painting blue Librarians because I don't like odd blue guys in the middle of my otherwise carefully choreographed army.
    Given that it's taken the two of us the better part of half a day to figure it out and cite our sources, I seriously doubt that casual observers would know the difference if you pained Voldus red and gold (perhaps more gold than red, as befits his station?) and just didn't mention it. Maybe find some middle ground with a few blue shoulder pads/arms here and there, and do the "Deathwatch" thing just to show it up a bit?

    If anyone does ask, point out that you're using Grey Knight rules and Grey Knights don't change the colour of their Librarians, so you've done it that way on purpose so as not to be accused of codex-hopping.
    Last edited by Wraith; 2019-07-28 at 11:17 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    On the one hand: I comparatively kind of like the idea of your Justicars being blue, so as to look like squads of Veterans being led by one of the abundant Librarians.
    So far I have three options;

    Paint them straight up Blood Ravens, pre-Heresy Thousand Sons and all.
    Paint them like 'Red Deathwatch', where they're red, but Psyker-identifying parts of the models like Psychic Hoods and shoulder rims, painted blue.
    Paint them like Librarians.

    The issue with just painting the...Justiciars special, is that the entire squads have Force Weapons, not just the dude in the front.

    On the other; I generally dislike painting blue Librarians because I don't like odd blue guys in the middle of my otherwise carefully choreographed army.
    That's why I like the way Deathwatch do their stuff.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    I tried to Google this and failed, so hopefully one of you 40k loremasters can help me out.

    Where do Space Marine vehicle crews come from?

    I think I understand the progression system of the 10 companies for a codex-compliant chapter, and generally how the specialist roles like Librarian and Chaplain fit into things. But tank crews, Rhino drivers and aerospace pilots? Are they sourced from one of the ten companies (like bikers and land speeder crew), or are they supernumerary like the honor guard and specialists.

    I can see clear as day that it's a power-armored Space Marine manning the storm bolter on a Rhino. And the Ultramarines have a named sergeant tank commander.

    Having one or two Space Marines per vehicle adds up, if the chapter in question has a decent-sized vehicle pool. I suppose all that gene-seed enhancement does confer some benefits to vehicle operation, but the question then becomes, how does a Space Marine find himself driving a tank?

    I can see them having trials and observations for things like Chaplain affinity or tech skills, but tank driving? What would justify taking a perfectly fine battle brother out of the ten companies and into the role of battle taxi driver. Could it be an as-needs system? A tank driver died, so let's take the worst performing battle brother from the reserve companies and stick him there? Hmm.

    Thanks in advance
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex_Pariah View Post
    Where do Space Marine vehicle crews come from?
    The Armoury (Techmarines).

    Having one or two Space Marines per vehicle adds up, if the chapter in question has a decent-sized vehicle pool. I suppose all that gene-seed enhancement does confer some benefits to vehicle operation, but the question then becomes, how does a Space Marine find himself driving a tank?
    Battleline Marines from the Company, find themselves attached to the Armoury for one reason or another. There's a myriad of reasons to take someone off the battleline, and into a truck. But, at the end of the day, it's really unclear how a Chapter recruits from the Companies, to the Armoury - it's not the ability to fix a Boltgun or patch Armour. All Marines are supposed to know how to do that. I guess you could maybe headcanon that each year a Chapter holds the 'Fully Sick Rhino Rally Derby' and anyone who wants to shows off their ability to do burnouts and doughies in the parking lot.
    (Which was basically the fluff behind my 'Yellow White Scars Razor-spam' back in 7th Ed., they were basically Mad Max-Marines)

    More often than not, painting a Vehicle gunner according to the fluff is too much effort. People just don't know the fluff, because nobody actually cares about fluff. Then again, why do Vehicle crews have Cog shoulder-pads? It's not like it isn't obvious.

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    This is the way that the Deathwatch also paint their Armoury Staff. Same armour colour as the rest of the 'Watch (You think you're special, son?), but with red accents.


    The exception is Land Speeders. The Pilots and Gunners are sourced from the Companies.
    Last edited by Cheesegear; 2019-08-01 at 11:16 PM.
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    Great, now my brain is trying to come up with a custom chapter that ran out of Dreadnought chassis and started sticking its nearly-dead heroes in Predators instead.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    My headcanon is that those spots are reserved for marines who are recovering from major injuries or who have enough damage/bionics to still serve the chapter in a combat role, but won't be optimal to have them running around at super soldier speeds all the time. If the chapter doesn't have enough of those, then it will be a mix of armoury marines who are familiar with the war gear, but who aren't the master techmarine for the detachment they've been assigned to, punishment/penance for a transgression, assignment based on uncommon skill or a way of keeping the newbies out of too much trouble.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Exceptions seem to be common for this. Storm Wardens, for example, are all (eventually) trained as Tank Commanders, according to the materials available on them.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    I never realized that the Armory could have so many Techmarines. I always imagined them to be small in number, with the heavy lifting covered by Servitors, but if there's at least one per vehicle, there might be a hundred* Techmarines in a given Chapter!

    It does explain why Rhinos have (or had?) the ability to repair themselves. There's already a Techmarine inside, lol.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex_Pariah View Post
    I never realized that the Armory could have so many Techmarines.
    They wouldn't neccessarily be Techmarines. They're simply dudes who get recruited or taken out of the Companies (I think usually the 7th and 8th) to start driving. Maybe if they drive for long enough, they'll get promoted and sent on a Company-paid business trip to Mars.

    I always imagined them to be small in number
    there might be a hundred* Techmarines in a given Chapter!
    Vehicle drivers aren't Techmarines. In the same way that an Taxi driver isn't a mechanic.

    The Codex only limits Battleline Marines, you could have infinity guys working the Armoury (in the same way that Librarius doesn't technically have a limit, so Blood Ravens are allowed to have as many Librarians as they can find). It just wouldn't be probable.

    Existing outside the Company level organisation, each chapter has an Armoury consisting of the chapter's Techmarines and tanks, a Librarium consisting of the Chapter's Librarians, a Chapter Space Marine Fleet, and the Chapter Master, plus various headquarters staff (including any Honour Guard and the Chapter Champion), and the Chapter's servitors and human serfs. This means that even the most Codex-compliant chapter can have as many Techmarines, Librarians, and vehicle staff (pilots, gunners, etc - this includes Dreadnoughts) as it can muster.

    You gotta get your arse to Mars before you're a Techmarine.
    All Techmarines can drive and pilot. But not all pilots and drivers are Techmarines.

    It does explain why Rhinos have (or had?) the ability to repair themselves. There's already a Techmarine inside, lol.
    Basically, yes. The crew are trained to make minor repairs. In the same way that you can probably replace a flat tyre and jump start a car, but you wouldn't know how to replace the engine block.
    Last edited by Cheesegear; 2019-08-02 at 03:30 AM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    It is kind of funny to think that some poor soul might survive the hellish Space Marine initiation rites, get lucky on gene-seed compatibility, go through Astartes Scout training, and then...get stuck driving a Rhino. Do Space Marines suffer from career dissatisfaction?
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    More often than not, painting a Vehicle gunner according to the fluff is too much effort. People just don't know the fluff, because nobody actually cares about fluff. Then again, why do Vehicle crews have Cog shoulder-pads? It's not like it isn't obvious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    They wouldn't neccessarily be Techmarines. They're simply dudes who get recruited or taken out of the Companies (I think usually the 7th and 8th) to start driving. Maybe if they drive for long enough, they'll get promoted and sent on a Company-paid business trip to Mars.
    6th and 7th, according to the various Space Marine-centric Forgeworld books through the editions.

    War Machines of the Adeptus Astartes:

    "The crews for a Chapter's armoured vehicles composes solely Space Marines, many assigned as required from the Tactical squads of the Chapter's 6th and 7th Companies. All Space Marines are trained in the operation of armoured vehicles and armoured formation tactics as part of their core indoctrination - some going on to specialise in armoured operations, being trained upon larger vehicles and even being entrusted with basic maintenance tasks."

    That said, according to the Codex itself, drivers, pilots, and gunners are typically Techmarines:

    page 85:

    Techmarine Pilots:

    A Chapter may have any number of Techmarines who exist outside the company organisation, belonging instead to the Armoury. Most Space Marines receive vehicle training during their time in the Reserve Companies to ensure a degree of flexibility, and so are capable of acting as drivers, pilots and gunners themselves, but such positions are typically held by Techmarines. Once a Techmarine is interfaced with a vehicle's machine spirit while performing these duties, the meld will occupy his full attention - though he cannot effect repairs, his bond with the vehicle makes it all the deadlier in offence.


    (Also, the old Death From the Skies book stated that, in almost all cases, it is Techmarines who pilot aircraft & gunships).

    Presumably, this is why aircraft pilots are always shown with the full red outfit, whereas vehicle gunners are often shown with only one red arm, or no red on their armour at all.
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2019-08-04 at 11:01 AM.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Simple question. Is there any reason why a Rogue Trader with a teleportariums wouldn't regularly teleport nuclear warheads onboard his enemies ship in combat?
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackhawk748 View Post
    Simple question. Is there any reason why a Rogue Trader with a teleportariums wouldn't regularly teleport nuclear warheads onboard his enemies ship in combat?
    Active void shields prevent teleportation, so you have to bring their shields down with conventional weapons first. That done, if you're lucky enough to own both an archaeotech teleportarium and archaeotech atomics, you can probably fling nuclear bombs into your enemy's hull instead of boarding parties if you really want. You're spending money like water in the process though, even by RT standards.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards View Post
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    Active void shields prevent teleportation, so you have to bring their shields down with conventional weapons first. That done, if you're lucky enough to own both an archaeotech teleportarium and archaeotech atomics, you can probably fling nuclear bombs into your enemy's hull instead of boarding parties if you really want. You're spending money like water in the process though, even by RT standards.
    Wait... Nukes arw archeotech? They can make a Nova Cannon shell but have issues making an HBomb?
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Why use an expensive missile to blow up other people's ships when you can teleport yourself and your team of elite warriors onto their bridge and duel the enemy captain in the name of swashbuckling?

    Seriously, ships are expensive things, if you can capture one you can make a small fortune nicking bits or just trying to declare the ship yours. Plus if you're any good at leading from the front, as a Rogue Trader should be to keep their reputation, you have good odds of winning and saving money on nukes by boarding the enemy instead.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackhawk748 View Post
    Wait... Nukes arw archeotech? They can make a Nova Cannon shell but have issues making an HBomb?
    They're archaeotech in the same sense that plasma drives are - ancient technology that can be replicated, but not easily. Basically, the AdMech has a monopoly on manufacturing them (like everything else), and they don't hand them out easily (in game mechanics, they are Near Unique, and each successful roll gets you a single atomic warhead).

    From Into The Storm:
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    Atomics are ancient weapons of widespread destruction, terrible
    devices that haunted humanity long before it reached the stars.
    In the Dark Age of Technology and the Age of Strife, atomics
    turned many worlds into scoured, radioactive wastelands. They
    were some of humanity’s most powerful weapons of war.
    In the age of the Imperium, however, atomics have since
    fallen out of favour. Simply put, the militant Adepta and
    the Imperial Inquisition have better ways to destroy worlds.
    Cyclonic torpedoes and virus bombs can slay whole planets
    in a matter of hours, or even minutes. On the other hand,
    even hundreds of atomic warheads will not destroy a world
    outright—instead polluting the biosphere and slowly choking
    life with palls of intensely radioactive soot.

    If an atomic was detonated within a starship or station,
    however, its destruction would be guaranteed.

    It is, of course, entirely possible for players to invent other
    ways to use atomics, such as hit-and-run attacks. The GM
    should allow any reasonable idea a chance to succeed, although
    the GM is the final arbitrator of what is “reasonable.”
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards View Post
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim Portent View Post
    Why use an expensive missile to blow up other people's ships when you can teleport yourself and your team of elite warriors onto their bridge and duel the enemy captain in the name of swashbuckling?

    Seriously, ships are expensive things, if you can capture one you can make a small fortune nicking bits or just trying to declare the ship yours. Plus if you're any good at leading from the front, as a Rogue Trader should be to keep their reputation, you have good odds of winning and saving money on nukes by boarding the enemy instead.
    Well this was more a tactic against Ork or Chaos vessels where you wouldn't want to be on it and just want it dead

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    They're archaeotech in the same sense that plasma drives are - ancient technology that can be replicated, but not easily. Basically, the AdMech has a monopoly on manufacturing them (like everything else), and they don't hand them out easily (in game mechanics, they are Near Unique, and each successful roll gets you a single atomic warhead).

    From Into The Storm:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Atomics are ancient weapons of widespread destruction, terrible
    devices that haunted humanity long before it reached the stars.
    In the Dark Age of Technology and the Age of Strife, atomics
    turned many worlds into scoured, radioactive wastelands. They
    were some of humanity’s most powerful weapons of war.
    In the age of the Imperium, however, atomics have since
    fallen out of favour. Simply put, the militant Adepta and
    the Imperial Inquisition have better ways to destroy worlds.
    Cyclonic torpedoes and virus bombs can slay whole planets
    in a matter of hours, or even minutes. On the other hand,
    even hundreds of atomic warheads will not destroy a world
    outright—instead polluting the biosphere and slowly choking
    life with palls of intensely radioactive soot.

    If an atomic was detonated within a starship or station,
    however, its destruction would be guaranteed.

    It is, of course, entirely possible for players to invent other
    ways to use atomics, such as hit-and-run attacks. The GM
    should allow any reasonable idea a chance to succeed, although
    the GM is the final arbitrator of what is “reasonable.”
    Ah, so it's expensive in the same way a Steam Engine is now. Barely anyone bothers to remember how it's made and there's no demand. Makes sense
    Last edited by Blackhawk748; 2019-08-04 at 12:12 PM.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Up in the crunch thread a few people have asked about an Astartes being turned into a Primaris, so I thought I'd share some of the newer stuff for those unaware.

    The newest source so have is Aaron Dembski-Bowdens's "Spear of the Emperor" novel, in which this process is a significant plot event. It's called (in Ultramar, at least) the Calgarian Rite; a gene-seed is dissected by the combined expertise of an apothecary and techmarine in order to grow the new organs required, which are then surgically implanted into a subject.

    It's very risky even on a healthy Astartes - after the surgery they go into torpor for several weeks while the Primaris organs take root. A bystander can literally hear the Astartes' bones as they squeal under the strain of lengthening, as they break and regrow hundreds of times over again and again.

    Assuming they survive, the Marine reawakens as a Primaris, though he still needs all the relevant hypnotherapy to be able to engage his new organs. Apparently he also tends to undergo a notable shift in personality - the recipient takes on character traits of the Marine from whom the secondary gene-seed was harvested, and even their facial features can grow to resemble their predecessor.

    So that's why the Rite is such a big and important thing, saved for named characters. It literally is a choice between making Calgar into a better warrior or having a second Astartes implanted.
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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackhawk748 View Post

    Ah, so it's expensive in the same way a Steam Engine is now. Barely anyone bothers to remember how it's made and there's no demand. Makes sense
    More or less, yeah. Nuclear bombs just aren't that scary when you have Nova cannons and cyclonic torpedoes and such, so the very tiny number of circumstances where they are better - such as being used in combination with teleportariums - isn't enough to justify their continued widespread use.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Fel, on quest rewards View Post
    "Is a stack of ten pancakes too many pancakes to give to the party, even if most of them fell on the floor and one or two were stepped on? I wanted to give my party pancakes as a reward but I'm unsure if it's too much. The pancakes are also laced with blowfish poison so the party would have to get an antitoxin before they could eat the ones which weren't pulverized by shoes."

    I don't think anyone would want those pancakes even if you paid them to eat them.

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    It's been a long time since I really followed what was going on with GW and the WH games - the last time I played Epic scale was still a thing and the Squats were still around. And it wasn't until a year after WHFB was killed off and Age of Sigmar began that I found out about that.

    I see that WH40K has finally moved things along a bit through lurking on this thread, including the return of various primarchs. Which does make me wonder - do you think GW will ever bring the Emperor back if they advanced things along further?

    I mean you could make a miniature of him and charge a whole lot of money and they could probably rake in the cash that way. Or would he just be too expensive points wise to have him in a battle and pretty much be the only unit on one side of the battle?

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    Default Re: Warhammer 40K Fluff Discussion XVI: Where the Ordnance is Hand-Delivered!

    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    do you think GW will ever bring the Emperor back if they advanced things along further?
    GW brings back The Emperor when it's on its last legs (probably due to the rise of home-3D printing within the decade). Bringing The Emperor back is what GW does when it literally has no more ideas left in the barrel and it's do-or-die.

    For now? Roboute is just as big a douche as his Dad was. He serves as a fine substitute. He's doing fine.
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