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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Janwin View Post
    Sorry, I must have edited while you were posting:

    Second question is if the Elven Pride of Arms flaw could allow the use of the Elven Lightblade and Elven Thinblade since they're...elven weapons and thus it kinda makes sense?
    Yeah, we're both definitely ninja editing each other. Oops

    Yes, Elven Pride of Arms may be tied to weapons that use Elf/Elven in their name instead of longswords, rapiers, and bows.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Ah, I was hoping more for "in addition to" than "instead of", since there aren't any Elven bows in 3.5, and Elves gain automatic proficiency with bows, longswords and rapiers thus treating them as favored weapons (translated to starting with Weapon Group (Bows) and Weapon Group (Heavy Blades or Light Blades) in the Weapon Group Feats system linked.

    "Instead of" makes that flaw go from seriously inconvenient (in light of completely eliminating a lot of possible weapons and making the warrior terrible if caught unarmed) to completely crippling since a lightblade and thinblade costs 150gp, which is all of a warrior's starting money. At least, until the character gets enough money to buy or make them...if he survived that long with a -4 to all combat. heh

    I'll see what other flaw options there are that would make sense for the character.

  3. - Top - End - #33
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Janwin View Post
    Ah, I was hoping more for "in addition to" than "instead of", since there aren't any Elven bows in 3.5, and Elves gain automatic proficiency with bows, longswords and rapiers thus treating them as favored weapons (translated to starting with Weapon Group (Bows) and Weapon Group (Heavy Blades or Light Blades) in the Weapon Group Feats system linked.

    "Instead of" makes that flaw go from seriously inconvenient (in light of completely eliminating a lot of possible weapons and making the warrior terrible if caught unarmed) to completely crippling since a lightblade and thinblade costs 150gp, which is all of a warrior's starting money. At least, until the character gets enough money to buy or make them...if he survived that long with a -4 to all combat. heh

    I'll see what other flaw options there are that would make sense for the character.
    3.5 yes, but you are forgetting the patently ridiculous Elven Double Bow from A&EG it's even listed on the weapon groups page.

    You do make a good point about the flaw though. Change the wording to:

    You suffer a -4 penalty on attack rolls when using a weapon other than an Elvish weapon, longsword, rapier, or bow (long, short, or composite). Attacks made while fighting unarmed, touch attacks (including ranged touch attacks), or attacks made with natural weaponry also incur this penalty.
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-06 at 05:05 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #34
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Can I have maneuvers? Would those progress with level like a variant spellcaster generic class, or should I play a warrior with feats that give maneuvers?
    Current games:
    The Sunless Citadel
    Blade of the Four Fallen
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay
    I think this teaches us a valuable lesson. At bizarrely low levels of optimization, the tier system disappears. In its place is the "we can't even beat CR=ECL-5 foes" system.

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vrock Bait View Post
    Can I have maneuvers? Would those progress with level like a variant spellcaster generic class, or should I play a warrior with feats that give maneuvers?
    You would take maneuvers through bonus feats, although you wouldn't actually have to be a warrior to do so. I know less about maneuvers than I really should, both because I don't have a copy of ToB and because anytime I've tried to use them or have seen them used they really screw with the balance of the game. So, that being said, tell me if you thing this is fair:

    Maneuvers: By taking this feat you may select two maneuvers that would normally be available to a Swordsage of your level. You may have one of these maneuvers readied at any time. These maneuvers function as Swordsage maneuvers in all ways, including the options to replace a maneuver at 4th level and every even level thereafter and the ability to regain expended maneuvers.

    This feat may be taken multiple times increasing your known maneuvers by 2 and your readied maneuvers by 1 each time. This feat does not grant access to stances or any other feature of the Swordsage class.
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-07 at 04:52 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Yeah... I guess it might be a bit unbalanced. Then I think I’ll be a monk-style character. Race: human. Class: Warrior. Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike, some other things. If I use the feat Hammer Fist, would it count as two-handed for Power Attack? Also.. are we using LA buy off? Finally, how much cheese can you tolerate?
    Current games:
    The Sunless Citadel
    Blade of the Four Fallen
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay
    I think this teaches us a valuable lesson. At bizarrely low levels of optimization, the tier system disappears. In its place is the "we can't even beat CR=ECL-5 foes" system.

  7. - Top - End - #37
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vrock Bait View Post
    If I use the feat Hammer Fist, would it count as two-handed for Power Attack? Also.. are we using LA buy off? Finally, how much cheese can you tolerate?
    Yes.
    There are no races available with a level adjustment so it's a moot point.
    Considering that feats and skills can be purchased character could conceivably cheese entry requirement and obtain a larger mechanical tool bag but as suggested above things that are blatantly broken like Greenbound Summoning or ridiculous on the face of them, for example Dark Chaos Shuffle are off the table.
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-10 at 09:49 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Thanks. You named only a small selection of races, but I was going to loophole through that by using templates. Anyway, here’s my schtick for now:
    Race: Human
    Class: Warrior
    Hit points: (1d10)
    Ability scores: Str 17, Con 15, Dex 15, Wis 13, Int 12, Cha 9
    Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike, Hammer Fist, Power Attack, Improved Natural Attack(Unarmed Strike), Feat that gives rage?
    Starting gold: 150 gp
    Feature: as Criminal
    Flaws: Shaky
    Traits: Distinctive
    Current games:
    The Sunless Citadel
    Blade of the Four Fallen
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay
    I think this teaches us a valuable lesson. At bizarrely low levels of optimization, the tier system disappears. In its place is the "we can't even beat CR=ECL-5 foes" system.

  9. - Top - End - #39
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vrock Bait View Post
    Thanks. You named only a small selection of races, but I was going to loophole through that by using templates. Anyway, here’s my schtick for now:
    Race: Human
    Class: Warrior
    Hit points: (1d10)
    Ability scores: Str 17, Con 15, Dex 15, Wis 13, Int 12, Cha 9
    Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike, Hammer Fist, Power Attack, Improved Natural Attack(Unarmed Strike), Feat that gives rage?
    Starting gold: 150 gp
    Feature: as Criminal
    Flaws: Shaky
    Traits: Distinctive
    Looks fine to me. Waiting to see how you tie all this up narratively. Should be an interesting character.

    Re: rage - Yes, Rage (or Frenzy) as a 1st level Barbarian.

  10. - Top - End - #40
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Here’s the rest:
    Name: randomly generated... Firatos Silverback.
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    Skill points: 32
    My array with max skill ranks applied:
    Influence 2, Athletics 4, Acrobatics 4, Perception 4, Knowledge(local) 4, Lingustics 4, Innuendo 2, Knowledge(history) 4, Dwarven, Draconic
    Without max skill ranks:
    Influence 2, Innuendo 2, Perception 4, Knowledge(local) 4, Linguistics 4, Athletics 6, Acrobatics 6, Dwarven, Draconic
    Languages: Common, Gutterspeak
    Purchases: Bedroll, Backpack, 2 bottles containing Frenzywater(A&EG) for rages mores than once in an encounter, 20 pints of oil, bull’s eye lantern, 12 days worth of trail rations, portable ram, 30 gp+9 sp, light load
    Background:
    A prominent member of the illegal streetfighting scene in Oakhurst. Hopes to earn enough money to pursue his passion, linguistics.
    Last edited by Vrock Bait; 2019-08-11 at 01:53 AM.
    Current games:
    The Sunless Citadel
    Blade of the Four Fallen
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay
    I think this teaches us a valuable lesson. At bizarrely low levels of optimization, the tier system disappears. In its place is the "we can't even beat CR=ECL-5 foes" system.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    Thundercracker's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    This looks really cool. If I’m understanding correctly, we start with a base class as one of the three (expert, warrior, spellcaster), and can mix and match class abilities by paying gold and spending time.

    So if I wanted to play a thief that uses magic to augment his sneaky stabby abilities, how would I do that?
    Last edited by Thundercracker; 2019-08-11 at 04:05 AM.
    TC for short
    Malcolm Reynolds avatar by Strawberries

    "I like the sense of chaos this game provides. OOC, I like that I cannot know every available avenue, but that I can pursue whatever avenue I so choose. IC, I like that what I am doing has consequences. It's very very real." --Noedig

  12. - Top - End - #42
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vrock Bait View Post
    Here’s the rest:
    Name: randomly generated... Firatos Silverback.
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    Skill points: 32
    My array with max skill ranks applied:
    Influence 2, Athletics 4, Acrobatics 4, Perception 4, Knowledge(local) 4, Lingustics 4, Innuendo 2, Knowledge(history) 4, Dwarven, Draconic
    Without max skill ranks:
    Influence 2, Innuendo 2, Perception 4, Knowledge(local) 4, Linguistics 4, Athletics 6, Acrobatics 6, Dwarven, Draconic
    Languages: Common, Gutterspeak
    Purchases: Bedroll, Backpack, 2 bottles containing Frenzywater(A&EG) for rages mores than once in an encounter, 20 pints of oil, bull’s eye lantern, 12 days worth of trail rations, portable ram, 30 gp+9 sp, light load
    Background:
    A prominent member of the illegal streetfighting scene in Oakhurst. Hopes to earn enough money to pursue his passion, linguistics.
    Okay:
    Yes, max skill ranks are still a thing.
    Linguistics must be tied to a specific language, just like a knowledge skill. Only dragons are fluent in draconic. So, it cannot be taken as a starting language and must always be purchased with ranks in Linguistics (Draconic).
    Not sure what language Gutterspeak is supposed to refer to, but there are no Forsaken in my setting
    And finally, Oakhurst is a very small community consisting of roughly 900 people. The town center is a cluster of some dozen buildings and the rest of the population is spread out in farms and ranches within about three day's travel. So, there's really no illicit scene of any kind, this includes streetfighting. You could be a member of the local militia or something similar, if you'd like.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    This looks really cool. If I’m understanding correctly, we start with a base class as one of the three (expert, warrior, spellcaster), and can mix and match class abilities by paying gold and spending time.

    So if I wanted to play a thief that uses magic to augment his sneaky stabby abilities, how would I do that?
    Well you get some just by leveling up, but yes, these can be augmented with yet more via time and money.

    To play that archetype you would probably multi class, what depends on how many skills and what level of combat prowess you want. If you're hard set against that I would build an expert or a fighter, take sneaky skills, roguish feats, and then look at some feats that grant spells or SLAs. Dragonmark feats spring to mind, if you can find one that gives you the powers you want. Also Touch of Deception, similarly drawn from Eberron. Things like that.

    Edit: I could also totally see a feat that let's you deliver touch spells as part of a melee weapon attack, like thr Duskblade's ability
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-11 at 08:56 PM.

  13. - Top - End - #43
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    Thundercracker's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Is there any way to train to gain class abilities like a scout’s skirmish, or a warlock’s eldritch blast, or rogue’s sneak attack?
    Last edited by Thundercracker; 2019-08-11 at 09:36 PM.
    TC for short
    Malcolm Reynolds avatar by Strawberries

    "I like the sense of chaos this game provides. OOC, I like that I cannot know every available avenue, but that I can pursue whatever avenue I so choose. IC, I like that what I am doing has consequences. It's very very real." --Noedig

  14. - Top - End - #44
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    Is there any way to train to gain class abilities like a scout’s skirmish, or a warlock’s eldritch blast, or rogue’s sneak attack?
    Sneak attack is covered here. Prerequisite is now 4 ranks in Stealth.

    I would say that eldritch blast as a 1st level warlock would be a feat, prerequisite is 4 ranks in Knowledge (Arcana). Improved EB is +2d6, prerequisite 11 ranks in Knowledge (Arcana)

    Skirmish would be 1d6 & 1 AC, prerequisite 4 ranks in Stealth. Improved skirmish +1d6 & +1 AC prerequisite 11 ranks Stealth.

  15. - Top - End - #45
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    Thundercracker's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Stats rolling:

    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[16]
    (4d6b3)[12]

    That’s just disappointing.
    Last edited by Thundercracker; 2019-08-12 at 01:21 AM.
    TC for short
    Malcolm Reynolds avatar by Strawberries

    "I like the sense of chaos this game provides. OOC, I like that I cannot know every available avenue, but that I can pursue whatever avenue I so choose. IC, I like that what I am doing has consequences. It's very very real." --Noedig

  16. - Top - End - #46
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    Stats rolling:

    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[16]
    (4d6b3)[12]

    That’s just disappointing.
    It is rather. You may instead use 28 point-buy oooooor this:

    (4d6b3)[12] 15
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[12] 9
    (4d6b3)[16]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-12 at 01:30 AM.

  17. - Top - End - #47
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    Thundercracker's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBarbecueChip View Post
    It is rather. You may instead use 28 point-buy oooooor this:

    (4d6b3)[12] 15
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    (4d6b3)[12] 9
    (4d6b3)[16]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    Very much appreciated will take that suggested array.

    Now leaning towards a sneak attacking animal training roguish type, using something that allows dex to damage (shadow blade from tome of battle maybe) and also the swashbuckler’s insightful strike ability (into to damage). Along with animal handling to train up some attack dogs to provide flanking. Sound good?
    TC for short
    Malcolm Reynolds avatar by Strawberries

    "I like the sense of chaos this game provides. OOC, I like that I cannot know every available avenue, but that I can pursue whatever avenue I so choose. IC, I like that what I am doing has consequences. It's very very real." --Noedig

  18. - Top - End - #48
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    Now leaning towards a sneak attacking animal training roguish type, using something that allows dex to damage (shadow blade from tome of battle maybe) and also the swashbuckler’s insightful strike ability (into to damage). Along with animal handling to train up some attack dogs to provide flanking. Sound good?
    Sounds good. I'm fine with the concept and the stacking of multiple ability modifiers for damage output. You can have a stable of animals if you are willing to spend the upkeep for them. I would ask that you only bring two or three with you at any given time, just so that it doesn't bog down combat too much (though that's less of a concern in PbP). However, their specific actions are under my control and I will be running them as well trained but not perfect tacticians. Commands will have to be simple and straightforward for best results. Please keep in mind all the rules and limitations provided in the Handle Animal skill description.

  19. - Top - End - #49
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Ok... here’s my changes:
    Remove all reference to linguistics. No. Extra skill from languages(4) and linguistics(4) go towards... WHY DOES EVERY MUNDANE SKILL TRICK REQUIRE OVER LEVEL 2. Towards... Lucid Dreaming and Control Shape then, I don’t know.
    Wandering mercenary, not a street fighter. Feature as Soldier.
    No Gutterspeak, since this is a small town. Gutterspeak only exists in cities.
    Current games:
    The Sunless Citadel
    Blade of the Four Fallen
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeSoberDay
    I think this teaches us a valuable lesson. At bizarrely low levels of optimization, the tier system disappears. In its place is the "we can't even beat CR=ECL-5 foes" system.

  20. - Top - End - #50
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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    I was only planning on bringing one pet at any given time.

    Looking at the below which I'm considering for the build (looking at expert/warrior), let me know what won't be allowed at level 1? That way I can narrow it down and pick 2-4 and worry about the rest later. Thanks.

    Sneak Attack class ability (thanks for this, stealth rank 4)
    Trap Sense class ability (got this, Search 4)
    Insightful strike class ability (from swashbuckler class, add int to damage)
    Martial Study feat (to get a shadow hand maneuver, the alternate you posted above works as well)
    Martial Stance feat (prereq: one shadow hand maneuver, islands of blades which grants flanking if myself and an ally are adjacent to an enemy).
    Shadow blade feat (prereq: one shadow hand stance, add dex to damage)
    Craven feat (-2 fear saves, +1 sneak attack damage per character level).
    Telling Blow feat (prereq: sneak attack, sneak attack damage applies to critical hits).
    Two weapon fighting feat/ranger class ability (dex 15)
    Weapon Finesse (add dex to melee attacks instead of str)
    Last edited by Thundercracker; 2019-08-12 at 08:07 AM.
    TC for short
    Malcolm Reynolds avatar by Strawberries

    "I like the sense of chaos this game provides. OOC, I like that I cannot know every available avenue, but that I can pursue whatever avenue I so choose. IC, I like that what I am doing has consequences. It's very very real." --Noedig

  21. - Top - End - #51
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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Spoiler: Stat Rolls
    Show

    (4d6b3)[9]
    (4d6b3)[15]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[14]
    (4d6b3)[9]
    (4d6b3)[9]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    "He who makes a beast of himself, loses the pain of being a man." - Dr. Johnson

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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Here's my character submission: Adorellan

    All I need to figure out is the Feature.

    Maybe something like:


    Wilderness Familiarity: You are more familiar with the wilderness than with civilized areas. You can find food and fresh water for yourself and up to five other people each day, provided that the land offers berries, small game, water, and so forth.

    However, your lack of familiarity with civilized interactions means that you cannot haggle for better prices, rarely can find an available room even in an empty inn, and are generally the first suspect the town guard comes after if something happens in a town you're in.



    Basically, part of the Outlander background minus the familiarity with terrain since I don't really envision him from being around Oakhurst and thus he shouldn't be familiar with the terrain. And then a whole load of bad stuff to make things interesting (and possibly earn a Feat).

  23. - Top - End - #53
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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Wow. Doubly unlucky. Not lucky enough to roll decent stats, and not lucky in that I rolled exactly a commutative +4 so I don't qualify for the far and away better 28 point buy. Wouldn't be able to cast for jack as a Spellcaster, wouldn't be able to qualify for any of the standard feat progressions as a Warrior, and wouldn't have the stats or skillpoints to back up the increased skill spread of an Expert.

    As interesting as the game's potential has...I think I'm going to have to pass. I don't mind lvl 1 games, but being a gimped lvl 1 would just....suck.
    Last edited by Geeksthenewsexy; 2019-08-12 at 09:40 AM.
    "He who makes a beast of himself, loses the pain of being a man." - Dr. Johnson

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vrock Bait View Post
    Ok... here’s my changes:
    Remove all reference to linguistics. No. Extra skill from languages(4) and linguistics(4) go towards... WHY DOES EVERY MUNDANE SKILL TRICK REQUIRE OVER LEVEL 2. Towards... Lucid Dreaming and Control Shape then, I don’t know.
    Wandering mercenary, not a street fighter. Feature as Soldier.
    No Gutterspeak, since this is a small town. Gutterspeak only exists in cities.
    Lucid Dreaming and Control Shape are not valid skill choices and there is not a language of the poor and downtrodden city dwellers.
    Please format your character into an online sheet. There are several options but Myth-weavers is preferred.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercracker View Post
    I was only planning on bringing one pet at any given time.

    Looking at the below which I'm considering for the build (looking at expert/warrior), let me know what won't be allowed at level 1? That way I can narrow it down and pick 2-4 and worry about the rest later. Thanks.

    Sneak Attack class ability (thanks for this, stealth rank 4)
    Trap Sense class ability (got this, Search 4)
    Insightful strike class ability (from swashbuckler class, add int to damage)
    Martial Study feat (to get a shadow hand maneuver, the alternate you posted above works as well)
    Martial Stance feat (prereq: one shadow hand maneuver, islands of blades which grants flanking if myself and an ally are adjacent to an enemy).
    Shadow blade feat (prereq: one shadow hand stance, add dex to damage)
    Craven feat (-2 fear saves, +1 sneak attack damage per character level).
    Telling Blow feat (prereq: sneak attack, sneak attack damage applies to critical hits).
    Two weapon fighting feat/ranger class ability (dex 15)
    Weapon Finesse (add dex to melee attacks instead of str)
    Insightful Strike - Requires Perception rank 5
    The homebrew maneuvers feat does not have a prerequisite and replaces Martial Study (so that maneuvers are slightly more accessible)
    Everything else is as written and so available at 1st level, build as you please.

    Quote Originally Posted by Janwin View Post
    Here's my character submission: Adorellan

    All I need to figure out is the Feature.

    Maybe something like:


    Wilderness Familiarity: You are more familiar with the wilderness than with civilized areas. You can find food and fresh water for yourself and up to five other people each day, provided that the land offers berries, small game, water, and so forth.

    However, your lack of familiarity with civilized interactions means that you cannot haggle for better prices, rarely can find an available room even in an empty inn, and are generally the first suspect the town guard comes after if something happens in a town you're in.



    Basically, part of the Outlander background minus the familiarity with terrain since I don't really envision him from being around Oakhurst and thus he shouldn't be familiar with the terrain. And then a whole load of bad stuff to make things interesting (and possibly earn a Feat).
    Sheet looks good with one exception. Draconic cannot be a starting language. Please choose something else.
    The feature sounds good. Expect to get alot of side eye from guards and pretty much any civilized authority figure. Take your feat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geeksthenewsexy View Post
    Wow. Doubly unlucky. Not lucky enough to roll decent stats, and not lucky in that I rolled exactly a commutative +4 so I don't qualify for the far and away better 28 point buy. Wouldn't be able to cast for jack as a Spellcaster, wouldn't be able to qualify for any of the standard feat progressions as a Warrior, and wouldn't have the stats or skillpoints to back up the increased skill spread of an Expert.

    As interesting as the game's potential has...I think I'm going to have to pass. I don't mind lvl 1 games, but being a gimped lvl 1 would just....suck.
    Hmm, well why don't we just slip another qualifier in the rules and say:

    if this leaves you with less than a cumulative +4 or your highest ability score is less than a 16 before racial modifiers you may instead create a character using 28 point-buy

  25. - Top - End - #55
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    Ildu's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    I'm really quite interested in this idea; I've been dying to get back into D&D, so let's give this a shot!

    Spoiler: Dice Rolls (I hope I remember how to do this...)
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    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[15]
    (4d6b3)[17]
    (4d6b3)[14]
    (4d6b3)[12]
    (4d6b3)[14]
    (4d6b3)[11]
    "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?"

  26. - Top - End - #56
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ildu View Post
    I'm really quite interested in this idea; I've been dying to get back into D&D, so let's give this a shot!
    Well, I think we know where all of GITNS' luck went... Them's some nice rolls

  27. - Top - End - #57
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    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBarbecueChip View Post
    Sheet looks good with one exception. Draconic cannot be a starting language. Please choose something else.
    The feature sounds good. Expect to get alot of side eye from guards and pretty much any civilized authority figure. Take your feat.
    You got it, boss man.

  28. - Top - End - #58
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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    I have a fair idea of what I want to do, but I have a question!
    So far I'm thinking of making a support druid--or as close a thing as I'm able--by use of feats. So far I have listed Eschew Materials, Turn Undead, and Healer's Luck, and was wondering if there was a way I could eventually take Extra Wild Shape at 5th level to replicate the class feature?

    As far as a background feature, I've crafted up this one:

    Spoiler: The Truant Hermit
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    You have lived in a seclusion – purely alone – mostly for the formative part of your entire life, in solemn reflection and contemplation of the great mysteries of the universe, attempting to become one with nature. Perhaps while you were looking for answers in your time apart from the clamor of society, in solitude you found peace. Your hermetic devotion to your cause has given you insight into the deeper secrets of time and space, but has stunted your developmental growth. You are calm and caring, but also distant and unnerving. Some may mistake your aloofness for naivete, and perhaps they are right. You will experience mixed interactions with those who may seek to use you for their own goals or are in desperate need of aid. But graver so, you broke your eremitic devotion to a place that was under your charge, which will most assuredly result in retribution upon your head.

    (This is more or less the Hermit and Acolyte backgrounds blended in a way that they offer some game hooks and partially explain my choice of Flaws)
    "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?"

  29. - Top - End - #59
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ildu View Post
    I have a fair idea of what I want to do, but I have a question!
    So far I'm thinking of making a support druid--or as close a thing as I'm able--by use of feats. So far I have listed Eschew Materials, Turn Undead, and Healer's Luck, and was wondering if there was a way I could eventually take Extra Wild Shape at 5th level to replicate the class feature?

    As far as a background feature, I've crafted up this one:

    Spoiler: The Truant Hermit
    Show

    You have lived in a seclusion – purely alone – mostly for the formative part of your entire life, in solemn reflection and contemplation of the great mysteries of the universe, attempting to become one with nature. Perhaps while you were looking for answers in your time apart from the clamor of society, in solitude you found peace. Your hermetic devotion to your cause has given you insight into the deeper secrets of time and space, but has stunted your developmental growth. You are calm and caring, but also distant and unnerving. Some may mistake your aloofness for naivete, and perhaps they are right. You will experience mixed interactions with those who may seek to use you for their own goals or are in desperate need of aid. But graver so, you broke your eremitic devotion to a place that was under your charge, which will most assuredly result in retribution upon your head.

    (This is more or less the Hermit and Acolyte backgrounds blended in a way that they offer some game hooks and partially explain my choice of Flaws)
    Hmm, seems like we might be shaping up for a party that is heavily populated by hippies and outcasts. Could be fun.

    Wildshape has always been a rather broken and tricky ability. I think instead I would allow you to take one form from the PHB II ACF Shapeshifter. So at 5th level you can spend a feat to, at will, assume either a predator form, an aerial form, or a scout form (the last would be home brewed, I'm thinking either a small or tiny creature, bonus to dex, scent ability, maybe a climb speed). Feat can be taken multiple times adding a new from to your repertoire each time.

    Anyways, as far as your feature, it is properly thematic but it is very vague on what it actually does. Acolyte gives you an association with an organization that you can call upon and hermit gives you a momentous discovery. Your feature gives you... people will treat you oddly, depending on the people in question? But I do like the last sentence... Would you be willing to adjust it to something like "Rogue Druid" and re-imagine it as you have violated the tenants of your Druidic Circle and were cast out. Not necessarily marked for death or anything quite so dramatic but certainly unwelcome in some areas of the wild
    Last edited by TheBarbecueChip; 2019-08-12 at 09:17 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #60
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    Default Re: The Sunless Citadel [D&D 3.5 Variant/Homebrew Rules]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBarbecueChip View Post
    Hmm, seems like we might be shaping up for a party that is heavily populated by hippies and outcasts. Could be fun.
    Isn't that what D&D was built on, though? A bunch of ragamuffin hobos out on a whirlwind adventure! I'm also charging 1gp for an ounce of goodberries.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBarbecueChip View Post
    Wildshape has always been a rather broken and tricky ability. I think instead I would allow you to take one form from the PHB II ACF Shapeshifter. So at 5th level you can spend a feat to, at will, assume either a predator form, an aerial form, or a scout form (the last would be home brewed, I'm thinking either a small or tiny creature, bonus to dex, scent ability, maybe a climb speed). Feat can be taken multiple times adding a new from to your repertoire each time.
    Excellent! I always liked the idea of using Wildshape for utility, to fill in whatever the party is lacking, so that sounds great to me. If we don't have a "tank," I'll go mama bear and stomp around, but if we're lacking a thief, a fieldmouse could work for scouting purposes? I have no qualms with your suggestion.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBarbecueChip View Post
    Anyways, as far as your feature, it is properly thematic but it is very vague on what it actually does. Acolyte gives you an association with an organization that you can call upon and hermit gives you a momentous discovery. Your feature gives you... people will treat you oddly, depending on the people in question? But I do like the last sentence... Would you be willing to adjust it to something like "Rogue Druid" and re-imagine it as you have violated the tenants of your Druidic Circle and were cast out. Not necessarily marked for death or anything quite so dramatic but certainly unwelcome in some areas of the wild
    That's more along the lines of what I was trying to say. Reading back, I started to ramble and kept things unintentionally vague. I was thinking she'd be more of a druid acolyte who was tasked with watching over a ruin, but wandered off. I can definitely rewrite that.

    Spoiler: The Outcast: Take 2
    Show

    You have lived in seclusion for the formative part of your life, studying under the grove of the Order of the Treefather. Perhaps while you were looking for answers in your time apart from the clamor of society, in solitude you found peace. Your hermetic devotion to your cause has given you insight into the deeper mysteries of nature, but over time, you have grown restless with the Order's seclusion and isolationism. You believe the tenets of druidism mean you must help any and all in need, and thus violated the Order's rules of secrecy and impartiality. By allowing a wounded traveler into the grove, you have been banished from The Order. You may be met with animosity by other druids of your Order or by Fey creatures who admonish your transgression.
    Last edited by Ildu; 2019-08-12 at 09:46 PM.
    "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?"

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