The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #61
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    What couldn't kill Belkar even if he wanted to. The Belkster is nasty.
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  2. - Top - End - #62
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    I am now convinced that the Belkster will die saving either his cat, or Durkon, from certain death. I am also convinced he will die to prove a point to somebody in the OotS, probably to Roy. I have nothing to back this up other than gut instinct.

  3. - Top - End - #63
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Syncrogti View Post
    I am now convinced that the Belkster will die saving either his cat, or Durkon, from certain death. I am also convinced he will die to prove a point to somebody in the OotS, probably to Roy. I have nothing to back this up other than gut instinct.
    Might his "extreme apology" be a step in that direction?
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  4. - Top - End - #64
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    HalflingRogueGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    You know how weíve never seen Belkar and a crate of overripe mangos in the same panel?

    Because foreshadowing.

  5. - Top - End - #65
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    You know how weíve never seen Belkar and a crate of overripe mangos in the same panel?

    Because foreshadowing.
    Are you suggesting Belkar will be mango'led to death? (Cos that would be gross)
    Last edited by D.One; 2019-09-20 at 03:27 PM.
    Each one of us, alone, is but a drop in the sea
    Our powers pale compared with the great heroes
    Our battles donít hit theheadlines or shake the earth
    But they are few, canít be everywhere, and we, many
    So, when the world or universe needs saving, they come
    But when people needs saving, we are the ones to appear
    We're underdogs, but we rise up to the challenge to be heroes.
    (Wishing Joe, a low-powered superhero)

    "I really like the Geek Math'ology we do here"

  6. - Top - End - #66
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by D.One View Post
    Are you suggesting Belkar will be mango'led to death? (Cos that would be gross)
    Obviously Belkar is actually three twentieths mango on his grandpappy's side
    Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2019-09-20 at 04:26 PM.
    An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.

    See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.

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  7. - Top - End - #67
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Squire Doodad View Post
    Obviously Belkar is actually three twentieths mango on his grandpappy's side
    Soooo....

    you are suggesting what will kill Belkar is a Man-Go...

    ... as in a Man made of Go pieces...

    ... and it will banish Belkar's soul to a plane which is an infinite Go set...

    ... and there Belkar will finally understand Shojo's speech about playing the game...

    ... aaand I think I've gone too far...
    Last edited by D.One; 2019-09-20 at 05:11 PM.
    Each one of us, alone, is but a drop in the sea
    Our powers pale compared with the great heroes
    Our battles donít hit theheadlines or shake the earth
    But they are few, canít be everywhere, and we, many
    So, when the world or universe needs saving, they come
    But when people needs saving, we are the ones to appear
    We're underdogs, but we rise up to the challenge to be heroes.
    (Wishing Joe, a low-powered superhero)

    "I really like the Geek Math'ology we do here"

  8. - Top - End - #68
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by D.One View Post
    Soooo....

    you are suggesting what will kill Belkar is a Man-Go...

    ... as in a Man made of Go pieces...

    ... and it will banish Belkar's soul to a plane which is a infinite Go set...

    ... and there Belkar will finally understand Shojo's speech about playing the game...

    ... aaand I think I've gone too far...
    Yeah sure that works too
    An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.

    See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.

    Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
    Green is serious talk about hypothetical
    Blue is irony and sarcasm


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    I joke, therefore I meme."
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  9. - Top - End - #69
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    ClericGirl

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    As he's a bit of an epicure, food wise, perhaps he will die from eating the salmon mousse.
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    Gosh, 2D8HP, you are so very correct (and also quite handsome) ... 2D8HP told me so
    Quote Originally Posted by HappyDaze
    Self-deception tends to have a low target number

  10. - Top - End - #70
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Belkar and Mr. Scruffy will don the Potara Earings and fuse permanently into Mr. Buffy, the Vampire Slayer. There will no longer be Belkar in the world anymore.
    Last edited by D.One; 2019-09-23 at 08:41 AM.
    Each one of us, alone, is but a drop in the sea
    Our powers pale compared with the great heroes
    Our battles donít hit theheadlines or shake the earth
    But they are few, canít be everywhere, and we, many
    So, when the world or universe needs saving, they come
    But when people needs saving, we are the ones to appear
    We're underdogs, but we rise up to the challenge to be heroes.
    (Wishing Joe, a low-powered superhero)

    "I really like the Geek Math'ology we do here"

  11. - Top - End - #71
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    DwarfBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    OK so, what about this? Belkar will draw his last breath as a mortal, and become a GOD! He already calls himself the shoeless god of war, what if we really DOES become a GOD? Would that fulfill the prophecy accurately? Am I late to this party?

  12. - Top - End - #72
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Syncrogti View Post
    OK so, what about this? Belkar will draw his last breath as a mortal, and become a GOD! He already calls himself the shoeless god of war, what if we really DOES become a GOD? Would that fulfill the prophecy accurately? Am I late to this party?
    It's been proposed before, yes. The main arguments against are:
    1.) it would be senseless for the Oracle to gloat about Belkar becoming a god
    B.) hardly anyone even knows who Belkar is, let alone cares about him, so him being deified seems really out there.
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  13. - Top - End - #73
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    DwarfBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    It's been proposed before, yes. The main arguments against are:
    1.) it would be senseless for the Oracle to gloat about Belkar becoming a god
    B.) hardly anyone even knows who Belkar is, let alone cares about him, so him being deified seems really out there.
    OK thanks. Good point about the gloating.

  14. - Top - End - #74
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    What if Belkar performs (or more likely, is used as a test subject by a psion wanting to perform) the psionic sandwich trick, but with his birthday cake that he only got one bite of before being mind switched with it?

  15. - Top - End - #75
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    I don't know what will kill Belkar, I just know that:

    1 It's not becoming a vampire, because that already is how Durkon's prophecy became true, and the B-plots in this comic are not quite that repetitive (note to mods: there's probably a rule that I can't talk about repetitiveness of B-plots in either a negative or positive light, but come on, this is nearly literally a line from the comic itself), and...
    2 It's not something he comes back from, because he was to take his last breath ever. So if he dies, no resurrection, and even if he does become something other than mortal living in a different world to technically fulfill the prophecy, no reversing that condition.
    Last edited by Lvl 2 Expert; 2019-09-24 at 02:45 AM.
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  16. - Top - End - #76
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Syncrogti View Post
    I am now convinced that the Belkster will die saving either his cat, or Durkon, from certain death. I am also convinced he will die to prove a point to somebody in the OotS, probably to Roy. I have nothing to back this up other than gut instinct.
    I agree, and I back it up with it being a common trope - Redemption Equals Death. We know Belkar is getting less evil, and we also know he is going to die.

    Since he is still Belkar, and there's only so much character development that can happen in what's left of the story, I don't think he will admit to making a heroic sacrifice, but do it just to prove how badass he is. Or at least that's what he will tell himself.

    The theory I can't back up is that he somehow will manage to meet Lord Shojo in the afterlife. That would mean his heroic sacrifice would change his alignment to one where that's possible. Just dying while trying to save his cat probably won't do it, which further backs up the theory that it will be an intentional sacrifice.
    Last edited by Themrys; 2019-09-24 at 03:37 PM.

  17. - Top - End - #77
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    We know Belkar is getting less evil, and we also know he is going to die.
    We know that Belkar is getting less obnoxious and selfish about his Evil. I do not at all know he is getting less Evil.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2019-09-24 at 03:30 PM.
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  18. - Top - End - #78
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    I have a crazy theory about this...What if Belkar becomes "THE sexy shoeless God of war" and somehow, someway elevates to Godhood (generating his own quiddity) and helps solve the whole Snarl mess? He wouldn't be mortal anymore.
    So I said to myself "SELF, if I were you, and I think I am, I would be beside myself in embarrassment, so slap myself silly."

  19. - Top - End - #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    We know that Belkar is getting less obnoxious and selfish about his Evil. I do not at all know he is getting less Evil.
    Technically we also donít know that Roy wonít die in the next five pages, but donít expect anyone to act like it isnít an incredibly obvious thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Havelocke View Post
    I have a crazy theory about this...What if Belkar becomes "THE sexy shoeless God of war" and somehow, someway elevates to Godhood (generating his own quiddity) and helps solve the whole Snarl mess? He wouldn't be mortal anymore.
    Didnít we already see this? Like, on this page even?
    Spoiler: Read this if I've posted a theory in the post above
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    I recognize that Conservation of Detail is Overrated, but I find the event that I am using as evidence for my theory above important enough/given enough focus to qualify for what I call Elanís Exception, ďWho wastes perfectly good foreshadowing like that?Ē. Also I have never correctly predicted any event in any piece of media so take this theory with a grain of salt (I call this Peeleeís Ye Old Reminder).

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  20. - Top - End - #80
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    We know that Belkar is getting less obnoxious and selfish about his Evil. I do not at all know he is getting less Evil.
    Does being less selfish not equate being less evil?

    When he didn't let the gnome woman invite him to dinner, he almost gave the impression he was slowly growing a proto-conscience. And I don't see how accepting the invitation would have hurt his long-term plans.
    Except you suspect someone from the Order could have tipped her off that Belkar is evil and the cloak clasp working just as intended?

    He clearly is still evil.

    But my theory is that he will manage to be just neutral enough at the hour of his death to be reunited with his cat in the afterlife. (Animals are always neutral, right? Even the ones everyone suspects of secretly being evil, like cats.)

    @Havelocke: While I do think Belkar is improving, I am really not keen on him being a god. There's enough evil gods.

    I'd rather Banjo made it into a pantheon.
    Last edited by Themrys; 2019-09-24 at 03:45 PM.

  21. - Top - End - #81
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    Didnít we already see this? Like, on this page even?
    Even more recently:

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncrogti View Post
    OK so, what about this? Belkar will draw his last breath as a mortal, and become a GOD! He already calls himself the shoeless god of war, what if we really DOES become a GOD? Would that fulfill the prophecy accurately? Am I late to this party?
    It's been proposed before, yes. The main arguments against are:
    1.) it would be senseless for the Oracle to gloat about Belkar becoming a god
    B.) hardly anyone even knows who Belkar is, let alone cares about him, so him being deified seems really out there.
    Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2019-09-24 at 04:05 PM.
    An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.

    See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.

    Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
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    Blue is irony and sarcasm


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    I walk, therefore I stand,
    I sleep, therefore I dream;
    I joke, therefore I meme."
    -Squire Doodad

  22. - Top - End - #82
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    Does being less selfish not equate being less evil?
    If he kills the same number of people he would have if he weren't less selfish, for example, does it really matter?,
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  23. - Top - End - #83
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    If he kills the same number of people he would have if he weren't less selfish, for example, does it really matter?,
    Kill count is a really bad way to determine alignment in a comic based on D&D.

    The whole premise of the game is that you can kill sentient creatures while being lawful good, as long as those sentient creatures are all evil.

    So, yeah, I'd say Belkar refraining from cheating the gnome who sold him his new cloak clasp out of even more money does matter with regards to his alignment.

    His change might not matter much to the universe in general, since evil people he murders out of sadism are just as dead as evil people he murders to save the world, but I thought we were discussing his alignment.

  24. - Top - End - #84
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    Kill count is a really bad way to determine alignment in a comic based on D&D.
    Murder count, then.

    Also, I've never played a game where one can murder all they want, then just stop one day and be counted as neutral. Can't much say I'd have interest in such a game, seems crazy arbitrary.
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  25. - Top - End - #85
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Murder count, then.

    Also, I've never played a game where one can murder all they want, then just stop one day and be counted as neutral. Can't much say I'd have interest in such a game, seems crazy arbitrary.
    It would come down to why the character has stopped murdering.

    "Because there's nothing left to kill!"- Still evil
    "Because I don't want to run afoul of the law"- Still probably evil, might be more lawful.
    "Because I need to pretend I'm not evil or I won't get to kill things anymore"- Definitely still evil
    "Because I've come to realize that what I was doing was wrong"- Genuine shift towards good

    Hell, by raw if you have the right splatbooks in play a sufficiently charismatic person can have a formerly unrepentant murderer questioning their actions and turning good within two weeks. They just might need an atonement spell to wash away any corruption from any particularly vile actions.

  26. - Top - End - #86
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by RatElemental View Post
    It would come down to why the character has stopped murdering.

    "Because there's nothing left to kill!"- Still evil
    "Because I don't want to run afoul of the law"- Still probably evil, might be more lawful.
    "Because I need to pretend I'm not evil or I won't get to kill things anymore"- Definitely still evil
    "Because I've come to realize that what I was doing was wrong"- Genuine shift towards good

    Hell, by raw if you have the right splatbooks in play a sufficiently charismatic person can have a formerly unrepentant murderer questioning their actions and turning good within two weeks. They just might need an atonement spell to wash away any corruption from any particularly vile actions.
    Belkar has yet to realize he was wrong. He has not expressed any sentiment indicating that might be the case. His revelation that turned him around was explicitly not "stop being evil," it was "stop antagonizing everyone." He is less grating to others, less in-your-face with his Evil, sure. But less Evil? I see no indication of change or desire to change.
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  27. - Top - End - #87
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    I'm not sure Belkar as he is CAN change. The one time he was hit with Owl's Wisdom, he promptly became a peaceful soul and not at all murderhappy. Once it was dispelled, he became a psycho again. His alignment appears directly tied to his wisdom score.

  28. - Top - End - #88
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Belkar has yet to realize he was wrong. He has not expressed any sentiment indicating that might be the case. His revelation that turned him around was explicitly not "stop being evil," it was "stop antagonizing everyone." He is less grating to others, less in-your-face with his Evil, sure. But less Evil? I see no indication of change or desire to change.
    He seems to understand the concept that he CAN change, and it will take some introspection. He also apologized for some of his specific inflicting of wrongs. But I agree that we haven't seen him actually put forth a serious effort at repentance. He seems to be sliding towards "less evil" but it's a slow slide rather than a dramatic rejection of evil.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Murder count, then.
    I was trying to think of the last time he killed for fun, rather than the group's goals...

    IIRC, this one is the most recent one where he's talking about being cool with killin' fools, but it's part of the whole save-the-world thing, so I don't know if it's really that much worse than Haley or V killing those giants.

    I think you'd have to go back to Nonamicus in the gladiatorial thing to get to the last one that he was cool with murdering that wasn't part of the group's goals. He only let Scruffy kill him because he didn't want another "sort of punished but not really" story line.

    And of course that was before Durkon sacrificed himself, and thus the major catalyst for Belkar's change.
    "Besides, you know the saying: Kill one, and you are a murderer. Kill millions, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Fishman

  29. - Top - End - #89
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    As for what kills Belkar?

    Occam's Razor would suggest: the Snarl.

    Can't get True Rezzed if that kills you.

  30. - Top - End - #90
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    Default Re: What's Going To Kill Belkar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Angelalex242 View Post
    As for what kills Belkar?

    Occam's Razor would suggest: the Snarl.

    Can't get True Rezzed if that kills you.
    It also handily lets the giant leave the issue of his redemption ambiguous.

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