The Order of the Stick: Utterly Dwarfed
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  1. - Top - End - #31
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Composer99's Avatar

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    Sep 2013

    Default Re: Classless D20 with Character Levels

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Well put, Composer. I do tend to get bogged down in details when discussing stuff reasonably often, so this is good for me to hear too.
    Well, it is fair enough to point out specific holes in a proposed design, and to address them, just as long as big-picture stuff gets dealt with, too.
    ~ Composer99

    D&D 5e Homebrew:
    Character Options: Fighter Remix, Paladin Oaths, Ranger Remix, Sorcerer Remix
    Playing the Game: Using Ability Score Variants
    New Subsystems: Combat Manoeuvre System
    Monsters: Yogg-Saron

  2. - Top - End - #32
    Librarian in the Playground Moderator
    Mark Hall's Avatar

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    Dec 2007
    San Antonio, Texas

    Default Re: Classless D20 with Character Levels

    So, a few things:

    First of all, have I mentioned my Classless hack of Star Wars: Saga Edition?

    And, while not a d20 system, what about my build-a-class hack of AD&D 2nd edition?

    Both of my classless hacks start with a d8 HD for EVERYONE but, rather than making increased HP something people just have, it might carry a cost; in SW, you could spend feats to improve your HP, while Classless AD&D allowed you to improve your HD size with points. Want a d12 HD? Spend the points to improve your HD size.

    Lastly, on mass going for HP, you might delve into some older RPGs. Villains and Vigilantes had a concept called "Base Hits", which was simply your weight, divided by 50 pounds. Those Base Hits were used in a number of ways, but also formed the core of the HP calculation (which was VERY complex; most of your attributes contributed to your HP to some extent; Endurance a lot, Dexterity and Strength some, but even Intelligence helped your HP).
    The Cranky Gamer
    *It isn't realism, it's verisimilitude; the appearance of truth within the framework of the game.
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  3. - Top - End - #33
    Dwarf in the Playground

    Join Date
    Jul 2019

    Default Re: Classless D20 with Character Levels

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    Umm, tracking two pools isn't nearly as cumbersome as you're making it out to be, and IMO the gain in verisimilitude is worth it.

    Also, as I said earlier, the lowest level enemies, the mooks, don't need VP at all. Low level monsters harder to kill? You're making a new system, fix it. Maybe WP doesn't need to exactly equal Con. It all depends on how you are structuring and scaling damage. IMO a good balance point is that one solid hit, especially from a larger weapon, should drop a human sized mook in one. But with VP a low levels Heros will survive two to three of those hit.

    That rat is quite small, even with a hearty Con it'll have like 1 WP after a size modifier, maybe 6 for a Giant Rat. So, one decent swing against its body. So, mook giant rats could down in a hit. Maybe they're special in some way, feral, and have some VP too, now it'll take three or four hits or one crit to drop one.

    Sometimes when you write it is hard to distinguish if you're trying to modify an existing system, or fully create a new one and it would be helpful for you to articulate the particulars.
    I'm trying to create a classless d20 system, it doesn't have to be Dungeons & Dragons, in fact I am planning on adapting it for Traveller. I want to keep the combat system simple, using classless d20 for personal combat and for starships, use Mongoose Traveller. D&D has character classes that don't fit in to the traveller setting, and i don't want bother creating Traveller classes. The T20 system had traveller classes, but all each class had were hit dice, feats, skills, and modifiers. I didn't see why they added two extra ability scores, Education, and Social Status, i think the six standard ones should work fine. What is the difference between education and intelligence anyway? I like charisma just fine too, don't see a need for a number quantifying social standing. If someone has a title such as a knight or a duke, just give him that title, and leave the number out of it.. Charisma is sort of inborn, while social standing is something society assigns to you, not something you carry around with you.

    It could also be used in a time travel campaign, i was watching Outlander, and it seems the 18th century doesn't have a lot of character classe muskets were easier to use than swords or bows and arrows, and they made armor obsolete, so there goes the fighter class. Whereas before it took a lot of training to master martial weapons of war, 18th century warfare consisted of muskets and cannons, armor was more of a hindrance, so a hunter and a soldier were essentially the same thing in this era.
    Last edited by Tom Kalbfus; 2019-08-24 at 07:39 PM.

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