OOTS #1179 - The Discussion Thread

[CriticalFailure]

I remember one adventure, forget the name, where the only verb that it would recognise to use with a knife you found was SACRIFICE--even though there was no indication any sort of sacrifice was taking place!

In Dunnet you can eat anything. That’s one thing I’ve figured out.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Reading all of this, I'm suddenly happy my early games was limited to dying of cholera in Oregon Trail.

[NobleCuriosity]

Reading all of this, I'm suddenly happy my early games was limited to dying of cholera in Oregon Trail.

Wow. I remember playing that in a high school electronics class. Makes me feel kind of old. I wonder when the last Oregon Trail game will be played.

[Peelee]

Wow. I remember playing that in a high school electronics class. Makes me feel kind of old. I wonder when the last Oregon Trail game will be played.

The black-and-white (well, green) version, or one of the various full-color versions? How about the Amazon Trail (which was WAY better)?

And, despite my "if they keep making remakes/updating it it'll never go away" point, dang I wish they'd release a new version of Amazon Trail.

[Jasdoif]

Reading all of this, I'm suddenly happy my early games was limited to dying of cholera in Oregon Trail.

Wait, you never lived long enough to die of dysentery?

Wow. I remember playing that in a high school electronics class. Makes me feel kind of old. I wonder when the last Oregon Trail game will be played.

Elementary school, here...then again I am a lifelong Oregonian, that's probably a factor. (I'm sure the Apple IIs in the computer lab were for something besides Oregon Trail and whatever was on...Microzine, I think it was?)

Anyway, I recommend Organ Trail if you want something nostalgic-ly similar but actually playable.

[RatElemental]

There was a game called Organ Trail released relatively recently that will keep the game shambling along for some time too I imagine.

[NobleCuriosity]

The black-and-white (well, green) version, or one of the various full-color versions? How about the Amazon Trail (which was WAY better)?

And, despite my "if they keep making remakes/updating it it'll never go away" point, dang I wish they'd release a new version of Amazon Trail.

I played the green version (though not very much.). I don’t think I ever beat it.

I never played Amazon trail.

For the last game played...hm. I think I’d count anything with the name Oregon Trail that was keyboard input based, with similar mechanics and tone.

Aaand I just learned there’s an iOS and Android app version, where you can buy "Oregon Trail Cash" to get the best wagon parts, skip crossing rivers, receive mission rewards instantly, heal sick family members, and buy supplies you couldn't normally get with in-game coins. Of course there is. It doesn’t count anyway because it’s not keyboard input based.

Maybe I shouldn’t have that criteria? I just think of Oregon Trail as THE archetypal keyboard input game (not the best, I’m sure, but the most famous).

[Peelee]

Elementary school, here...then again I am a lifelong Oregonian, that's probably a factor. (I'm sure the Apple IIs in the computer lab were for something besides Oregon Trail and whatever was on...Microzine, I think it was?)

Winter Games. Did y'all not have that in Oregon?

[Jasdoif]

Winter Games. Did y'all not have that in Oregon?

Not on the Apple IIs at school; that one was on the Atari ST. (I was better with World Games, though)

[danielxcutter]

I am not sure what you mean by "messed up". In any case, Favored Souls are considered Tier 2 (same tier as the Sorcerer, making them sort of the Sorcerer to the Cleric's Wizard), but are also usually considered weaker than Sorcs because they draw from a weaker spell list (Cleric but worse), are MAD (multiple attribute dependent), and don't have the Sorcerer's powerful exclusives.

Also Favored Souls don't have access to domains (and domain powers), can't spontaneously convert spells (they can spontaneously cast, but some Cleric options require conversion), and cannot turn undead. This also denies them the usual Cleric cheese like Divine Metamagic and (trade-in) Devotion feats.

Er, actually, it's Wisdom for DC and Charisma for casting and bonus slots.

Also, since by default Favored Souls get proficiency as well as Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization in their deity's favored weapon for free, plus they get more spells known than Sorcerers and the Cleric list has a lot of good buffs, they make quite good "gishes", the common term for characters who both cast spells and beat face.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Wait, you never lived long enough to die of dysentery?

Until now I didn't know that was a possibility.

[danielxcutter]

Until now I didn't know that was a possibility.

I mean, this isn't Oregon Trail or anything, so...

[The Pilgrim]

Eh...there were certainly a few games with good parsers, but with most of them it was a matter of figuring by trial and error out which small handful of verbs the parser recognized, and then having to deal with idiosyncrasies from the rest of the design
(...)
The kind of transformation you're talking about would happen some time after that...and it had little to do with text parsers.

You are right in that most text-based adventure games were quite obnioux. But Sierra made a good work with their AGI, allowing you a good amount of command variants to perform the actions and you didn't felt frustrated by the parser itself. I think it's a pity they discontinued it after King's Quest IV in favor of a graphical interface. I understand they had to do it to keep up with the times as they needed to keep their games marketeable (and make them translatable to other languages), but still King's Quest V didn't feel the same to me.

(Though I still wonder why Rosella was the only member of Graham's family who wasn't allowed to grab everything on sight that was not nailed down, or resort to violence. Also, I still have mixed feelings about how naturally came to my mind what I needed to do at the dwarves' house).

I'm sad that I can't tell how serious you are being there.

If you try hard enough, you can always find a reason to blame George Lucas for the downfall of western civilization.

[CriticalFailure]

Is Favored Soul worse than Oracle from PF? It sounds like it's similar but more MAD.

[Riftwolf]

Seeing as we're talking old games...
There was a platform game we had on the computer (Apple II maybe) in primary school (late 80s-early 90s) where you had to collect gems from round a tomb. If you showed me a screenshot I'd recognise it straight away, but I never learnt the name of it; it was deleted when the teachers discovered when you quit the game it swore at you. I remember it having far better graphics than any other game of the time. Any ideas what it could've been?

[Jasdoif]

Reading all of this, I'm suddenly happy my early games was limited to dying of cholera in Oregon Trail.

Wait, you never lived long enough to die of dysentery?

Until now I didn't know that was a possibility.

Huh, dying of dysentery was common enough to be directly associated with Oregon Trail....

Anyway, for me, text adventures were like six years after what I'd call early games. Those was more along the lines of Archon, M.U.L.E., Millipede, Mail Order Monsters, Gorf, Joust, Dig Dug, Boulder Dash...you know, stuff a six-year-old with ADD could figure out by themselves just well enough to feel like they were accomplishing something before getting distracted/bored and quitting to try something else.

Seeing as we're talking old games...
There was a platform game we had on the computer (Apple II maybe) in primary school (late 80s-early 90s) where you had to collect gems from round a tomb. If you showed me a screenshot I'd recognise it straight away, but I never learnt the name of it; it was deleted when the teachers discovered when you quit the game it swore at you. I remember it having far better graphics than any other game of the time. Any ideas what it could've been?

I remember seeing something like that on the Apple II at the library in middle school...Montezuma's Revenge, maybe?

[Squire Doodad]

I remember seeing something like that on the Apple II at the library in middle school...Montezuma's Revenge, maybe?

Isn't that just what you call food poisoning from eating undercooked llama in a pseudo-mesoamerican setting?

[Jasdoif]

Isn't that just what you call food poisoning from eating undercooked llama in a pseudo-mesoamerican setting?

I'm sure someone thought it'd be clever to name the game after that particular phenomenon.

[Ruck]

Oops well I do suck at cooking as well as dunnet

Ahh, I never played it. I was more early-graphic-adventure era. (Which reminds me, I started playing Beneath a Steel Sky for the first time a while back, but I haven't gotten terribly far and I've been playing more Dragon Quest 11 lately.)

I remember one adventure, forget the name, where the only verb that it would recognise to use with a knife you found was SACRIFICE--even though there was no indication any sort of sacrifice was taking place!

I remember one text game I played that only used the first three letters of each interactive element to recognize it, which drove me nuts pretty early in when fter having previously interacted with a parchment scroll, I had to try to go to the parapets.

Wow. I remember playing that in a high school electronics class. Makes me feel kind of old. I wonder when the last Oregon Trail game will be played.

Well, I saw an American Dad episode that featured Oregon Trail and aired, I think, last year. I feel like a lot of millennials (or maybe Gen-X / millennial border kids; I've heard them referred to as "the Oregon Trail generation," although as a member, I don't buy it) have a certain nostalgia for it.

You are right in that most text-based adventure games were quite obnioux. But Sierra made a good work with their AGI, allowing you a good amount of command variants to perform the actions and you didn't felt frustrated by the parser itself. I think it's a pity they discontinued it after King's Quest IV in favor of a graphical interface. I understand they had to do it to keep up with the times as they needed to keep their games marketeable (and make them translatable to other languages), but still King's Quest V didn't feel the same to me.

I was always more a Space Quest guy myself-- Space Quest III and King's Quest IV were the first two graphic adventures I played, and I had a lot more fun with the former.

I'm sure someone thought it'd be clever to name the game after that particular phenomenon.

Nerds having a juvenile sense of humor? Never!

[CriticalFailure]

Ahh, I never played it. I was more early-graphic-adventure era.

It's pretty old, the only reason I've played it is courtesy of the text editor that wishes it were an OS.

[Peelee]

I remember seeing something like that on the Apple II at the library in middle school...Montezuma's Revenge, maybe?

Isn't that just what you call food poisoning from eating undercooked llama in a pseudo-mesoamerican setting?

I'd always heard it as the hangover from cheap tequila.

[Ruck]

I'd always heard it as the hangover from cheap tequila.

This is the first I've heard of it being anything except the other thing.

[Jasdoif]

This is the first I've heard of it being anything except the other thing.

In that case, have another.

[Schroeswald]

In that case, have another.

But its spelled differently, it was written Montezuma, that is Montezooma.

[Jasdoif]

But its spelled differently, it was written Montezuma, that is Montezooma.

I'm sure someone thought it was clever to replace the identically-sounding syllable with "zoom" for the name of a roller-coaster ride.

[Schroeswald]

I'm sure someone thought it was clever to replace the identically-sounding syllable with "zoom" for the name of a roller-coaster ride.

Oh very, but this is written form so you can't weasel your way out with the fact it sounds identical (unless every use of it until mine is replaced by an audio file of someone saying Montezuma).

[Jasdoif]

Oh very, but this is written form so you can't weasel your way out with the fact it sounds identical (unless every use of it until mine is replaced by an audio file of someone saying Montezuma).

I hadn't heard of Montezuma's revenge before seeing Montezooma's Revenge at Knott's Berry Farm, so the reference was lost on me at the time. Also, you should consider apologizing to the weasels.

[Squire Doodad]

I hadn't heard of Montezuma's revenge before seeing Montezooma's Revenge at Knott's Berry Farm, so the reference was lost on me at the time. Also, you should consider apologizing to the weasels.

There's also some B lister villain in a comic (I think Tom Strong?) that makes a remark about having "Montezuma's Revenge".
Though that's more from personal experience and if you need to get that niche you're probably doing something wrong.

[The MunchKING]

I'd always heard it as the hangover from cheap tequila.

I heard it was from drinking the water.

[Ruck]

I heard it was from drinking the water.

You definitely don't want to drink the water. He said, based on an experience of living there six months and every single person he knew having distilled water and encouraging him heavily to do the same.