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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    Lord Raziere's Avatar

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    Default What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    I just had a thought.

    Say there is a mortal, and they do something heroic or whatever to make it seem they are worthy, and both The Unconquered Sun and Luna came to them at the same time and found each other trying to Exalt the same person.

    The situation is wildly, completely improbable. Astronomically so. I know that. but lets say, for the sake of discussion, that it just does: these two Incarnae are trying to Exalt one person and they won't budge on it.

    What happens, because I don't know if anyone has ever asked this question before, but it sounds like something out of myth that Exalted would totally have happen, much like the golden apple of discord being argued over by three goddesses.

    So what do you guys think would happen? would this mortal have the unique chance to CHOOSE which Exaltation they get? would Sol and Luna compete over who gets to Exalt them? Do they just flip a coin of ambrosia? What? I don't think there is any wrong answer to this, but I certainly want to hear peoples thoughts on this.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    I just had a thought.

    Say there is a mortal, and they do something heroic or whatever to make it seem they are worthy, and both The Unconquered Sun and Luna came to them at the same time and found each other trying to Exalt the same person.

    The situation is wildly, completely improbable. Astronomically so. I know that. but lets say, for the sake of discussion, that it just does: these two Incarnae are trying to Exalt one person and they won't budge on it.

    What happens, because I don't know if anyone has ever asked this question before, but it sounds like something out of myth that Exalted would totally have happen, much like the golden apple of discord being argued over by three goddesses.

    So what do you guys think would happen? would this mortal have the unique chance to CHOOSE which Exaltation they get? would Sol and Luna compete over who gets to Exalt them? Do they just flip a coin of ambrosia? What? I don't think there is any wrong answer to this, but I certainly want to hear peoples thoughts on this.
    First off, Luna and TUS don't choose who exalt. The individual exaltation chooses. And there is a different qualifier for each. Lunars are chosen more because they acted as a type of guardian. For Solar exaltations, it is more dependent on the heroism as typified by the individual caste.

    That said, if a Lunar or Solar exaltation tried to attach and exalt a specific mortal at the same time, then ultimately it is the mortal's choice.

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Both Sun and Moon at the same time? Is that not definitionally an Eclipse Caste?

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by EmperorSarda View Post
    First off, Luna and TUS don't choose who exalt. The individual exaltation chooses. And there is a different qualifier for each. Lunars are chosen more because they acted as a type of guardian. For Solar exaltations, it is more dependent on the heroism as typified by the individual caste.

    That said, if a Lunar or Solar exaltation tried to attach and exalt a specific mortal at the same time, then ultimately it is the mortal's choice.
    Thats a 2eism. I'm talking about 3e. Exaltations are not shards in 3e.
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    I'ma go with "Solar during the day, Lunar at night." With their personalities slowly splintering, too, at a guess. Seems like the most narratively interesting, though god knows how it would work mechanically.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    My guess it depends on the person then. Luna always visits when someone exalts as a Lunar. TUS only gives a small message for the Zenith caste. But isn't limited to that.

    So my guess is that the person has the choice. To choose which path to go down. I doubt TUS or Luna would force exaltation on someone who didn't want it.

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    If the power levels of the deities aren't too different in 3rd edition from 2nd, I'd guess that Solar one would win if they 'fought' over the human due to TUS being more powerful than Luna. At least, more directly powerful.

    I don't know the 3rd edition lore, but I could see something like the person has both. Thus, access to both Solar and Lunar charms plus the inherent abilities of both. Probably overpowered for a PC, but a neat concept for an NPC.

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    When two companies wanted to hire me at the same time, I would choose which offer to accept.
    If two women were interested in me at the same time, I would choose who to date.
    When two D&D groups want me to join them for a Saturday afternoon game, I decide whose house to drive to.
    When two colleges admitted me, I chose which one to attend.

    Why would this be any different? [And how?]

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    When two companies wanted to hire me at the same time, I would choose which offer to accept.
    If two women were interested in me at the same time, I would choose who to date.
    When two D&D groups want me to join them for a Saturday afternoon game, I decide whose house to drive to.
    When two colleges admitted me, I chose which one to attend.

    Why would this be any different? [And how?]
    Well, in all of those examples you have a choice in the matter. I don't think it's possible to turn down becoming Exalted. You aren't being hired, you're being picked.
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    When two companies wanted to hire me at the same time, I would choose which offer to accept.
    If two women were interested in me at the same time, I would choose who to date.
    When two D&D groups want me to join them for a Saturday afternoon game, I decide whose house to drive to.
    When two colleges admitted me, I chose which one to attend.

    Why would this be any different? [And how?]
    If two different states want to try you for crimes, you don't get to choose which state tries you.
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    I thought at first this would lead to two different situations, but I think they actually fold into each other. I realized after a few minutes that they are both same but that they focus on different perspectives (he divine and the mortal) on essentially the same thing.

    Essentially the two different Incarnae have some sort of contest, ala God, Satan, and Job, to see who their Chosen drifts to. Not that the person would have the same things happen to them as the biblical story, but that an "average" person would find their life suddenly having a lot of supernatural attention on it, and that attention demanding a response from them. I think the exact nature of that attention would vary a lot on the chosen in particular as well as the Incarnae involved, but I imagine it should be all about the mortal making clear and distinct choices between two different things. What is appealing to me about this is that I think the outcome doesn't have to step on any toes in particular, which makes it playable at least to me. "Luna got this one, well I guess this mortal didn't have what it takes to be a Chosen of Battles" says Mars at the end of the day.
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    Jay R's Avatar

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Random NPC View Post
    If two different states want to try you for crimes, you don't get to choose which state tries you.
    Oh, very good point.

    But I think it's not sufficiently analogous. In the Exalted case, both Incarnae are trying to honor you. If two states want to give me a medal, I do get to choose which ceremony to attend.

    But you still make a valid point, requiring me to refine my analogy and explain it better.
    Last edited by Jay R; 2019-10-16 at 10:17 AM.

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    But I think it's not sufficiently analogous. In the Exalted case, both Incarnae are trying to honor you. If two states want to give me a medal, I do get to choose which ceremony to attend.
    But if you're important enough, the very act of choosing can ruffle feathers. If you think mere mortals can get prissy over being "snubbed..."

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    But if you're important enough, the very act of choosing can ruffle feathers. If you think mere mortals can get prissy over being "snubbed..."
    Of course. The whole reason to set up this situation is to force a PC to snub a powerful being.

    DMs are supposed to put players in dangerous positions.

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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    In the Old Lore, this would not happen, as Solars exalt before/during the heroic Deed, and Lunars afterwards.

    In the (fluffwise meh to horrible, if mechanically clearly superior) 3rd Edition though....phew....more difficult#.

    I am going with "unless very specific circumstances are against it, Solar", as TUS is simply Lunas Superior in everything but Shapeshifting.
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  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Last edited by Mutazoia; 2019-10-20 at 12:03 AM.
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    Considering how rare both Solar and Lunar Exaltations are... the chance of both the deities picking the same mortal is pretty vanishingly small. If it were to happen, I could honestly see it going either way. Lunar Exaltation is a lot more varied, as Luna meets each of their Chosen in a variety of shapes and guises. It also places less emphasis on the "great deed" part, though Solar Exaltation doesn't require it, either. You could say the Sun's superior strength would overpower Luna, or that Luna's mercurial trickster nature would win over.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: What if Two Incarnae want to Exalt The Same Person?

    I could go either way on either agreeing to a contest between the two of them to see which one the mortal seems appropriate to (which will have the effect of making the mortal's life exceptionally interesting), or straight up giving the mortal a choice. If a mortal did something so impressive that they get multiple offers for exaltation, without having already been exalted for awesomeness by that point, the incarnae might well think their input had merit. Storywise I'd be slightly more inclined to have them be tested, just because that creates more interesting conflict.

    While Sol could probably win if it turned into a contest of who could stuff their exaltation into the mortal harder, incarnae rarely duke it out amongst themselves and their primary pastime is gaming. Being so crude and direct doesn't seem to be their style.

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