What is the role of a tempest cleric?

[Trandir]

Well this saturday I will play a tempest cleric and I realized that I do not know exactly what this subclass is supposed to do.

My impressions so far:

Spoiler

Show

Martial striker:
Up to lv 4 you can do a below average damage by using weapons, then after lv 5 you deal considerably less damage compared to other melee classes.

Blaster:
The domain's spells offers a good array spells with area of effect and destructive wrath adds a lot of damage. There are not many monsters that are resistant/immune to lightning and thunder particularly.

BFC:
The domain spells plus the knockback of thunderbolt strike should be enough to be serviceble at this

Defender:
The AC is good thanks to the heavy armor, wrath of the storm deals good damage at low levels and with thunderbolt strike it can make for some fun plays later on.

Healer/Buff/Debuff:
The subclass isn't built for this.

All in all this class seems to do his best in the middle of the battlefield, taking blows and using aoe spells.
Wearing heavy armor a shield and no weapon. Good Con, for the HP and concentration, and Wis, to actually hit something, scores and the rest is dumpable (Dex is the third most important stat).

What is your take on this subclass?

[Keltest]

That's pretty much my take as well. Theyre blaster casters that trade some of the sheer offense of a sorcerer, warlock or wizard for more protection, HP and the ability to carry a meaningful melee weapon.

[Laserlight]

You pretty much have it right. Wear heavy armor and shield, cast Bless, get in the middle of the fight, and cast AoEs.

[Frozenstep]

While they aren't built to heal/debuff/buff, it is still a cleric and having those options on top of being a tanky blaster is quite good. Also, no reason not to use a weapon. Swing away in combat, then when you need to cast, drop the weapon as a free action, cast, and then pick it up as an item interaction. If you want it to seem less gamey, say you stick the weapon in the ground before casting and grabbing it again.

[Dudu]

Played a Tempest Cleric.

In fact, it was my very first character in this edition.

All I can say is that, yeah, you are a blaster. Better at blasting than many would assume.
Having martial as well as heavy armor proficiency makes many believe you should go melee. And yes, you can stay in melee better than most casters, just not good at dishing damage with melee weapons. Instead, you are better at positioning yourself at the center of the fray and dishing out loads of damage while (with some likely rider effect, such as knocking down).

Also, depending on how magic items are handled in your campaign, a wand of lightning for that cleric can be ridiculously strong. While having martial proficiency is good, in case you got an interesting weapon that no one else wants but requires such proficiency.

I will go ahead and say that Tempest Cleric might be one of the top 5 strongest subclasses of the whole edition.

[Trandir]

While they aren't built to heal/debuff/buff, it is still a cleric and having those options on top of being a tanky blaster is quite good. Also, no reason not to use a weapon. Swing away in combat, then when you need to cast, drop the weapon as a free action, cast, and then pick it up as an item interaction. If you want it to seem less gamey, say you stick the weapon in the ground before casting and grabbing it again.

That is true. The OP was about the designated roles of a tempest cleric. Any cleric can heal and everyone should keep one or two healing spells always prepared. Also bless is just too good to pass most of the time, right?

About the weapon the thought process was this: a tempest cleric can't be optimal by using weapons the martial class to it better, with the point buy then you should prioritize Con and Wis, this leaves either a 14, dumping 2 stats, or a 13, dumping 1. Even at lv 1 we are looking at 1d8 (or 1d12 with toll the dead) vs 1d8+1/2. With divine strike you deal comparable damage with cantrips and weapons but the spell attack/save DC will increase over the levels making using spells more reliable, right? You always keep a spare weapon in case you face a monster immune to thunder and lightning but that is a worst case scenario

[BoringInfoGuy]

While they aren't built to heal/debuff/buff, it is still a cleric and having those options on top of being a tanky blaster is quite good. Also, no reason not to use a weapon. Swing away in combat, then when you need to cast, drop the weapon as a free action, cast, and then pick it up as an item interaction. If you want it to seem less gamey, say you stick the weapon in the ground before casting and grabbing it again.

Technically, dropping your weapon is still your item interaction. Picking back up the weapon would require your Use an Object Action, but you’ve already used your action Casting a Spell.

Dropping an item in hand being a complete non-action is a common house rule, but not one that should be allowed to bypass casting component rules. (My group will allow it to change weapons quickly - drop bow / draw sword / attack with sword - but not drop mace / cast / pick up mace). Basic idea is if you are quickly dropping something fast enough to not count as your object interaction, then you can’t be paying enough attention and care to see where it lands / bounces to and grab it again that turn.

Pure Raw has no special rules for dropping vs stowing, so you may as well stow your weapon instead of dropping it.

Of course, if your DM is fine with drop / cast / pick up cheese, then actual RAW is irrelevant.

[CTurbo]

Tempest Clerics are awesome and are easily one of the most versatile subclasses in the game if not one of the strongest too.


I like the tank role best for Tempest Clerics. They make the best tanks of all the Cleric subclasses IMO.

But they make excellent blasters too. They are probably the highest DPR of all Cleric subclasses as well.

[micahaphone]

War caster seems like a phenomenal choice for a tempest cleric

[Waazraath]

Well this saturday I will play a tempest cleric and I realized that I do not know exactly what this subclass is supposed to do.

My impressions so far:

Spoiler

Show

Martial striker:
Up to lv 4 you can do a below average damage by using weapons, then after lv 5 you deal considerably less damage compared to other melee classes.

Blaster:
The domain's spells offers a good array spells with area of effect and destructive wrath adds a lot of damage. There are not many monsters that are resistant/immune to lightning and thunder particularly.

BFC:
The domain spells plus the knockback of thunderbolt strike should be enough to be serviceble at this

Defender:
The AC is good thanks to the heavy armor, wrath of the storm deals good damage at low levels and with thunderbolt strike it can make for some fun plays later on.

Healer/Buff/Debuff:
The subclass isn't built for this.

All in all this class seems to do his best in the middle of the battlefield, taking blows and using aoe spells.
Wearing heavy armor a shield and no weapon. Good Con, for the HP and concentration, and Wis, to actually hit something, scores and the rest is dumpable (Dex is the third most important stat).

What is your take on this subclass?

Over all I agree. Some remarks though:
- defender: don't forget dodge + bonus action spiritual weapon. Makes it even better.
- healer/buff/debuff: the SUBclass doesn't add much, but the class itself is great in this respect, so if you want to do this, you can. Bless is always good, as is Aid, and an upcast blindness targiting several low con enemies.
- grabbing Booming Blade greatly increases both your tank/defender role (it punishes ene mies for walking to a squishier target) and increases your melee damage.
- martial striker/melee: is underrated afaic. In the first place, get booming blade for damage boosts at 5th and 11th level. Together with the standard cleric +1d8/2d8, it does get respectable. You can combo it with the knockback reaction: hit enemy with booming blade, get hit with first counterattack, knockback, and force creature to either forgo other attacks, or take 1d8/2d8/3d8 extra damage.

About the weapon the thought process was this: a tempest cleric can't be optimal by using weapons the martial class to it better, with the point buy then you should prioritize Con and Wis, this leaves either a 14, dumping 2 stats, or a 13, dumping 1. Even at lv 1 we are looking at 1d8 (or 1d12 with toll the dead) vs 1d8+1/2. With divine strike you deal comparable damage with cantrips and weapons but the spell attack/save DC will increase over the levels making using spells more reliable, right? You always keep a spare weapon in case you face a monster immune to thunder and lightning but that is a worst case scenario

I think you can get more out of it when you roll for stats (and roll good). My current Tempest Cleric has at lvl 4 18 dex and 18 wis. Melee always does more damage than a cantrip, it allows me to use the reaction-damage ability, with Booming Blade I can tank (hard to hit + forces enemies to stay in place) and combined with Spiritual Weapon the damage is on par with dedicated martials (in those fights I use SW, that is - but even without it, damage is still respectable while remaining one of the hardest party members to lay a hit on).

[Zerubbabel]

What's the best melee Cleric then?

[Trandir]

Over all I agree. Some remarks though:
- defender: don't forget dodge + bonus action spiritual weapon. Makes it even better.
- healer/buff/debuff: the SUBclass doesn't add much, but the class itself is great in this respect, so if you want to do this, you can. Bless is always good, as is Aid, and an upcast blindness targiting several low con enemies.
- grabbing Booming Blade greatly increases both your tank/defender role (it punishes ene mies for walking to a squishier target) and increases your melee damage.
- martial striker/melee: is underrated afaic. In the first place, get booming blade for damage boosts at 5th and 11th level. Together with the standard cleric +1d8/2d8, it does get respectable. You can combo it with the knockback reaction: hit enemy with booming blade, get hit with first counterattack, knockback, and force creature to either forgo other attacks, or take 1d8/2d8/3d8 extra damage.



I think you can get more out of it when you roll for stats (and roll good). My current Tempest Cleric has at lvl 4 18 dex and 18 wis. Melee always does more damage than a cantrip, it allows me to use the reaction-damage ability, with Booming Blade I can tank (hard to hit + forces enemies to stay in place) and combined with Spiritual Weapon the damage is on par with dedicated martials (in those fights I use SW, that is - but even without it, damage is still respectable while remaining one of the hardest party members to lay a hit on).

Well yes the tempest cleric is still a cleric so you get te bundle of buffs, heals and good spells (at low levels bless, healing word, spiritual weapon).

Booming blade is interesting but you don't have natural access to it. How would you get it?

Rolling stats allows some PCs concepts to be great right off the bat but I assumed poiny buy. Still you can get 3 decent stats (Str/Dex, Con and Wis) but it ends up much less powerfull.

Never actually tryed it but probably
T1 spirit guardians
T2 spiritual weapon+ booming blade
T3+ booming blade and SW attack
Is a great routine that should get through most combats if you do not need to go nova.
(Is it possible to use efficiently two main attack stats and have the constitution to survive in the frontline?)

Also funny thing, for me at least, you can use destructive wrath to maximize the damage an attack's thunder damage so those from booming blade and divine strike. This means anything from 8 to 40 confirmed damage depending on the level, right?

[Waazraath]

Well yes the tempest cleric is still a cleric so you get te bundle of buffs, heals and good spells (at low levels bless, healing word, spiritual weapon).

Booming blade is interesting but you don't have natural access to it. How would you get it?

Rolling stats allows some PCs concepts to be great right off the bat but I assumed poiny buy. Still you can get 3 decent stats (Str/Dex, Con and Wis) but it ends up much less powerfull.

Never actually tryed it but probably
T1 spirit guardians
T2 spiritual weapon+ booming blade
T3+ booming blade and SW attack
Is a great routine that should get through most combats if you do not need to go nova.
(Is it possible to use efficiently two main attack stats and have the constitution to survive in the frontline?)

Also funny thing, for me at least, you can use destructive wrath to maximize the damage an attack's thunder damage so those from booming blade and divine strike. This means anything from 8 to 40 confirmed damage depending on the level, right?

Got BB through high elf, though variant half elf or a feat would have worked as well. And ay, point buy is default usually, at least on these boards. Your routine seems solid, can't wait to try it out when lvl 5 :)

[Chronos]

Aside: So often, people say "such-and-such is good if you roll for stats", and leave the "(and roll good)" part implicit. Always remember: When you're rolling for stats, you're just as likely to roll bad as to roll good. Sure, you might end up with your lowest score at a 16, but you might also end up with your highest score at a 10. Never ask to roll stats unless you have a backup plan for what to do if you don't roll well.

[Waazraath]

Aside: So often, people say "such-and-such is good if you roll for stats", and leave the "(and roll good)" part implicit. Always remember: When you're rolling for stats, you're just as likely to roll bad as to roll good. Sure, you might end up with your lowest score at a 16, but you might also end up with your highest score at a 10. Never ask to roll stats unless you have a backup plan for what to do if you don't roll well.

Very true this.

[Wizard_Lizard]

I say all of the above.
High ac, martial weapons, blasting features, and standard cleric...
In short, much versatility...

[CTurbo]

I'd say the Tempest Cleric is the best melee Cleric too with the exception of a niche GWM War Cleric build.

[stoutstien]

I'd say the Tempest Cleric is the best melee Cleric too with the exception of a niche GWM War Cleric build.

I'd call it a 4 way tie between nature for SADness, War for 2hd goodness, tempest for all around, and arcane for easy access to BB and such.
I think temp does the best at being a complete concept that does what it says on the label.

[Wizard_Lizard]

I'd call it a 4 way tie between nature for SADness, War for 2hd goodness, tempest for all around, and arcane for easy access to BB and such.
I think temp does the best at being a complete concept that does what it says on the label.

exactly why it is my favourite cleric!
to bad almost all of their gods are sea gods or evil...
WE NEED MIRE WEATHER GODS

[Frozenstep]

About the weapon the thought process was this: a tempest cleric can't be optimal by using weapons the martial class to it better, with the point buy then you should prioritize Con and Wis, this leaves either a 14, dumping 2 stats, or a 13, dumping 1. Even at lv 1 we are looking at 1d8 (or 1d12 with toll the dead) vs 1d8+1/2. With divine strike you deal comparable damage with cantrips and weapons but the spell attack/save DC will increase over the levels making using spells more reliable, right? You always keep a spare weapon in case you face a monster immune to thunder and lightning but that is a worst case scenario

Drop con a bit (yeah, I know it hurts, but that's reality for a gish...gotta rely on your AC), or get a belt of giant strength.

It's not optimal with point buy and a lack of stat boosting items, but there are still some upsides, namely being able to make use of advantage. If your party has a wizard who's always trying to restrain enemies, or a wolf totem barbarian, or a bard who loves faerie fire, you'll find weapons suddenly become a lot more reliable.

[KorvinStarmast]

War caster seems like a phenomenal choice for a tempest cleric

exactly why it is my favourite cleric!
to bad almost all of their gods are sea gods or evil...
WE NEED MIRE WEATHER GODS

If you play in Sword Coast/Faerun ... Your cleric's and your god's alignment do not have to exactly align.

There is an Elven Chaotic Good deity, Aerdrie Faenya, whose domains are Tempest and Trickery. (Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide, p 23). CG god, Tempest domain, and your character embraces lawfulness in the cause of Good.

There is also Deep Sashelas, Chaotic Good Elf god of the Sea (PHB Appendix B). CG god, Tempest domain, and your character embraces lawfulness in the cause of Good.

There is the neutral halfling goddess, Sheela Peryrol, whose domains are Nature and Tempest. (Sword Coast Adventurer's GUide, p 23).

A better fit might be Valkur, Chaotic Good God of Tempest and War (Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide p. 21). CG god, Tempest domain, and your character embraces lawfulness in the cause of Good.

Istishia, God of Water, N, Tempest. Symbol is a wave. (Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide, p. 21)


Akadi, Goddess of Air. (N) Symbol is a cloud. (Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide, p. 21).

For the OP:

My second PC ever was a Tempest Cleric. Very enjoyable. Warhammer by his side, he tended to carry a javelin since his Background was Sailor. Throwing the jav was a good opening attack, followed by a bonus action some times, other times he'd stow the jav and cast Bless. If he needed to draw the war hammer he could do that on round two, or subsequent, depending on how the battle shaped up. Or, round two could be all casting. Shield had holy symbol.

Flexible, and survivable. Healing when needed but not a primary mission. I think I used Lesser Restoration with this cleric more than on any of my life clerics due to the troubles my fellow PCs kept running into with being blinded, paralyzed, poisoned, etc. beyond healing word, LR was his most cast spell.
After that were Fog Cloud and Thunderwave. Neither of them ever got old.
Only used Spirit Guardians if we ran into a crowd of mooks. Otherwise, it wasn't a best choice.
Remove Curse and Dispel Magic were always prepared once I hit sixth level ... we ran into a lot more casters at that point and beyond.

[VonDragon]

my take is that the cleric is in general a support class unable to sustain high damage but can burst quite well. tempest lean towards melee support its high ac help but does not usually make it a defender as it lacks the ability to encourage people to attack (until you unleash something like maximised shatter or destructive wave using your divinity) I do find on mine magic initiate for booming blade helps with sustained but damage should be left to the rogues fighters and barbarians of the party

[MrStabby]

The class is kind of a generalist, able to do a bit of everything.

Healing is at its most valuable when a PC is down. Divination is great out of combat. Spirit Guardians is great when facing low wisdom enemies. Maximised shatter is awesome against those that can't dodge it.

Direct blast damage is a cleric weakness, buffing this up means that the cleric can do what is best at any point rather than sometimes being awesome and sometimes useless.

With some spells being close range, like spirit guardians, the support these spells get from heavy armour proficiency is not insignificant. Add in martial weapons for opportunity attacks and you are quite the presence. Personally i like pole arm mastery on a tempest cleric to get an extra shot at landing the thunder damage and the extra reaction attacks are nice (And fewer concentration breaking attacks against you due to reach is also nice).

Some readied spell with lightning damage to knock back an enemy is also brutal with spirit guardians. They start the turn 10 to 15 ft away, close 5 ft and get knocked back, then they close again (all fighting against the movement effect of spirit guardians). They start their turn in the effect and enter it's effect for the first time on the turn. Do be fair you can do something similar with a readied dash and any cleric, but the tempest does it best.

Tempest is good, no doubt. Not my personal favourite as I like to be a bit more of a specialist.

[KorvinStarmast]

Direct blast damage is a cleric weakness, buffing this up means that the cleric can do what is best at any point rather than sometimes being awesome and sometimes useless.

Every so often, a maxed out call lightning is a nice blasty spell. :) But that isn't often an option indoors.

[GreyBlack]

So in addition to the Cleric bag of tricks like divination spells (which, if you're not using, _you should_), the Tempest Cleric, to my mind, is best used as a tank. You're in heavy armor with a martial weapon, so your damage output will be on the high end. Your melee abilities will be good. You'll also have access to the Spirit Guardians/Spiritual Weapon which will encourage enemies to attack you. You have good HP and ways to mitigate HP damage like Aid and Cure Wounds.

My recommendation is to play the "eye of the storm" type of character. You should be up in the front of battle attacking and dealing damage and encouraging the enemies to attack you. Damage spells and concentration spells should be your bread and butter, so throwing up Bless at early levels is an option. Otherwise... just have fun with it! It's a great subclass.

[Hairfish]

If INT isn't a total dump stat, consider taking Magic Initiate (Wizard) to grab Shocking Grasp and Find Familiar.

Using your owl's flyby attack to joy buzzer a nasty enemy off a ledge is the best thing.

[Tanarii]

The same as most clerics with Heavy Armor and Divine Strike: Zone control tanks.

Whack things your weapon when you aren't busy casting, or as an OA. Thunder Wave to break up enemy formations or push enemies off of allies. Gust of Wind for the same purpose. Spirit Guardians is your friend at 5th level for close in fighting, Sleet Storm for slowing down approaching hords, or partially pinning ranged attackers.

And of course you have ranged blasting options when you need them.

[Theodoxus]

Aside: So often, people say "such-and-such is good if you roll for stats", and leave the "(and roll good)" part implicit. Always remember: When you're rolling for stats, you're just as likely to roll bad as to roll good. Sure, you might end up with your lowest score at a 16, but you might also end up with your highest score at a 10. Never ask to roll stats unless you have a backup plan for what to do if you don't roll well.

I've adopted the "Roll 4d6L1, in order" twice. If you don't like either set, you get the standard array (PB if I'm feeling particularly generous). Some players don't even opt to roll, knowing exactly what they want to play - in that case, I only offer them the standard array. I'm not really a fan of boosting 3 scores to 15 and nuking 3 to 8...

Most of my players like the chaotic nature of rolling in order - seeing what the dice dictate. I've had more than one "play against type", using a lower roll for their primary stat because they were enamored with a particular idea. 5E's bounded accuracy allows for a lot more leeway in regards to stats. A 20 in nice. A 14 is playable.

[tormund]

(until you unleash something like maximised shatter or destructive wave using your divinity)

Can someone clarify this aspect of the Channel Divinity feature for me: when you use CD: Destructive Wrath to "deal maximum damage, instead of rolling", does this apply for all creatures affected by an AoE spell? E.g. in the case of Shatter with two creatures inside the area of effect, do both creatures take maximum damage if they fail their saves? Or does one of my choosing take max damage, and I roll damage for the other?

[CTurbo]

Can someone clarify this aspect of the Channel Divinity feature for me: when you use CD: Destructive Wrath to "deal maximum damage, instead of rolling", does this apply for all creatures affected by an AoE spell? E.g. in the case of Shatter with two creatures inside the area of effect, do both creatures take maximum damage if they fail their saves? Or does one of my choosing take max damage, and I roll damage for the other?

It's to ALL to enemies in the AoE as far as I know at least that's how I've always played it. I killed 90% on an entire pack of Gnolls with a single maximized Shatter once and it was awesome!