Catch your breath: a mechanic idea

[CheddarChampion]

Sometimes a fight leaves our protagonists in need of recovery but the story calls for action.

For such situations, I propose that the characters are allowed to catch their breath before continuing:

1. Counts as a short rest for ability recharge. Does not count as a short rest for spending HD to heal.
2. The DM chooses a number for each of the following as they see fit:
i. An amount of time that passes for the purpose of spell durations and the like.
ii. A number of saves to end ongoing conditions (if applicable). May be determined individually per effect or broadly.
iii. A number of "rounds" (before the recharge takes effect) that can be used to activate abilities which recharge on a short rest (so they are not wasted).
iiii. A number of "rounds" (after the recharge takes effect) that can be used to cast spells or use abilities to recover or prepare. Examples include lay on hands, second wind, cure wounds, channel divinity, dispel magic, armor of agathys, elemental weapon, tenser's transformation, spirit guardians...

Would you include such a mechanic?
How would you improve it?

[JackPhoenix]

No, I wouldn't use such mechanic.

First, it doesn't affect everyone equally... some classes get little to no benefit from short rests outside using their HD to heal (which they can't do)
Second, why would the GM choose everything? The players should decide how long their characters are going to do whatever they do. If you want to go with this idea, give it a set duration, no arbitrary "whatever the GM feels like at the moment".

Or just use epic heroism rest variant from the DMG.

[Zhorn]

I'd avoid it also.

While i'm not personally fond of it, plenty of groups already shorten Short Rests into 5 minutes, describing that as 'a short rest is catching your breath'. If your goal is a faster rest option, just having faster short rests serves that purpose.

[Corran]

Or just use epic heroism rest variant from the DMG.

Agreed.

@OP: Between the epic heroism rest variant and handing out healing potions (for when the pc's HD can't do the trick), you should be covered if you have planned for a high number of encounters that the players need to accomplish within some time limit. You don't need to use the rest variant for the whole campaign if you don't like it, you could only adapt it for that one session that you need. Communicate that to your players at the start of the session (eg ''Your characters know they have about one hour to stop the evil wizard from completing the ritual. I wanted to throw multiple tougher fights against you, so that's why we'll use this rest variant for this adventuring day''). This will let you accomplish more or less what you want to do with your feature, while letting you not worry too much about any undesirable mechanical consequences or added complexity.

[cullynthedwarf]

I agree as well. Probably would not use. However major props to you for trying to fill a niche.

[Mr Adventurer]

I don't think spending Hit Dice is much of a factor in short rests - isn't it mostly about recharging powers?

TBH I'd probably have something like: "once per adventure*, if the players agree, they can have their characters catch their breath. This takes ten minutes of rest. It confers the benefits of a Short Rest."

* or per in-character day, or game session, or whatever

[CheddarChampion]

Thanks for the criticism all.
It was intentional that short rest based classes get more out of this, same as a short rest.
I was mostly trying to fit in a short rest for class balance without breaking any narrative. (I realize now I didn't communicate that well at all.)
Good deal with finding the rest variant!

You don't need to use the rest variant for the whole campaign if you don't like it, you could only adapt it for that one session that you need. Communicate that to your players at the start of the session (eg ''Your characters know they have about one hour to stop the evil wizard from completing the ritual. I wanted to throw multiple tougher fights against you, so that's why we'll use this rest variant for this adventuring day''). This will let you accomplish more or less what you want to do with your feature, while letting you not worry too much about any undesirable mechanical consequences or added complexity.

I think this is a better solution to what I was trying to solve. No extra complexity, the players know I'm doing this for balance but don't expect rests like that to happen all the time. Thanks much!

[Mr Adventurer]

Call it the "Sh*t just got real" rule.

[JNAProductions]

A houserule I've pondered is allowing three short rests per long rest-one at one minute, one at ten minutes, and one at an hour. They can be taken in any order and can be done alone (Warlock blows both slots in a fight, while the Fighter didn't expend anything? Warlock takes their one minute, Fighter doesn't) or as a party.

[YoungestGruff]

Main question: How is this substantially different than a Short Rest? It fills the same niche, story wise (Just a quick break to regroup before pressing on). Catching Your Breath, as a variant, feels more like some kind of bizarre Rage variation or something.

[Randomthom]

A fun variant could be that the group could spend perhaps just 10 minutes to do a short rest that benefits only one character. They choose who and all their characters are occupied in getting that character back fighting-fit. Perhaps make it a skill check too. i.e. If someone can manage a Wisdom (Medicine) check DC 12 then he can spend his hit dice as he would during a short rest.

Or...

Bard: I grab the warlock's tome, open the pages and try to engage with his patron through the pages.
DM: Ok... make an arcana check
Bard: 19?
DM: :nods:
Bard: "Ok, listen here you odious malcontent of a patron, you'd better grant him more of the magic you've been providing right now or all your investment in him is down the pan and you'll have made 4 new enemies."
DM: Sure, make a Charisma (intimidation) check.
Bard: Oh, I'm good at these... 17!
DM (to Warlock): You feel the magic surge through you once again and the unnerving tickle of your patron's voice in your brain "go ahead my pawn, I've work for you to finish, don't stop now". You gain back both your spell slots.

[Darkstar952]

I use a variant on gritty realism in my current game, so as standard Long rest takes a week (with different benefits on if resting in town or a camp in wilderness) and a short rest is 8 hours.

But I also added in a "Heroic Rest", this functions as a short rest in all ways with the exception that it takes 10 minutes, the cost of this is that after 1 hour all characters gain a point of exhaustion. This represents the characters marshalling their reserves and pushing themselves beyond their normal endurance for a short period and then being drained by it.

So far it has worked out very well, players tend to take normal 8 hour short rests but when the story requires it they have the ability to push on, they know the cost/benefits up front so they can make an informed decision.

[Man_Over_Game]

I love the idea, even wrote about a nearly identical solution a while back. It's the Adrenaline Surge link in my signature, if you're interested.

My problem is that very few tables utilize Short Rests, and there's a decent amount of power disparity between Long-Rest and Short-Rest classes, such as comparing Wizards to Warlocks.

See, Long Rest characters already exceed when there are fewer encounters per day, as they can expend 100% of a day's limited resources into a single fight. Inserting a Short Rest in the middle of a fight allows Short Rest characters to help bridge that gap.

For example, when taking a Wizard and a Warlock that are both level 5:

• No Short Rest:
  
  • Round 1
    
    • Wizard: Fireball (3)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 2
    
    • Wizard: Fireball (3)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 3
    
    • Wizard: Fire Sphere (2)
    • Warlock: Cantrip (0)
• With Short Rest:
  
  • Round 1
    
    • Wizard: Fireball (3)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 2
    
    • Wizard: Fireball (3)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 3
    
    • Wizard: Fire Sphere (2)
    • Warlock: Cantrip (0)
  • (Short Rest)
  • Round 4
    
    • Wizard: Fire Sphere (2)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 5
    
    • Wizard: Fire Sphere (2)
    • Warlock: Fireball (3)
  • Round 6
    
    • Wizard: Fire Sphere (2)
    • Warlock: Cantrip (0)

Totals by Round 6:

• Without Short Rests:
  • Wizard:
    • Level 3: 2
    • Level 2: 3
    • Level 1: 1
  • Warlock:
    • Level 3: 2
    • Level 0: 4
• With Short Rests:
  • Wizard:
    • Level 3: 2
    • Level 2: 4
    • Level 1: 0
  • Warlock:
    • Level 3: 4
    • Level 0: 2

Looks pretty balanced to me.

However, I would implement them as a DM decision, not one made by the players, as they should ONLY be implemented when inserting Short Rests naturally feels forced and inorganic. A good example of what that looks like is a table that only has 1-2 combat scenarios per day, when inserting extra encounters for the sake of balance slows down the game or feels "gamey".

So to solve that problem, I tie it into a boss feature. Boss hits 50% HP, new mechanics are introduced to the fight (more badguys, boss upgrades, environmental effects occur, etc), and the team gets a Short Rest. This also gives me the chance to tune the fight up-or-down, since I have witnessed the players in the first half of the encounter. Balancing a sole encounter for a day is tough, and "dividing" it into 2 separate encounters with a Short Rest inbetween lets the DM know what needs to be fixed WHEN it needs to be fixed.

All-in-all, it's been a lot of fun to use in my games. I don't have to worry about certain classes being weaker, and I can let all of my players feel adequate despite not actively searching for constant combat.

[BloodSnake'sCha]

Sounds like catnap to me.

[Man_Over_Game]

Sounds like catnap to me.

The thing is, spending a 3 level spell slot to cast on 3 creatures to reduce a Short Rest down to 10 minutes from 60 minutes doesn't have much value. How often would that solution be relevant to be worth the level 3 spell slot?

[BloodSnake'sCha]

The thing is, spending a 3 level spell slot to cast on 3 creatures to reduce a Short Rest down to 10 minutes from 60 minutes doesn't have much value. How often would that solution be relevant to be worth the level 3 spell slot?

Only when you are a warlock with your last spell slot and need to make a quick break.

[Man_Over_Game]

Only when you are a warlock with your last spell slot and need to make a quick break.

Warlocks don't get a third spell slot until level 11. That's 50% of your spell slots until then. I think it'd just be better to find a place where I can afford the extra 50 minutes rather than take a risk with 10.

[BloodSnake'sCha]

Warlocks don't get a third spell slot until level 11. That's 50% of your spell slots until then. I think it'd just be better to find a place where I can afford the extra 50 minutes rather than take a risk with 10.

If you use all your spells in a single fight you will have non for the second one.

You can never know if you will have a safe way to get a short rest.

It is always better to keep a spell slot as a warlock.

[HiveStriker]

The thing is, spending a 3 level spell slot to cast on 3 creatures to reduce a Short Rest down to 10 minutes from 60 minutes doesn't have much value. How often would that solution be relevant to be worth the level 3 spell slot?

Whenever you have a Monk, a Druid, a Warlock, some Cleric, Wizards?
Whenever you are in place you secured enough to take a deep breath, but not enough to stay safe for a whole hour (maybe you managed to barricade a door in a hostile dungeon, maybe you managed to kill close guards of a boss and know for sure he's confident enough that he'll prevail to wait for you? Or maybe simply you're on the clock, and you got into an unexpected fight into which you had to blow many more resources than you wanted because you were traveling towards a big encounter in the first place?)

Sorry if I sound as vexing here, but it seems you have, an unusually (I mean, compared to your usual posts ;)) self-centered point of view here.
As long as you get at least one of those classes, Catnap becomes interesting. If you get two of them, Catnap becomes a must-have. If you get three of them, it's the one spell you have to keep whatever happens.

At level 5, it's a very steep trade-off, but it still may be worth if your tactic for upcoming fight was based on a short-rest ally's resources.
At level 9, it's still a significant chunk of your own power, but it also means Moon Druid is 100% ready again, that Tempest Cleric can still count on its max damage spell, or likewise that the tactic you devised based on a Stunning Strike nova is still a go.
It also means your Land Druid / Wizard pals could restore 4 "units" worth of slots: maybe Druid could refill its Healing Words, maybe Wizard liked its Fireball or Mirror Image or whatever.
In any case, you paid "3 units" to get back 4 of them per relevant ally.
Or, to pick example of Warlock, it's trading 1 3rd level spell for 2*5th level ones.
It's a net added value, it just so happens that it's a kind of "transfer".
In fact, we could say it's a "Life Transference" ability, except for resources and ever-improving cost/benefit ratio. ^^
Oh, and let's not forget about racial or feat features like Inspiring Leader.

I think demonstration is enough: this kind of spell ranges from "situationally good" to "awesome", and its value scales naturally with level, although indirectly.

It's also a simple courtesy in parties that frown upon short rests, usually because most of them are long-rest resource based and thus see no reason to short rest (which is impolite, borderline irrespectful to their short-rest friends, and overall often inefficient, but that's another matter).

At least you can guarantee benefits of a short rest with minimal impact on travel planning, whatever the reason for not stopping for full short rest may be, for those that would otherwise feel crippled and possibly lose interest or fun.

[Tvtyrant]

I would suggest making short rests take longer each time, then a maximum amount before a long rest.

So first short rest could be almost instant, second is 5 minute, then normal length, then you have to take a long rest to rest again.

[JNAProductions]

A houserule I've pondered is allowing three short rests per long rest-one at one minute, one at ten minutes, and one at an hour. They can be taken in any order and can be done alone (Warlock blows both slots in a fight, while the Fighter didn't expend anything? Warlock takes their one minute, Fighter doesn't) or as a party.

*cough cough cough*

Sorry, what was that TVTyrant? :P

[HiveStriker]

*cough cough cough*

Sorry, what was that TVTyrant? :P

I think it's a bit presomptuous to hint that you would be the original bearer of that houserule. :)
Anyone can come up with that idea when considering current short rest is a problem. Also, his version is slightly different from yours, in that his imposes the "order" of varying duration.

With that said, whoemever could say (s)he was the first to publicly post it, I have to say it strikes a nice balance between improving adventure pacing and "limiting" immersion-breaking...

Because, let's be honest, why would it make such a huge difference between short rests? Even if you actually blew much less resources on a later occurence than before the first?
And why then not take into account Constitution modifier, or calculate effective short rest time based on consumption?

That's the main reason why, IF I personally felt there was a problem with short rest, I would probably include another level called a "breather", that you can take once between two rests, giving the same benefits as a regular short rest. You could decide to get another breather, but would suffer one level of Exhaustion for each.

Or I would simply go with Epic Heroism variant rule.
Whatever group prefers.

[djreynolds]

I would suggest making short rests take longer each time, then a maximum amount before a long rest.

So first short rest could be almost instant, second is 5 minute, then normal length, then you have to take a long rest to rest again.

That is good.

The rest system isn't perfect, and sometimes you just cannot rest. Its the challenge inherent in D&D, you are in a dangerous world and you are constantly checking on resources spent, and sometimes the day ends and you haven't used a spell slot... and sometimes you've used up all your resources in your first encounter.

But this idea coupled with the increasing time penalty looks good

[Theodoxus]

Here's what I did, and then added two feats to support it:


Breather: A Breather is a period of brief respite between encounters. So long as the character is not in imminent danger they can spend one Hit Die. A character cannot benefit from another Breather until they've finished a Short or Long Rest.

Restoring spent resources with a Breather Hit Die for Primary Classes:
Barbarian - Can restore a spent use of Rage.
Bard - Can restore a spent use of bardic inspiration.
Cleric - Can restore a spent use of Channel Divinity.
Druid - Can restore a spent use of Wild Shape.
Fighter - Can restore a spent use of Fighting Action Surge.
Monk - Can restore two spent Ki points.
Paladin - Can restore their Lay on Hands pool up to the amount rolled on the Hit Die.
Ranger - Can restore one spent level 1 spell slot.
Rogue - Can restore two spent Healing Surges.
Sorcerer - Can restore two spent Sorcery Points.
Warlock - Can restore one spent spell slot.


Breathe Deep

Benefit: When spending a Hit Die to recover spent resources, you may opt to restore a single use of any class ability that normally recharges on a short rest.
Breathe Deeper

Prerequisite: Breathe Deep
Benefit: You can opt to spend two Hit Dice during a Breather or Short Rest to restore a single use of any class ability that normally recharges on a long rest. Once you do, you can't use this ability again until you've taken a long rest.

[JNAProductions]

I think it's a bit presomptuous to hint that you would be the original bearer of that houserule. :)
Anyone can come up with that idea when considering current short rest is a problem. Also, his version is slightly different from yours, in that his imposes the "order" of varying duration.

With that said, whoemever could say (s)he was the first to publicly post it, I have to say it strikes a nice balance between improving adventure pacing and "limiting" immersion-breaking...

Because, let's be honest, why would it make such a huge difference between short rests? Even if you actually blew much less resources on a later occurence than before the first?
And why then not take into account Constitution modifier, or calculate effective short rest time based on consumption?

That's the main reason why, IF I personally felt there was a problem with short rest, I would probably include another level called a "breather", that you can take once between two rests, giving the same benefits as a regular short rest. You could decide to get another breather, but would suffer one level of Exhaustion for each.

Or I would simply go with Epic Heroism variant rule.
Whatever group prefers.

Oh, I certainly wasn’t the first.

But I just find it funny that you posted the same thing, basically, and got more responses about it than me.

[HiveStriker]

Oh, I certainly wasn’t the first.

But I just find it funny that you posted the same thing, basically, and got more responses about it than me.

Well technically I pointed out another poster which had an idea similar to you.

Mine is very different imo, because it does not vary in time, it's just one new type of rest.
Also, let's be honest, I didn't like it that much because I felt strange that a "breather" would get you the exact same benefits than a full short rest, but I was too lazey to do actual thinking to distribute effects depending on each class.

Which happens to be exactly what Theodoxus did, so thanks to him and congrats for his work, which I consider a big and net improvement over my suggestion.

@Theodoxus just two small critics:
- Barbarian's Rage is a long rest. I'm not sure what actual value you bring by allowing restoration of a spent use, but I'm afraid it's a very big power buff, at least at low levels.
- Rogue: what are Healing Surges??
- Monk: I would possibly push to "WIS mod", so that it scales gracefully with progression and still be overall balanced relatively to total pool. I'm saying that because we are talking about a resource that fully recharges on a regular short rest, so it seems to me it can be fair. Whereas Sorcerer's SP are long-rest, so what you propose for them seems point on.

[DarknessEternal]

Short rest definitely needs work. Some classes are balancing around using 2 per day, but all adventures allow zero.

[Theodoxus]

Well technically I pointed out another poster which had an idea similar to you.

Mine is very different imo, because it does not vary in time, it's just one new type of rest.
Also, let's be honest, I didn't like it that much because I felt strange that a "breather" would get you the exact same benefits than a full short rest, but I was too lazey to do actual thinking to distribute effects depending on each class.

Which happens to be exactly what Theodoxus did, so thanks to him and congrats for his work, which I consider a big and net improvement over my suggestion.

@Theodoxus just two small critics:
- Barbarian's Rage is a long rest. I'm not sure what actual value you bring by allowing restoration of a spent use, but I'm afraid it's a very big power buff, at least at low levels.
- Rogue: what are Healing Surges??
- Monk: I would possibly push to "WIS mod", so that it scales gracefully with progression and still be overall balanced relatively to total pool. I'm saying that because we are talking about a resource that fully recharges on a regular short rest, so it seems to me it can be fair. Whereas Sorcerer's SP are long-rest, so what you propose for them seems point on.

Thank you for the feedback!

My thinking behind Barbarian was 1) they're more likely to want to use HD to heal themselves, (having witnessed most barbi players wanting to be 'topped off' before every fight to have optimal "soak') so having spare hit dice around might not happen. 2) I've always felt that Barbi's have too few rages as is. If they'd copied the PF style round by round instead of up to a full minute, it would have been better. If they'd granted fewer, but made them short rest recharge, that would have been better... 3) Barbarians don't have anything else to spend HD on, outside of healing. Given my feelings on 1 and 2, just seemed like a natural fit.

Rogue - I borrowed Healing Surges from 4th edition. Every class gets a few, usually 6 to 8, per long rest to do a quick self heal. Since rogues don't have a baseline resource to restore, it made the most sense. Allows rogues to be a little less 'squishy', and have allowed players to play more thuggish types, feeling emboldened to melee and take a punch or two. If you have an idea of what rogues might get back instead on a breather, I'm open to it.

Monk - that's actually a good idea, and my monk player who is constantly begging for short rests would appreciate the boost to Ki restoration... consider it changed

[HiveStriker]

Thank you for the feedback!

My thinking behind Barbarian was 1) they're more likely to want to use HD to heal themselves, (having witnessed most barbi players wanting to be 'topped off' before every fight to have optimal "soak') so having spare hit dice around might not happen. 2) I've always felt that Barbi's have too few rages as is. If they'd copied the PF style round by round instead of up to a full minute, it would have been better. If they'd granted fewer, but made them short rest recharge, that would have been better... 3) Barbarians don't have anything else to spend HD on, outside of healing. Given my feelings on 1 and 2, just seemed like a natural fit.

Rogue - I borrowed Healing Surges from 4th edition. Every class gets a few, usually 6 to 8, per long rest to do a quick self heal. Since rogues don't have a baseline resource to restore, it made the most sense. Allows rogues to be a little less 'squishy', and have allowed players to play more thuggish types, feeling emboldened to melee and take a punch or two. If you have an idea of what rogues might get back instead on a breather, I'm open to it.

Monk - that's actually a good idea, and my monk player who is constantly begging for short rests would appreciate the boost to Ki restoration... consider it changed

If you want to make him a small treat, maybe find a way to put Rope Trick and Catnap in party's path, especially the latter. Maybe there would be some "franchise" of NPC providing "Ring of Spell Storing charging" that would know that spell, or maybe a Wizard NPC accompanying... ^^

Also, if your player *REALLY* wants an easy way to get short rests while everyone else in party doesn't want...
Suggest he multiclasses into 2 levels of Druid (Moon while at it). Shape into any innocent-looking familiar, step and gripe on a friend's shoulder or get carried in some "niche", and here you go! You rest while party travels.

Of course, it also works if simply party has any caster willing to use a Polymorph to achieve the same effect (decent trade-off from level 9 onwards), or if party lets Monk behind with a Phantom Steed in a Ring of Spell Storing to catch up later. ^^

[Tvtyrant]

*cough cough cough*

Sorry, what was that TVTyrant? :P

Sorry, I didn't feel like reading through the whole thread.

I prefer escalating to by choice. When working out or hiking I can recover quickly at first, and as I add more exercises it takes longer and I get less back. I force my heart rate up over 170 when running, and recover from a 30-60 minute run in 1-5 minutes. After weights it takes a lot longer, by the time I have done all my ab work I'm pretty burnt. I am mostly recovered by a couple hours later, but then if I have to chase a bus it takes me a disproportionate amount of time to recover from a short run.

Also the inability to fully recover without sleep eventually forces you to take a long rest, which in a 20 mile hike becomes really apparent. It also prevents coffeelock junk.