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  1. - Top - End - #61
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by d20srd
    Swift Actions
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    A swift action consumes a very small amount of time, but represents a larger expenditure of effort and energy than a free action. You can perform one swift action per turn without affecting your ability to perform other actions. In that regard, a swift action is like a free action. However, you can perform only a single swift action per turn, regardless of what other actions you take. You can take a swift action any time you would normally be allowed to take a free action. Swift actions usually involve spellcasting or the activation of magic items; many characters (especially those who don't cast spells) never have an opportunity to take a swift action.

    Casting a quickened spell is a swift action. In addition, casting any spell with a casting time of 1 swift action is a swift action.

    Casting a spell with a casting time of 1 swift action does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
    As far as Iron Heroes goes, it may be a good plan, but it's not something we can use under the Open Game License. All we can use from published materials, is what's in the d20srd. With that in mind, it makes more sense to homebrew our ideas up so we can have our own, unique working system. Obviously, you should feel free to run an Avatar D20 game anyway you see fit, but we're trying to build from the ground up. My suggestion, as you've mentioned regional feats a few times, is to sit down and write up a couple of ideas for Water Tribe, Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Air Nomad specific feats, and maybe even include some feats for the Foggy Swamp Tribe and the Sun Warriors.

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  2. - Top - End - #62
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    ErrantX: Sorry about that, to my shame I have yet to see that episode...

    Copyright: At what point does something become copyright infringement? Since we already have a kind of unique system here would it be OK to draw on the ideas of things outside of the SRD? And just adapt them to our system?

    Sandbending: Well, since I have Sandstorm, a great starting place for Sandbending seeds, I'll work on building some for this system and post them when they're done.

    Since we're not sure yet as to whether or not there's going to be a Sandbender PrC, or just a feat that allows Sandbending, or something else, here are the seeds I've got.

    Sand Shield
    Base DC: 15
    As a move aciton, this technique creates several thin bands of sand that swirl and twist around the Earthbender, helping to deflect incoming attacks. The sand does not make it harder to see the Earthbender, but it grants her a +4 deflection bonus to her AC. Maintaining the Sand Shield for more than two rounds gives a -4 penalty to all Earthbending checks until the Earthbender ends the seed, increasing by -1 every two turns. If this penalty actually causes an Earthbender to fail a Earthbending check, she may choose to end the seed and remove the penalty at that time. An Earthbender can concentrate on maintaining this seed as a Swift action. Their must be at least a handful of sand within the Earthbender's bending range for this technique to be accomplished.

    Dust Devil
    Base DC: 20
    By manipulating the sand the Earthbender creates a whirlwind made entirely of sand and loose dirt. The Dust Devil is 5 feet in radius and 5 feet in height. 5 feet may be added to the height or width by adding +4 to the DC. Anytime a Dust Devil enters a creatures square, that creature takes 2d6 damage, Reflex save half.

    The movement of the swirl sand is equal to the Earthbender's base movement with good maneuverability and may move it as a swift action. The Swirl Sand’s base must always be touching the ground. The Sandbender must concentrate on a Dust Devil to keep it active. The Sandbender must make a Concentration check (DC 10+damage taken) whenever he takes damage from an attack. If the Sandbender is unable to maintain Concentration for any reason the Dust Devil collapses into normal sand. Creatures within the Swirl Sand have concealment, while those on the other side have total concealment.

    The Dust Devil is also used to power the Sand Skids sailed by Sandbenders (see below).

    Wall of Sand
    Base DC: 15

    The Sandbender causes a small wall of churning sand to shoot out of any large amount of sand within her bending range as a standard action. The wall is 1 inch thick, plus one more inch per every 2 points by which the Earthbending check exceeds the DC. The wall’s area is one five-foot square, but the Earthbender can add another such square by increasing the Earthbending DC by +4. Or, you may double the walls area by halving its thickness. The wall may be moved with another Earthbending check at the base DC. The Earthbender pushes the wall back 20 ft in a straight line, plus another 5 ft for every 4 points by which the Earthbending check exceeds the DC. The Sandbender must maintain Concentration to keep the churning wall of sand active. The Sandbender must make a Concentration check (DC 10+damage taken) whenever he takes damage from an attack. If the Sandbender is unable to maintain Concentration for any reason the Wall of Sand collapses into normal sand.

    The wall cannot be made so that it occupies the same space as a creature. No form of attack can be made to harm a Wall of Sand directly, but each 5ft section has 2 hit points per inch of thickness for determining whether an attack passes through it. It essentially absorbs damage, so attacks must deal more damage than the wall has hit points to have any effect on a target on the other side of the wall.
    Breaches in the wall close immediately after the attack that passes through. The sand blocks line of effect, and creatures on opposite sides have total concealment from one another. Moving through the wall requires a strength check (DC 10+ creators Earthbender levels). Those who fail must stop in the space from which they attempted to enter the wall. Any creature that attempts to pass through a Wall of Sand must also make a Reflex save (DC 15) or be blinded for 1d4+1 rounds. A creature passing through the roiling wall does not leave a usable breach for others. All flames are extinguished if carried through the wall.

    Control Sand
    Base DC: 10
    Area: Dust or sand in a volume of 10
    ft./level wide by 10 ft./level long
    by 2 ft./level deep
    Duration: Concentration
    Saving Throw: None; see text

    Depending on the version you choose, control sand raises or lowers fine particles of material, such as dust or sand. For either version, the Sandbender can reduce one horizontal dimension by half and double the other horizontal dimension.
    Lower Sand: This effect causes sand to reduce its depth by as much as 2 feet per caster level, to a minimum depth of 1 inch. The dust and sand is lowered within a square-shaped depression whose sides are up to 10 feet long per caster level. In extremely large and deep sand piles, such as a sand dune, the spell creates a pit that sweeps creatures downward (without dealing damage), putting them at risk and rendering them unable to leave by normal movement for the duration of the spell.
    Raise Sand: This effect causes dust and sand to rise in height, just as the lower sand version causes it to lower. Creatures and objects on top of the dust or sand are raised along with the top level of sand.

    Sand Blast
    Base DC: 25?
    The Earth Bender can cause a fistful of sand to spray with enough force to strip flesh from bone and scour surfaces in a 20ft cone shaped burst. Any one within the area takes 1d8 points of damage per 2 Earthbender levels (Maximum 10d8) with a Reflex save for Half damage (DC 16+ Wisdom Modifier). Do not divide damage from sand scour by four when applying it to objects.

    Sand Skid: Large vehicle; Sea(Sand)worthiness +4;
    Shiphandling +3; Speed 60 ft. (good); Overall AC
    –3; Hull sections 40 (sink 10 sections); Section hp 30
    (hardness 5), Section AC 3; Ram 4d6; Space 90 ft. by
    30 ft.; Height 30 ft. (draft 0 ft.); Complement
    5; Cargo 7 tons; Cost 36,000 gp.

    Edit: Fixed damage and maneuverability issues.
    Last edited by Dolphin Safe; 2008-01-09 at 11:42 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #63
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    2 D8 still seems like a lot. whats wrong with d6? It shouldn't be able to do more damage than the average small elemental, the DC's only 20. You should probably add stuff about how a sandbender maintains and moves a dust devil, and how difficult that would be.
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-09 at 10:39 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    To be honest, I'm not sure how I feel about the sandbending seeds. In and of themselves they look pretty good. However, all of them with the exception of Dust Devil are completely unprecedented. Again, the only seeds we see sandbenders use in the show are Dust Devil, Steady Stance, and some sort of sand geyser. That's all we've got. I still support waiting to see if we learn anything else before moving ahead with a sandbender class.

    I also caution against using the Arms & Equipment or Stormwrack stat block for the Sand Sailors, mainly because those books aren't in the Open Game License, and are therefore only available to those who purchase them. When we do get around to dealing with ships, we'll have to come up with our own stats.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Well, ok, but a lot of the abilities in the Bending Study feat were unprecedented as well, and there was no problem with them...

    Actually, I was wondering about a few of the normal seeds and where they came from: Sound Waves, Golem, Immobilize: Arrest, Metalbending: Crush, Mist: Figment, Ice Shards: Melee, Armor, and Blizzard: Ice Storm.

    If these were all shown in the show and I just can't remember or missed them, just say so. If not, I'm wondering how they came to be...?
    Last edited by Dolphin Safe; 2008-01-10 at 12:32 AM.
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  6. - Top - End - #66
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    A lot of those forms... well actually don't have a real precedent in the show, but are some extrapolations from I guess pretty strong sources and forms. To me, some are just more for utility, I guess... really interesting, and almost too specific to actually be a form and had to be a seed. Seriously, though, Golem has never been shown, but it's something doable, but is so unwieldy as a form, that it's a seed instead.

    There's a few more seeds I wish that existed, mostly things that have to deal with bloodbending, and not the whole puppet thing. Personally, I think that Bloodbender could soon easily become a whole prestige class, as there is a healing waters prestige class... sort of, not sure if it was ever finished. But.. that's been sort of shot down. Here's an idea of seeds for what I think would fall under bloodbender:

    Body of Water
    DC Varies
    A Bloodbender may effect the flow of blood and other bodily fluids that they may pose a serious impediment to the target. The target must make a Fort Save (10 + half levels of waterbender and bloodbender + Wisdom mod) or suffer the effect; on a successful save, the effect is negated. For every 5 that the base DC is surpassed, it adds a +1 to the Save DC.
    Sickened DC 20: The target is sickened for 1d4 rounds
    Nauseated DC 25: Target is nauseated for 1d4 rounds
    Stunned DC 15: Target is stunned for 1 round

    Muddled Mind
    DC Varies
    The Bloodbender can also move the fluids of the nervous system to incur sensory deprivations and muddle thoughts. The target must make a Fort Save (10 + half levels of waterbender and bloodbender + Wisdom mod) or suffer the effect; on a successful save, the effect is negated. For every 5 that the base DC is surpassed, it adds a +1 to the Save DC.
    Blind or Deaf DC 25: Causes subject to be blind or deaf for 2d4 rounds
    Dazed DC 10: Target is Dazed for 1 round

    Midnight Falls
    DC Varies
    The Bloodbender may also as a final act cause the subjects body to shutdown, rendering it tired, or useless. The target must make a Fort Save (10 + half levels of waterbender and bloodbender + Wisdom mod) or suffer the effect; on a successful save, the effect is negated. For every 5 that the base DC is surpassed, it adds a +1 to the Save DC.
    Fatigue DC 30: The subject becomes fatigued
    Exhaustion DC 35: The Subject becomes exhausted
    Unconscious DC 40: The Target is unconsious

    But these are besides the point.

    Oh yeah, reading through the PDF, there are some either redundancies about the Healing Water Seeds and some of the seeds of the Disciple of Healing Waters, such Major Wounds, and the main use of Panacea. I figured it should be brought up here since, it's more about bending practices and the seeds themselves.

    I also don't quite like the way Bloodbending is done, as in the Ep. "Puppetmaster", Hama is easily controlling multiple mice. For Hama to control one mouse it seems, she would have to make a 50 bending check... to control the 5 mice she was controlling... she would have to make a 70 check. I doubt even with the full moon she was capable of a 70 check... but either way, a 70 check to control 5 mice? That seems a bit out of line there.

    Bending Study
    They all work out really well I think, except for the one that reduces the penalty to deflect attacking for firebenders. Why not just take the penalty away completely? I mean, they do have to use a feat to do so, and in RP terms are enlightened to that aspect of how the elements work. If you got rid of the penalty completely, then I think that the feat would have more value, as it is, the Water Study feat is probably the juiciest for a lot of benders, especially that neglected firebender.
    Last edited by Ceiling009; 2008-01-10 at 06:25 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #67
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    As far as Iron Heroes goes, it may be a good plan, but it's not something we can use under the Open Game License. All we can use from published materials, is what's in the d20srd. With that in mind, it makes more sense to homebrew our ideas up so we can have our own, unique working system. Obviously, you should feel free to run an Avatar D20 game anyway you see fit, but we're trying to build from the ground up. My suggestion, as you've mentioned regional feats a few times, is to sit down and write up a couple of ideas for Water Tribe, Fire Nation, Earth Kingdom, and Air Nomad specific feats, and maybe even include some feats for the Foggy Swamp Tribe and the Sun Warriors.

    Peace,
    -X
    I'll get right on it, but I think I'll do Racial traits instead of feats I think it will work better most reginal feats tend to suck except one or two
    Last edited by Elathron; 2008-01-10 at 09:03 AM.

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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by Dolphin Safe View Post
    Well, ok, but a lot of the abilities in the Bending Study feat were unprecedented as well, and there was no problem with them...
    True, and I won't deny being a little bit uncomfortable with the inconsitancy. However, the consensus of the group is to include them, and, where reasonable, consensus comes before strict accuracy. Since the beginning, accurately representing the show has been one of my priorities, but I also realize that this is a group project.

    In regards to the sandbender's specifically, I apologize if I sounded harsh. Such was not my intention. I do like the seeds. They're good adaptations of some of the Sandstorm content (one of my favorite books, by the way) and they do fit with what sandbenders could do. When I think about it, I'm more worried about lack of general information about sandbending than I am about the specific seeds. We don't really know if sandbenders can bend normal earth, or to what extent. Should we represent them as rogue-ish benders or stick with the monk/fighter-like feel of the earthbender? What earthbending seeds are they capable of using? Can they use any airbending seeds? What's the difference between their ability to bend sand and that of a normal earthbender? We really only see Toph and the sandbenders bending sand, and Toph's inability to bend effectively could easily be explained by the limits of her tremorsense rather than any innate inability to bend sand.

    Those are my most pressing concerns about sandbending and the main reasons I support keeping it on the back burner until it's clear we need to extrapolate or we have more information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dolphin Safe View Post
    Actually, I was wondering about a few of the normal seeds and where they came from: Sound Waves, Golem, Immobilize: Arrest, Metalbending: Crush, Mist: Figment, Ice Shards: Melee, Armor, and Blizzard: Ice Storm.

    If these were all shown in the show and I just can't remember or missed them, just say so. If not, I'm wondering how they came to be...?
    I'll grant that not all of these seeds are directly depicted. Here are some screenshots, though:
    • Immobilize (arrest) - from The Winter Solstice, Part I - We might need get rid of this form now that the Strength DC's scale with class level. This was mostly to provide an immobilization option for lower-level earthbenders.
    • Golem - from The Siege of the North, Part II - at least, provided inspiration for Golem
    • Mist (figment) - from The Fortuneteller
    • Ice Shards (Weapon) - from The Cave of Two Lovers - this reminds me, I have to update Ice Shards on the website
    • Armor - from The Crossroads of Destiny

    I can't find anything for Sound Waves, Metalbending (crush),and Blizzard (ice storm). I know that Aang has demonstrated some control over sound on multiple occasions (even if it's only yelling really loud), and that Metalbending (crush) was something of a concession to make Metalbending a more attractive seed. Perhaps that moment in The Day of Black Sun when Toph traps the Dai Lee agent in a girder... Finally, the gaang is seen making snow in Sokka's Master, though not an ice storm. Again, I think this is a creative interpretation.

    I hope that helps. Again, I'm sorry for the apparent inconsistancies and for sounding harsh.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I made some changes to Waterbending Study and to Airbending Study. With water I changed the Earth ability to Circular Attack but only with Earth. For air I reduced the Firebender's deflect penalty to +0.

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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I don't think we need any bloodbending seeds beyond puppets, mostly because that's all we see in the show, and she could only do it at the full moon. And, since Katara managed to do it when she'd never done it before, the DC should have a lower base, say 30, + x per y HD the creature has. I think to make it doable yet safeguard against it being overpowered, the DC can be lowered if the seed explicitly states that it can only be performed under a full moon.

    And whats wrong with giving earth a normal circular attack with the waterbending study? if anything, it would be easier to maintain a chunk of earth in a circular attack than it would be water, just swinging the thing around like a sling shot. It makes sense, as an earth bender studying water would learn about tides and gravity and such, it would work like an orbit around the bender.
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 12:49 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by Pirate_King View Post
    And whats wrong with giving earth a normal circular attack with the waterbending study? if anything, it would be easier to maintain a chunk of earth in a circular attack than it would be water, just swinging the thing around like a sling shot. It makes sense, as an earth bender studying water would learn about tides and gravity and such, it would work like an orbit around the bender.
    That's because they're not waterbenders, they're earthbenders. They've simply learned a trick from the waterbender, hence why they're not as good at it. Otherwise it would be more unbalancing.

    -X
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Now that I've sat down and statted out two of the main characters of the show on the iconic character thread (both Aang and Toph, considering Zuko or Azula next), it occurs to me that Earthbenders (and probably to some extent Firebenders) are not getting enough seeds. I had to buy 4 extra seeds to just get all the seeds that Toph has demonstrated proficiency with on the show. While this may be alright, I'd propose to increase the seeds to be 1 plus 1 seed per 2 levels, or 1 + half your level, and make that equal across the board for all benders. As it stands, we have Waterbenders with 11, Earthbenders with 9, Firebenders with 8, and Airbenders with 11. So I'd at least give all of them 11. Whatcha think?

    -X
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    you could balance it in other ways, maybe by giving them a penalty to the reflex save, or make them unable to make as many deflect bending attempts. Given the way a circular attack works, the physics of it only working against earth attacks doesn't really make sense. When a water bender does a circular attack, it's just bringing the water around them to deflect the attack, then using that same water for a waterblast after it orbits the bender using the momentum from the deflection. To do the same thing with earth, perhaps take a penalty to the attack roll since earth is heavier or something, but to make it work only against earth attacks? That doesn't make sense. That's more like a contested bending on the rocks thrown by an opposing earthbenders blast

    note: it's not the same as redirect lighting, because that's a redirection of someone else's attack, not a re-use of the substance used in a deflection.
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 01:51 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by Pirate_King View Post
    note: it's not the same as redirect lighting, because that's a redirection of someone else's attack, not a re-use of the substance used in a deflection.
    I disagree entirely. Someone fires an earthblast at, say, Toph. We'll say for argument's sake she has the Waterbending Study feat. So, say, the Boulder fires an earthblast at her and she uses the earthbender circular attack, the earthblast comes at her and she takes control of it with her circular attack and then fires it right back. Redirect lightning is the same way, Ozai fires at Zuko, Zuko directs the lightning through his body (away from his heart) and then channels the exact same lightning bolt back out the other side and redirects it towards a new target/away from himself. Zuko cannot make lightning, this is abundantly clear, so in that situation, it had to be Ozai's lightning.

    I am personally against the earthbender circular attack existing in the first place, as that's what firebenders technically have (more or less). I prefer the earthswim ability. Waterbenders use the material that they blocked with for the blast, earthbenders deflecting earthbending could simply just try to take control of the material directly to block it or (as we've seen) use their hands and feet to deflect it. Why couldn't they just go the step farther and use the exact same material from an enemy earthblast to make their counter attack?

    -X
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I don't think earthbenders should have circular attack, at best, that earth swim ability is one of the better ideas. I'm trying to rack up ideas that would be water, but done with earth... Hmm, but instead of earth swim exactly, you can double your speed with the tunnel seed, and extend the distance of the earth teleport seed? It somehow gives the earthbender greater maneuverability, and really makes the feat valuable; while not infringing on anything else.

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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Quote Originally Posted by ErrantX View Post
    Waterbenders use the material that they blocked with for the blast, earthbenders deflecting earthbending could simply just try to take control of the material directly to block it or (as we've seen) use their hands and feet to deflect it. Why couldn't they just go the step farther and use the exact same material from an enemy earthblast to make their counter attack?

    -X
    With the rules for contested bending and move a rock, it's almost as if they could do that anyway. Why make it a feat? The swim thing wouldn't make sense anyway, if we get rid of the waterbender's swim speed, as we probably should.

    I feel as though an earth bender who studied water bending could do this, with a penalty since earth is heavier and not as pliable as water


    A fire bender couldn't do that, because their element couldn't work that way. Still, they can use water bending concepts of motion to do this:
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 02:31 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I'm with X on the earthbending circular attack debate. First, giving earthbenders circular attack that's usable in any circumstance, even with penalties, is more powerful and more versatile than other abilities that these feats grant. Second, there's a precedent (albeit a tenuous one) for this specific type of circular attack, whereas there isn't for any other uses. Third, using the same techniques with earth that waterbenders use with water doesn't make sense to me. Earthbending is rooted and (in almost all cases) directly connected to the earth, whereas waterbending is much more fluid. Fourth (and most important) is the philosophical argument. The bending disciplines are rooted in a martial philosophy that governs the moves that they are able to use. Earthbending's philosophy is one of stability and rootedness. Even with the increased fluidity that waterbending study brings, it can't overcome the inherent rootedness of earthbending on a philosophical level enough to allow circular attacks with impunity.

    Also, even though it was originally my idea, I'm not sold on circular attack for earthbenders. The more I think about it, the more ambivalent I feel about the whole issue of circular attack versus earthswim (though I'm not a huge fan of the name "earthswim," which conjures up images of someone doing the front crawl through a stone floor). Only the Redirect Lightening ability is precedented, so the rest of it is just extrapolation. Gaaah! I hate this flip-flopping, but I really don't know which I support anymore.

    On the issue of seeds known, I really can't say why Eighth_Seraph decided to alter the number when he started work on the version 2.0 benders. The original version had all benders knowing the same number of forms. I'm fine with either, though (if he's still around, and not in any intending to bring him out of semi-retirement) I'd like to hear Eighth_Seraph's explanation.

    My (only semi-coherent) thoughts.
    Last edited by Mephibosheth; 2008-01-10 at 02:35 PM.
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  18. - Top - End - #78
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    What exactly would earth swim do that can't already be done with earth jump or tunneling seeds? And isn't the whole point of the bending study to do something that isn't normal for the bender? And I can sort of see how a circular attack would work for only earth, now that I've been crudely illustrating things; it'd be just like redirect lighting, only rather than pass through the person, the opponent's earthblast would swing around her. It still just seems like contested bending, though contested bending requires a move action, so... it couldn't be done on someone elses turn? how does contested bending actually work, anyway?
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 02:44 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    How about we say it gives them the ability to "swim through the earth", i.e. the burrow special ability. Waterbending Study teaches earthbenders to Burrow at the listed speed. How's that sound?

    As far as stepping on the toes of Tunnel and Earth Jump, let's talk it out.
    • Earth Jump: Using this seed, an Earthbender can transport herself through the earth to any point within 25 feet. The Earthbender’s starting and ending points must be connected by a contiguous area of earth or stone at least 5 feet thick at all points. For every 5 by which the Earthbender’s skill check exceeds the base DC, the distance she can travel increases by 5 feet. Additionally, by increasing the base DC by 20, an Earthbender can use this seed as a Move action.
    That's just a single dimension door like effect in which the earthbender goes into the ground in one place and comes up in another, short distance. Burrowing would allow you to travel for multiple rounds with speed underground. Tremorsense would be very helpful here.

    • Tunnel: By digging directly into the earth, in which case she begins by making a hole (as above) and then making it deeper, or making it horizontal beneath the ground. The earth moved aside by this seed is compacted around the sides of the excavation, making a noticeable bulge in the ground if the tunnel is within 5 ft of the surface. Tunneling through stone doubles the Earthbending DC, and an earthbender can choose to collapse the tunnel through the use of Move a Rock.
    This allows an earthbender to travel for distance and time AND bring other people. Burrowing doesn't allow someone to follow you with ease.

    -X
    Last edited by ErrantX; 2008-01-10 at 02:53 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    That does make sense in terms of difference with the seeds, but it doesn't make sense to give them that ability if we take away a waterbender's swim speed. They should learn something from the fluidity of a waterbender's movements.

    perhaps, in addition to taking a penalty to the reflex save involved in circular attack, the damage is also reduced to a d4, to reflect the earth having a chunk of it flung loose by the attack that it just deflected? not that an earth bender's reflex save is all that great, anyway.

    on a side note, I came up with a way to create a practiced bending feat as was suggested earlier.

    Practiced Bending[bending]
    Prerequisite: Knowledge(bending) 4 ranks, member of any bending class
    Benefit: You continue to gain bending seeds even when multi-classing for up to 4 levels.
    example: A human firebender 4/ martial artist 3 normally only knows 2 firebending seeds. Using this feat, the character would gain the seeds of a 7th level firebender, granting him 3 seeds. Should he take another level in martial artist, he would gain a fourth seed as though he attained 8th level in firebender.

    Sort of a draft, I didn't think a bender should gain any other benefits, as that would defeat the disadvantage of multiclassing.
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 03:09 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I second the loss of the swim ability of Waterbenders and let them have Water Walk as a class ability; without the trappings of a seed. I mean, it seems all earthbenders can stick to stone walls pretty easily, Airbenders can easily fly, but if Water Walk were to turn into a class ability, please don't make it seed or have the same trappings as thus.

    Since that, "earth swim" would kinda be moot. I mean, I think it's the better of the two options so far presented. But, instead of circular attack, how about something like "Splitting the Flow". Earth, being the rooted immovable rock it is, learns that sooner or later, you can split anything, just like the flow of water. Possibly as a mechanical advantage, it ups the Head-on Defense Ability. Or something to the nature.

  22. - Top - End - #82
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I like the sound of that, the only problem is, an earth bender doesn't get head-on defense until 7th level. Still, this concept is probably more likely to reap some less controversial mechanics. I'll think on ways to use it.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    What about something that builds off the ability of earthbenders to do this (it's kinda hard to see, but this is immediately after Aang splits a "surface to air rock" in half with his staff)? Perhaps, in the process of splitting the earthbending attack, they can redirect it in a limited way, making it hit enemies behind them and slightly to the side, dealing the same damage as the original attack would have. It's a relatively circumstantial ability that could be quite useful and fits with both the earthbending philosophy and the waterbending philosophy.

    Edit: I'm not too worried about the feat only being available late. Redirect Lightning is pretty useless until you're high enough level where your enemies can shoot lightning.

    Just an idea. What do you think?
    Last edited by Mephibosheth; 2008-01-10 at 03:21 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    it's kinda cool, but incredibly consequential, especially if it only works against earth attacks. perhaps broaden it, the effect of bending an angled earth that does a deflect bending and has a chance of redirecting and kind of attack? it might be a bit complicated, though:

    Whenever an Earthbender with the waterbending study feat makes a deflect bending attack, she may take a reflex save to shape the earth she uses to make the deflection. If her reflex save beats her opposed attack roll (the roll she made for the deflect bending, not the opponents initial attack), she may redirect the attack towards any creature in an arc( insert how to describe the angles illustrated below. I'm not so good at that.), dealing the damage that would have been dealt to the bender, reflex negates. The range of this redirection is the remainder of its original range after it reaches the earthbender.

    The little curvy brown line is shaped earth that the bender pulled up from the ground. I suppose this is more flow changing than flow splitting, but an attack would have to have a certain intensity to be split and still do damage.

    Who's lovin' my illustrations? Are they not awesome and clarifying at the same time?
    Last edited by Pirate_King; 2008-01-10 at 09:08 PM.
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    I think the big problem we may be running into with the Bending Study feat is that we all have good ideas of what the elements look like individually, but not when two are used together. For instance, what comes to mind when you think of an Earthbender who has lived among Waterbenders?

    Perhaps, knowledge of the movements and philosophy behind these combinations will help us determine what kinds of mechanics to utilize. So, I've taken the liberty of finding some video's of Kung Fu styles I think might be a good representation of particular combinations.

    Earthbending+Waterbending: Paochui, a style that emphasizes rootedness and strength, but also fluidity and flexibility. A style that is one moment supple and flowing and the next hard and unyeilding.

    Earthbending+Firebending: Tiger Crane Style: A style that has strong, steady stances, but also intricate, ferocious strikes and jumps, imitating the ferocity and hardness of a tiger and the grace and speed of a crane. It also places special importance in breathing techniques and mental focus.

    If these are useful, I can post more later. And hey, even if they aren't, its KUNG FU!
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  26. - Top - End - #86
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    tiger crane is part of the hung gar kung fu that earth bending is already based on. where's the added fire? cool videos, though
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  27. - Top - End - #87
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Maybe a simple fix, would be that maybe to focus on Earth's neutral jing, and give the feat more or less a bonus to deflect attempts... or! Since earth to me actually is more defensive than water or air, give them an extra deflect attempt, at a -2 penalty (penalty can be larger), almost like an anti-flurry attempt.

  28. - Top - End - #88
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    Tiger Crane is part of Hung Gar, but it is never really demonstrated in the show. The movements in the show are mostly based on the Taming the Tiger form or Iron Wire Fist, but you rarely ever see the Crane side of Hung Gar in the show, the part that jumps around and has graceful, expansive movements. They deemphasize the ferocity of the Tiger forms too.

    Anyways, the extra deflect attempt sounds good, but I think the Circular Attack would actually be a good idea. The concept of being rooted would actually help perform a Circular Attack, because your body serves as a base for the rotation of the attack. Like what Pirate was saying about the earth blast orbiting the Benders body and swinging back around.

    I imagine a Bender with the lower body in a solid Horse Stance and their upper body pivoting at the hips to bend the Earthblast around them. Seems both Earthbender in nature with a dash of Waterbender thrown in from the Feat.
    Last edited by Dolphin Safe; 2008-01-11 at 02:07 AM.
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  29. - Top - End - #89
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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    The thing is that, I'm with Errant and Meph on how I don't like Circular Attack to be given to the Earthbender. It's both a philosophy aspect to the Art, and what I think is devaluing the 10th level ability of the Waterbender. The thing about Earthbending, I think, is that it's more like the mountain; mountains don't attack back, but they do a darn good job staying in one place. With Waterbending ideals and the Philosophy of Earthbending, an extra deflect attack makes more sense to me rather than Circular Attack ability, as the "no matter how much the river pushes, the mountain always pushes it aside"; type enlightenment seems more... well Earthy.

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    Default Re: [Avatar d20 Project] Bending System and Bending Classes - Thread II

    so how about my beautifully illustrated change flow?
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