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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Hi all.

    As you may recall, I asked for help fortifying a cottage a few months back, against an army of redcaps.

    We have gotten ourselves into an all new mess, of the original party in the redcap cottage, only the carmendine monk2/swashbuckler 3 has survived (he now has three levels of warblade, armed with a spike chain). The rest of the party includes a cleric 6 (Finder Wyvernspur, skalykind renewal domains), a barb4/fighter2, a duskblade 6, a dragon shaman 6, a bard 6/lyric thaumaturge 2, a druid 7.

    While tracking down kidnappers, we stumbled across a black dragon cult who just killed an adult copper dragon. Enraged, our dragon shaman(whose totem dragon is copper) charges and we support him. From our vantage point, we can see about fourteen black dragon spawn. We thought it was easy pickings. Then the sh*t hit the fan when these things started pouring out of the walls. So far, each round has added about six more black dragon spawn and we have killed a few. Most of us at less than fifty percent of our resources. Lastly, a mini-bbeg may have been introduced because someone dispelled my bard's haste on the party.

    Round breakdown

    1. Party charges in. Barb/Fighter kills two black dragon spawn with cleave. Dragon shaman places a lingering/clinging line of acid across the battle field to limit enemy mobility; shifts from aura of senses to aura of energy shield. My bard puts up inspirational boost and inspire courage. Warblade proceeds to the center for some tactical advantage. Cleric casts bane, one of them fails its save *eyeroll.* Druid starts summoning two dire wolves. Duskblade casts true strike. Black dragonspawn attack.

    2 Six more black dragonspawn arrive. Bard casts haste. Barb/Fighter fells four more. Warblade trips two in within reach, two wolves trip four more; they now risk aoo's from warblade if the stand up. druid turns into bear, casts Bite of the wereboar. Cleric and dragon shaman deal miserable damage. Duskblade attacks, sorta. Black dragonspawn.

    3 Six more black dragon spawn arrive. Barb Fighter drops three, warblade drops one. Wolves and warblade trip three more. Bard trips six more with Balagharn's Iron Thunder Horn. Druid casts Magic fang. Cleric casts close wounds and cure serious wounds on barb fighter who was critted with a power attack on a falchion. Dragon shaman flails; duskblade hits. Black Dragonspawn attack.

    4 Six more dragon spawn arrive. Barb fighter down to 14 hitpoints, drops four baddies. Warblade has so far taken only 7 hitpints, trips one more guy. One wolf dies, other wolf down to 19 hitpoints; last wolf trips again. Bard g'elsewhere chants Druid into safety; druid summons three more wolves. Dragon Shaman breathes a clinging line of electricity. Duskbalde hits. SOMETHING DISPELS OUR HASTE!

    5 no more black dragonspawn arrive. yay! Bard casts haste but to no effect (ENEMY CASTER??? Where?) Barb/fighter, warblade, dragon shaman, duskblade and drops one. Blackdragon spawn swarm over barb/fighter, cleric heals. Second Dire wolf dies. Druids with three fresh dire wolves charge in.

    GAME DISMISSED

    Primary damage dealer is at less than half hitpoints. Primary arcane is out of third level spells, has four more level one's, three more level two's. primary divine does not know how to select spells, has a bunch of healing spells and low level debuffs and searing lights. Duskblade is doing miserable damage for some odd reason. Druid has yet to use his personal buffs because he has been summoning or casting. There is still eleven black dragon spawn AND an unseen enemy caster.

    Everyone except the druid and his wolves are back to back surrounded by black dragonspawn.

    It's looking grim but we know we can win this, we just don't know how... How what could y'all good folks of the playground suggest to win this dead man's hand?
    Last edited by cupkeyk; 2008-01-22 at 01:25 PM.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Irreverent Fool's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    "If you kill us, you'll never know where the rest of the dragon's treasure is hidden!"

    It'll buy you some time. Barring that, the druid turns into something to get away and reincarnates you all later .
    On DMPCs: "Remember, nothing will spice up your campaign quicker than long descriptions of NPC’s doing spectacular stuff while the players sit around and watch." -Shamus Young, DM of the Rings
    Divide By Zero: Irreverent Fool, you are my hero.

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    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Imp

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Out of curiosity, are these just baby black dragons or blackspawn like what is in the Monster Manual IV?

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Monster manual 4 black dragonspawn
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Iku Rex's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Wait, you have a 14th level character?

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iku Rex View Post
    Wait, you have a 14th level character?
    Oops that's bard 6 LM 2
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    What spells do your casters have prepared/known?
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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Spoiler
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    cleric

    bane
    healthful rest
    bless(spent as cure)
    divine favor
    comprehend languages
    sanctuary
    charm person(domain)

    lesser restoration(spent as cure)
    close wounds(spent)
    close wounds(spent)
    close wounds(spent)
    lesser restoration(domain)

    Searing Light(spent)
    Searing Light(spent)
    Searing Light (spent cure)
    Remove Disease (domain)

    bard
    1(four remaining)
    Inspirational Boost
    Balagharn’s Iron Horn
    Distort Speech
    Improvisation

    2(six remaining)
    Celerity
    Bigby’s Slapping Hand
    Reveille
    Tasha’s Hideous Laughter

    3(none remaining)Haste
    Fly
    G’Elsewhere Chant


    I will try to ask the druid for his spell list, but its based off the CO board's druid handbook/revisited.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Is running an option? If nothing else, it'll either get you away from the hidden baddie or force him to expose himself (unless he's invisible).
    Praise me not for my born strengths, but for what I make of them.
    Scorn me not for my born faults, but for my failure to overcome them.

    The Practical Monk's Manuscript

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Imp

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    I really don't see any other option but to run. If it was just the black dragonspawn (I'm presuming raiders, because 26 of anything else would have stomped your party) I'd give you even-ish odds but then there's that spellcaster. Whoever he is, he's the one who killed the adult copper, 'cause a bunch of non-flying CR4 dragonspawn sure didn't, which puts him around CR10-11, which would be darn tough for your party without the dragonspawn. On the plus side, if he just killed an adult copper, he's probably fairly drained (if he's not you're doomed anyway). So yeah, time to run.

    I'd say your best bet is to have the druid go central and try to hold the dragonspawn while the fighter/cleric/anyone else really hurt make a break for it. He can probably hold for a round or two because he's got the wolfs, the buffs, he hasn't really been hit yet, and he's a freakin' druid. If the chain fighter isn't too hurt I'd have him help (with dragonspawn at 60hp a pop I'd focus more on tripping/slowing than damage) and have the bard use Tasha's Hideous Laughter on any dragonspawn that just has to be removed for the fighter/etc to get away. Once the wounded have gotten a headstart, have everyone run for it (remember that if you really need to get out of dodge, the druid can shapechange into a horse as a standard action, chainfighter/bard can jump on with readied actions, then the druid/horse can move out of there (I'm pretty sure that works)). Hopefully the summoned animals left behind can buy you another round. I doubt the spellcaster will give much chase if he's already drained from killing the copper. The only real danger is if he casts a Web spell or something.

    There's a real risk because most of your team moves at 30ft and the dragonspawn go at 40ft (and know it). If they give chase, you best bet is to find a treeline or hill, set a quick ambush, drop one of them with focused long range fire, then hold them off with summoned animals while you all run again. If all else fails, the cleric's sanctuary might be worth a shot.

    I will say, there's a compelling argument in favor of circling back and attacking again. If your Barb/Fighter is cleaving through 4 dragonspawn, there's a decent chance he could one shot an arcane caster. And if this is an arcane caster who has shot most of daily spells on a copper, this could be your best chance. On the other hand, if it's a cleric, you're better off waiting for another day. Anyway to tell what kind of caster you're dealing with would be really valuable. Just be much sneakier than your dragon shaman was.

    As a caution, there's a chance that there is no spellcaster. I think you're right about it, it's certainly the most logical explanation, but DMs come up with odd things all the time and the fact that he's only been blocking your magic (instead of offensive magic or focusing on the druid) and has only blocked haste spells (even if you haven't cast anything else) strikes me as odd.

    On the metagame level, I think your DM is trying to get you to run. I imagine he wanted you guys to observe the cult instead of charging in headfirst, especially since you were already on another mission. His first instinct was to just throw numbers at you (I can't imagine he wanted to run a combat with 20+ creatures) and when that didn't work, he used psychology. A good portion of your group seems pretty optimized and when there was an indication of a spellcaster, you guys freaked out (reread your post, these things are close to killing your Barb/Fighter and the most critical thing to you is that someone is dispelling your hastes). If so, props to him because he knew just which of your psychological buttons to press. Then again, I don't really know your group but it seems reasonable to me.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    On a metagame level, the dragon shaman realized that he wanted to be a dragonborn of bahamut instead of human. We guess the dead dragon was the dm's way of giving him the copper's scales for his rite.

    Hmmmn, and before the game is dismissed he told us the xp we are going to expect so I have the idea he either wants us dead dead dead or to fight it through.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    GreataxeFighterGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    It sounds like your haste wasn't dispelled, but that someone cast Slow on all of you. I think the two cancel each other out while they're both still in effect. And you can't really dispel one without dispeling both, as far as I know.

    If you can figure out who cast slow, and drop him, I believe the slow spell will end, and you'll all be hasted again.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Voyager_I's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Slow allows a save, and it simply would have dispelled the first Haste. Countering/Dispelling the second Haste would have required another Slow, and I believe an opposed check.

    Also, regardless of your DM's plans, running is always a viable option. I mean, sometimes it isn't, but you'll know when that is, and it doesn't sound like there's a locked door behind you...
    Last edited by Voyager_I; 2008-01-23 at 04:51 PM.
    Praise me not for my born strengths, but for what I make of them.
    Scorn me not for my born faults, but for my failure to overcome them.

    The Practical Monk's Manuscript

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    would be nice to know what the druid has left for spells. As well as the duskblade, since they can dabble into a few utility spells here and there.

    Tasha's and Bigby's if your desperate. Horn spell is nice to drop some at least.
    Spontaneus heals from the Cleric.
    Get the Duskblade some new dice :P
    All out defense from the fighter/bar till he gets a few heals?
    Have the druid summon more pets in front of you to prevent the dragon spawn from hitting.
    *shammy have anything of use available? Drop some heals?

    Also any useful magic items/trinkets/potions? Nows the time to use em :P

    If your trying to run for it, Bullrush/overun if there not to tightly packed.
    Have the druid cast more pets to cover your backs, and see if anyone has any slowing spells left i.e grease from duskblade???

    After that keep dropping things in the way and hope they give up chase.
    Last edited by Reijura; 2008-01-23 at 05:16 PM.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    If he has not yet, have barb fighter rage. This will give him a extra 12 hit points, which should help you live. If Barb fighter has already raged, get out. Have dragon shaman project arua of vitality, and use healing touch on Barb to full use. Have druid use his forth level spell slot to cast flame strike, If not prepared, summon a dire wolverine in the middle of their forces, which makes them get a AoO. Dire wolvorine gets pissed and kills a lot. As for the dispelling, they probably have a new toy that messes with spells. A caster is not a huge problem, as he has nothing good left, besides some Slows and hastes, probably to counter the slow effect of a copper dragon and to slow down the copper, I doubt anything that could kill a copper and leave no ally corpses has used most spells. If any evocation spells are used on you, run! I think you can win this though, 11 is not that much.




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

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  16. - Top - End - #16
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    The Druid's spell list:
    Spoiler
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    1
    sandblast
    spider hand
    lesser vigor
    lesser vigor
    Lion's Charge

    2
    Embrace the Wild
    Halo of Sand
    Listening Lorecall
    Creeping Cold

    3
    Greater Magic Fang(cast)
    Vigor(cast)
    Mass Lesser Vigor(cast)

    4
    Bite of the Wereboar(cast)
    Bite of the Wereboar(cast)


    The Duskblade has so far only cast Truestrike, Flaming Hands and Bigby's Tripping Hand.
    Last edited by cupkeyk; 2008-01-23 at 06:32 PM.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Quote Originally Posted by cupkeyk View Post
    The Druid's spell list:
    Spoiler
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    1
    sandblast
    spider hand
    lesser vigor
    lesser vigor
    Lion's Charge

    2
    Embrace the Wild
    Halo of Sand
    Listening Lorecall
    Creeping Cold

    3
    Greater Magic Fang(cast)
    Vigor(cast)
    Mass Lesser Vigor(cast)

    4
    Bite of the Wereboar(cast)
    Bite of the Wereboar(cast)


    The Duskblade has so far only cast Truestrike, Flaming Hands and Bigby's Tripping Hand.
    That changes things. Have the druid cast embrace of the wild on himself, then wildshape and kill stuff. Has the barbarian raged yet?




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

    - captain McCallister

    my stats
    LG Human Paladin 1/ Sorcerer 1

    Ability Scores:
    Str- 15
    Dex- 14
    Con- 16
    Int- 17
    Wis- 13
    Cha- 16



    Quote Originally Posted by Brickwall View Post
    Thog is more than a character - Thog is a universal truth
    Smart Thog by me, Smart Thog

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Yes the Barbarian has raged already at the start of combat.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Alright, whats his con modifier, and does he have the extend rage feat?




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

    - captain McCallister

    my stats
    LG Human Paladin 1/ Sorcerer 1

    Ability Scores:
    Str- 15
    Dex- 14
    Con- 16
    Int- 17
    Wis- 13
    Cha- 16



    Quote Originally Posted by Brickwall View Post
    Thog is more than a character - Thog is a universal truth
    Smart Thog by me, Smart Thog

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    yes he has extend rage. con mod = +3
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Before rage or after? either way it does not matter, you still have 5 or 7 rounds left. Has the dragon shaman used his vitality touch yet? Also, what arua's does he have?




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

    - captain McCallister

    my stats
    LG Human Paladin 1/ Sorcerer 1

    Ability Scores:
    Str- 15
    Dex- 14
    Con- 16
    Int- 17
    Wis- 13
    Cha- 16



    Quote Originally Posted by Brickwall View Post
    Thog is more than a character - Thog is a universal truth
    Smart Thog by me, Smart Thog

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Yes the Dragon shaman has consumed his touch of vitality. He has only six of it anyway, charisma 12.

    His auras are presense, senses, vigor and energy shield.
    My mother says: those on fire should roll.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Last question. Does he have the double arua projection feat? If so then project energy shield and vigor, if not, then just vigor. If more dragon spawn come out next turn, fight your way out.




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

    - captain McCallister

    my stats
    LG Human Paladin 1/ Sorcerer 1

    Ability Scores:
    Str- 15
    Dex- 14
    Con- 16
    Int- 17
    Wis- 13
    Cha- 16



    Quote Originally Posted by Brickwall View Post
    Thog is more than a character - Thog is a universal truth
    Smart Thog by me, Smart Thog

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Troll in the Playground
     
    GreenSorcererElf

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Double Draconic Aura requires character level 12th to take, so he won't be having that.

    I'll agree with those that suggest retreating if possible. I'll also agree that it's probably a creature with a slow ability removing your haste abilities. I don't think you have to fail your save for the slow to remove the haste, and if you do the DM might not know that. But a full blown caster is possible too. Either way you should be getting gone. If the terrain allows running, those that can should go full out, and hope the spawn get bored. If nothing else, any extra distance they have to cover to get to you will be more time to get ready for them, especially if they string themselves out.

    You don't have many options for covering your retreat: just leave any summons you've got to slow down what they can, drop an iron horn to knock over any that get past that if you need to. I like the idea of putting the slow people on the druid in horse form.

    It sounds like the druid's pretty buffed up. If you feel like living on the edge you might be able to fight it out if he gets in there right now while someone heals the barbarian. I see you have celerity, so if the caster/slow-er comes out to get at you you can hit them with something before a retreat, or you could provide a finishing attack of sorts if you only need one more round to kill them, it affords you a lot of flexibility. There's also the fact that the dragon shaman character may not want to leave, since you're trying to avenge his totem dragon at the moment.
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  25. - Top - End - #25
    Orc in the Playground
     
    smart thog's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dead Man's Hand: Party walk's into a black dragon cult.

    Your idea might work, but it probably won't. I would only do that if a caster actually starts blowing things up, OR, 6 more dragon spawn come out of the walls.




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    Yarr, and I would have gotten away with it to. If I was smarter.

    - captain McCallister

    my stats
    LG Human Paladin 1/ Sorcerer 1

    Ability Scores:
    Str- 15
    Dex- 14
    Con- 16
    Int- 17
    Wis- 13
    Cha- 16



    Quote Originally Posted by Brickwall View Post
    Thog is more than a character - Thog is a universal truth
    Smart Thog by me, Smart Thog

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