Mind Flayers and Diet

[Tetsubo 57]

Mind Flayers are carnivores that primarily consume humanoid brains. The dread "brain extraction" attack. Does anyone know if they can survive on non-humanoid brains, such as animals? Essentially a "vegetarian" Mind Flayer. I am just wondering what a good aligned Mind Flayer would do to survive...

[Cuddly]

Take vow of poverty?
Ring of sustenance?
Psionic powers?

[Fax Celestis]

I believe they can survive on less intelligent brains; they're just less tasty and filling.

[Icewalker]

Yeah. Or you could be a crazed 'righteous crusader' type, and eat the brains of the evil, although many would argue that that is evil. I'm not sure myself.

I'm with Fax: any brains are fine, intelligent ones are just far preferable.

[Azerian Kelimon]

Get a minor creation at will item and make brains, I guess.

[Fax Celestis]

Get a minor creation at will item and make brains, I guess.

Can't make animal materials with minor creation, sorry. I suppose you could make a brain-shaped rock, though. Or a tree that grows brains.

[Cuddly]

Yeah. Or you could be a crazed 'righteous crusader' type, and eat the brains of the evil, although many would argue that that is evil. I'm not sure myself.

I'm with Fax: any brains are fine, intelligent ones are just far preferable.

Hey, waste not want not. And you can donate the saved rations to orphans.

[Mewtarthio]

I suppose it really depends on the definition of "Good" the campaign setting uses. If it's a strictly utilitarian definition (eg The rights of an individual can be sacrificed for the good of the whole), you could theoretically extract brains from unwilling, screaming peasants provided you use that nourishment to kill a Pit Fiend.

Generally, of course, that sort of thing won't fly in most worlds. I would expect, however, that you'd always have the option of extracting brains from foes in combat.

[The_Snark]

Or be a psionic mind flayer and take Psionic Sustenance as one of your powers. You don't even need to be an exceptional (PC) mind flayer to do this.

[Fax Celestis]

Hey, waste not want not. And you can donate the saved rations to orphans.

...or to cats.

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[FoE]

I would think that mind flayers would have to consume the brains of non-sentient creatures if only because they would not have easy access to sentient beings. That said, I would think they would prefer the brains of sentient organisms, just like vampires prefer the blood of humans to that of pigs.

[Krusty Kobold]

orc and goblin brains may taste like crud but if it follows the attack first, without making a righteous decree of your impending destruction, ask questions later method I say eat it up. if your party is gonna kill it anyways... you know... waste not want not.

[Prometheus]

I had always assumed that a Mind Flayer's psionic power-like abilities, telepathy, racial power points, and mind blast ability were a result of their consumption of sentient brains (definitely the mind blast, as the HP Lovecraft explanation for it would be that they are broadcasting the terrible secrets of tortured brains at their target). If they feasted on only animals, or replaced their need for sustainence with magic, than they would still survive, but would lose their special abilities. That, of course, would defeat the point of wanting to be a mind flayer.

Neutral works surprisingly well as an alignment in these types of things (I've had a vampire in a similar situation). As long as the party allows the mind flayer to extract the brains of recently defeated foes, than the mind flayer should have a sufficient stock of brains that satisfy both the craving for brains and the intelligent kind (the latter they would need less frequently I'd imagine). They, of course, might still want sustainence magic for dry spells

[Tetsubo 57]

Or be a psionic mind flayer and take Psionic Sustenance as one of your powers. You don't even need to be an exceptional (PC) mind flayer to do this.

That is an excellent idea. I haven't looked at the Psionic Powers list in ages. Might be time for a reread.

[Tetsubo 57]

I suppose it really depends on the definition of "Good" the campaign setting uses. If it's a strictly utilitarian definition (eg The rights of an individual can be sacrificed for the good of the whole), you could theoretically extract brains from unwilling, screaming peasants provided you use that nourishment to kill a Pit Fiend.

Generally, of course, that sort of thing won't fly in most worlds. I would expect, however, that you'd always have the option of extracting brains from foes in combat.

Not to turn this into an alignment thread... but that doesn't fit my personal nor gaming definitions as "good". Peasants are people too... :)

[Worira]

A mind flayer only actually needs one brain a month, though they aim for one a week. As far as I can tell, they have to be sentient, or at least are far preferable. Orcs will do, but are like unflavoured porridge. Brains aren't actually all they eat, though.

[Collin152]

A mind flayer only actually needs one brain a month, though they aim for one a week. As far as I can tell, they have to be sentient, or at least are far preferable. Orcs will do, but are like unflavoured porridge. Brains aren't actually all they eat, though.

Hey, don't go dissin' mah porrige!

[DM_Rotate]

As Woira said, according to LoM, illithids can get a lot of their physical nutrition from organs and such. Brains, however, are their most efficient food, since brains contain both all the nutrition they need plus the psionic energy they feed off of.

Thus, I think you could make a "vegetarian" illithid by making him survive off of a variety of different organs taken from slain enemies.

[Pronounceable]

Can't make animal materials with minor creation, sorry. I suppose you could make a brain-shaped rock, though. Or a tree that grows brains.

Is it me, or is that an awesome image?

[Tetsubo 57]

Is it me, or is that an awesome image?

Well, since the Mind Flayers think of all sentient life (other then themselves) as food... I could see a Mind Flayer program of warping humanoids via Psionics and transforming them into such an aberration.

[Fuzzy_Juan]

Who says a Mind Flayer who was 'good' wouldn't eat brains of sentient creatures? To them, brains are food as much as steak is food to us. We keep cows and sheep and other creatures herded together and slaughter them to feed our need/desire for meat...is that evil? (aside from some PETA wack jobs, most would say no). In the wild an animal is at least as intelligent than it's prey...and they are not 'evil'.

So...a creature that devours brains...they do so just for food. To them, humans and such are so much as cows. Creatures of inferior intellect that can be herded, controlled, raised, used for labor, and killed when time comes to use them for food. There in a nutshell, you have their abduction, slavery, and murder of humanoids...similar to the way we catch, domesticate, use animals for labor, breed them, and then eat them...is it evil? No...even ants grow plants, and cultivate herds of aphids for food...

A mind flayer 'enslaving' groups of humanoids they find in 'the wild', and using them for whatever before eating them is only 'evil' to us...to them...it is just normal activity.

I am sure there are some 'PETA' style Mind Flayers...perhaps METH (mind Flayers for the Ethical treatment of Humanoids) who see the eating of humanoid brains to be an abomination...that obviously these poor humanoids are smart and know what is going on and that herding them around is just barbaric and cruel...these Mind Flayers might swear off brains and seek other methods of nutrition...perhaps magical or psionic fare, perhaps only consuming the brains of animals or giant insects...depends on what would sustain an Illithid.

Remember, to them we are as smart as animals that learn tricks...a few are even smart enough to learn rudimentary telepathy and handle it with the same grace as a gorrilla does sign language and can communicate...to the at least. does it matter to them...probably not...they know through their own telepathy that all living things are capable of communication with each other...some more than others...Only...more brain power to them is just like picking the fattest hogs or the beffiest cows...you pick the food that tastes the best and cultivate it.

[VanBuren]

Who says a Mind Flayer who was 'good' wouldn't eat brains of sentient creatures? To them, brains are food as much as steak is food to us. We keep cows and sheep and other creatures herded together and slaughter them to feed our need/desire for meat...is that evil? (aside from some PETA wack jobs, most would say no). In the wild an animal is at least as intelligent than it's prey...and they are not 'evil'.

So...a creature that devours brains...they do so just for food. To them, humans and such are so much as cows. Creatures of inferior intellect that can be herded, controlled, raised, used for labor, and killed when time comes to use them for food. There in a nutshell, you have their abduction, slavery, and murder of humanoids...similar to the way we catch, domesticate, use animals for labor, breed them, and then eat them...is it evil? No...even ants grow plants, and cultivate herds of aphids for food...

A mind flayer 'enslaving' groups of humanoids they find in 'the wild', and using them for whatever before eating them is only 'evil' to us...to them...it is just normal activity.

I am sure there are some 'PETA' style Mind Flayers...perhaps METH (mind Flayers for the Ethical treatment of Humanoids) who see the eating of humanoid brains to be an abomination...that obviously these poor humanoids are smart and know what is going on and that herding them around is just barbaric and cruel...these Mind Flayers might swear off brains and seek other methods of nutrition...perhaps magical or psionic fare, perhaps only consuming the brains of animals or giant insects...depends on what would sustain an Illithid.

Remember, to them we are as smart as animals that learn tricks...a few are even smart enough to learn rudimentary telepathy and handle it with the same grace as a gorrilla does sign language and can communicate...to the at least. does it matter to them...probably not...they know through their own telepathy that all living things are capable of communication with each other...some more than others...Only...more brain power to them is just like picking the fattest hogs or the beffiest cows...you pick the food that tastes the best and cultivate it.

Good and Evil aren't relative in DnD.

[Fuzzy_Juan]

no, they are not relative...but the argument holds...Mind Flayers are 'evil' in that they take pleasure in the fact that they torment and kill things that fear them. They get a kick out of it. It's not just the nurishment, they enjoy all the things they do.

What I was saying was that a mind flayer could be 'good' and still enslave and eat humanoids as long as they weren't malicious about it. Afterall...they need to eat...it isn't their fault humanoid brains are made of food.Even if they didn't get off on all the death misery and destruction they would still eat humanoid brains if only to keep themselves alive and to feed their families/community.

The brain eating alone does not make them evil...what makes them evil is all the crap they do and with glee. They feel themselves superior to the lesser creatures and unlike elves who see 'lesser races' as misguided children, mind flayers see humanoids as food at best, and as objects to be used and destroyed as a verminous pest that makes funny noises when you do 'this' at worst.

[Xuincherguixe]

I think it was mentioned already, but Mind Flayers do eat more than just brains.

The reason why they need to eat brains, is because of the way they take over bodies. Those bodies require certain energies, which normally would be produced by a brain. But the Mind Flayer's don't produce them.

So they eat people's brains.

Also, herding people tends to result in what more or less is pretty bland and flavorless. Wild Humanoid has a lot more "flavor".

Adventurers in this example are a delicacy.

[Khanderas]

Mind flayers live off brains. Brains are mostly just fat.
If only the nutrients were important, they could just live off bacongrease.

Therefore: They need psionic sustenence, taken from a living, intelligent brain. (note: psionic sustenence does not equal psionic abilities).
So you need intelligent brains to feed from.

Now eating brains is a natural function for Illithids so with the same "logic" I don't count lions as evil, eating brains because your body requires it for you to survive, is not evil inherently. Intelligent or not. Remember: killing stuff is NOT evil in DnD. It is the reason why you kill that (sometimes) pushes your alignment one way or the other.


I remember a spelljammer novel series, where there was an illithid who was a nice guy, had a charmed kobold around. The protagonist asked him who that was and got the reply, "he is my food" (followed by the explanation he needed that to live, though he understood other humanoids were somewhat revolted). One day that kobold was not around anymore....
Many awesome points to that guy. Ethriss ? Something like that was his name. When they were boarded by pirates he ate one of the pirates IN BATTLE !

Annd im off rambling agin. Short answer: Needs intelligent brains.

[Armoury99]

.... or maybe just a Ring of Regeneration and a devoted slave? Admittedly, its like eating the same meal over and over again, but if you're a member of METH you just have to make sacrifices.

[hewhosaysfish]

Why has no-one suggested Hydras yet?

And to throw my 2cp into the alignment discussion:
Suppose I was dying of liver failure and couldn't find a donor. A willing donor, that is. Suppose I killed the guy across the room from me, the skinny guy in the red football shirt, and took his liver (ignoring questions such as tissue compatibility for the sake of the analogy).
Would this be evil or not? I am doing it to stay alive. Just one person killed and I can live out the rest of my natural span. I'm not don't have any malice towards him. Can wanting to save your own life be evil?

Now suppose it wasn't a case of one "donor" equals one natural span; suppose one "donor" equalled one month; suppose I knew the to sustain my existence, it would require one death every ~30 days. Does the fact that this process becomes "normal" make it more or less evil?

Substitute brains for liver where appropriate.

[Reinboom]

I would consider the above evil, in that it is inherently selfish while still taking something against another person's free will that also jeopardizes the other person's standing.

You are also making a comparison value for human life. (I'm worth more than they are).

Then ends isn't even justifying the means here.
1 living while many die.

A justified end would be the eater letting themselves die so other live.
1 dead while many live.

It is difficult for me to conceive how that would not be evil.

[PlatinumJester]

I think these brains would be OK to eat:




OR

[MorkaisChosen]

How's this for an idea- Mind Flayer Paladin who exacts justice by eating brains?

In fact he doesn't even need to be a Paladin, just a Judge-type (Vigilante, maybe...). You are an evil murderer, therefore I eat your brains.