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2008-03-30, 01:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Or, more subtly, just be lured into getting lost, going in the wrong direction, even attacking their own units in a state of confusion... the likelihood of this is less if you have good scouts. Greater if the good scouts keep having to deal with traps and deadfalls. Still greater if you are under orders to move fast and attack at once when you find the enemy.
Anyone who has ever tried spelunking will know how easy it is for such mistakes to happen. Fighting in tunnels or catacombs makes all the dangers of spelunking even worse. I admit, I personally would be very, very wary of any attack plan that involved tunnel fighting as its main thrust -- though that is why this is such a good trap: it suggests that little or no tunnel fighting is needed at all.My Avatar is Vinnie Doombats from the Erfworld comic written by Rob Balder and illustrated by Jamie Noguchi.
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2008-03-30, 02:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Sorry, I mis-typed. I MEANT, that the other Coalition leaders would be worried that, since they don't even have Arkentools, Attuned or not, that the one who does, might get a bit paranoid about having his one advantage taken away from him. Add paranoia to that list of possible signs of insanity.
When we find out who has the other Arkentool, Attuned or not, that they should be wary of Ansom as well, for fear that he might pull another "Kill Stanley the Worm" campaign.
The other Coalition Leaders might be willing to continue with the siege, but maybe not necessarily under Ansom's leadership. Of course, the ensuing struggle for just who gets to calls the shots is a weakness Parson can exploit as well. XD
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2008-03-30, 05:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
The whole royalty themed outburst does certainly sound inflammatory, but it may not be much of an issue for the coalition. Looking at the list of members in the coalition... we see that Sofaking and Unaroyal are probably ruled by royalty. We also know that Jetstone, CharlesComm, Transylvito and the Barbarians aren't going anywhere. Foxmud, Hobbittm, the Marbits and Elves are the only ones who could be offended by these comments and leave.
Personally I doubt that the Marbits would leave, they have figured large in all the depictions of battle since the beginning. From a metaplot perspective, it feels unlikely that the Marbits will suddenly quit fighting their hated enemy because of Ansom's outburst. Anyway the Marbits have already split off for the tunnels. So if Foxmud, Hobbittm and all the elves leave that's only a bit over 1000 units, and only ~10% of the whole coalition. So the maximum of damage that could be caused by the whole royalty superiority thing looks to be minimal compared to the size of the opponent.
Every little bit helps, but goading Ansom into this outburst to disrupt the coalition doesn't strike me as being the kind of thing that Parson can be seriously considering as a path to victory. Rather he wants to goad Ansom into doing something stupid. I'm not sure if the stupid thing is going to be going over the walls or going through the tunnels. It's a huge sacrifice for Parson, since he is now known to the enemy. His being unknown was a valuable asset, he was a wild card that they didn't know was around. It's almost ensured that Vinny will connect the dots and figure out that the trap previously laid was conceived by Parson and Vinny will realize that Parson is a skilled strategist. That realization by Vinny could change the outcome of Parson's psychological attack.
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2008-03-30, 07:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
True. And Parson couldn't even obscure his intelligence, because if it didn't come across to Ansom that his opinion was worth something, Ansom wouldn't have been motivated to contradict him. I doubt if some random gobwin said "Stanley is better than Ansom!", that Ansom would get into a philosophical argument with it. Ansom would just whip out his pliers and apply force.
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2008-03-30, 07:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
This is how the other royals may hear Ansom's comments:
"I am directly descended from those whom the Titans chose to rule. I am stronger, smarter and more morally fit than those of a lesser station. It is my privilege, and my burden to lead both man and beast!"
Although they may, in fact, be subordinate in the campaign, they would not care for it being emphasized. As for being lumped in with the beast...well!
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2008-03-30, 07:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Why am I expecting Parson to end this thinkagram with something equivalent to a challenge to a duel(except with two nations as opposed to two people)?
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2008-03-30, 08:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
That seems to be exactly what Ansom wanted to do, and precisely the reaction that Parson wanted to provoke. Random gobwins do not send thinkogram messages, but if one somehow had---and made th same statements as Parson---then I think Ansom might react the same way. In Ansom's eyes Parson is some random up-jumped twoll.
Illimir orc monk avatar by yours, truly. He seems to be looking for his cigarettes.
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2008-03-30, 08:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Actually the how big of a role the marbits have been playing could be a reason for them leading... think about it this way, why is that we've seen the Marbits playing such a large role, but not the jetstones? From what we've seen of this war, so far it seems like the marbits and the elves are the ones being put on the front lines and their groups may have suffered the greatest losses. Essentially, this little outburst, Ansom annoucing that they are lower then them, may get them wondering "why isn't there more Jetstone's on the front lines"... They may come to think that Ansom is treating them like cannon fodder and refuse to go along with it any longer... they took a lot of losses fighting and may refuse to take anymore; or atleast refuse to be put on the front lines causing massive tension between them and Ansom since they are refusing to follow his lead... If Ansom gives them an order they don't like and they question it and he reacts in a poor way, it could lead them to getting fed up... They will leave and let the rest of the alliance finish off Stanely saying that they did more than their fair share already
And the Marbits and elves make up about 30% of Ansom's forces... And that's just in terms of numbers; depending on how the troops are being used, that 30% could actually be a very important 30%... for instance, without the elves they may not have many good units to provide archery cover for the seige, or heal their fallen units; also, the elves and marbtis were orginally gonna be at the front (elves on the true frontlines,a nd the marbits providing a distraction and getting the enemies attention)... So while they may only provide 30% in numbers, they could have 50% importance; especially if they no longer have as much use for the seige... and before they lost the siege engines, Ansom said that they had 4 times the force they needed to take the city... but loosing the 40% of their seige along with 30% of their troops will seriously lower their advantage. With Ansom angry and making rash decisions, and Parson making a good plan, the more even the fight becomes the better it does for Parson... the number of Jetstones alone tells use that the Alliance will always hold the numerical advantage and that Parson will need to use his strong defenses and good tactics to win this asymmetrical battle
furtharmore, the loss of the Marbits and elves may make the other sides start to question Ansom's leadership and so forth; especially if in his rage Ansom makes serious mistakes... they may want to get rid of Stanely, but they won't want to do it along side him
Also, all the Marbits have not all moved for the tunnels yet... we have only heard of scouts in there... since they are still planning their attack on the city, the marbit and elf leaders are likely with Ansom right now helping him come to a decision on how they should attack.
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2008-03-30, 08:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Personally I doubt that the Marbits would leave, they have figured large in all the depictions of battle since the beginning. From a metaplot perspective, it feels unlikely that the Marbits will suddenly quit fighting their hated enemy because of Ansom's outburst. Anyway the Marbits have already split off for the tunnels. So if Foxmud, Hobbittm and all the elves leave that's only a bit over 1000 units, and only ~10% of the whole coalition. So the maximum of damage that could be caused by the whole royalty superiority thing looks to be minimal compared to the size of the opponent.
Anyway the marbits leaving won't be a problem there are forces to spare so whatever. Even less so for Foxmud and Hobbittm, we haven't seen anything important from them so they either brought token forces or really are just some warlords for a higher bonus, so they don't matter either.
Although the elves leaving will be problematic
1) These guys were guarding the siege with their archers, so I'm assuming they were the best for the job. New archers will need to be used so the attacking force will be severely reduced in terms of archers and the siege will be really vulnerable to dwagons; possibly making the tunnels look really inviting. Remember the coalition knows of the foolamancer so the dwagons might be veiled, as far as they know.
2) The elves were going in first; I doubt replacements will be volunteering, so more strain will be placed on the coalition.
3) Also they were providing healing the coalition will be weakened with out healers so the loss there might be bigger than it looks. Also it will be harder to convince people to risk important units if there is no healing. Worse, warlords won't be able to re-enter if they become to damaged to continue.
I'm not too sure about the elves deserting the coalition entirely, the eager elves will probably just demand to go in before the Marbits, and the healers might just stay out of enemy hexes, but still heal.
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2008-03-30, 08:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
When (if) Ansom gets a chance to cool his head a little, he's going to have to be thinking, “Who the boop was he, where did he come from, and why wasn't Stanley on the other end of the line?” Up until now he's been assuming that he's been dealing with a military idiot and acting accordingly. This could send him one of two ways: it could make him follow a more cautious and thoughtful approach, or it could give him the panicky feeling that he's completely misjudged things and dealing with a power he doesn't understand. His ego is unlikely to let him respond rationally to that.
The final thought, that he's dealing with a subordinate rather than the Worm directly, could also push him one step further over the edge:
Ansom: Put me through to Stanley the Worm, right now!
Parson: Can't do that. Stanley's busy with more important things. He doesn't think this little brawl of yours is worth his time.
Ansom: Choose your weapon, cur!
Parson: d20s at ten paces.
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2008-03-30, 09:54 PM (ISO 8601)
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2008-03-31, 12:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
tunnel fight is always a nice option.
we don't know how many units can stay on a single hex, but this may give some advantage to sizemore's stack, since he'll fight some even stacks...and his stack is kinda beefed up!
hope wanda heal next turn...her bonus to the uncroaked could turn tables in a tunnel fight.
sizemore can dig thru solid rock...he can backstab weakened running warlords
tunnelfight turns assymetric warfare into somthing more "fair"
I'm still waiting fot the "you are paying to have an true arkentool on your side" from parson...
A gump inside ansom's ego!Last edited by zeropsm; 2008-03-31 at 12:46 AM. Reason: typos
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2008-03-31, 09:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Well, technically, Parson and Ansom are equals in that each is the Chief Warlord of his side. Ansom wouldn't see it that way, though, since he's also a royal and heir to Jetstone.
Reminding Ansom that Stanley considers himself superior because he has the attuned Arkenhammer plays right into this. I get the impression that Ansom's motivation isn't merely a general objection to jumped-up commoner Overlords, or even to ones who got there by (sorta) regicide -- it's to prove that Stanley is NOT favored over him in the eyes of the Titans, Stanley's attuned Arkenhammer and his own non-attuned Arkenpliers notwithstanding.
If so, Parson is now facing an angry man with something to prove. Perhaps he's the one favored by the Titans....
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2008-03-31, 10:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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2008-03-31, 11:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Hmm... well, it seems like the Arkendish is common knowledge, but it is possible it is not. Perhaps GK has knowledge of it (Maggie certainly does), but Ansom does not?
Alternatively, Charlie might be a royal but just chooses to use the title 'Overlord' instead of 'King'.
Extrapolating to a tin-foil-hat level, perhaps Charlie is neither male nor female, and thus chooses the non-gendered 'Overlord' instead of the gender-laden 'King' or 'Queen'.
Or, on an equally far-fetched level, Charlie is not the original Charlie, who was a King named Charles, but is actually a female (royal or not) trying to maintain the illusion that good ol' Charles is still in power, but can't bear to refer to herself as 'King'.
Or, perhaps for marketing reasons, Charlie uses whichever title is more likely to go over well with whomever he is talking to... 'King' for Ansom, 'Overlord' for Parson. This is much more likely than the above ideas.
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2008-03-31, 11:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Simple really; Charlie hasn't been boasting that being Attuned to an arkentool makes him better than a royal... He may very wall have been giving royalty a decent amount of respect and doesn't act like he is above them, or even on their level possibly; a good businessman tells his potential clients what they want to hear. Charlie doesn't act like he's better than royalty so Ansom has nothing to prove in regards to him
Stanely on the other hand as been smacking around his holy-ness even more than Ansom smacks arounds his royalty... this is why Ansom feels he must put down Stanely and shut him up, but doesn't do as much for Charlie... however, the fact that Chalrie is a non-royal and attuned to and arkentool could be a reason as to why Ansom was hesitant to hire his services; not wanting to rely on a non-royal weilder of an attuned arkentool
but is actually a female (royal or not) trying to maintain the illusion that good ol' Charles is still in power, but can't bear to refer to herself as 'King'.Last edited by slayerx; 2008-03-31 at 11:11 AM.
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2008-03-31, 11:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Because we have no evidence that Charlie is male?
Even 'Charlescomm -> Charles -> male' is weak tea because we have no evidence (other than a similarity in names) that Charlescomm is actually named after the character that we know as Charlie...
Charlescomm is probably named after Charlie, and Charlie is probably male. That's why I labeled my theory as far-fetched to a tin-foil-hat level.
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2008-03-31, 01:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Another good point about luring them into the tunnels is that the only part of the coalition forces that get a Tunnel fighting bonus is the Marbits. While we know that gobwins get the same tunnel fighting bonus, but one would expect that the golëms would get the same if not better by being commanded by a Dirtmancer.
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2008-03-31, 01:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
it seems to me the real reason for the anti-Stanley collation is because he wants to collect all the arkentools. In most games of that type, collecting all the mcguffins would by itself equate to winning the game, with a different cinematic ending.
if theres anything suggesting that whoever has all the tools will easily rule the world... well, that would be enough reason to stop anyone from doing it. especially anyone who already proved they know how to attune.
in the short run... i expect the next strip will conclude the call, and then focus on the alliance reaction. its probably going to be a response which is based in part on information that was not available to us before, but will be revealed at that time.
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2008-03-31, 02:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
My theory about Charlie in regards to Ansom is the fact that Charlie is 'merely' a high-priced mercenary unit.
Charlie apparently makes no airs about wanting a kingdom/side. He has a base of operations, yes, but that seems to be the extent of his 'presence' on the map. Ansom has no problem with Charlie because Charlie ... isn't trying to act like a royal. Charlie's just there, to be hired and led until the contract's over.
Stanley, however, is leading a side. He's 'pretending' to be a Royal. He's expanding his territory. He's attacking other sides. He's not led by a Royal.May you get EXACTLY what you wish for.
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2008-03-31, 06:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
My guess is he's trying too goad Ansom into charging AT THE HEAD of his forces into a trap, based on what he knows of Ansom's personality.
It's possible thoguht that what might happen is that Ansom will challenge Parson too some kind of duel, just like someone else further up in the thread suggested. Is it a coincidence that Parson's weapon is due too be completed soon? how much damage could Ansom do with the pliers to Parson who is NOT uncroaked.
Capturing Ansom would give him leverage too call off the war.. maybe... and capturing another tool would win him Stanley's good graces (or near enough). i dont see Stanley dying in some random air fight miles away.
I'm sure that no matter what Parson manages to do, Stanley will claim the glory.
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2008-03-31, 11:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Actually, they already seem to know Stanley is gone. Jillian is definitely sure of it, to the point of stating "I had him." Add to that that Ansom agrees with that assessment, and he shouldn't be surprised that somebody else is in charge. As to the competence of the leader, Stanley doesn't exactly have a good record for choosing warlords. (The last one was named Manpower the Temporary for crying out loud!)
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2008-03-31, 11:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Even if Parson shatters the alliance without taking any casualties, reducing it to just Jetstone v. Gobwin Knob, he's still outnumbered nearly 5 to 1. (Ansom initially thought that a 3 or 4 to 1 advantage was enough, but that was probably based on the bonuses to Marbits & Elves.) Maybe an even battle.
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2008-04-01, 12:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Why would Ansom's feelings be “equally bad” toward him? As far as we know, Charlie has never (a) committed or been suspected of regicide; (b) been involved in croakamancy and similar evil-oriented things; (c) captured and tortured Jillian; (d) the points slayerx made. Maybe loads of other things, too. Being common and having the Arkenhammer aren't the only reasons Ansom hates Stanley.
Also, recall that Ansom didn't bring Charlie into the alliance until Parson started doing bad things to the siege train. While that may have been partly due to the (presumably) extortionate fee being asked, it's not unreasonable to suppose that Ansom may not have been entirely happy with having such a person involved.
The fact that Ansom was willing to make such a deal doesn't mean he had to like it.
True but unimportant. Ansom's goal is Stanley, not GK, but he hasn't called off the siege, which means he still thinks GK matters with regard to Stanley. Ansom knows that GK has thinkamancy capability, so unless Stanley makes it known that he's abdicated (or the world mechanics reveal it in some way, which they don't seem to have done), there's no reason for him to believe that Stanley isn't still running the show, especially as Parson has given no indication that he's anything more than a warlord. And as to the competency of the leader — thanks for confirming my argument.
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2008-04-01, 02:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
Actually he first contacted charlie after he found out Jillian was captured... likely with her lastest capture and the dwagons being the greatest threat, he felt that he needed the archons as back up...
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2008-04-01, 06:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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2008-04-02, 02:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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2008-04-02, 08:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
A possibility that has been mentioned in in one of the first posts by someone else already:
Imho Parson is trying to something much more wicked than goading the other side. I assume he is manipulating the stats themselfs. In particular, the "Duty" stat of Ansom. This affects the Chief Warlord the strongest, forcing him to be loyal to his Ruler (Klog #10). Ansom obviously believes in the Titan-given right of Royalty to rule. But if he can be talked into even considering a higher priority of Stanly's rule... this could wreck his leadership bonus, his influence on his allies and eventually might even force him to switch sides.
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2008-04-02, 12:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
So, there are several ways this could go. Parson is obviously trying to get Ansom to lose his cool, having him do stupid things. I am undecided as to what I think he is exactly trying to accomplish, but it seems to me there are several possibilities.
1) Cause rifts in the coalition by having Ansom spout off about how great royalty in general, and he in particular, is, compared with the peons.
2) Goad Ansom into hasty, ill-conceived attacks, allowing Parson to hammer Ansom's forces through ambushes and such during Ansom's turn. Further, cause Ansom to end his turn with his forces in bad tactical positions, allowing Parson's newly healed forces to respond with a devastating counterattack on their turn using units heavily boosted by the presence of the Sizemore and (if she recovers in time) Wanda.
3) Cause fractures among the coalition once the non-Jetstone elements, particularly the Marbits and the Elves, suffer disproportionately heavy losses as a direct result of Ansom's hasty actions. Combined with his seeming casual disregard and near-contempt towards the non-Royals, this could cause enormous friction among the these erstwhile allies.
4) Further damage Ansom's standing by convincingly demonstrating that he, Parson, a commoner, is more than Ansom's match in terms of tactics and "moral fitness" to lead.
5) Cause doubts in Ansom himself by handing him a total defeat, again at the hands of a commoner.
All of these things mesh nicely to demoralize, fracture, render ineffective and otherwise subvert both the coalition and Ansom's leadership of it. Given the right conditions, it could result in a "perfect storm" of disaffection among the coalition that we could see a break-up as early as the next turn. Or, at least, throw a huge monkey-wrench into Ansom's plans, forcing him to take a turn or two to back off and regroup, giving Parson that much more time to cause trouble.
There is one wildcard in this whole thing, though. The one thought that keeps going through my head is that Parson is building up to some sort of mano-a-mano champion duel between Parson and Ansom. It really seems that the entire conversation is building up not only to have Ansom blow his cool, but to force him to demonstrate his superiority over Parson. I am not sure how Parson could structure that so that he would have a decent chance to win (like a previous poster, I am reminded of the duel of wits in the Princess Bride), but he may have some ideas. Maybe he is planning to steal the idea from the Princess Bride whole cloth? Not sure. Also, if there does come a one-on-one fight, I have to think that Parson's enormous advantage in height, weight and (presumably) strength would have to play some part. I doubt he is planning single combat, but you never know.
Just some random thoughts as we all wait for the next update.
David
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2008-04-02, 12:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: 101 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 91
I seriously doubt Parson is intentionally angling towards a duel. For one, it's not his style, for another, there's a very good chance that he will lose, no matter how he tries to rig it. He just doesn't know enough about Erfworld to be able to pull off an Iocaine powder trick.
As for a physical duel... he would lose. Badly. Think of it this way. Ansom has huge amounts of training and a lot of magic on his side. Parson has bulk that may hinder him as much or more than help and a blade-less sword. Sure, if Erfworld worked off of our physics, he would have a huge advantage in leverage, but it doesn't.
Even if he could win, Parson has no reason to think he could. SAo why risk everything on that? Now, Ansom may issue a challenge, which Parson would then have to respond to one way or another... but Parson won't issue the challenge unless it's a trap. He won't issue a challenge with any intention to fight it...