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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AugustNights's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Gender
    Female

    Default Making Saves mean more.

    Dramatic Saves: (Saving Throw Variant.)
    When making a saving throw versus a spell, spell-like ability or other effect, there are more results than Success and Failure.

    The five possible out-comes of a Saving throw are:
    Save, Save Minor, Half-way, Fail Minor, and Major Fail.

    Save: 'Ya missed me by a mile!' If one succeeds on a saving throw by 5 or more one ignores all effects, as if you one succeeded on a saving throw, normally.

    Save, Minor: 'I'm...erg...stronger than that!' If one succeeds on the saving throw by 1 to 4, on has only barely staved off the effect. The effect takes place, but only mildly. These mild negative effects take place for 1d6 rounds, (i.e. loose some dex if turned to stone, or such, armor is useless after rusting, negative to rolls for enervation. If the effect was pure damage, equipment or clothing or even hair is slightly damaged.) These Mild negative effects are up to the DM, and should be no greater than 4 or less points worth of penalty. (I.e. 1d4 dex lost, cloths take 1d4 damage from fire, etc.) However, flavor effects are permanent. (I.e. Ranger Gill saved, minor, on his fort save vs. the Cockatrice's Petrification. He now has a gray complexion, and gravely skin until healed by a spell or such.) One may be hit by the spell or ability again, (even if the spell/ability specifically says that one cannot be effected by it after the save has been succeeded against.) for the next 1d6 rounds. If the ability states that once one makes their save, one cannot be affected by it, one gains a +2 competence bonus vs. the effect every time one minorly save against it, but only for the 1d6 rounds that one is minorly effected.

    Half-Way: 'Must...not...push...button...' If one makes a save dead on, one is half-effected by it. Minor effects are permanent, (see above.) and one can be easily affected by the same spell, again. In addition, every round one must re-roll the save, [ignoring major/minor saves.] if one makes it, that round they are only minorly effected. If one fails this secondary save, for the round that they failed the save they are effected as if they had failed the save. As with a minor save, one may still be affected by abilities that specifically say that if a save is made that it cannot be redone. One takes a -2 difficult penalty to all saving throws vs. effects or spells that mimic the affect half-saved until they are cured of the minor effects. No matter how one saves, they retain the minor negative effects and the flavor.

    Fail, Minor: 'I'm not dead yet!' If one fails by 4 or less they have minorly failed. One is effected as though they failed their saving throw, however, one may make a second saving throw on their next turn. If they fail this save, they are treated as though they failed the save entirely. If they succeed on this second throw, they are treated as Half-Way.

    Failure: 'Suck it Trebek.' If one fails by 5 or more, they simply fail.

    Abilities or Effects like Slippery mind will allow for a free second save, as usual.

    Abilities or Effects like Mettle and Evasion, move one's failure up one level, as that a Failure becomes a minor failure, and a half-way becomes a minor success. Improved versions of these abilities move it up twice.


    ~~~~~

    New Spell: Minor Esuna
    Conjuration (Healing)
    Level: Clrc 1, Brd 1, Pal 1
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Creature touched
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
    Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

    This spell removes the Mild negative effects that occur from Minor Failure or Half-Failure.


    Some things I am having some difficulty with...
    Game Balance: Will this over-throw game balance? I have no idea, but I feel it would make players fear saving throws a little more, and be a lot less dissapointing when the monsters beat your spells by one or two points.
    Complication: Yes. I feel this is something more to 'eye-ball' than to RAW rule, as it were.

    EDIT: Added in Jack_Smith's Suggestions for Slipper Mind/Evasion/Mettle.
    EDIT: New Spell for System.



    Any suggestions?
    Thanks for your time
    ~ChumpLump.
    Last edited by AugustNights; 2008-05-19 at 06:13 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Jack_Simth's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2006

    Default Re: Making Saves mean more.

    Interesting idea. It doesn't actually make the save mean more - it makes the roll mean more, and introduces more randomness. Also makes the "save or lose" spells a little iffier.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Some things I am having some difficulty with...
    Wording: I really need help cleaning the wording up.
    Evasion/Mettle/Slippery Mind: How will these work with this system, I'm not sure yet...
    Slippery Mind: No need to change much - give a free re-roll to improve the condition. For the others, have them move the effect they apply to up one step on the "good for the defender" scale. Minor save becomes "save" (which is basically what Evasion and Mettle do now), Half-way becomes minor save, minor fail becomes half-way, Fail becomes minor fail. An Improved version moves it up two steps.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChumpLump View Post
    Game Balance: Will this over-throw game balance? I have no idea, but I feel it would make players fear saving throws a little more, and be a lot less dissapointing when the monsters beat your spells by one or two points.
    Complication: Yes. I feel this is something more to 'eye-ball' than to RAW rule, as it were.

    Any suggestions?
    Thanks for your time
    ~ChumpLump.
    Game Balance: ... I'm not sure. It mirrors, so it's probably not too broken, but then, mechanical penalties on a successful save make certain tactics more effective.
    Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2007

    Default Re: Making Saves mean more.

    This is a good Idea. I never really like the all or nothing mentality of D&D magic. I also agrea with jack on the slippery mind and mettle. I do however think a range of 5 might be to much. maybe shorten it up to a pluss or minus 3. Test it out in a game both ways see how it works.

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