Dragons

[Kaww]

Is it just me or is dragon advancing a bit odd?

They don't follow the stat by size table from MM1. They get only marginally better stats, some of which come from HD...

Also CR is a bit odd, they fly, have SR, and tons of fun, awesome abilities...

Are there any fixes, at least for size advancement?

[DrWeird]

Nobody actually *plays* a dragon by character progression; they're pretty terrible.

There was a thread about this with the Polymorph Any Object trick a few threads down that was on about this, which is better than taking levels in it. Be warned of massive cheese wheels, though.

[Kaww]

Nobody actually *plays* a dragon by character progression; they're pretty terrible.

There was a thread about this with the Polymorph Any Object trick a few threads down that was on about this, which is better than taking levels in it. Be warned of massive cheese wheels, though.

I'm not asking for info on playing them, but info on them as monsters.

It's just weird that they don't follow the growth rules from the MM1, although they are from the said book. Their strength and constitution should be MUCH higher.

[NineThePuma]

Then buff them. I personally home-brewed a complete rehash of the entire thing where dragons grow more rapidly and are much nastier beasties, capable of magical activity from the get go, and come in a few varieties. Giving them more strength and con is a minor thing, comparatively.

[Kaww]

@ Shalist: They are good as it is, but maybe they deserve a higher CR?

@ DythTheKobold: My original question was, paraphrased: Is there an official fix, or explanation why standard growth rules aren't applied to them? I know I can add the stats and increase the CR. I just want to know why were their stats reduced. If I'm going to enhance them from which size category should I start (my best guess is medium)?

[AslanCross]

My take on the dragon advancement rules:

-The standard size increase table is there so that DMs can make monsters tougher than they originally are. Advancement for monsters represents "tougher-than-usual" examples of the monster. (Same thing with Elite Array monsters) They can be born tougher and larger, or can simply have grown stronger from eating too much (Barghests, for example).

-The dragon advancement rules are there so that players can fight dragons no matter what level they are. The game is Dungeons & Dragons, after all. Advancement here represents actual aging. Given that these monsters take centuries to mature, their growth is somewhat slower.

[Ormur]

A perfunctory glance at dragon stats show me that they all gain 28 strenght by ageing from medium to colossal (taking the youngest category of each size) versus the 32 they should get. They gain 16 constitution in the same time just as they should and don't loose 4 dexterity as they should.

So overall their stats per age category accurately reflect size increases except they trade 4 strenght points for 4 dexterity points.

[Starbuck_II]

I'm not asking for info on playing them, but info on them as monsters.

It's just weird that they don't follow the growth rules from the MM1, although they are from the said book. Their strength and constitution should be MUCH higher.

They'd have way too low Dex if they followed the rules.