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  1. - Top - End - #121
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Laurentio II View Post
    Page 50, panel 8. A Pink dwagon engulf a Cloth Golem (Bear), that react to the attack. If they are immune to suffocation, then the dwagon should know and use the special attack on a more susceptible enemy, or the Cloth Golem should not react.
    Not conclusive (the Dwagon could not know, and the Cloth Bear could react just for the surprise or visual obfuscation), but likely.
    Heh. Fun little detail about that particular strip you linked to:

    "You're a 5. and your girlfriend's a 2."

    "Our column is quite strong enough to take care of itself."

    ORLY? :)

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Zuber View Post
    Um... You seem to be forgetting recent history here. This is not the first battle in the tunnels. a turn or two ago Sizemore crushes the first scouts in the tunnels, mainly marbits. During this time Wanda was otherwise disposed so it would explain why these bodies were not uncroaked.
    On contrary. My point was, that they had to be croaked way before the powders were mixed.
    In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.

  3. - Top - End - #123
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Flaming Running Crap golems Oh god be afraid. ok my theroy! White powder = chlorine Grey/black powder = magesium No ignition source needed just a bit of moisture!

    Insight on to Jack Snipe The two man Dingy! Mulitple personalities or maybe he is just coo'koo as a result of been linked to other spell casters

    OMFG JUST NOTICED http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0059.html Dalek far right hand crap golem!
    Last edited by OldeGai; 2008-09-10 at 04:59 AM.

  4. - Top - End - #124
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by slayerx View Post
    So anyone else take note of how The golem activating the traps does not appear to be one of the 4 golems we saw earlier

    Methinks that Sizemore may have been bulking up his golem troops for the past couple of turns
    Which is smething people have been suspecting as back then people were arguing over whether or not they were hard rock golems or metal golems... They appeared to be metal golems, but their was supposedly only one metal golem while their was 4 hard rock golems... only way they could have been metal golems is if Sizemore made more that very turn
    The golem with the barrel would seem to be the Metal Golem listed in this strip http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0084.html and I think it is the one on the far left in this lineup http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0088.html.
    The four golems in front of Sizemore would most likely be the Hard Rock golems.

    And for the record glowing shovels of power are very cool.

  5. - Top - End - #125
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by IronBear View Post
    I take his initial appearance through the glasses to be one of surprise. Wouldn’t you be surprised?
    If I was a stark-raving-mad caster? No.

    But more than that, compare how he looks in that panel to, well, how he looks any other time we've seen him. With one exception (which I'll get to in a moment), every time we see him his face is deformed into a grotesque parody of insanity. That's not just 'surprise', that's seeing him without his mask. (If it is surprise, it amounts to the same thing -- if his reaction to surprise is to 'looking normal', it's logical to assume that his insane expression is an act. A genuine madman would look more insane when taken by surprise, not less.)

    And that one other place (aside from the flashback) where we see him without an insane expression? Here -- at night, under very dim light, when Stanley is specifically shown as not looking at him (and could hardly have seen him anyway, the way he's staring right at the fire.) In other words, the one place where we've seen Jack in a situation where he could have safely dropped his facade of insanity, he did.

    Oh, and one final point (which is really much more telling than the rest, but I only just noticed it): Even in that page, there's still something insane about him (something he couldn't change as fast as his expression). His hair, of course, has been worn in a wild, 'madman' shape since Stanley unlinked him. It's to be expected, of course, if he's faking it -- combing his hair would make him look less insane, and he wants Stanley to think he's bat**** crazy.

    Now go back and look at today's page. Compare how he looks via Thinkamancy (which, remember, connects directly to his mind -- it's not Lookamancy or Foolamancy, it doesn't pay attention to actual images) to how he looks in the next panel, or with how he looked in the other page I linked above. Notice anything different besides his face?

    Yeah. I could maybe buy surprise accounting for the change to his eyes, but I can't really see it slicking down his hair (and then immediately unslicking it.) Via Thinkamancy, he looks like an neat, organized, sane person -- which is what he really is.
    Last edited by Aquillion; 2008-09-08 at 07:52 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #126
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Radar View Post
    But if they were killed by said gas trap, then they would be alive before the trap was set off and given the fact, those corpses are right next to the powder mixture, metal golem would get into a fight, what is not probable - setting a trap for someone, you have to kill in order to set the trap just doesn't fit.

    If they are GK troops, it wouldn't fit even more - killing your own troops on purpose is illogical.

    So they were not marbits (or not all of them were), but i still think, they had to be croaked before the powders were mixed. Patrols didn't have to be formed solelly from marbits.
    It could be that they aren't really croaked units at all, but just part of the decor to define the ambience of the place, like the severed-arm light sconces.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquillion View Post
    Now go back and look at today's page. Compare how he looks via Thinkamancy (which, remember, connects directly to his mind -- it's not Lookamancy or Foolamancy, it doesn't pay attention to actual images) to how he looks in the next panel, or with how he looked in the other page I linked above. Notice anything different besides his face?

    Yeah. I could maybe buy surprise accounting for the change to his eyes, but I can't really see it slicking down his hair (and then immediately unslicking it.) Via Thinkamancy, he looks like an neat, organized, sane person -- which is what he really is.
    I dunno -- looking at the semi-concealed (behind the stat display) part of his hair, it doesn't look all that neat to me.
    Last edited by SteveMB; 2008-09-08 at 07:58 AM. Reason: Added reply to new post

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Is anyone else concerned about his eyes? So far, every FAQ unit has whites to their eyes, and every other Erfian unit doesn't. Now we see Jack via Thinkamancy sans whites. And we know he's a FAQ unit. This is also assuming that Manpower was originally from FAQ as well, but I was led to believe that that was the general consensus.
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveMB View Post
    It could be that they aren't really croaked units at all, but just part of the decor to define the ambience of the place, like the severed-arm light sconces.
    I like that idea. Nothing makes a traditional dark & dangerous cave feel like a few corpses here and there.
    As weird as it sounds, that idea is quite consistant with the world.
    Last edited by Radar; 2008-09-08 at 08:50 AM.
    In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveMB View Post
    It could be that they aren't really croaked units at all, but just part of the decor to define the ambience of the place, like the severed-arm light sconces.
    Moving such a large mass of troops without scouts is unwise, and considering the golem corps that Sizemore is guiding, they could have lasted less than a second.
    Badass Sizemore. When you known that it's time to flee.
    Last edited by Laurentio II; 2008-09-08 at 09:00 AM.

  10. - Top - End - #130
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by OldeGai View Post
    OMFG JUST NOTICED http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0059.html Darleek far right hand crap golem!
    [Sylvester McCoy]That's Dalek.[/Sylvester McCoy]

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    I'm surprised that no one has mentioned a Snipe Hunt. Seems just the thing a foolamancer would do to enemy troops.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snipe_hunt

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Laurentio II View Post
    Moving such a large mass of troops without scouts is unwise, and considering the golem corps that Sizemore is guiding, they could have lasted less than a second.
    Badass Sizemore. When you known that it's time to flee.
    Oni the gripping hand, maybe, just maybe, these are the marbit bodies that were left behind earlier when they still triggered som of the traps, and thus have not had the time to disappear as of yet.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    As to the various rumors about the face(s) that the Foolamanacer is demonstrating, the answer is simple - inner face, and outer face. The latter does not have the blue outline from the Thinkagram, and has dragons 92) in the background, and hence is in the 'real' world, whereas the blue-outline thinkagram view, he is un-deranged, and thus 'reachable'.
    I am so eager to see the excahnge between Parson and the Foolamanacer - how much will he tell Jack? (And by the way, whomsoever mentionned t4h Jack Sparrow vs Jack Snipe was brilliant, just brilliant.)

    Will he tell him that Jillian is there, about to attack? More than likely - Parson is not aware of Jacks' 'crush' factor. This will introduce yet another variable.

    I also am not sure that FAQ was indeed destroyed. They may have retreated underground. We know that FAQ is accessible by tunnels, where dragons can not go. I could see a trade-off hapenning between Saline and Banhammer - 'Your Dirtamancer will create escape tunnels for us, and I shall pay you handsomely'... but banhammer may have betrayed Saline, or may have offended the Gobwins enough for them to revolt and kill Saline, at which point Stanley swooped down and took the casters... I don't know... must.. spend time... in sense-tank... <glub>

    This tale is very well thought out and deserves a Webcomic award, and whatever monies they charge for this book.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Re: the bodies

    They look like gobwins to me. Also remember, corpses disappear if they are not uncroaked or moved. So if they were put into a pit to decompose...

    This may be what Stanley (and/or Saline) did with corpses prior to the acquisition of a croakamancer.

    No, that's not likely, because then Sizemore would probably know about it, and that seems unlikely.

  15. - Top - End - #135
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Zuber View Post
    The problem here, is if H2S was present, everybody would be dead as soon as they enter the cave. It wouldn't just suddenly form mid comic on you, it's a slower process than that.
    Having worked in H2S gas, it is not rapidly fatal, even at concentrations over 120ppm. (I, personally, have spend an 8-hour shift at that level, without usefull protection) Even high concentrations produce only nausea and fatigue in the short term; Long term effects include the really nasty stuff. Nauseated and fatigued marbits, however, might be far less combat effective.

    Also, H2S gas is NOT enough heavier than air to settle out.
    <MATH>Sulfur, relative atomic mass(RAM)~32, plus 2 Hydrogen, RAM~1, yeilds a total molecular mass (TMM)of 34. O2, having a RAM of ~16, yeilds a TMM of 32, while N2 with a RAM of 14, has a TMM of 28.</MATH>

    <TRANSLATION>H2s is about 6% denser than oxygen gas, while oxygen is about 14% more dense than nitrogen gas. Oxygen would settle out of air before hydrogen sulfide would, and Brownian Motion keeps both of them mixed.</TRANSLATION>
    The normal breakdown of Earth's atmosphere (Which might be different than Erfworld's atmosphere) is 20% oxygen, 80% nitrogen, with a rounding error of trace gases. (Water vapor content varies, going from 0% to about 6% in normal conditions). If Erfworld had a signmificantly different partial pressure of oxygen, it would affect Parson greatly- Assuming a similar total atmospheric pressure, down to about 18%, Parson would tire MUCH more easily, and probably be unable to climb the stairs. Below about 18% could be fatal to a pudgy man like Parson. More than 20% would make him more energetic than normal, and would not be toxic, even long-term until it reached close to 100%, but such concentrations of oxygen would make fires burn much more firecely.

    That's all assuming that physics in the two worlds is the same, and that Parson's personal biochemistry is also unchanged.
    Last edited by Decius; 2008-09-08 at 12:19 PM.
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by fendrin View Post
    They look like gobwins to me. Also remember, corpses disappear if they are not uncroaked or moved. So if they were put into a pit to decompose...
    Some have hairs, some have the Marbits' distinctive head bands.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    uhm... so it still would take 2 turns for Stanley and Dwagons to return to GK. Wonder how the Charlie issue will be played out.

    edit: what does GLERSH stand for? i have just seen it (panel 6)
    Last edited by PePe QuiCoSE; 2008-09-08 at 12:32 PM.
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    Default How do I shot Web?

    Thought thought thought! I have a thought!

    Webinar's booped. IF things are fairly normal physics/physiology -wise.
    IF that's Webi's troops at the top of the cliff, he's booped - there's a fire, smoke rises, more people die from the smoke of a fire then from fire itself. IF that's NOT Webi's troops (and upon close inspection, that's crap golems he's climbing into), he's facing bad odds (2 vs at least 4 golems, and he's a 5, and his girlfriend [judging by the hair] is a 2). And IF my guess is right, golems don't really need to breathe, being automated constructs made of inanimate (even inorganic for the metal golems) material.

    Alas, poor Webi. Third named croaking (Lord Manpower the Temporary [x2], Jaclyn) and first of the 'main' battle. At least, that's how I'm calling it.


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    Default Re: How do I shot Web?

    Quote Originally Posted by DCR View Post
    IF that's NOT Webi's troops (and upon close inspection, that's crap golems he's climbing into), he's facing bad odds (2 vs at least 4 golems, and he's a 5, and his girlfriend [judging by the hair] is a 2).
    Upon closer inspection, people standing on the cliff have helmets. So, I'd say Jetstone units. Still, doomed.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by PePe_QuiCoSE View Post
    uhm... so it still would take 2 turns for Stanley and Dwagons to return to GK. Wonder how the Charlie issue will be played out.

    edit: what does GLERSH stand for? i have just seen it (panel 6)
    That is the sound one would get, if one was opening a chamber filled with a somewhat viscous liquid (the golem is pulling up a gate in that panel - it's slightly confusing, because the said gate has the same color as the ground and such).
    In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Laurentio II View Post
    Some have hairs, some have the Marbits' distinctive head bands.
    Yes, the closest corpses in the 5th panel are clearly marbits. In the 7th panel those are quite likely marbit and Jetstone troops.


    Quote Originally Posted by Radar View Post
    That is the sound one would get, if one was opening a chamber filled with a somewhat viscous liquid (the golem is pulling up a gate in that panel - it's slightly confusing, because the said gate has the same color as the ground and such).
    Yes, he is opening the liquid trap. I still think that we are seeing two different traps.
    Last edited by teratorn; 2008-09-08 at 01:08 PM.
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by teratorn View Post
    Yes, the closest corpses in the 5th panel are clearly marbits. In the 7th panel those are quite likely marbit and Jetstone troops.
    What you are seeing as those head-stripe things I'm seeing as horns. Note that Mung has horns as well as ears and the gobwins have horns that stick up through their helmets.

    In closer inspection, though, I'm seeing bodies littering the area around the 'stream' in panel 7. That means that bodies were not stored in the liquid.

    I'm guessing that there was a battle we did not see.

    Other observation. Sizemore is leading a stack greater than 8 (presuming all 10 of those golems are stacked with him). Thus I would gather that the bonus he grants them is greater than that they would get for being in two stacks of 5 (or whatever).

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Others have probably already pointed this out a couple weeks ago, when Charlie first showed up at GK with a bunch of Archons, but it's looking like Parson's more and more likely to get out from under Stanley's control.

    It looks like:
    1) Stanley will either croak or sneak past the blockade, and then he'll form a new capital city in FAQ.
    2) Parson's going to beat down the attacking army probably clearing the tunnels this turn. After that he may raise as many undead as Wanda can manage in a day, then end turn with everyone on the walls to hold them. Thereby delivering a nasty blow to the coalition, and putting himself in the optimal defensive position for the enemies remaining. Hopefully this allows him to retain the city for another turn after Ansom counter attacks.
    3) Eventually Ansom's Coalition won't be a threat to the city. Either the coalition breaks up under the predictable stress, or Parson defeats enough of them. In any case at that point, Charlie becomes the biggest threat to the city, and Parson will be forced to surrender himself to Charlie in exchange for Charlie not taking the city.


    Personally I'm hoping to see Parson fight with his new sword. He's got a "full day's supply of Luckamancy" and that sword which privides leadership and combat bonuses. I expect that if he personally participated in much of the fighting, he'd be able to level and increase his leadership a bit. You can imagine the synergy of him leveling a few steps and his leadership bonus that applies to all the capital forces increasing. That makes it easier for him to direct successful battles, and continue going up levels.

    Also I'm really liking it when we get multiple updates per week. The level of Buzz around hear really picks up when that happens.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by SauroGrenom View Post
    Personally I'm hoping to see Parson fight with his new sword. He's got a "full day's supply of Luckamancy" and that sword which privides leadership and combat bonuses. I expect that if he personally participated in much of the fighting, he'd be able to level and increase his leadership a bit. You can imagine the synergy of him leveling a few steps and his leadership bonus that applies to all the capital forces increasing. That makes it easier for him to direct successful battles, and continue going up levels.
    Mmm... I'm hoping that Parson doesn't have to fight. If he's bad at it, it's demoralizing for his troops and dangerous for him. If he's good at it, it'll probably be demoralizing for him (not a killer, see "booping hardcore") and he doesn't need any (more) mental distractions. Between Ansom's massive coalition, Charlie's unashamed opportunism, Stanley's undermining, Wanda's speech impediment (ok, I'm reaching for that one), Sizemore's discontent, his Thinkamancer's ...dunno, goldbricking? Posterior-covering at the possible cost of Mandy/Jack/everybody else, the possibility that he's actually in the hospital and Wiz of Oz'ing the whole thing... he's got a lot of things to deal with.

    Besides, if he wins battles, he should level. Even if he doesn't, well... I prefer he doesn't. It's the main hook or theme - Parson trying to overcome impossible odds with skullduggery, tactics, strategy instead of better stacks/stats.

    My two cents of little monetary value.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    "Redox" - Brilliant!

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by Radar View Post
    That is the sound one would get, if one was opening a chamber filled with a somewhat viscous liquid (the golem is pulling up a gate in that panel - it's slightly confusing, because the said gate has the same color as the ground and such).
    yeah, i get that. I was aiming for an additional meaning to the onomatopoeia... i think i might have got a bit spoiled
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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    I think it's safe to assume that the flaming liquid is the liquid trap. Perhaps the innocuous little pile of dirt in the corner whispering redox is tha gas trap. We have yet to see how effective this actually is, although there are certainly many theories around. ;P

    And despite the whole 'corpses decay at dawn thing' I'm still going with the theory that they're residual corpses as an artistic license. no longer uncroakable, but still there for appearances.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by lamguin View Post
    Is anyone else concerned about his eyes? So far, every FAQ unit has whites to their eyes, and every other Erfian unit doesn't. Now we see Jack via Thinkamancy sans whites. And we know he's a FAQ unit. This is also assuming that Manpower was originally from FAQ as well, but I was led to believe that that was the general consensus.
    Distance is a pretty big predictor of this, I think. He's too far away in that first frame to see eye detail -- that's it.

    I'm also not seeing any real argument about him being somehow sane in that first glimpse. His hair *is* sticking up, the big clump in the middle plus a few spikes on the side, again just missing some detail because of distance... and he's giving us a child's blank stare accompanied with the usual Shakespearean half-sense. He doesn't have to be having a spasm every second (when he's not being strangled, anyway); see his facial expression in the 2nd to last panel here for example.

    That spasm at the end seemed to me more like something really happening, actually -- I'm not sure yet if that's where the effect of hearing his name is snapping him back into himself... but possibly. We'll see....

    Finally, about the golems & corpses... that looks like two different golems to me (shoulder spikes vs. fat shoulder pads), setting off two different traps. Each of them perhaps needed to force their way through a poorly-guarded chamber or two to get to the trigger points -- that would explain the bodies, and the results of this clash would be rapid & a foregone conclusion (hard rock golem vs. a handful of low-level infantry...).

    Finally, you don't need a chemical explanation to what might fire up the liquid -- the golem is right there, presumably he could in a match on his way out, or whatever... It's not shown -- but it seems trivial enough to bring about, so I can see why they might not dedicate a panel to it.

    Re-lurking.... Oh, no wait -- last thing: it's "Webinar", not "Weibner" or any other odd variation. It's modern management-speak for an online (web) seminar... yet another quirky result of the requirement that everything must be familiar to the summoned perfect warlord.
    Last edited by jtheory; 2008-09-08 at 06:10 PM. Reason: corrected type of golem... I think

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    Quote Originally Posted by ericgrau View Post
    CO is created simply from combustion in the presence of insufficient oxygen (such as an enclosed space). It weighs about the same as air; it isn't really lighter or heavier. CO2 is heavier than air. Death by either is essentially death by suffocation. But if that were the issue I think we'd see a lot of smoke as well.

    CO2 is death by suffocation, there's insufficient oxygen to allow for passive transport. CO is worse, it preferably binds to hemoglobin, meaning your red blood cells prefer to carry it over oxygen, and won't let it go.

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    Default Re: 120 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 108

    About the eyes, the amount of detail depends strongly on the character. The first character with detailed eyes is in fact Manpower. I remember Jami saying something about this subject (or I may be wrong, it was something we have talked about a long time ago). I'll try to fish that out.
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