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2008-09-30, 06:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Singapore
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
To switch to this discussion for a moment...
I think the contrast between Sizemore's reaction and Parson's flippancy is deliberate. Remember, after Misty's death, his first reaction was to try and 'wake up' (which he stopped 'for now'.) This plainly freaked Sizemore out.
This is emphasizing that again. Parson is reacting to this world by trying to avoid taking it seriously; he gets the occasional 'wham' from things like Misty's death or his talk with Sizemore last night, but he's trying to put those out of his head and treat it like a game. This is setting him up for more conflict with Sizemore and others in the future, I think.
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2008-09-30, 06:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2007
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Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
My Avatar is Vinnie Doombats from the Erfworld comic written by Rob Balder and illustrated by Jamie Noguchi.
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2008-09-30, 09:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2005
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2008-09-30, 10:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2007
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2008-10-01, 02:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2008
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- Roma
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Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Considering that Mungs is aroused by a (admittedly sensual) member of a different specie, I have to fully agree. Or, he is a fetishist of dominatrix outfits, that hardly invalidates the point.
The lack on maternity and reproductive issues is growing a weird side debate in this comic.
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2008-10-01, 07:01 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
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- Europe, GMT+1
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Still, for me it is about as out of place as if he did unsavory things on their graves. As impressive as the entire panel is, the last frame ruins the mood for me (well, maybe that was the intention after all). I know I can speak only for myself but I have the feeling that I am not alone.
@Laurentio: huh, right, I was just trying to make a point that what the two girls have might perfectly normal in Erf, which is similar but not quite the same as Earth. Well, seems like there is a great potential for gender equality in Erfworld that is offset by inequality of station.Orc Girl Avatar by Yeril !
Irideen Yoannaell,woodelf ranger Into the Depths of the Earth (Dawnhorn) character sheet
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2008-10-01, 08:07 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2005
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- Fith layer of Heck.
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Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
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2008-10-01, 05:06 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2008
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2008-10-01, 05:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2004
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Last edited by Kish; 2008-10-01 at 05:30 PM.
Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
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2008-10-02, 07:54 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
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- An old missile silo, somewhere...
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2008-10-02, 11:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- Washington, DC
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
This is -such- a good comic. I can't wait to see what happens next!
Last edited by Aeryn; 2008-10-02 at 11:34 AM.
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2008-10-02, 12:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2007
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- Zwolle, the Netherlands
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Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
why there's sex in Erfworld even without the biological significance, as there's no birth nor childhood (POP- there's a new inhabitant fully matured)?
Because it's enjoyable, fun, pleasant (most of the time)!
We have seen that the Erfworlders are very much personalities who, despite not having any biological need for procreation, still want intimacy and companionship. Sex maybe devoid of actual/biological necessity, it's still quite popular. Even the Tool enjoys it enough to spend part of his turn doing it.
the necessity of Sex in Erfworld is social or even psychological. The concept of love is not alien to Erfworld at all and when Love rears it's head, Sex might get involved too. it usually does...
and then there's sex without love, like Wanda distracting the Tool during the dragon raid on ansom's siege....
so, excluding the non-existant biological necessity for sex in Erfworld, it is done for all the other reasons we have in the real world. Pleasure, deep-felt affection for one-another etc.
which makes the erfworlders more "human" or "real" and thus it's sad when they die violently...
Is this comic really a matter of "wargaming chits have feelings too..."?Please buy my lo-fi mini-album at:
http://www.musicfan.fm/beechcraftbonanza
Chaos Farts on your Face Phase, Warhammer, tales of the Oldskool
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2008-10-03, 12:12 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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2008-10-03, 12:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Having read nearly everything in this post (most of what I skipped was the horse discussions) and having read TamLin's long post (I want the cookie too, I have no cookies) I have to say I think its really cool that Erfworld has really sparked such interesting and (in many places) eloquent debate.
I have to say myself, I didn't even think that much of Parson's comment when I first read it (only after reading TamLin's response did I begin to think about it). And while I'm more in the camp that tends to attribute Parson's response to simply extreme joy that their winning (not to mention "I'm gonna live!" bit), but also an expression of his own liberation from the censors. However, I can also see the merit in much of TamLin's point of view as well (though I don't find it confused genre wise, for me personally, simply because I tend to focus on it as an incomplete work at present).
So to add something new so that I'm not just making an affirmative post, and just because I wanted to:
I think this comic also creates an interesting figuration of the Other (in the literary sense of the word, by which I mean loosely in the dichotomy of Us/Them we often have different shades (places where the them can become us (usually based on levels of empathy and similarity), where Other is the extreme of Them. Monsters are the archetypal Other (but it comes in other forms, including a psychological meaning of the word which I won't delve into as deeply right now).
What I mean is, in typical D&D the Other is the monster that's simply "always evil" applied to it and is monstrously ugly by human standards (and hence is often thought of as having inhuman thought patterns too). Hence the Other is sanctioned for death, removal, and annihilation.
In Erfworld, this is played on as well, but sometimes from a nearly opposite end of the spectrum. Instead of being monstrous as ugly inhuman, its demarked as still non-human, but also not as monstrous, but rather as (I guess the best word I can find here is) "inanimate" in the sense that marbits are connected to marshmallow bits, cloth golems to stuffed animals, gwiffions are peeps, etc. So when we witness their destruction we are unphased (just as with the death of a monster).
Even our empathy for the fallen in this comic scene is run though Sizemore, rather than rooted in the suffering of marbits (who remain silenced and are spoken for by their human leaders).
hmmm. . . stuff to chew on.
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2008-10-04, 04:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Alright, as engaging as this discussion has been, it's grown too large for me to keep up with anymore, and besides, there's a new page up anyway. Cookies will be en route to those who requested them as soon as I learn how to bake.
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2008-10-04, 07:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Singapore
Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
To be fair...
Imagine we only saw Parson's side of things; we never saw or were introduced to Webnar or Dora. Or suppose instead of Webnar and Dora, the Marbits were lead by two slightly bigger Marbits, otherwise drawn identically, whose 'communication' was just incoherent sounds.
Would you feel the same way about this page?
Remember, for all intents and purposes, that is what Parson sees. All he knows is that the tunnels are being attacked by Marbits lead by warlords. He's never even seen a Marbit; he might think they're little triangle marshmellow squares. He knows Sizemore is freaked, but that's it.
I think that's the point. We see how horrible Parson's joking is, because we were introduced to Webnar and Dora, and because we saw them die. Parson saw neither; and I think that if we'd seen things solely from his position, people wouldn't be that upset.
In fact, I know that that is the case. This isn't the first engagement of the war. Parson's ordered units killed before. And he was joking the night before the battle. Nobody here protested. It was only after characters we know got killed, a few panels away, that people here started realizing something was wrong. As long as there was distance between Parson's joking and the killing, nobody here cared. Nothing has changed from Parson's view; it's just that the strip is forcing us to see what's going on. And no, you can't say the units that were killed before 'weren't people'; Stanley was promoted from the ranks, remember, and that means most intelligent-seeming units probably are, in fact, intelligent. Every Marbit Parson ordered killed was likely just as much worth getting upset over as Webnar and Dora.
I don't know which it was -- the closeness with which we were shown them, or the fact that suddenly the units getting killed look like us, or the fact that we've been introduced to them and know their name, or the fact that we were shown their deaths and it was made to look sympathetic.
But either way, I think that the fact that people are only reacting to this now is telling, and indicative that few people here can realistically claim to be different from Parson -- certainly, if you've never been concerned with the death toll or with Parson's joking before, you can't credibly criticize him for it now, because before the strip went out if its way to wave it in your face you were just the same way.Last edited by Aquillion; 2008-10-04 at 07:35 AM.
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2008-10-04, 08:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2007
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- Jacksonville, FL
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Re: 124 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 112
Wait… who's Gillian!? That looked important!
For another fantasy webcomic with Dungeons and Dragons, read Heroes of Lesser Earth now, before it becomes cool and everyone starts doing it!