Erfworld 127 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 115

[FoE]

So what if Stanley makes it to the ruins of FAQ? Can't Jillian and the Transyvito warlords just follow him and croak him there?

[Nargrakhan]

That doesn't answer the question of how and why Jack came to be working for Stanley in the first place, or what made him agree to the link that's left him as he is -- or appears to be.

That doesn't mean Jack is a mastermind schemer who's playing his own side. Truth of the matter is: We don't know ANYTHING about the extreme loyalty Stanley's casters are showing. Nor do we know how Faq fell to Stanley, and why so many casters are so devoted to.

Every time someone takes initiative in this story, people go off and assume that individual is playing some sort of Xanatos Gambit. Can't characters actually be loyal to a person/ideal/faction/etc.

[fendrin]

Maggie was the Thinkamancer, therefore, the dominant personality. The others only lent their magical abilities to the link as long as it was active.

We see here that the three minds 'alloy' with the thinkamancer's. That means that they are blended. Not just that the Thinkamancer is able to utilize the others' magical abilities. Even the Thinkamancer has their mental self violated.

[Laurentio II]

About the lost dwagon stack: now that Stanley is gone, probably some dwagon will punch the hex to follow him, but yes, most of them are doomed. You don't waste the chance of weakening your rival AND make lot of XP.

And, Cesare is alive. Bad news for the Plaid Tribe, really. Next turn is Transylvito, and all Stanley hope is a Veil that a dozen warlords could pierce?

And again, who is telling Parson that there are no more dwagons? It seemed that he cared about them. Mind why.

[Shatteredtower]

That doesn't mean Jack is a mastermind schemer who's playing his own side.

Never said it did. Stop missing the point.

[The Rose Dragon]

We see here that the three minds 'alloy' with the thinkamancer's. That means that they are blended. Not just that the Thinkamancer is able to utilize the others' magical abilities. Even the Thinkamancer has their mental self violated.

Still, as she was the caster, and a skilled Thinkamancer, she could allow the other two suffer most of the damage while remaining relatively normal.

EDIT: Either that, or Maggie refused to be linked in the first place and simply shattered the minds of Misty and Jack instead.

[zaitcev]

I still do not understand just how this was possible for the dwagon to go down while spawning an illusion and simultaneously turn invisible... or something.

[Oslecamo]

So what if Stanley makes it to the ruins of FAQ? Can't Jillian and the Transyvito warlords just follow him and croak him there?

It depends on how many dwagons and knights escaped. Jack was able to cloack entire cities. A couple dozen units shouldn't be too hard.

Again, I believe that Transyvilto and Jillian are fighting the weakest dwagons and several illusions, and the bulk of Stanley's force already sliped out of the hex.

Then, they go to FAQ, claim it at their own, and probably get a fat defense bonus that Tranyvilto doesn't have any true chance of overcoming.

Plus, there may be neutral units there, that get under Stanley's control when he claims the city as his own.

[Nargrakhan]

Never said it did. Stop missing the point.

Well you said: I'm left wondering what Jack's agenda was -- or maybe even is. How appropriate that an episode featuring a foolamancer reminds me of G'kar's observation that, "No one here is exactly as they seem.

Which left me thinking, you were thinking Jack had an agenda. I was just answering that Jack didn't have an agenda... just following the orders and battle plan for victory.

If I'm missing the point, please explain it to me. English isn't my second language...

[fendrin]

Still, as she was the caster, and a skilled Thinkamancer, she could allow the other two suffer most of the damage while remaining relatively normal.

Which was my point. Not only did she shunt the damage from the break to them, she also kept herself more aware of the world than the other two were.

Maybe it was her selfishness, or maybe it's just the way Links work.

The only other explanation would be that Jack was intentionally disobeying the order to call Stanley 'Tool' instead of 'Lord'. That seems unlikely.

[The Rose Dragon]

If I'm missing the point, please explain it to me. English isn't my second language...

Psst... That usually implies it's your native language.

[Saladman]

Awesome.

Personally, I'm skipping past any future posts where I see "I was disappointed..." or "this was not what I wanted to see." The creators can do a coherent body of work, or they can do a newspaper style comic with a punchline every page, but they can't do both. We wouldn't get the reveal, we wouldn't get the awesome, without the setup.

Thank you, Rob and Jamie.

Now, on to the speculation! I'd agree Jack is loyal to Stanley for reasons yet unknown. But I also wonder if, in the back of Jack's head, is a concern still for Jillian's welfare. He might not be sure who would win a fight between Jillian and Stanley, so he's doing the best he can for her by keeping them apart.

[J.Gellert]

Awesome, and looking back on the previous strip, you can see the cloud of bats that is really the dwagon... right next to the illusion that gets stabbed and bitten. And then flying on a straight line as the illusion goes down, and Stanley goes up!

Love the expression on the dwagon's face as it leaves the hex!

[Nargrakhan]

Psst... That usually implies it's your native language.

知らぬが仏。

[Demonicbunny]

Awesome, and looking back on the previous strip, you can see the cloud of bats that is really the dwagon... right next to the illusion that gets stabbed and bitten. And then flying on a straight line as the illusion goes down, and Stanley goes up!

Pretty well crafted illusion if it was "solid enough" for Jillian and the Gwiffon to actually touch it, hang on to it and inflict damage on it without ever realizing that it wasn't the real dwagon.

[headhoncho]

It depends on how many dwagons and knights escaped. Jack was able to cloack entire cities. A couple dozen units shouldn't be too hard.

Again, I believe that Transyvilto and Jillian are fighting the weakest dwagons and several illusions, and the bulk of Stanley's force already sliped out of the hex.

THIS would be awesome.

I find myself pretty satisfied with this one, although I'm still waiting to see if most of the dwagons end up getting croaked with relatively little damage to Transylvito.

If that DOESN'T happen, then all around fantastic.

[The Rose Dragon]

Which was my point. Not only did she shunt the damage from the break to them, she also kept herself more aware of the world than the other two were.

And my point there was, she not only kept herself aware after the spell was broken, but even before it.

Perhaps the word "just" should have been "mostly" instead. While they did give part of their minds, Maggie still kept her own awareness intact through the linking, and thus knew that Stanley was "the Tool" now. When the linking ended, she simply regained what little she lost of her consciousness.

Or maybe it is that Sizemore is not entirely knowledgeable about the theory of the linking.

[fendrin]

Pretty well crafted illusion if it was "solid enough" for Jillian and the Gwiffon to actually touch it, hang on to it and inflict damage on it without ever realizing that it wasn't the real dwagon.

And yet Vinny was able to stick his arm through it.

Perhaps the illusion lost strength over time, or maybe Jack was putting less 'effort' into it after the illusory dwagon was croaked and was being ignored.

[Lamech]

How much of the last battle was even real? And was that an illusion in the third panel killing something? And why, why, why would Stanley abandon all those units to translovito? It seems that Stanley's only goal was to get through the hex, not protect the dwagons.

Also we know that the hexs apperantly have two side to both east and west, but on side to the north and south. "East, topside". Also Stanley started this off by flying to the west then he turned around and went east. Umm... the coalition has no air defence right now... Does Stanley have spare dwagons? Ohh... crap, what if some of those dwagons were fakes?

Ghaaa!!! Too many questions!

[headhoncho]

Awesome, and looking back on the previous strip, you can see the cloud of bats that is really the dwagon... right next to the illusion that gets stabbed and bitten. And then flying on a straight line as the illusion goes down, and Stanley goes up!

Love the expression on the dwagon's face as it leaves the hex!

And I love how the bat cloud in 126 is vaguely dwagon-shaped! That is brilliant!

By the way... do we know each other? :)

[Godskook]

And, Cesare is alive. Bad news for the Plaid Tribe, really. Next turn is Transylvito, and all Stanley hope is a Veil that a dozen warlords could pierce?

Not even close. Turn order goes:

Dawn
TV
Charlie
GK
Coalition
Dusk

And it is still GK turn, so there are some things that can happen between now and TV's next turn. Also, TV has no lookamancer in the field, so it is unlikely that they know where the hell Stanley is, unless he makes it back to GK, in which case, Ansom is so screwed.

[Ronald_saveloy]

知らぬが仏。

Was ich nicht weiß, macht mich nicht heiß!

[Nargrakhan]

Also Stanley started this off by flying to the west then he turned around and went east. Umm... the coalition has no air defence right now... Does Stanley have spare dwagons? Ohh... crap, what if some of those dwagons were fakes?

Stanely wants to go west, so he can reach Faq. East takes him back to Knob. We know Parson told Jack, to find a means in getting the Tool to go back to Knob. If Stanley is heading to Knob (which I think he is), its because Jack is following Parson's most recent orders. I think its safe to assume the Tool wanted to punch through TOWARDS Faq, not away from it. Seeing as how Parson and the Tool have conflicting orders – or at least intentions – I wonder if units obey commands like real military soldiers are supposed to: last given.

[fendrin]

It seems that Stanley's only goal was to get through the hex, not protect the dwagons.

Well, his plan was to punch through. He may really like his dwagons & knights, but his own skin is still more important to him.

[Nargrakhan]

Was ich nicht weiß, macht mich nicht heiß!

You know what I said... and I know what you said.

We're best friends forever now!

[Oslecamo]

Perhaps the illusion lost strength over time, or maybe Jack was putting less 'effort' into it after the illusory dwagon was croaked and was being ignored.

Perhaps illusions have a life score like everybody else and when it gets destroyed it slowly dissipates.

[Shatteredtower]

Which left me thinking, you were thinking Jack had an agenda.

Once upon a time, it's fairly obvious that he did when he first encountered Stanley, even if it was just to survive. I have no idea what it was. I also have no idea what it might be now, assuming he might have one.

I was just answering that Jack didn't have an agenda... just following the orders and battle plan for victory.

You don't know that. It's a possibility, but not the only one. It doesn't speak to the past either.

If I'm missing the point, please explain it to me. English isn't my second language...

"No one here is exactly as they seem."

Ansom isn't just a hero. Stanley isn't just a villain or an idiot. The playing pieces aren't just playing pieces, and so Parson isn't just playing at war. We have no idea what Charlie is.

We have good cause to believe that Wanda has her own reasons for following Stanley, but we have no idea what they could be. It leads one to ask: Did Jack, Misty, and Maggie also have personal reasons for aligning themselves to an outsider like Stanley?

It may be as simple as Jack thinking Stanley had a pretty face or a good handshake, but I doubt it. I'm not saying Jack was trying to play some sort of mastermind either, but something doesn't add up when you think about the fact that somehow Stanley managed to overcome FAQ's defenses and come out with the services of one of the greatest foolamancers of all time -- one of the city's key defenses at that.

[SteveMB]

Also we know that the hexs apperantly have two side to both east and west, but on side to the north and south. "East, topside". Also Stanley started this off by flying to the west then he turned around and went east.

So it looks like he's not going to Faq any more (having left the hex through the east side, he's have to run the gauntlet all over again with his remaining forces). The obvious alternative is to return to Gobwin Knob, given that it has somehow not yet fallen.

[Lysander]

I assume Tool's plan is to create a new city in Faq. Once he's there his surviving forces will have all the defensive advantages Parson is exploiting at Gobwin Knob right now, and I doubt that any of the aerial units have the siege ability. It'll also limit Ansom from using most of his army since it's ringed by mountains.

It'll come down to whatever flying units the coalition has versus whatever of Stanley's forces survive (and maybe Faq can start popping new units too).

[Saladman]

It depends on how many dwagons and knights escaped. Jack was able to cloack entire cities. A couple dozen units shouldn't be too hard.

Again, I believe that Transyvilto and Jillian are fighting the weakest dwagons and several illusions, and the bulk of Stanley's force already sliped out of the hex.

Jack didn't snap out of it until he saw Jillian, after we saw the dwagons already engaged. (Page 113.) It's conceivable that Jack had the juice, the action points, and the presence of mind to veil and extract the toughest engaged dwagons, but I don't consider it likely.

Then, they go to FAQ, claim it at their own, and probably get a fat defense bonus that Tranyvilto doesn't have any true chance of overcoming.

Plus, there may be neutral units there, that get under Stanley's control when he claims the city as his own.

Rebuilding a ruined city doesn't imply waiting neutral units to me. FAQ had an heir, so it wouldn't go neutral at the death of its ruler like Gobwin Knob is expected to. And I'm not sure about the fat defense bonus, beyond what we already know about city defense from Gobwin Knob. A tunnel zone, walls and an air zone, all of which have to be controlled by the defender to protect the inner garrison.

Stanley's plan in its ideal form relied on his enemies not knowing there was a ruined capital city site there, so he was probably counting on ordering some units popped to properly garrison it. Now that his destination's been made, if he knows its been made, he'll have to alter the plan.

I also wonder what Stanley will do when he realizes his side hasn't fallen yet. I think Gobwin Knob has to fall before Stanley can start a new side. And Stanley clearly expected them to fall, he wasn't sure if Parson et al were traitors or just hopelessly incompetent. So I picture him tapping his watch if he had one, checking the time and the turn date, wondering what's taking so long.