Erfworld 128 The Battle for Gobwin Knob, Page 116

[Dragonus45]

Loyalty stops the morale drop from seeing your dead friends guarding the wall. They have to attack no matter what. IT doesn't however stop the leaders from getting panicky.

[Etheric]

A lot of the turning things around has been done by the casters, which in some ways is a shame, they are very very powerful units. In some ways it seems crazy that Ansom as careful as he is did not bring any casters with him if they were available.

I do think with the arcanpliars power against uncroaked then Parson is not as safe as he thinks he is. Almost all of Parson's force is now uncroaked, and we have no evidence that Parson knows what the Arkenpliars will do for Ansom.

With all the uncroaked on the walls forcing a breach is going to be very tough, so the last battle is going to be the air battle. I do wonder at the reusability of GK's air defenses too.

I do wonder where this is going as a story though. With the established massive power of the casters at GK's disposal a followup story is going to be tough, unless Charlie does get his way and recuit's Parson. And I don't see Charlie as someone who would worry too much about waiting a few turns for the uncroaked to turn to dust before attacking to capture Parson (and his mathemancy artefact).

[Dr. Simon]

Has it been established that the sun rises in the East in Erfworld?

Given that everything is supposed to be "safe and familiar" to Parson, I'd say that it probably does.

[lug0si]

I'm supprised no ones tried to interpret the foolmancers words yet. "Love is the wisdom of the fool and the folly of the wise". Whom is he referring too? Himself, Jillian and the former King of Faq perhaps?

Jack is talking about himself. he feels better (mentally healed) and worse (reminded of his old love Jillain) now.

[randomnondescri]

I suppose it wouldn't make sense for Erfworld to have the sun rising in the West though; it's not a mirror world, just.... skewed a bit. So maybe the sun rises in the North or something.
It would be fun to have Stanley coming in, arkenhammer raised high, silhouetted with the rising sun behind him though...

[teratorn]

I do wonder where this is going as a story though. With the established massive power of the casters at GK's disposal a followup story is going to be tough, unless Charlie does get his way and recuit's Parson.

Sizemore will crack if used regularly. Here he knows GK's survival is at stake, but not in regular battles. Jack is the master of illusions but doesn't add bonus to real troops.

Only Wanda is really combat worthy but she's too valuable to risk except in desperate circumstances. I would guess that once a caster is spotted in the field all enemy warlords will converge for the kill or capture.

[BRC]

Ouch, Parson has mad psychological warfare skills.
"These guys tried to capture our city, whose next"

I wonder how this "Only surviving because of somebody else" will affect Stanley's outlook...

[MattR]

I do wonder where this is going as a story though. With the established massive power of the casters at GK's disposal a followup story is going to be tough, unless Charlie does get his way and recuit's Parson.

I disagree, having Stanley as a foil and continuing the quest for the arkentools/world conquest opens up more opportunities for character developement for Parson then joining Charlie's unstoppable uber merc force.

Charlie has been the only one shown so far who can really challenge Parson . Following Stanley on his quest for the Arkentools will bring Parson and Charlie into conflict eventually, leading to an awesome battle indeed :)

[Axl_Rose]

Since when did "more than a thousand" jetstone troops die?

I like a competant villain and everything but this is a bit stretching it.

[D4ng3r0usDM]

Does it seem like Stanley has changed his attitude dramatically? Rather than upset that hes now heading away from FAQ, he seems to accept that it was "the will of the Titans." When has he ever behaved like this before? Can anyone guess as to the reason for the sudden change?

Also, Charlie has been, for the past dozen or so comics, the one hope I can see of Parson solidly winning this fight. I thought that an alliance(where Parson and Stanley hire Charlie, not where Parson joins Charlie) was what Parson was working for, after he talked with Charlie and was refused because Charlie didn't want to ding his reputation by switching sides...but then when Charlie was released from his service with Jetstone right before the FAQ gambit, he contacted Parson and told him of an "opportunity." I always thought that opportunity was the chance to ally with Gobwin Knob without breaking a previous contract.

Where does this leave us now? Even with all the uncroaked, the traps in the few remaining tunnels, and his brilliantly devious mind, I cant see Parson getting out of this seige without Charlie on his side.

One final note...I'm sure someone has mentioned this before, but Charlie was the Army parlance for "enemy" in Vietnam. Does this mean that Charlie won't ally with Parson? If that's the case, what can Parson do?

[BRC]

Since when did "more than a thousand" jetstone troops die?

I like a competant villain and everything but this is a bit stretching it.

Ansom sent a very large number of troops into the tunnels, none of them survived. Many died to the traps, and then Sizemore took out Dora and Webinar breaking their leadership. The rest of them were routed.
This was Parson being competant, but it was also Ansom being Incompetant. He sen't Webinar in as commander rather than one of the better warlords his Allies had because he wanted only Jetstone and Marbit troops in the tunnels. Parson hit him right in the ego, so he blundered.

[teratorn]

A lot of the turning things around has been done by the casters, which in some ways is a shame, they are very very powerful units. In some ways it seems crazy that Ansom as careful as he is did not bring any casters with him if they were available.

With casters as valuable as they are he would need to watch out even for his own allies.

Since when did "more than a thousand" jetstone troops die?

I like a competant villain and everything but this is a bit stretching it.

Parson had 242 gobwins, 36 spidews, 19 crap golems, 4 rock golems, 8 soft rock golems. Overal he was outnumbered but with surgical strikes on the warlords, tunnel collapses and all it isn't that much of a strech. Particularly if most of the kills were after Sizemore took Webinar out (no leadership bonus).

Depending on the golem and spidew strength it may even be a simple 2:1 or 3:1 kill ratio. Nothing surprising. Parson had "artillery" (tunnel collapses) against mostly infantry on the enemy side.

[Tom90deg]

One final note...I'm sure someone has mentioned this before, but Charlie was the Army parlance for "enemy" in Vietnam. Does this mean that Charlie won't ally with Ansom? If that's the case, what can Ansom do?

I believe that it's more on Charlie's Angels, but on the other hand, Charlie is not on any side. If this was D&D, he'd be True Neutral. I kinda picture him like a mercenary Switzerland. No real care about what the side he's on, whoever pays gets the power. So he's not really on anyone's side, he's on whichever side has the money.

[Sieggy]

I guess when Wanda goes out for a stiff one, she does it in style . . .

I would also point out that tunnels that lead in also lead out. Having hordes of undead swarming out from under the ground ought to make for mucho minuses on the RCC morale saves. And the opportunity for a flanking attack is very tempting . . .

I can see Parson 'overlooking' an area of the wall, and leaving a 'weak' spot that Ansom would see as an opportunity to exploit. And Sizemore preparing tunnels that would extend underneath outside the wall that would be too weak to support siege towers, and would allow the undead to sally and attack when the towers toppled.

Charlie may or may not have any way of knowing if Stanley escaped. If not, his Archons may be between a rock and a hard place if they're engaging Wanda's air force when he shows up. I can see Jack being able to veil Stanley and the dwagons and hitting them from behind with total surprise. If he does, Charley's going to have to worry about if / when Stanley is going to show back up, and that will divert him from making any kind of deal with RCC. He strikes me as a CYA kind of guy. Besides, this is probably the best entertainment he's had in years.

Wanda has had plenty of time to make her air force a serious factor, though the RCC may not be aware of it; I've seen nothing that would indicate that they've been active during the daylight hours. If so, getting hit by undead from the air as well as below will probably require the RCC forces to roll a natural 20 to keep from fleeing in panic.

But any way you look at it, Ansom is seriously pwned.

[AngryAngel]

A lot of the turning things around has been done by the casters, which in some ways is a shame, they are very very powerful units. In some ways it seems crazy that Ansom as careful as he is did not bring any casters with him if they were available.

Ansom's casters are no doubt in the same place Stanley's casters are: his capital city. If Stanley was in Ansom's place, and vice-versa, Stanley would be the one bereft of caster support. Of course, Ansom could have brought casters with him, but it has been established that casters aren't normally risked/used as field commanders (because of their rarity), and might not be used in that role by a typical Erfworld overlord even in the face of total defeat. Parson, however, is not a typical Erfworld overlord. He is defying, if not the rules, at least established practice.

I also don't get why the powerful units turning the tide is bad. If you were leading an infantry company, and you found yourself in a losing battle against an enemy infantry battalion, would you begrudge the friendly tank that turned up and saved the day, just because it is more powerful than you are?

[fendrin]

Since when did "more than a thousand" jetstone troops die?

I like a competant villain and everything but this is a bit stretching it.

In the tunnels. We only saw a few combats, but it was implied that there were several others.

Here we see that Jetstone has almost 4k troops in the coalition.

Here Webinar refers to leading 'the bulk' of the Jetstone forces.

That means that Webby was leading more than 2k, obviously some were to far destroyed (or buried in rubble, etc.) to be uncroaked.

[Heavy]

The sun rises in the East, because that's the way "East" is defined. Has something to do with a celestial body's rotation.

[SteveMB]

Does it seem like Stanley has changed his attitude dramatically? Rather than upset that hes now heading away from FAQ, he seems to accept that it was "the will of the Titans." When has he ever behaved like this before?

His attitude when he decided to abandon Gobwin Knob ("The Titans have made it clear to me. I'll have to walk this path alone.") was at least tending in that direction -- note that, while he warned the others in the room to get out of his sight if they wanted to live, he did so without the sort of angry ranting I would have expected from him based on his earlier behavior (e.g. his tirade after Parson called his side "the bad guys").

[Ragn Charran]

Since when did "more than a thousand" jetstone troops die?

I like a competant villain and everything but this is a bit stretching it.

Um, hello? Frame 10, Parson says it himself. "How will they react when they see more than a thousand uncroaked Jetstone infantry on our walls?"

[Winged One]

Regarding the direction symbolism: The sun sets in the west, and Stanley has evil as a motif (whether or not it accurately describes his morality is a matter of debate).

Not really. This was one of those pages where Rob writes "Wanda uncroaks a boop load of Jestone troops. Oh, and their armor changes color with the Hamster crest." Takes mere seconds to write. Takes freaking HOURS to draw and color.

Well, the amount of work you put into it definitely shows.

[Generalissimus]

Another question is the next movement of the Air Forces. They will need two turns to get back to GK (with no rules exploiting this tima), and they can´t know for sure if the Tool is returning there or is going to hide in ah hexe along the route to get to FAQ later...

[randomnondescri]

The sun rises in the East, because that's the way "East" is defined. Has something to do with a celestial body's rotation.

Not to belabor the point, but is Erfworld a celestial body? Is it even spherical?
Remember that its a gameworld, where East tends to be an arbitrary direction marked on a map. I think it would be entirely consistent for erf to be a 2d world... (after all, I don't think hexes fit neatly in non-euclidian geometry)...

And yes, your point is well taken that I could be going about this backwards, but I'm just trying to say that we shouldn't make assumptions that the world works like ours. (and I want to see the dramatic rescue scene)

[the_tick_rules]

Wow Hamster is rocking and rolling. So what's the fate of Stanley's stack?

[SteveD]

In the tunnels. We only saw a few combats, but it was implied that there were several others.

Here we see that Jetstone has almost 4k troops in the coalition.

Here Webinar refers to leading 'the bulk' of the Jetstone forces.

That means that Webby was leading more than 2k, obviously some were to far destroyed (or buried in rubble, etc.) to be uncroaked.

Aye, but you're not counting 2'000 marbits in that, all of which were likely committed to the underground fighting. If over 2k Jetstone went underground too, that would mean close to half the coalition was croaked down there, which seems a bit extreme for the 300-ish of Parsons forces.

But the thing that confuses me is that we know that after the failure of the dwagon raid the Gobwin Knob forces number close to 800 and the Coalition had 10'000. That's no ware near the 25:1 odds that was quoted at the start. What happened to the coalitions other 10'000 troops?

[Sieggy]

Another question is the next movement of the Air Forces. They will need two turns to get back to GK (with no rules exploiting this tima), and they can´t know for sure if the Tool is returning there or is going to hide in ah hexe along the route to get to FAQ later...

And this time, he has a fully functioning foolamancer with him, so it comes down to the TV forces having to decide whether he's gone to ground, waiting for the coast to clear before proceeding to FAQ, or is he returning to GK? I am assuming that Jack will veil Stanley's forces, so there will be really no way for them to know.

[teratorn]

But the thing that confuses me is that we know that after the failure of the dwagon raid the Gobwin Knob forces number close to 800 and the Coalition had 10'000. That's no ware near the 25:1 odds that was quoted at the start. What happened to the coalitions other 10'000 troops?

Stanley said 12:1. Wanda's 25:1 also make sense because nearly half of the army are uncroaked, and as such probably rather weak fighters.

[SteveD]

The sun rises in the East, because that's the way "East" is defined. Has something to do with a celestial body's rotation.

East is the direction of the Earth's spin, but it isn't really the definition.

Because the earth's rotation isn't exactly perpendicular to its orbit of the sun, the sun won't always rise in exactly the same place and we get variation in the length of the day. The definition of east is more the mid point between north and south in the direction of the earth's rotation.

But I think people are perhaps seeing a little unintended symbolism here. It could be a purely functional plot device.

[MReav]

I'm guessing that unless a major turnaround happens, Parson is going to have to grind his Uncroaked units against the coalition.

[Kyouhen]

Aye, but you're not counting 2'000 marbits in that, all of which were likely committed to the underground fighting. If over 2k Jetstone went underground too, that would mean close to half the coalition was croaked down there, which seems a bit extreme for the 300-ish of Parsons forces.

But the thing that confuses me is that we know that after the failure of the dwagon raid the Gobwin Knob forces number close to 800 and the Coalition had 10'000. That's no ware near the 25:1 odds that was quoted at the start. What happened to the coalitions other 10'000 troops?

Right, the COALITION had 10,000 troops. Ansom didn't want to let the other leaders send troops into the tunnels, only his. With only Marbits and Jetstone units the troops available to him have easily been halved.

Also I don't think Wanda was just changing all the outfits. I think that might be a typical thing to show what force the units belong to. Kind of like how every unit in Warcraft is wearing the colours of it's side until something makes it change sides.

And everyone's forgetting something. Charlie's turn is at dawn. Stanley can't move while the sun rises.

[Krelon]

Ahh, i hadn't even considered that.

Stanley - ''Hey, um... that was the same barbarian we had captured before, right?''

Since he's directing the question at Jack and expecting an answer it implies that Jack was aware Jillian had been a captive on occasion. Interesting.

Jack was part of the all-seeing trimancer link.

Huh... Parson now has a fairly large number of troops that are A> Expendable, and B> Quickly degrading. Somehow I see them being used for the brunt of any sorties against siege or other targets of opportunity. I wonder if Webinar and Dora still count as warlords? If so, Parson can use his "hit a stack, kill the important stuff, and retreat" strategy with those two.

Also, Parson has pretty much told the coalition that they have to take GK in a single turn at this point. Otherwise, they'll see all of both side's losses raised as a low quality uncroaked wave to be sent right back against them...

That's what I would do: keep them in the first row on the walls as long as possible to be the first losses and send on a suicide attack against the siege one turn before they decompose.