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Thread: Rules Questions

  1. - Top - End - #571
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    After the latest game with my wife, I decided it was time to reread the rules (good thing; I'd been misremembering several of them!).

    One of the things I'd forgotten was that you get to pick up two loot when you rest.

    Now I'd had some trouble understanding how the whole 'picking up loot' thing works, and I finally worked it out like this (check me if I'm wrong here): a turn is, in a sense, divided into four phases. The first is the 'Beginning of the turn' phase, the second is 'movement,' the third is 'battle,' and the fourth is 'end of turn' (I've actually created a flowchart that encompasses all of this, as I understand it, which I may share at some point in the future).

    As far as picking up loot goes, in the 'beginning of the turn' phase, you are allowed to pick up one loot in your current room IF there are no monsters there. In the 'battle' phase, you are allowed to pick up two loot IF you clear the room of monsters (regardless of whether you've picked up any loot earlier in the turn). In the 'end of turn' phase, you're allowed to pick up one loot IF there are no monsters in the room with you AND IF you've not picked up ANY loot earlier in the turn.

    If this is correct, then it would indicate that it's possible, without schticks or other effects, to pick up three loot in one turn: one in the beginning of the turn, and two after moving and battling in which you successfully clear out the last monster.

    So my question is this: does the two loot from resting work the same way? If you start your turn in a room with three or more loot and no monsters, can you pick up a loot at the beginning of your turn and then pick up two more when you elect to rest? Or is it more like you get to pick up one bonus loot when you elect to rest, thus keeping it at a total of two loot picked up in this turn, and the only way to get a third without using schticks or other effects is by moving and battling?

  2. - Top - End - #572
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oisian View Post
    As far as picking up loot goes, in the 'beginning of the turn' phase, you are allowed to pick up one loot in your current room IF there are no monsters there. In the 'battle' phase, you are allowed to pick up two loot IF you clear the room of monsters (regardless of whether you've picked up any loot earlier in the turn). In the 'end of turn' phase, you're allowed to pick up one loot IF there are no monsters in the room with you AND IF you've not picked up ANY loot earlier in the turn.
    That's right.

    So my question is this: does the two loot from resting work the same way?
    One might read the rules that way, but I don't think that's intended. If it were, I think it would probably be spelled out explicitly on page 24, or in the example on page 25.

  3. - Top - End - #573
    Giant in the Playground Administrator
     
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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    For ease of finding and answering questions about The Shortening, I've moved the three posts with questions about it to another thread. So this thread will remain for general rules questions or i those about the Dungeon of Dorukan/Deluxe Edition, and that thread for ones about The Shortening.
    Rich Burlew



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  4. - Top - End - #574
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Question Single Player Rules

    I just got Dungeon of Dorukan for Christmas (finally!) and was wondering: It would seem to me to be possible to play this game single-handedly. Most things that happen are either die rolls or pulling cards from decks, which are easily randomized if they aren't already.

    Has anyone come up with such rules? I'm playing around with it at the moment, having a single Battle deck to pull from, for instance, but I was wondering if any previous work had been done on this subject.
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  5. - Top - End - #575
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    AssassinGuy

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    A question: As long as you didn't move, are you allowed to make multiple ranged attacks per turn as long as you don't lose or draw? (When battling monsters, not players)
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  6. - Top - End - #576
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    MindFlayer

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    Some questions on Elan's "Poorly Planned Illusions"...

    1. As a Ranged Attack that hits All Monsters, does this hit every monster within its range, like how a ranged Trap hits every player in its range, or does it only affect monsters within a selected room?

    2. The card says that Elan may move all monsters he wins against. Does that mean that, if the total result is high enough to beat some monsters in the affected area, but not others, those beaten get moved while those not beaten potentially counter-attack? Or is it an all-or-nothing deal, where you have to beat EVERY monster to move ANY of them?

    3. Can monsters be moved into areas that monsters cannot normally appear in, such as the Safe Haven?

    4. While Xykon himself cannot be moved, other Xykon monsters can be moved. Does this include the ability to move them up the stairs, out of Xykon's lair?

    5. Can Poorly Planned Illusions be used against another player? If so, what happens when Elan wins that combat?

    ...I think that's all the questions I had on that subject, though I've got this nagging feeling I'm forgetting one.

    On a completely different subject, though...Resting/Losing a Turn.

    6. The rules say that combat effects from Resting or Fleeing also apply while Losing a Turn. What, exactly, does this mean? Does it mean the player Losing a Turn is at -4 against other attacking players? Or does that only apply if the player was trying to Rest when they lost their turn? Does it affect monster combat in any way (e.g., if someone uses "Surprise!" to launch a monster attack on the character)?

    7. Can a character who is Resting search for stairs?

    8. Can a character who is Resting or Losing a Turn use combat schticks to defend against attacks from other players? What about against Surprise! attacks from monsters?

    Hmmmm...yeah, I think that's enough questions for now.

  7. - Top - End - #577
    Halfling in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by NettoTakashi View Post
    As a Ranged Attack that hits All Monsters, does this hit every monster within its range, like how a ranged Trap hits every player in its range, or does it only affect monsters within a selected room?
    Only those in the targeted room. A Ranged Attack lets you target one monster in another room (rulebook page 12), and Area Effect expands the attack to include other monsters in the same room (page 18). There isn't anything in the rules that would expand it beyond there.

    Or is it an all-or-nothing deal, where you have to beat EVERY monster to move ANY of them?
    All or nothing. This is unrelated to ranged attacks, but is true for all Area Effect attacks. See page 18.

    Can monsters be moved into areas that monsters cannot normally appear in, such as the Safe Haven?
    Yes. The rules don't make an exception for such rooms.

    While Xykon himself cannot be moved, other Xykon monsters can be moved. Does this include the ability to move them up the stairs, out of Xykon's lair?
    Yes. Since you can move them only one room at a time, this would require multiple battles on multiple turns.

    Can Poorly Planned Illusions be used against another player?
    No, for all Area Effect shticks. Page 18.

    Does it mean the player Losing a Turn is at -4 against other attacking players?
    Yes. This applies to monster battles as well, in the case of Surprise! or Wandering Xykon with the Shortening expansion. Page 20 states the penalty applies to both player and monster battles when resting, and later states that the same penalties apply when missing a turn.

    Can a character who is Resting search for stairs?
    You can search at the beginning or end of your turn, so you can search before you rest, on the same turn.

    Can a character who is Resting or Losing a Turn use combat schticks to defend against attacks from other players? What about against Surprise! attacks from monsters?
    Yes. There's no prohibition in the rules against using shticks while resting.
    Last edited by prj; 2012-07-30 at 05:19 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #578
    Giant in the Playground Administrator
     
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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    All of prj's answers are correct.
    Rich Burlew



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  9. - Top - End - #579
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGirl

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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    Good day!

    It's been quite a while since I posted here.

    Oh well, we started to play again the game, but I have a doubt regarding the rules.

    When I end up in a new room, a monster appears, a battle happens, my turn ends. If I start the turn with the monster in the same room, Can I walk away from the battle and move to a different room with one of my friends to heal? Or do I have to fight the monster until it's dead?

    Thanks in advance!!

  10. - Top - End - #580
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dice Kitty View Post
    When I end up in a new room, a monster appears, a battle happens, my turn ends. If I start the turn with the monster in the same room, Can I walk away from the battle and move to a different room with one of my friends to heal? Or do I have to fight the monster until it's dead?
    You can walk away.

    As a rule of thumb, already face-up monsters don't impede movement at all, and only force a battle if you end your movement there. You can walk away from (or through) face-up monsters with impunity as long as you have movement remaining.

    There are, I think, one or two exceptions, but they're clearly spelled out on the card in question.
    Rich Burlew



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  11. - Top - End - #581
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    BardGirl

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    Background cards-I can't find anything in the rules book about them. I think I must be overlooking the listing, but I spent at least an hour on Wednesday trying to find anything that says when or how you get the Background cards.

    Any pointers (or to the rule book page) would be helpful.

  12. - Top - End - #582
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    ElfPirate

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    Hi guys.

    We have a particular issue that arose in our game last night. After Xykon was defeated, V, Haley and Durkon were all left in his room (on the 4th floor, with only three rooms on it; the safe haven and two Xykon's secret layers). V moved first, using the gourd to enhance his speed and left that layer, using the Emergency Exit on the 3rd floor to move directly to the Dungeon Entrance and removing one of the three 4th floor rooms. It was Haley's turn next, but she was left with removing either the room with the only stairs out, or the room in which Durkon was still stood.

    In that situation, what happens? Does the room with Durkon still in it get removed? If so, what happens to Durkon, is he trapped down there, or does he get moved to the last remaining room on that floor?

  13. - Top - End - #583
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    I think I remember seeing this situation in the rulebook. Durkon's room would get taken out and Durkon himself would just move to the next room over if I recall. I think there was an example in the rulebook somewhere on the dungeon collapsing that had Roy do that several times before it got to be his turn. Correct me if I'm wrong, I don't have the game in front of me, but that sounds right.

  14. - Top - End - #584
    Orc in the Playground
     
    RogueGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Advance Strat.. View Post
    I think I remember seeing this situation in the rulebook. Durkon's room would get taken out and Durkon himself would just move to the next room over if I recall. I think there was an example in the rulebook somewhere on the dungeon collapsing that had Roy do that several times before it got to be his turn. Correct me if I'm wrong, I don't have the game in front of me, but that sounds right.
    That would be the correct answer.
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  15. - Top - End - #585
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    PirateGuy

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    Simple question but I've spent some time searching and can't find an answer. Do non-battle schticks stack or do you only get the boost effect from having multiple copies in play?

    A specific example is Haley's Sneak Attack. If she has all three copies in play *and* both her longbows is her defense +7 and her attack +7 at range 0? Or does it only become d+5/a+5?

    To put it another way does she get the +1/+1 from the second and third Sneak Attacks in addition to the boost effect? Or does she only get +1/+1 from the first Sneak Attack and then only the boost effect from the 2nd and 3rd ones.

  16. - Top - End - #586
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    I played this game for the first time yesterday as Vaarsuvius, and had no idea for what strategies would work best for V. I ended up starting out with "Fireball", "Right Spell for the Job", and the one where she talks everyone to sleep for my starting Shticks. None of us were entirely sure how the rules would apply for my defensive shtick, and we agreed that if I fought two monsters and won my defense against the first, causing a Draw, then I could still choose to attack the next monster in the stack. My first question is whether or not that is an accurate ruling. But this developed into an interesting strategy that I also want to ask about, because it turned out to be extremely useful and I hope it was actually correct. After defending against the first monster successfully I would cast Fireball offensively against the second monster, and we decided that because the spell had an Area effect that it would hit both monsters anyway. I used this on the second floor to great effect by entering an empty room, defending, and then defeating both monsters and collecting the loot, then resting to gain back Fireball and my health point. Was this a valid strategy, or does it break any of the rules?
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  17. - Top - End - #587
    Orc in the Playground
     
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keeper of Starlight View Post
    None of us were entirely sure how the rules would apply for my defensive shtick, and we agreed that if I fought two monsters and won my defense against the first, causing a Draw, then I could still choose to attack the next monster in the stack. My first question is whether or not that is an accurate ruling.
    It is not an accurate ruling. Page 15 of the rulebook, emphasis mine: "If you won the battle and there are additional Monsters in the same room, you may choose to battle the next Monster in the Battle Stack." Page 14 clarifies that if you use a Battle Shtick that results in a draw even if you win the battle, then you should treat the battle as a draw if you win (or if you draw). Page 15 clarifies that you may not continue to battle Monsters one after the other if a battle is a draw.

  18. - Top - End - #588
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    PirateCaptain

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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    Hello,

    I tried to browse for it but did not find, sorry if it has been asked / answered before.

    I understand you can't Range Attack if you have moved, cannot Range Attack if there are monsters with me in my room and can also make only 1 Ranged Attack per turn. But what if:

    I start the turn in a room with X monster(s). I fight and kill the X monster(s). May I then, having not moved, being in a monsterless room, make a Ranged Attack at another room's monster?

    Regards,

  19. - Top - End - #589
    Pixie in the Playground
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    My copy of the game came without the simplified 8-page rule book. Is there a way I can get an image or a hard copy of it without having to buy the game again?

  20. - Top - End - #590
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anaesthesia View Post
    Background cards-I can't find anything in the rules book about them. I think I must be overlooking the listing, but I spent at least an hour on Wednesday trying to find anything that says when or how you get the Background cards.

    Any pointers (or to the rule book page) would be helpful.
    Backgrounds are not used in the basic game, but are part of The Shortening. The folded instruction sheet for that game has the details. Iirc you deal each person 5 cards, then they look at them and keep three, discarding two (You can certainly use them in the basic game if you are so inclined).

    Quote Originally Posted by Keeper of Starlight View Post
    I played this game for the first time yesterday as Vaarsuvius, and had no idea for what strategies would work best for V. I ended up starting out with "Fireball", "Right Spell for the Job", and the one where she talks everyone to sleep for my starting Shticks. None of us were entirely sure how the rules would apply for my defensive shtick, and we agreed that if I fought two monsters and won my defense against the first, causing a Draw, then I could still choose to attack the next monster in the stack. My first question is whether or not that is an accurate ruling. But this developed into an interesting strategy that I also want to ask about, because it turned out to be extremely useful and I hope it was actually correct. After defending against the first monster successfully I would cast Fireball offensively against the second monster, and we decided that because the spell had an Area effect that it would hit both monsters anyway. I used this on the second floor to great effect by entering an empty room, defending, and then defeating both monsters and collecting the loot, then resting to gain back Fireball and my health point. Was this a valid strategy, or does it break any of the rules?
    Also, as page 18 says, when using area effect Shticks, you pick the highest defense value in the area of your Shtick and use that for the combat (Elan's poorly planned illusion affects all monsters in the stack; V's fireball affects the top two monsters in the stack, unless it's been boosted). Your Fireball Shtick targets the highest defense of the monsters in its area (top two monsters). Did you remember to take one wound off of V each time you use the Fireball Shtick against monsters in the same room as you?

    Quote Originally Posted by akroknymn View Post
    Simple question but I've spent some time searching and can't find an answer. Do non-battle schticks stack or do you only get the boost effect from having multiple copies in play?

    A specific example is Haley's Sneak Attack. If she has all three copies in play *and* both her longbows is her defense +7 and her attack +7 at range 0? Or does it only become d+5/a+5?

    To put it another way does she get the +1/+1 from the second and third Sneak Attacks in addition to the boost effect? Or does she only get +1/+1 from the first Sneak Attack and then only the boost effect from the 2nd and 3rd ones.
    Multiple copies of shticks do not stack, but the "top" copy is boosted by the other copies you have in play.

    So the "top" Longbow Stick is boosted by the other Longbows you have in play (granting +1 Def and +1 Range for each extra copy if I remember correctly), and the Sneak Attack shtick is boosted by the other copies in play (which I seem to recall adds +1 Att for each extra copy).

    You only flip one copy of a flippable shtick when you use it, though. If V has 3 Fireball shticks, the first one she casts will have an ATT of 5 and an area of 4 monsters. One Fireball shtick will then get flipped, and the next fireball she casts will have an ATT of 5 and an area of 3 monsters.

    Does this answer your question?
    Last edited by Lord Torath; 2013-08-28 at 04:30 PM.
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  21. - Top - End - #591
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    MonkGuy

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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    Hopefully this is a simple question with a simple answer. Durkon's shtick, "Take Yer Medicine," states that after you have flipped your "Cure Assorted Wounds" shtick, they must give a loot to you. Is that on addition to the one from "Cure Assorted Wounds?"

  22. - Top - End - #592
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Lord Torath's Avatar

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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    No, I think. It's not an extra loot. It's just your way of forcing them to pay you for healing their wounds unasked.
    Last edited by Lord Torath; 2013-08-28 at 03:04 PM.
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  23. - Top - End - #593
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    DwarfClericGuy

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    It's not technically a rules question, but what would be a good situation to use Durkon's Awfully Lawful shtick?

  24. - Top - End - #594
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtlGuy View Post
    It's not technically a rules question, but what would be a good situation to use Durkon's Awfully Lawful shtick?
    Ever been in one of those situations where a bad roll would be debilitating, but you don't actually need a particularly good roll to win? This is the card for that. Just do the math in your head, if you only need a 4 to win, skip the chance of failure (potentially up to 25% if a 3 would fail), embrace your Lawful nature and beat the snot out of your enemies with mediocrity.
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  25. - Top - End - #595
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    If a player has a sticky monster stuck to them, and is reduced to zero wounds and forced to flee the dungeon, does the monster get dragged along with them? All the way to the dungeon entrance? What about if the monster gets unstuck at the entrance, does it stay there, triggering battles if players return to the surface?
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  26. - Top - End - #596
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    I was playing and noticed that forgotten bonus (screw this) that makes one ability not active can be used on Xykon. That seems a little unfair, and I was wondering if that is actually allowed. Thanks!
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  27. - Top - End - #597
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtlGuy View Post
    It's not technically a rules question, but what would be a good situation to use Durkon's Awfully Lawful shtick?
    Quote Originally Posted by Belril Duskwalk View Post
    Ever been in one of those situations where a bad roll would be debilitating, but you don't actually need a particularly good roll to win? This is the card for that. Just do the math in your head, if you only need a 4 to win, skip the chance of failure (potentially up to 25% if a 3 would fail), embrace your Lawful nature and beat the snot out of your enemies with mediocrity.
    Just played the first time last weekend, but actually happened across this card.

    We thought its intent was to hinder other players... likely force them to lose a battle. Because I thought it said the card could apply to ANY attack (not just one of yours).

    ETA: Of course, now that I think about it more, it was a Shtick, right (not a Screw This)?? Well, another situation might be that you are in an obligated battle, and you DON'T want to win -- Exploding Monster... too much loot to be dropped by others in the stack... too many players too close by...? Ok, I'm stretching here...
    Last edited by SteveDJ; 2014-02-11 at 11:20 AM.

  28. - Top - End - #598
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    PirateCaptain

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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    Hey all, finally played through an entire first game. There were several things that came up that didn't have a clear answer to us and a quick search online didn't provide answers.

    First, there is a loot that says when discarded all weapon schticks are boosted for the turn. But doesn't say how much the boost is. Is there a default boost of +1 or +2 in the game?

    Second, When fighting Xykon and you defeat him, the rules say that the game immediately freezes and you start the steps for the collapsing dungeon. What happens to the rest of the monsters in the Battle Stack with him? Since the game freezes and the first step is that all monsters run away, does that mean after you defeat Xykon the rest of the monsters in the stack run away and you don't have to fight them? Also, does the players turn resume as normal allowing him to pick up loot for defeating the last monster in the room (since the others fled)? And, does the player that defeats Xykon remove a dungeon room too, or does the next player remove the first room?

    Third, just trying to clarify, you can equip any loot that you Drool over, right? Not just useable items? So like the Impressive Scar can be equipped even though it doesn't do anything?

    Fourth, can Area of Effects be used for defense? Specifically, Durkon's Thor's Might schtick (from the Shortening deck). Lets his Thor's Hammer become and AoE, since you can use the hammer for attack and defense, if I defend against the top monster can I apply my roll to the next two monsters too?

  29. - Top - End - #599
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    Default Re: Rules Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonewolf147 View Post
    First, there is a loot that says when discarded all weapon schticks are boosted for the turn. But doesn't say how much the boost is. Is there a default boost of +1 or +2 in the game?
    All cards that can be boosted have a "Boost: yadda yadda yadda" at the bottom. When a card is boosted, you apply (for each boost) the effect there. For example for each boost, Belkar's Twin Daggers of Doom deal an extra wound (in the base game only matters against other players).

    Second, When fighting Xykon and you defeat him, the rules say that the game immediately freezes and you start the steps for the collapsing dungeon. What happens to the rest of the monsters in the Battle Stack with him? Since the game freezes and the first step is that all monsters run away, does that mean after you defeat Xykon the rest of the monsters in the stack run away and you don't have to fight them? Also, does the players turn resume as normal allowing him to pick up loot for defeating the last monster in the room (since the others fled)? And, does the player that defeats Xykon remove a dungeon room too, or does the next player remove the first room?
    Yes, they run away. Yes, the player can pick some loot. IIRC the next player is the one to remove a room.
    Third, just trying to clarify, you can equip any loot that you Drool over, right? Not just useable items? So like the Impressive Scar can be equipped even though it doesn't do anything?
    Yes, IIRC.
    Fourth, can Area of Effects be used for defense? Specifically, Durkon's Thor's Might schtick (from the Shortening deck). Lets his Thor's Hammer become and AoE, since you can use the hammer for attack and defense, if I defend against the top monster can I apply my roll to the next two monsters too?
    Don't have that so don't know.
    solo tú sabes bien quien soy y por eso es tuyo mi corazón
    AKA Yakkul in Not Real Life

  30. - Top - End - #600
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location

    Default Re: Rules Questions

    A question come up that I can't seem to find a direct answer for.

    If a player defeats an Exploding Monster in combat, and there remains other monsters in the room (that are subsequently defeated by the explosion), does the monsters (other than the first one that the player actually slain directly) get saved by the player as exp? Does it give loot in this fashion as well?
    Last edited by Menarker; 2014-03-10 at 10:08 PM.
    Order of the Stick Board Game Players: ROLL D12s not D20s!

    Order Of The Stick Deluxe Adventure Board Game Discussion Pad New Order of the Stick Game Pad!

    Character Sheet for Shard of Tharon RP.

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