2/28/2013 - Update on Thumb
12/31/2012 - There's a New Comic
12/12/2012 - The "Lost" Holiday Ornament (and Child's Play)
11/26/2012 - Leftover OOTS Swag on Sale (+Thumb Report)
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)

Order of the Stick 889 Get Real
Erfworld 163 The End of Book One
Erfworld Now at Erfworld.com!
RSS Feeds: OOTS

The Duke's Wolf, Part Four by Amber E. Scott
The Duke's Wolf, Part Three by Amber E. Scott
The Duke's Wolf, Part Two by Amber E. Scott

The New World, Part 9: Barbarians by Rich Burlew
The New World, Part 8: Gnomes by Rich Burlew
The New World, Part 7: Names and Cultures by Rich Burlew
Looking for the Gaming Articles?

 



Welcome back! Be sure you have read and understand the Forum Rules.


Go Back   Giant in the Playground Forums > Gaming > Homebrew Design
Register FAQ Members List Mark Forums Read End

Homebrew Design Roll up your sleeves and get working: there's lots of homebrewin' to be done! Post your custom creation for critiques or review those of your peers.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-07-2012, 08:24 PM   Top  -  End  -  #1
Ernir
Ettin in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 
Iceland
Gender: Male
Default [3.5] Gold.

What is this? Assorted bits of optional 3.5-laced fluff about gold.

The origin of gold:
Spoiler

The immutability of gold:
Spoiler

Gold and magic:
Spoiler

The golden cycle:
Spoiler

Skills, feats, and the economy
Spoiler

Transmuting gold: (New spells)
Spoiler
__________________
Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.

My sarcasm is never blue.

Personal stuff: PbP characters, The Diablo 2 game (DMing), BBCode syntax highlighter for KDE
CharOp: Lists of Necessary Magic Items
Homebrew: My proudest achievement, a translation of vancian spellcasting to psionic mechanics. Other brew can be found in my Homebrewer's Extended Signature.

Last edited by Ernir : 04-08-2012 at 07:48 PM.
Ernir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2012, 08:56 PM   Top  -  End  -  #2
Reluctance
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

The fluff is take it or leave it. It seems like an attempt to discourage infinite wealth loops, but then it introduces multiversial potential wealth to allow arbitrary wealth generation until the DM says the cosmos is tapped out.

TG&G/AMT are a bit of a pain for any spellcaster without access to cantrips/orisons (it's kind of weird giving 0 level spells to someone without access to 0 level slots), but mostly serve to give another option for turning one form of fungible wealth into another.

Alchemy, though, is just bad. Not only does it allow you to destroy an enemy's swag with a simple touch attack (changing the target to one unattended item quickly patches that), but it allows for perfectly efficient item exchanges. I get the appeal. But if item X can be exchanged at 100% efficiency and then the money used to buy item Y, that helps T1-ify everyone too much. (The point of T1 is always being able to have the right solution for any problem. Perfectly efficient item exchanges allow you to quickly have just the right item for whatever situation with zero waste/disincentive.)

You also have the question of why item X can be made for (N/2) gold, but still breaks down into N gold. Changing it to only give out half the price of the item should keep the economy intact. The remainder of the item's selling price being an overhead for people who would rather pay a gold premium than invest their own life force into an item.
Reluctance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2012, 09:38 PM   Top  -  End  -  #3
Ernir
Ettin in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 
Iceland
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
The fluff is take it or leave it.
Yup, yes it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
It seems like an attempt to discourage infinite wealth loops, but then it introduces multiversial potential wealth to allow arbitrary wealth generation until the DM says the cosmos is tapped out.
No, I did not intend to fix anything. At best, I wanted not to create new loops.

The way to tap the multiversial wealth is to cast Wish, which already puts more wealth into the hands of the players. All this (is supposed to be) is an explanation of where that wealth comes from. Do you think I am creating new loops?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
TG&G/AMT are a bit of a pain for any spellcaster without access to cantrips/orisons (it's kind of weird giving 0 level spells to someone without access to 0 level slots), but mostly serve to give another option for turning one form of fungible wealth into another.
Hmm, good point about the casters without 0-level spells. Teaches me not to make generalizations about the 3.5 spellcasting system. Will fix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reluctance View Post
Alchemy, though, is just bad. Not only does it allow you to destroy an enemy's swag with a simple touch attack (changing the target to one unattended item quickly patches that), but it allows for perfectly efficient item exchanges. I get the appeal. But if item X can be exchanged at 100% efficiency and then the money used to buy item Y, that helps T1-ify everyone too much. (The point of T1 is always being able to have the right solution for any problem. Perfectly efficient item exchanges allow you to quickly have just the right item for whatever situation with zero waste/disincentive.)

You also have the question of why item X can be made for (N/2) gold, but still breaks down into N gold. Changing it to only give out half the price of the item should keep the economy intact. The remainder of the item's selling price being an overhead for people who would rather pay a gold premium than invest their own life force into an item.
Uh, two things.
1) Alchemy has a 1-minute casting time. If you can convince someone to sit still while you melt the magic out of their gear, I think you could just as well have run off with the stuff...
2) It does give "the amount of gold spent on imbuing the magic item with its properties in the first place", not the whole sell value. How did you read it?

Does that solve some of the concerns?
__________________
Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.

My sarcasm is never blue.

Personal stuff: PbP characters, The Diablo 2 game (DMing), BBCode syntax highlighter for KDE
CharOp: Lists of Necessary Magic Items
Homebrew: My proudest achievement, a translation of vancian spellcasting to psionic mechanics. Other brew can be found in my Homebrewer's Extended Signature.

Last edited by Ernir : 04-07-2012 at 09:39 PM.
Ernir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2012, 10:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #4
bobthe6th
Troll in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: 
Under the midnight sun
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

I'm kind of worried about the fact carting a dragons hoard out of the cave is a 0-level spell. boom, 1,000,000 lb in gold becomes 1 0lb diamond... I would just have currency be in gems, you can carry as much gold as you want, as apposed to the weight problem for commoners... heck change is easy, just carry around 1 gem as their wallet, and have the creditor extract x gold from it.

great magic trap idea. take 1 massively expensive gem, place it on a modified TG&G spell trap(modify the spell to convert gem to copper pieces)... boom, one tide of crushing metal.

The fluff seems nice, explains why their is still diamond dust for resurrections, and why gold isn't a non-renewable resource like in "sorcerers wheel".
__________________
avatar by Szilard, thank you sir for the fine work!

my home brew. you should PEACH them...
Telekineticist
Razor
Shield
blasterv4
mindbender
bobthe6th is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2012, 11:37 PM   Top  -  End  -  #5
Ernir
Ettin in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 
Iceland
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobthe6th View Post
I'm kind of worried about the fact carting a dragons hoard out of the cave is a 0-level spell. boom, 1,000,000 lb in gold becomes 1 0lb diamond... I would just have currency be in gems, you can carry as much gold as you want, as apposed to the weight problem for commoners... heck change is easy, just carry around 1 gem as their wallet, and have the creditor extract x gold from it.
Hmm, it is a bit too easy, isn't it?

Even raising the spell level to just 1 might mean not every 1st-level Sorcerer has it. And low-level Wizards would not walk around with it prepared as a matter of course. Although the high level ones probably would, but I think that's OK.

This could probably use a sanity cap as well. Around 1000GP/CL transmutable?

As for 1-gem wallets, I think that might be just the thing that would happen in a setting high magic enough to support magic ATMs at every other corner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobthe6th View Post
The fluff seems nice, explains why their is still diamond dust for resurrections, and why gold isn't a non-renewable resource like in "sorcerers wheel".
Thanks. \o/
__________________
Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.

My sarcasm is never blue.

Personal stuff: PbP characters, The Diablo 2 game (DMing), BBCode syntax highlighter for KDE
CharOp: Lists of Necessary Magic Items
Homebrew: My proudest achievement, a translation of vancian spellcasting to psionic mechanics. Other brew can be found in my Homebrewer's Extended Signature.
Ernir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2012, 11:51 PM   Top  -  End  -  #6
toapat
Ogre in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernir View Post
As for 1-gem wallets, I think that might be just the thing that would happen in a setting high magic enough to support magic ATMs at every other corner. /
Make it so
__________________


My Homebrew: found here.

I use Red when I'm angry, I use blue when I'm excited.
Winged Drow avatar @ myself
toapat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 02:43 AM   Top  -  End  -  #7
tuggyne
Troll in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: 
Pondering turns of phrase
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernir View Post
Uh, two things.
1) Alchemy has a 1-minute casting time. If you can convince someone to sit still while you melt the magic out of their gear, I think you could just as well have run off with the stuff...
Craft two or three wands of Alchemy (silenced if possible). Sneak up on a sleeping party. Steal all their stuff (including the armor they're wearing and the fortifying bedroll they're lying in). Laugh. (Note: this takes as many rounds as the items you're stealing, not including move actions to reposition to a new victim.)
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Water_Bear View Post
That's RAW for you; 100% Rules-Legal, 110% silly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
"Common sense" and "RAW" are not exactly on speaking terms
Homebrew Sigbox and Quotebox are overflow. RACSD and Top Ten fix and highlight some 3.5 rough spots. See also Gentlemen's Agreement.

Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid"
I often hop into threads for just one thing
Jezrald Ceikatar · ​CitP · ​Catgirl-Killers Society
tuggyne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 08:15 AM   Top  -  End  -  #8
bobthe6th
Troll in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: 
Under the midnight sun
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Alternative ending: take the stuff, sneak away, go to a fence, sell the stuff, profit.
__________________
avatar by Szilard, thank you sir for the fine work!

my home brew. you should PEACH them...
Telekineticist
Razor
Shield
blasterv4
mindbender
bobthe6th is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 07:40 PM   Top  -  End  -  #9
Ernir
Ettin in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 
Iceland
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuggyne View Post
Craft two or three wands of Alchemy (silenced if possible). Sneak up on a sleeping party. Steal all their stuff (including the armor they're wearing and the fortifying bedroll they're lying in). Laugh. (Note: this takes as many rounds as the items you're stealing, not including move actions to reposition to a new victim.)
This doesn't work either. Activating a spell trigger item requires the same amount of time as casting the spell that the item stores, so you'd still be poking them with a wand for a minute. Just stealing the stuff is still quicker.

There are ways to shorten the casting time (like Alacritous Cogitation), but I don't remember one that is easy/re-usable enough for me to worry about it very much.
__________________
Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.

My sarcasm is never blue.

Personal stuff: PbP characters, The Diablo 2 game (DMing), BBCode syntax highlighter for KDE
CharOp: Lists of Necessary Magic Items
Homebrew: My proudest achievement, a translation of vancian spellcasting to psionic mechanics. Other brew can be found in my Homebrewer's Extended Signature.
Ernir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 07:48 PM   Top  -  End  -  #10
bobthe6th
Troll in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: 
Under the midnight sun
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

this would allow a cool addition to the artificer: the gold pool. they just apsorb gold essence straight into themselves then expend it for crafting.
__________________
avatar by Szilard, thank you sir for the fine work!

my home brew. you should PEACH them...
Telekineticist
Razor
Shield
blasterv4
mindbender
bobthe6th is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 08:34 PM   Top  -  End  -  #11
tuggyne
Troll in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: 
Pondering turns of phrase
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernir View Post
This doesn't work either. Activating a spell trigger item requires the same amount of time as casting the spell that the item stores, so you'd still be poking them with a wand for a minute. Just stealing the stuff is still quicker.
I think I've heard this rule but I can't remember where it's from, which is why I ignored it . RC? SpC?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Water_Bear View Post
That's RAW for you; 100% Rules-Legal, 110% silly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
"Common sense" and "RAW" are not exactly on speaking terms
Homebrew Sigbox and Quotebox are overflow. RACSD and Top Ten fix and highlight some 3.5 rough spots. See also Gentlemen's Agreement.

Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid"
I often hop into threads for just one thing
Jezrald Ceikatar · ​CitP · ​Catgirl-Killers Society
tuggyne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2012, 08:50 PM   Top  -  End  -  #12
Ernir
Ettin in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 
Iceland
Gender: Male
Default Re: [3.5] Gold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuggyne View Post
I think I've heard this rule but I can't remember where it's from, which is why I ignored it . RC? SpC?
Rules Compendium, page 85.
__________________
Halfling healer avatar by Akrim.elf.

My sarcasm is never blue.

Personal stuff: PbP characters, The Diablo 2 game (DMing), BBCode syntax highlighter for KDE
CharOp: Lists of Necessary Magic Items
Homebrew: My proudest achievement, a translation of vancian spellcasting to psionic mechanics. Other brew can be found in my Homebrewer's Extended Signature.
Ernir is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:11 PM.



Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Usage of this site, including but not limited to making or editing a post or private message or the creation of an account, constitutes acceptance of the Forum Rules.