Dragon Ball Super II: Orange Hillbilly Dooms World... Again.

[Rater202]

Again, they later pointed out that Buu's power level went back down when his transformation was complete and he'd fully regressed to his oriiginal form.

He wasn't getting stronger, his energy output spiked while he was transforming.

[Anteros]

Again, they later pointed out that Buu's power level went back down when his transformation was complete and he'd fully regressed to his oriiginal form.

He wasn't getting stronger, his energy output spiked while he was transforming.

No they do not. I literally just read the entire manga from where I linked you to end and that does not happen. Vegeta makes a joke about Buu being short (pot meet kettle). That's it.

[Douglas]

Can we at least agree that Kid Buu is weaker than Gohan Buu? And maybe Gotenks Buu?

[Anteros]

Can we at least agree that Kid Buu is weaker than Gohan Buu? And maybe Gotenks Buu?

Probably. Even if we can't all agree it's not like it matters. The power scalings will probably all change again in an episode or two anyway.

[Rater202]

No they do not. I literally just read the entire manga from where I linked you to end and that does not happen. Vegeta makes a joke about Buu being short (pot meet kettle). That's it.

1: The official English translation changes somethings.
2: What you linked looks like a low-quality fan-scan. I can't confirm 100%, but if it is it's basically worthless.

I've checked. As far as I can tell, in the original, it's stated that Kid Buu's power level went back down when he finished regressing.

Also, logic: SSJ3 Gotenks=Base Super Buu,more or less.
Goku explicitly states that Gotenks has more raw power than he does at this time.
SSJ3 Goku=Kid Buu, more or less.

Thus, Super Buu has to be stronger than Kid Buu.

[Douglas]

Probably. Even if we can't all agree it's not like it matters. The power scalings will probably all change again in an episode or two anyway.

I just mention that because I've seen people assert that Kid Buu is the Strongest Of Them All, explicitly including Gohan Buu, and that one strikes me as really ridiculous. If Kid Buu were stronger than Gohan Buu then it would have taken Vegitto to even fight him at all for longer than a few seconds.

[Anteros]

I just mention that because I've seen people assert that Kid Buu is the Strongest Of Them All, explicitly including Gohan Buu, and that one strikes me as really ridiculous. If Kid Buu were stronger than Gohan Buu then it would have taken Vegitto to even fight him at all for longer than a few seconds.

Ultimately there's just no telling unless the characters explicitly say something. This is a series where Gohan jumped from like 20,000 power level to smacking around final form Freeza just because he got a little angry. We have an arc now with characters who went from Saiyan saga level to universal in the span of a week. Gohan lost a fight to Krillin. None of the scaling makes any sense, and power levels are completely meaningless for determining the outcome of a fight...except when they're not.

[The Troubadour]

Can we at least agree that Kid Buu is weaker than Gohan Buu? And maybe Gotenks Buu?

Sure. I don't think anyone here was disputing that.

1: The official English translation changes somethings.
[...]
I've checked. As far as I can tell, in the original, it's stated that Kid Buu's power level went back down when he finished regressing.

So you do read Japanese, then?

[Future Sword]

That linked translation looks mad sketchy. I really doubt it's a reliable source. FWIW, I've only ever seen Kid Buu referred to as "weaker, but more dangerous". I can't read Japanese, though, so my input is invalid, I guess.

[Spamotron]

Hiromi Tsuru the voice actress for Bulma just passed away.

[The Troubadour]

That linked translation looks mad sketchy.

It does, but Viz' translation says pretty much the same thing.

[Xihirli]

Hiromi Tsuru the voice actress for Bulma just passed away.

Farewell, Hiromi. May the gods cower before you in the next life, as well.

[Sniccups]

Farewell, Hiromi. May the gods cower before you in the next life, as well.

That is the best epitaph.

[jindra34]

Spoiler: Episode 116

Show

Well... Ultra Instinct's 'rules' are given more clarity. And seriously Kefla/Kale/Cauifla is a really novice fighter, what with her thinking POWER was all that mattered. She shoulda realized otherwise when she couldn't hit Goku with a Hellzone Grenade type attack.

[Rakaydos]

Spoiler: Episode 116

Show

Well... Ultra Instinct's 'rules' are given more clarity. And seriously Kefla/Kale/Cauifla is a really novice fighter, what with her thinking POWER was all that mattered. She shoulda realized otherwise when she couldn't hit Goku with a Hellzone Grenade type attack.

You could say that the power went to her head.

[Xihirli]

Spoiler: 116

Show

Well, that was... yeah. A pretty amazing finishing blow. My jaw dropped. Totally admit that. I'm just hoping they can top it for the final. It was a great send-off to so many Goku episodes in a row, and now we can watch everyone else for a time.

[HolyDraconus]

It's not Ultra Instinct. With what we know of it and with Whis confirming it, it's NOT Ultra Instinct. I agree with the name Ultra Instinct Omen/Sign though. However, with how things are going, it may well morph into the real thing before long.

[Anteros]

This was possibly the best choreographed Dragonball fight ever. Definitely the best in a long long time. Super doesn't impress me often, but this episode did so.

Plus, we probably won't have to focus on Kale and Caulifla for a while, so that's definitely a huge plus.

[Lord Raziere]

Spoiler: Episode 116

Show

......Kefla literally says "hooray for being born a saiyan." -_-. they're not even pretending anymore.

and yeah, this is exactly how chaotic things would get with saiyans: one powers up, the other powers up even more, which makes the other power up even more, which makes the other one to power up even more....it would just be an endless feedback loop.

and Goku's dodging every single attack. yup, Kefla's doomed.

and Jiren gets up, oh no. that look is a "DOES JIREN HAVE TO SMACK A SAIYAN!?"/"DON'T MAKE ME COME OVER THERE!" look.

and yup, Kale and Caulifla are defeated and fall onto the stands. whelp, there goes my favorite part of the tournament. thanks a lot Goku

yeah....your two generic namekians......yeah......I'm sorry U6, but.....you don't have long to live......nice knowing you.....

and the Ultra-Instinct fades, leaving goku to walk wounded through the battlefield once again.

Tournament Status:
U7: 7/10
U3: 6/10
U2: 5/10
U4: 3/10
U11: 3/10
U6: 2/10
U10: Erased.
U9: Erased.
Total: 26 fighters remaining.

so yeah, U6 is doomed, I'll give them one episode to live before Gohan and Piccolo clean up the U6 Namekians. I'm sad at this. Just sad. Kale and Caulifla were like some of the best things about the tournament and now they're on the sidelines are soon going to be erased. No more Kale and Caulifla.....

Why is U6 seem to be the third to be erased? it seems that it shined too early, relied too much on specific super powerful people rather than teamwork, and didn't use their aces right.

Preview:
So wait, its Androids vs. Universe 2? Huh. okay, not 3, ok. whatever.

[Dragonus45]

Spoiler

Show

Great fight overall. The most interesting part is that Every time we see UI Goku is literally at a last gasp of energy. Once he learns to activate that while he still has his full stamina it's going to get real. The best part however is Caulifla is gone. Kale is interesting enough but I would sacrifice all of universe 6 forever it if meant never seeing her again.

[Anteros]

Spoiler

Show

Great fight overall. The most interesting part is that Every time we see UI Goku is literally at a last gasp of energy. Once he learns to activate that while he still has his full stamina it's going to get real. The best part however is Caulifla is gone. Kale is interesting enough but I would sacrifice all of universe 6 forever it if meant never seeing her again.

I don't mind either of them individually. It's when they're interacting with each other that I want to claw my eyes and ears out.

[Lord Raziere]

I don't mind either of them individually. It's when they're interacting with each other that I want to claw my eyes and ears out.

What are you talking about? their relationship is what makes them work. can't imagine them without each other really.

[Dragonus45]

Which is sort of a downside. They don't really hold up as individual characters, which makes sense since they were just introduced for this arc. Provided they aren't dead forever after this arc I'm hoping they get better characterization , or at least some screen time for Kale that isn't her fawning over lady Boring Alt Lady Goku.

[Lord Raziere]

Not seeing the Caulifla hate? They're the best part of the arc in my opinion. like Jiren is still a meaningless do-nothing slacker, U2 is a joke, U7 has lost so little members that it doesn't feel like they are in any danger of actually losing, U9 and U10 are erased, and the rest of the universes have proven ineffectual and not worth noting at all. Kale and Caulifla have characterization, power and heart to them that really is lacking among everyone else.

[Callos_DeTerran]

Spoiler: Episode 116

Show

Well... Ultra Instinct's 'rules' are given more clarity. And seriously Kefla/Kale/Cauifla is a really novice fighter, what with her thinking POWER was all that mattered. She shoulda realized otherwise when she couldn't hit Goku with a Hellzone Grenade type attack.

Spoiler: Episode 116

Show

Actually I'd say its the exact opposite. The whole point behind a Hellzone Grenade like attack is that there isn't any opening for someone to dodge through, which is primarily how UI Goku handles his defense..dodging the attack.

It also makes a Hellzone Grenade type attack the perfect example to show off Goku's new reflexes however.

[Dragonus45]

Not seeing the Caulifla hate? They're the best part of the arc in my opinion. like Jiren is still a meaningless do-nothing slacker, U2 is a joke, U7 has lost so little members that it doesn't feel like they are in any danger of actually losing, U9 and U10 are erased, and the rest of the universes have proven ineffectual and not worth noting at all. Kale and Caulifla have characterization, power and heart to them that really is lacking among everyone else.

She bores me, and reminds me a lot of Gotenks who I consider the worst part of Z. I also really dislike the whole, tingly feeling in my back to go super saiyan followed by SS2 immediately. If they had at least waited till the tournament proper and given her a bit of an arc tin a single episode to unlock it she wouldn't feel so flat. Honestly it feels like they were in such a rush to get to the big first female super saiyen moment that they rushed it forward instead of giving her the gravity the moment deserved. Which is a damn shame since much like the. Death of Superman you only get to do that for the first time once.

[Lord Raziere]

She bores me, and reminds me a lot of Gotenks who I consider the worst part of Z. I also really dislike the whole, tingly feeling in my back to go super saiyan followed by SS2 immediately. If they had at least waited till the tournament proper and given her a bit of an arc tin a single episode to unlock it she wouldn't feel so flat. Honestly it feels like they were in such a rush to get to the big first female super saiyen moment that they rushed it forward instead of giving her the gravity the moment deserved. Which is a damn shame since much like the. Death of Superman you only get to do that for the first time once.

Didn't feel flat to me, thats just your opinion man.

[Anteros]

Didn't feel flat to me, thats just your opinion man.

It's a lot of people's opinion though.

What bothers me about them is that they're basically hollow caricatures. They have very little personality outside of the trope they each fulfill. This is true for a lot of characters in Super though.

[Future Sword]

U6 is hosed. Vegeta had better win and get his wish.

[Dragonus45]

Didn't feel flat to me, thats just your opinion man.

I'm aware that's my opinion but thanks for reminding me. Its also the opinion of a fair majority of the fandom to one degree or another.