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Thread: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
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2019-04-14, 02:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-04-14, 02:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-04-14, 04:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
I'd go further than that. IRV doesn't work well for the application at all. To top it off, the fact that the curator finds running votes to be "exhausting" means the situation is biased towards inertia.
Every proposal that gets seconded by two or three or four other participants should simply be the object of a binary vote where the two options would be "implement proposal" and "don't implement proposal". (The proposal can be a mix of things, of course. So if you want A + B + C and only want them if they're together, you suggest voting on it, if four others agree, then a binary vote takes place between "implement A + B + C" and "no changes".)
Elegant, simple, and perfectly functional.
(I'd raise the support for a call for a vote to four instead of two because anything that has any chance of passing should have no problem at all getting the support of four people; raising the bar there has the effect of reducing the likelihood of a proposal that won't pass of reaching the formal voting stage, which would be an useless exercise.)Offer good while supplies last. Two to a customer. Each item sold separately. Batteries not included. Mileage may vary. All sales are final. Allow six weeks for delivery. Some items not available. Some assembly required. Some restrictions may apply. All entries become our property. Employees not eligible. Entry fees not refundable. Local restrictions apply. Void where prohibited. Except in Indiana.
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2019-04-14, 05:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Where exactly? There's a pale blue spot on the end of the black spike, but that looks like a lighting thing than an eye.
That has quite a bit of "interesting, but...", none of which I want to talk about right now because that's too much thinking about stuff that needs solid days of thought, not 5-20 minutes.
Also, would we need double the people to nominate your proposal in order to get it to go to Grey Wolf, or would the normal amount do...?Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2019-04-14 at 05:21 PM.
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 05:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
No, it is neither elegant nor functional and certainly not simple. Running 20 voting procedures instead of one would be even more exhausting. Not to mention is completely disregards that many people only multiples changes if they go together, while others will only want them individually, meaning I'd have to run 7 votes for a simple "A, B, C" suggestion of your example (A or not A? B or not B? C or not C? A & B or not A & B? A & C or not A & C? B & C or Not B & C? A and B and C or not?), never mind a realistic scenario like the last vote where there were ~10 suggestions. And that's not even going into the trivial scenarios where contradictory conclusions could easily result, such as voting for both increasing an decreasing the size threshold, or in this example, A and B individually being wanted, but A & B being voted down.
Your continued refusal to learn how the voting works is now being counted against you for all further communications. You failed to understand how it worked, and have been railing against a process you clearly have demonstrated multiple times you don't understand. I suggest you educate yourself before you continue to make a fool of yourself.
For the record, what made it most exhausting was you. You and your ignorance. If I could make sure not to have to listen to your blabber about the process I'd run Kish's new voting request tomorrow. But as long as you are involved, it is exhausting to contemplate. I am not at all interested in going another 20 pages of people trying to explain to you how the system works, given your penchant for misrepresenting it and your clear incapability of grasping it.
Grey WolfLast edited by Grey_Wolf_c; 2019-04-14 at 07:59 PM.
Interested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
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Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2019-04-14, 05:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
If you are the hero of a kingdom, and whenever the king wants a new sofa you have to spend 50 days to go through the Trail of Horrors to fetch a Lumpersand Beast pelt, then even if you are loyal to the king and would do anything to him, you would still be really annoyed when he asks for a new sofa. Why? Because even if you can do it safely, and even if it is not too much trouble, its still 50 days travelling through the Trail of Horrors.
Same concept here: Grey Wolf is arguably obligated to do votes, and does them willingly. That doesn't mean he wants to do them constantly nor that he doesn't find them tiring to do.An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 05:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
It is not just about me, although let me be clear that I do find it tiring even when I don't have to deal with lio45. There is a well-known phenomenon called (at least in my own language, I'm translating on the spot) "decision exhaustion". The more you ask people to vote, the less they vote because it becomes boring and routine to do so. It is most known to happen in the US, where they vote on every imaginable governmental position, sometimes even several times per year. People stop caring after a (very short) while, and only the most dedicated show up, leading to warped results that don't truly represent consensus.
Imagine how much worse it would be for making decisions affecting a silly internet thread. I am happy we got as many participants as we did last time, and I am in no hurry to abuse their patience by asking them to vote again on items that in all honesty had their chance to be voted on not a month back. I'm sorry for Kish, but I want a cool-off period between votes, not just for my own sake but for the sake of everyone not 100% committed to this thread, which should be all of us. The Giant's comments thread uses 3 months. That feels about right.
Grey WolfLast edited by Grey_Wolf_c; 2019-04-14 at 07:36 PM.
Interested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
Deep in the corners of your mind
Where reality is an intruder
And myth and legend thrive
Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2019-04-14, 06:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
On the one hand, indeed. On the other, if homebrew 5e citations count, I'll be back in 5 minutes with a counter-citation.
Im good with whichever, its win-win for me.
The ways of the bullhonkey are mysterious indeed. Such is the burden of not using bull**** instead.Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2019-04-14, 06:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-04-14, 07:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
If I could vote for how long it should be until we vote again I'd vote for this lol.
And to those who want to vote right now, I say bullhonkey!!
I'm interested to hear about the Hagunnemon from any source, as it seems like the best option right now and any evidence in favor of it or against it should be brought to light asap.Peelee's Lurker Lotsey Leader
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2019-04-14, 07:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 07:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
For the record, it's two months*; I'm twelve days out from the next update.
* It's actually two months or six quotes, whichever comes first; but "quotes by the Giant" is a much more objective target than "suggestions for adjusting criteria by any of numerous posters" in a thread, FBS or in general. The closest equivalent would be "X number of new strips with MitD appearances", which is...unlikely to be a useful metric.FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2019-04-14, 07:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Interested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
Deep in the corners of your mind
Where reality is an intruder
And myth and legend thrive
Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2019-04-14, 08:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-
About the Hanguandaonemonn, I am an avid Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy fan (if that wasn't obvious) yet I didn't know that the Protean's origins aren't in mythology or urban legends but rather from the works of Douglas Adams.An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 08:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
The Uvuudaum has a special quality called Blindsight, which leads me to believe that it does not have eyes. I'm with Squire Doodad, that pale spot is just light reflecting off of the beak-thing near its base.
This signature was written by me, Aveline, to indicate that this message was written by me, Aveline.
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2019-04-14, 08:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 08:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
I, on the other hand, don't think that information about the inspiration for a D&D monster should be considered when evaluating the D&D monster's candidacy. A D&D monster is its own thing, independent from whatever inspired it, and information about the inspiration is simply not relevant to the D&D monster, either in general or in the context of whether it could be MitD.
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2019-04-14, 09:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Fair enough, but it could be used to make sense of a few comments. Like the "have I ever been drawn" bit for a being that technically originates from a strictly non-visual media.
Out of curiosity, what section is the list of names under? Or is that going to be revealed when the time inevitably (apocalypse notwithstanding) comes?Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2019-04-14 at 09:03 PM.
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-04-14, 09:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
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2019-04-14, 09:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
The description for Blindsight doesn't say that creatures with the ability don't have eyes, but I would agree that the Uvuudaum's art suggests otherwise. That said, if we're willing to accept the Hagunemnon can have two stationary eyes without additional ones popping up spontaneously, it seems fair to consider it a similar con to the Uvuudaum's lack of eyes.
Looking at Blindsight's description, I wonder about this quality:Blindsight never allows a creature to distinguish color or visual contrast. A creature cannot read with blindsight.
... Unrelated, but is anyone up for going to a game of bullhockey later? The way they make it around the rink is just, well, it's an experience!feed the crows
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2019-04-14, 09:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Five gold says ol' GW_c just digs for a, minute and pulls from here when the time comes. "Here," of course, updating every thread iteration.
If there's a different way, well, that one also works.
I propose we play down in my neck of the woods!Last edited by Peelee; 2019-04-14 at 09:44 PM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2019-04-14, 09:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-04-14, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
I automatically copy over the list of names suggested to each new thread. So I simply added your suggestion to the top of said list in the last thread (~page 44, IIRC). When the time comes, even if we both have forgotten this conversation, it'll be copied over. The same exact thing happened last thread - someone wanted a suggestion recalled, so I put it on the list, and indeed that person (who had forgotten) was able to vote for it regardless.
Grey WolfInterested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
Deep in the corners of your mind
Where reality is an intruder
And myth and legend thrive
Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2019-04-14, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Last edited by Peelee; 2019-04-14 at 10:03 PM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2019-04-14, 11:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
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2019-04-14, 11:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-04-15, 12:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Looks like you don't understand the proposed improvements, then.
Running 20 voting procedures instead of one would be even more exhausting. Not to mention is completely disregards that many people only multiples changes if they go together, while others will only want them individually, meaning I'd have to run 7 votes for a simple "A, B, C" suggestion of your example (A or not A? B or not B? C or not C? A & B or not A & B? A & C or not A & C? B & C or Not B & C? A and B and C or not?)
Your continued refusal to learn how the voting works is now being counted against you for all further communications. You failed to understand how it worked, and have been railing against a process you clearly have demonstrated multiple times you don't understand. I suggest you educate yourself before you continue to make a fool of yourself.
If I could make sure not to have to listen to your blabber about the process I'd run Kish's new voting request tomorrow.
(Reforming this thread's voting system is guaranteed to help improve the quality of the FBS contenders, IMO. It's a no brainer.)Offer good while supplies last. Two to a customer. Each item sold separately. Batteries not included. Mileage may vary. All sales are final. Allow six weeks for delivery. Some items not available. Some assembly required. Some restrictions may apply. All entries become our property. Employees not eligible. Entry fees not refundable. Local restrictions apply. Void where prohibited. Except in Indiana.
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2019-04-15, 12:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
I don't know what is homebrew and what isn't. It is the first link that popped up when googling, it says D&D. As a non-player, to me it looks as authentic as the next.
Thats why I asked a couple weeks back whether any descriptions in books or Giant's playing time did NOT contain that, as it helps the Protean as guessing candidate.
At any rate, "Citation needed" was used as a short and abrasive counter argument, as usually. He didn't bother to be specific, and such is the answer he gets.
Your observation is inaccurate, which you can (could) very easily note once you
A follow the discussion that led to me first using it
and
B look closely at the couple instances I have used it since.
Wasn't it "Have I been drawn?"
If it was like that, it really suggests to me a monster Rich knew from a non-visual source, but ultimately wasn't 100% sure to never have been drawn. Like, he wouldn't want someone to point out an obscure picture after the reveal and say "You said he never was painted you liar!!"
That, or it is just some misdirection and he has been painted all the time...Last edited by Mightymosy; 2019-04-15 at 12:33 AM.
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2019-04-15, 12:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Understandable. At the bottom of the page, it says "Back to Main Page → 5e Homebrew → Races," meaning you're looking at a page in the races of 5e homebrew. d20 SRD tends to be a better source, since D&D wiki has an overly large homebrew section that loves to get top results in search rankings.
The discussion that led to you using it, where I said it was a PG version of an ift-censired word, which you don't use it as and/or do not understand how it's typically used?Last edited by Peelee; 2019-04-15 at 12:25 AM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2019-04-15, 04:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: MitD XIII: Learning is happening
Huh? Funny how there aren't any other lighting spots; it's an eye. Look at the picture of the Infernal and you'll see the eyes are red spots. Look at the Phaethon and you'll see that its eyes are white spots. Ditto the Phane. Do you really want me to go through the whole list of ELH monsters?