2/28/2013 - Update on Thumb
12/31/2012 - There's a New Comic
12/12/2012 - The "Lost" Holiday Ornament (and Child's Play)
11/26/2012 - Leftover OOTS Swag on Sale (+Thumb Report)
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)

Order of the Stick 889 Get Real
Erfworld 163 The End of Book One
Erfworld Now at Erfworld.com!
RSS Feeds: OOTS

The Duke's Wolf, Part Four by Amber E. Scott
The Duke's Wolf, Part Three by Amber E. Scott
The Duke's Wolf, Part Two by Amber E. Scott

The New World, Part 9: Barbarians by Rich Burlew
The New World, Part 8: Gnomes by Rich Burlew
The New World, Part 7: Names and Cultures by Rich Burlew
Looking for the Gaming Articles?

 



Welcome back! Be sure you have read and understand the Forum Rules.


Go Back   Giant in the Playground Forums > Gaming > Homebrew Design
Register FAQ Members List Mark Forums Read End

Homebrew Design Roll up your sleeves and get working: there's lots of homebrewin' to be done! Post your custom creation for critiques or review those of your peers.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-21-2010, 04:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #31
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForzaFiori View Post
Maybe have a feat to let you get extra brawler abilities too. If you can do it with maneuvers, why not these?
Hrmm. Maybe.
Also, I just realized a nasty combo.
Dirty Fighting+Close and Personal+Hit em while they're down+Candy from a baby+ Clever Tactics+ Injury to Insult.

As part of you're trip attempt, you move into the opponent's square. Close and Personal gives you an attack when you do this. Use that attack for Dirty Fighting, rendering them flat footed, this means Candy from a Baby gives you an additional bonus on your trip check.
Injury to Insult+Imp Trip+Hewtd=2 attacks at a x2 bonus and they're tripped.
If you also have sucker punch, that would be 2 attacks at a x3 bonus (IIRC DnD Multipliers are logarithmic, x2+x2=x3).
Of course, such a combo requires ALOT of brawler abilities, so I'm okay with it. That's really a theme I like for the Brawler abilities. Individually they're okay, but they can synergize very well if you pick the right ones.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler

Last edited by BRC : 04-21-2010 at 04:42 PM.
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2010, 04:44 PM   Top  -  End  -  #32
Lyndworm
Firbolg in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: 
An hour out of Chicago
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

I love this class. I don't really have anything to add to it, I just wanted to sow my support.
__________________
Linnormatar by the ever-wonderful Serpentine.Visit Beautiful Gatazka Today!
The World in my Head | The Mechanical Guide
I'm hardly an expert, but if you ever need anything, feel free to PM me. Build advice, homebrew advice,
elaboration of a post I made, explanation of/for my homebrew, my Social Security number, or a friendly ear.
Lyndworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2010, 06:23 PM   Top  -  End  -  #33
Magikeeper
Dwarf in the Playground
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 
IL, USA
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

The easiest way to prevent dips is thus:

> Have the brawler gain brawler abilities on even levels. I.E., 2-4-6-8-10-12-14-16-18-20. It would still be dippable, but much less so for tight builds.

That would result in a table kinda like this:
Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special  
1st +1 +2 +0 +0 Improved Unarmed Strike, Brawler’s Fists (1d6)  
2nd +2 +3 +0 +0 Brawler Ability
3rd +3 +3 +1 +1 Speak Softly
4th +4 +4 +1 +1 Brawler Ability , Brawler’s Fists (1d8)
5th +5 +4 +1 +1 Supernatural Brawler ability
6th +6/+1 +5 +2 +2 Brawler Ability
7th +7/+2 +5 +2 +2 Mighty Boast
8th +8/+3 +6 +2 +2 Brawler Ability, Brawler’s Fists (1d10)
9th +9/+4 +6 +3 +3
10th +10/+5 +7 +3 +3 Supernatural Brawler Ability, Brawler Ability
11th +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +3
12th +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +4 Brawler Ability , Brawler’s Fists (2d6)  
13th +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +4 Juggernaught
14th +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +4 Brawler Ability
15th +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +5 Supernatural Brawler Ability
16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +5 Brawler Ability , Brawler’s Fists (2d8)
17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +6 +6
18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +6 Brawler Ability
19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +6 Champion
20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +6 Supernatural Brawler Ability, Brawler’s Fists (2d10)

There would be new dead levels at 9th, 11th, and 17th. Although I think Mighty boast is kinda weird at level 7 - it could be added to level 3 alongside speak softly. It would only be +1 attack/damage at level 3. Doing this would leave the following dead levels:

7-9-11-17

Level 17 could be "Boisterous Nature: At level 17th the Brawler can use his Mighty Boast as often as he desires. Furthermore, whenever he uses Mighty Boast he may make an intimidate check as a free action."

Level 11 could be Massive Brute

Level 9 and 7 could be... perhaps something that can double as non-combat abilities? I actually managed to think of some that fit the brawler:

Level 7 – Hulking Roar: A 7th level Brawler can, as a swift action, let out a mighty bellow or proclamation. This roar can be heard over nearly any amount of noise, effectively making it a DC -50 listen check to hear him. This bellow can be used to make intimidate checks on all opponents in a 30ft radius, or just to be heard over a loud scuffle.

Level 9 – Subtle Pump: At 9th level the Brawler gains the ability to intimidate with just a glance. Whenever the Brawler successfully intimidates a target they must make a sense motive check against the Brawler’s intimidate check or else think that the brawler wasn’t even trying to intimidate them. This doubles any penalties given by being intimidated and intimidated foes do not become unfriendly after the duration of the effect ends. Any onlookers that may also make a sense motive check against the brawler’s intimidate check. Failure means they do not notice that the brawler actively intimidated the target.

Last edited by Magikeeper : 04-21-2010 at 06:32 PM.
Magikeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 12:25 PM   Top  -  End  -  #34
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Hmm, Brawler abilities on even levels should work. Helps prevent Dips, but dosn't make Multiclassing impossible.

As for an "Extra Brawler Ability" Feat. I think I'll allow it, but give it a requirement of Brawler Level 3rd or something.
The point is, I don't want somebody taking 1 Brawler level in order to get 2 feats for the price of 1 with things like Brutal and Cunning tactics.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 03:02 PM   Top  -  End  -  #35
Magikeeper
Dwarf in the Playground
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 
IL, USA
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRC View Post
As for an "Extra Brawler Ability" Feat. I think I'll allow it, but give it a requirement of Brawler Level 3rd or something.
The point is, I don't want somebody taking 1 Brawler level in order to get 2 feats for the price of 1 with things like Brutal and Cunning tactics.

How about: Prerequisite : Base Attack Bonus +6, Two Brawler Abilties

That requires you be at least a 6th level PC with at least 4 levels of Brawler. I'm not sure I'd let you take the feat multiple times, but this helps allow Brawlers to multi-class a little.

What is your opinion on my other suggestions?
Magikeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2010, 03:03 PM   Top  -  End  -  #36
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magikeeper View Post
How about: Prerequisite : Base Attack Bonus +6, Two Brawler Abilties

That requires you be at least a 6th level PC with at least 4 levels of Brawler. I'm not sure I'd let you take the feat multiple times, but this helps allow Brawlers to multi-class a little.

What is your opinion on my other suggestions?
I like them. I'll update the first post as soon as I get around to it.

Edit: That feat format is good. It also stops a straight brawler from pulling off some of the nastier ability combos at low levels by spending Feats.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler

Last edited by BRC : 04-22-2010 at 03:07 PM.
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 01:12 PM   Top  -  End  -  #37
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

First post Updated. I need to clean up the formatting, but I'll do that later.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 02:41 AM   Top  -  End  -  #38
NakedCelt
Dwarf in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: 
Dunedin, New Zealand
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

So many people have independently thought of making unarmed warrior classes called "The Brawler", I've started collecting them... there's this one and this one and this one (cough) and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and, on a different board, this one, and I'm sure plenty more. Maybe someone should drop a hint to Wizards of the Coast.
NakedCelt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 10:04 AM   Top  -  End  -  #39
Magikeeper
Dwarf in the Playground
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 
IL, USA
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NakedCelt View Post
So many people have independently thought of making unarmed warrior classes called "The Brawler", I've started collecting them... there's this one and this one and this one (cough) and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and this one and, on a different board, this one, and I'm sure plenty more. Maybe someone should drop a hint to Wizards of the Coast.
Lets compare!

Spoiler

Last edited by Magikeeper : 04-24-2010 at 10:06 AM.
Magikeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 01:18 PM   Top  -  End  -  #40
Cute_Riolu
Barbarian in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Looking good... Looks like you could use some more supernatural abilities, though. However, given its flavor, it seems that it would be best were they not overt.

I do have an ulterior motive in that, though. One of my players in a low magic game is thinking on this class. :P
__________________
Formerly known as Cariyaga.
Cute_Riolu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 01:28 PM   Top  -  End  -  #41
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cute_Riolu View Post
Looking good... Looks like you could use some more supernatural abilities, though. However, given its flavor, it seems that it would be best were they not overt.

I do have an ulterior motive in that, though. One of my players in a low magic game is thinking on this class. :P
AWESOME. Tell me how it goes.

Some more Supernats would be nice, but I don't know what to do for those. They should be subtle things, not "The Brawlers fist lights on fire" or anything, externally, one shouldn't be able to recognize the ability at all, except through careful study. A Brawler may not even realize they possess these abilities. Upon being told that you need silver weapons to hurt werewolves, they might just say "Huh, you do? I headbutted one to death just last week". Maybe something like
Warriors Blessing: Increase your Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution by 1 point.
Tough Skin: You gain DR/- equal to your brawler level/5.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler

Last edited by BRC : 04-24-2010 at 03:00 PM.
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 01:30 PM   Top  -  End  -  #42
Cute_Riolu
Barbarian in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Heheh, I will. It might be a bit, though, I'm still getting things together for it. And yeah, that's exactly the kind of things I was thinking. I'll think on it and get back to you with some more abilities. :3
__________________
Formerly known as Cariyaga.
Cute_Riolu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 03:00 PM   Top  -  End  -  #43
Lyndworm
Firbolg in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: 
An hour out of Chicago
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRC View Post
AWESOME. Tell me how it goes.

Some more Supernats would be nice, but I don't know what to do for those. They should be subtle things, not "The Brawlers fist lights on fire" or anything, externally, one shouldn't be able to recognize the ability at all. Maybe something like
Warriors Blessing: Increase your Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution by 1 point.
Tough Skin: You gain DR/- equal to your brawler level/5.
Warrior's Blessing seems good, but Tough Skin is kind of pointless. At level 5 you have DR1/-. At level 10 you have DR2/-. At level 15 you have DR3/-. At level 20 you only receive DR4/-.

Brawler level divided by two might be a little better, but I won't swear that this won't seem very powerful at lower levels.
__________________
Linnormatar by the ever-wonderful Serpentine.Visit Beautiful Gatazka Today!
The World in my Head | The Mechanical Guide
I'm hardly an expert, but if you ever need anything, feel free to PM me. Build advice, homebrew advice,
elaboration of a post I made, explanation of/for my homebrew, my Social Security number, or a friendly ear.
Lyndworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 03:11 PM   Top  -  End  -  #44
molten_dragon
Barbarian in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: 
The State of Denial
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

It looks pretty cool at first glance. I think most of the rest of the people here have covered what I might say, but I do have one minor suggestion.

Quote:
Chair, Not a weapon!: A Brawler may use an improvised weapon without penalty, this weapon deals damage as one size larger than the Brawler’s unarmed strike, but cannot be used in conjunction with other special abilities.
This ability is a little bit unclear, specifically the part about how much damage it deals. Does it deal damage as if the brawler were a size category larger, or does it deal damage equal to the next step up on the unarmed damage chart.

For example, a 6th level brawler normally deals 1d8 damage with an unarmed strike. Would he deal 1d10, or 2d6 damage when using the 'Chair, not a weapon' ability? If it's the former, what happens if a level 20 brawler uses this ability?
__________________
If build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day.

If you set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

My Homebrew
molten_dragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 03:32 PM   Top  -  End  -  #45
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by molten_dragon View Post
It looks pretty cool at first glance. I think most of the rest of the people here have covered what I might say, but I do have one minor suggestion.



This ability is a little bit unclear, specifically the part about how much damage it deals. Does it deal damage as if the brawler were a size category larger, or does it deal damage equal to the next step up on the unarmed damage chart.

For example, a 6th level brawler normally deals 1d8 damage with an unarmed strike. Would he deal 1d10, or 2d6 damage when using the 'Chair, not a weapon' ability? If it's the former, what happens if a level 20 brawler uses this ability?
Chair, not a weapon does need a better description. Hrm, maybe like this.
"Chair, not a weapon!": When using a large improvised weapon a Brawler takes no penalty. The weapon is counted as being wielded with both hands and cannot be finessed, When using such a weapon the brawler deals damage as if they were one size category larger and using their Unarmed Strike, or the damage the improvised weapon would do normally, whichever is higher.
"Barroom Assassin": when using a small, sharp improvised weapon (Like a broken bottle), a Brawler takes no penalty on attack rolls. In addition, their critical hit multiplier with unarmed strikes goes up by one.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler

Last edited by BRC : 04-24-2010 at 03:36 PM.
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2010, 03:46 PM   Top  -  End  -  #46
Magikeeper
Dwarf in the Playground
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 
IL, USA
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Edit: Yeah, I think man of the book is underpowered. Replacing the joke +10 circumstance bonus on bluff checks made to convince people you know stuff about religion with the ghost touch ability. So Man of the Book is now the undead-ridden-game ability of choice. I changed the mindless undead/outsider ability to something more fun. Now it makes them both easier to run from and easier to chase down!
Edit 2: Huh. I forgot that DR/Magic also causes your natural attacks to count as being magical...
Edit 3: Added an ability to Man of the Streets.


I was just thinking about the supernaturals.

Suggestions:

Man of the Land: The brawler gains scent, a +2 natural armor bonus, and his speed increases by 10ft. Also, the Brawler can ignore the racial immunities of plants, vermin, and magical beasts when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt.

Man of the Book: The brawler gains DR X/Magic, where X is equal to his class level divided by 4 (rounded down). Also, the Brawler can ignore the racial immunities of outsiders and undead when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt. Mindless outsiders/undead that are intimidated in this way move at half speed. Furthermore, the brawler can now attack incorporeal targets as though his unarmed strikes had the ghost touch special quality.

Man of the Inanimate: The brawler gains Resistance X against all elements, where X is equal to twice his class level. Also, the Brawler can ignore the racial immunities of elementals and constructs when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt. Furthermore, the brawler no longer needs to eat, drink, or breathe although he can still do so. He still needs to sleep.

Man of the Crazed: The Brawler gains 10ft Blindsight and becomes immune to any effect that would be suppressed by Protection From Evil. Also, the Brawler can ignore the racial immunities of fey and aberrations when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt.

Man of the Streets:: The Brawler can take '10' on any strength-based check, even when distracted or threatened. Also, the Brawler can ignore the racial immunities of humanoids, monstrous humanoids, and animals when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt. I’m not sure there are any humanoids or animals that have such a racial immunity. Note that the ability would work for intimidate.

I would change “Magic Hands” into the following:
Edit: DR/magic grants the magic hands effect, so I added in "dress wearing pansy!" as well:

Mage Puncher: A Brawler’s unarmed strikes are treated as Magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction and he gains Spell Resistance equal to 8 + his current Brawler level. Also, the Brawler can ignore magically granted immunities when making intimidate checks. This includes supernatural class abilities. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt, which stacks with other abilities if the creature would normally be doubly immune (Like an undead lich that cast mindblank).



I like the intimidate parts, not sure if I picked the right battle abilities to go with them.

Last edited by Magikeeper : 04-24-2010 at 10:18 PM.
Magikeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2010, 09:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #47
Averagedog
Bugbear in the Playground
 
SamuraiGuy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 
Illinois
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Have you considered having the brawler be eligible for fighter bonus feats much in the same way Warblades are?
__________________
Benedictus, Venit in Nomine, in Nomine, Domini, Hossanna in Excelsis........
Averagedog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2010, 10:03 PM   Top  -  End  -  #48
Lyndworm
Firbolg in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: 
An hour out of Chicago
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

I still love this class, by the way, and desperately want to try it out on a Thri-Kreen, but that's unrelated to the nature of this post.

I wanted to comment on the Mage Puncher ability that Magikeeper suggested. In my opinion, SR 8+Class levels is kind of weak. Anything less than 10+Class levels is sort of a joke, because any caster who would bother targeting you can make the check more than 50% of the time. Just throwing that out there.
__________________
Linnormatar by the ever-wonderful Serpentine.Visit Beautiful Gatazka Today!
The World in my Head | The Mechanical Guide
I'm hardly an expert, but if you ever need anything, feel free to PM me. Build advice, homebrew advice,
elaboration of a post I made, explanation of/for my homebrew, my Social Security number, or a friendly ear.
Lyndworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2010, 11:21 PM   Top  -  End  -  #49
Cute_Riolu
Barbarian in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyndworm View Post
I still love this class, by the way, and desperately want to try it out on a Thri-Kreen, but that's unrelated to the nature of this post.

I wanted to comment on the Mage Puncher ability that Magikeeper suggested. In my opinion, SR 8+Class levels is kind of weak. Anything less than 10+Class levels is sort of a joke, because any caster who would bother targeting you can make the check more than 50% of the time. Just throwing that out there.
Which gives a % chance of a spell failing outright. I'd say that's pretty handy.
__________________
Formerly known as Cariyaga.
Cute_Riolu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 12:29 AM   Top  -  End  -  #50
Magikeeper
Dwarf in the Playground
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 
IL, USA
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyndworm View Post
I still love this class, by the way, and desperately want to try it out on a Thri-Kreen, but that's unrelated to the nature of this post.
You too, huh?

On Mage Puncher I took that amount from the current DWP ability. No reason it couldn't be 10, although I'm not sure what the power level of the SBAs should be.

I do think Man of the Land is a bit on the weak side, so

Man of the Land: The brawler gains scent, a +2 natural armor bonus, and his speed increases by 10ft. The natural armor bonus stacks with similar bonuses and increases by 1 for every three class levels (rounded down). Also, the brawler can ignore the racial immunities of plants, vermin, and magical beasts when making intimidate checks. He receives a -4 penalty if the creature would normally be immune to the attempt.

So, +3 AC at level 5, +4 at level 6, +5 at level 9, +6 at level 12, and after that AC doesn't matter. It probably doesn't matter at level 12, really. Might be worth taking early, not so much as one of the later abilities.



Also, more suggestions:

Fists you can Believe In: The brawler’s unarmed strikes count as one of the following per 5 levels: [Lawful, Chaotic, Good, or Evil] for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction. Furthermore, any enemy whose damage reduction can be overcome by the brawler receives a -10 penalty on intimidate checks against the brawler or any of the brawler’s allies. Finally, the brawler recieves a +X bonus on all saving throws where X is equal to the brawler’s level divided by 4 (rounded down).


Here is one more ability. I’m not sure I like this one, but we have so many abilities that work great with this archtype:
Spoiler



Here are some more normal brawler abilities:
Spoiler


---------------------------


Boisterous Nature needs descriptive text in the front post btw.
Also, do Constant Sway + Big Stepper + Close and Personal form an infinite combo if you have 2+ enemies next to each other (Sway during the AoO to gain another AoO), or does CaP count against your AoOs for the round (at which point it isn’t an infinite combo until epic)? Or am I wrong?

Last edited by Magikeeper : 04-28-2010 at 12:36 AM.
Magikeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 10:42 AM   Top  -  End  -  #51
Lix Lorn
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: 
Missing her corner
Gender: Male2Female
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Hiya.
I have a couple of ideas:
A standard ability-
Neck Snap
Increase your threat range by one. This stacks with Improved Critical and similar effects.

A Supernatural ability-
Steel Fists
All threats you make are automatically confirmed.

I like this class. :3
__________________
Recent Homebrew:
My anima stands ready!
Pick a celestial, any celestial
Valley Dwarves-Vodka, Blizzards, and Wolves
Spoiler

Spoiler
Lix Lorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 10:54 AM   Top  -  End  -  #52
Averagedog
Bugbear in the Playground
 
SamuraiGuy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 
Illinois
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

After building a character using this class, I can safely say that the brawler really relies on anyone with healing magic. The Brawler defensive prospects are very low, except for his d12 hit die of course :P. The brawler ability versus fear is quite nice, but it doesn't help against other will save effects, which will be key to eliminating or simply neutralizing the Brawler. If defensive abilities were made for the Brawler, it will detract greatly from his damage output due to having many choices with few slots to put them in.

Otherwise, I currently see it as a fairly balanced glass cannon.
__________________
Benedictus, Venit in Nomine, in Nomine, Domini, Hossanna in Excelsis........
Averagedog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 11:08 AM   Top  -  End  -  #53
Lix Lorn
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: 
Missing her corner
Gender: Male2Female
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

By the way,
I want to quote something Kuma Kode said.
Quote:
I've actually been looking for a decent unarmed class that isn't based around some kind of eastern lore. It seems Wizards of the Coast believe the Japanese invented the punch.
Extended signature.
__________________
Recent Homebrew:
My anima stands ready!
Pick a celestial, any celestial
Valley Dwarves-Vodka, Blizzards, and Wolves
Spoiler

Spoiler
Lix Lorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 12:41 PM   Top  -  End  -  #54
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Alright, time for some full on comment responding
Concerning Magikeeper's "Man of the" abilities. I don't know, they just don't seem to fit for some reason, maybe it's the names, maybe it's how they're multi-faceted while all the other abilities mainly just do one thing. I'll chew on them, but I dunno.
Neck Snap seems like it should increase the multiplier, not the range.
Averagedog: Did you actually play it, or just build it? Can we see the build you used? Also, how reliant are we talking. Is this "Strap a gnome cleric to your back or else you're dead meat" or "Buy the party healer a wand of CLW and a box of chocolates".

How would people feel about giving them Evasion as a class feature (As opposed to a Brawler ability), improving their saving throws, or maybe let them use Potions as a Swift action?

I think we should establish that either Constant Sway can't be used on an AoE, or that Close and Personal counts as an attack of opportunity.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 03:54 PM   Top  -  End  -  #55
Lix Lorn
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: 
Missing her corner
Gender: Male2Female
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRC View Post
Neck Snap seems like it should increase the multiplier, not the range.
Averagedog: Did you actually play it, or just build it? Can we see the build you used? Also, how reliant are we talking. Is this "Strap a gnome cleric to your back or else you're dead meat" or "Buy the party healer a wand of CLW and a box of chocolates".
You may be right. I couldn't think of a better name for a threat increaser...
Also... Can I sig part of that? XD
__________________
Recent Homebrew:
My anima stands ready!
Pick a celestial, any celestial
Valley Dwarves-Vodka, Blizzards, and Wolves
Spoiler

Spoiler
Lix Lorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 04:02 PM   Top  -  End  -  #56
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lix Lorn View Post
You may be right. I couldn't think of a better name for a threat increaser...
Also... Can I sig part of that? XD
Go right ahead.

I have been informed that, as worded, Massive Brute could be interpreted as doing a good deal more than I intended it to, but that if I fix it, the Brawler will need more defensive stuff, preferably defensive stuff that dosn't eat up Brawler abilities.
Also, I think I'm definetally going to give them Evasion.
Here's one idea I had, dunno how well it would work.
Flesh Wound: At Sixth Level, a brawler learns to shrug off trivial wounds. Any attack that fails to deal more damage than (Brawlers Hit Die+Brawler's CON modifier) has no effect. So against a 6th level brawler with 16 con, an attack that deals 10 damage would act as normal, while one that deals 9 damage would be negated.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 04:13 PM   Top  -  End  -  #57
Lix Lorn
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: 
Missing her corner
Gender: Male2Female
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

I think that should be Class Level rather than hit dice.
And thanks.
__________________
Recent Homebrew:
My anima stands ready!
Pick a celestial, any celestial
Valley Dwarves-Vodka, Blizzards, and Wolves
Spoiler

Spoiler
Lix Lorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 04:14 PM   Top  -  End  -  #58
Averagedog
Bugbear in the Playground
 
SamuraiGuy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 
Illinois
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

wow, while flesh wound is, by no doubt, pretty original. It is very overpowered. It essentially negates damage from physical ranged attacks and mooks. While it is by no doubt epic, it's potential in "real" situations does nothing against bigger badder enemies and completely negates a horde of mooks.

Let's use the barbarian as an example: The barbarian get's DR 5 by level 19 and has access to feats that can increase the DR (especially if he has 20 con, see the monster manual feats for details). DR 5 doesn't negate all damage and only can against minor scratches or glancing wounds (though larger creatures generally do more than glancing blows, or if they are they really really hurt). Fleshwound on the other hand is currently so strong for reasons I have already stated :P.

so basically, you are giving the brawler (Brawlers Hit Die+Brawler's CON modifier - 1) DR
__________________
Benedictus, Venit in Nomine, in Nomine, Domini, Hossanna in Excelsis........
Averagedog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 04:16 PM   Top  -  End  -  #59
Lix Lorn
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: 
Missing her corner
Gender: Male2Female
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

No, cause if you have DR 9 and get hit for 10 damage, you take one. If you have Flesh Wound, you take ten.
__________________
Recent Homebrew:
My anima stands ready!
Pick a celestial, any celestial
Valley Dwarves-Vodka, Blizzards, and Wolves
Spoiler

Spoiler
Lix Lorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2010, 04:23 PM   Top  -  End  -  #60
BRC
Titan in the Playground
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 
On Paper
Gender: Male
Default Re: The Brawler (Base Class, PEACH!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Averagedog View Post
wow, while flesh wound is, by no doubt, pretty original. It is very overpowered. It essentially negates damage from physical ranged attacks and mooks. While it is by no doubt epic, it's potential in "real" situations does nothing against bigger badder enemies and completely negates a horde of mooks.

Let's use the barbarian as an example: The barbarian get's DR 5 by level 19 and has access to feats that can increase the DR (especially if he has 20 con, see the monster manual feats for details). DR 5 doesn't negate all damage and only can against minor scratches or glancing wounds (though larger creatures generally do more than glancing blows, or if they are they really really hurt). Fleshwound on the other hand is currently so strong for reasons I have already stated :P.

so basically, you are giving the brawler (Brawlers Hit Die+Brawler's CON modifier - 1) DR
Flesh Wound was my Crazy Idea to throw out there before I move on to more sensible stuff, by which I mean one of two things.

Of course, mind you, DnD Already has Mooks as fairly useless, this just makes them useless in a different way.
Of course, it's also worthless against heavier hitters.
1) Give the brawler ways to boost their AC
or
2) Give the brawler more hit points.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsurion View Post
I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much everything BRC posts is full of awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiasaur11 View Post
So, Astronaut, War Hero, or hideous Mantis Man, hop to it! The future of humanity is in your capable hands and or terrifying organic scythes.
My Homebrew:Synchronized Swordsmen,Dual Daggers,The Doctor,The Preacher,The Brawler
BRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:18 AM.



Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Usage of this site, including but not limited to making or editing a post or private message or the creation of an account, constitutes acceptance of the Forum Rules.