LGBTitp - Part Six

[Danne]

Originally Posted by Dracons

I want to be a father. But I doubt any agency would allow a single male that couldn't get a girlfriend to save God's life (If... he was threatened somehow) to adopt.

Hi Dracons. I'm sorry I can't really offer advice for your other problems, though I would like to say that I'm confident that there's someone out there who can love you. Also that the girl you wrote about sounds very immature and not a particularly nice person, and that's not your fault.

But I can respond to the part about adopting as a single man. Specifically: yes. Yes, you can, if it's something you're serious about. While most international countries don't allow single men to adopt (there are some, but not the big ones like China or Russia) more and more single men are adopting through domestic adoptions. The most common option is to adopt from foster care (either starting out as a foster parent and then adopting the kids you're placed with, or skipping straight to adoption), and if you're interested there's an article about that here. There are also adoption agencies who would work with you (they'll say right on their website if they work with single men or not) so poke around online to look for one in your area. Here is an article on single parent adoption in general; some of it's geared toward women but there are sections for men, too. Alternatively, you could investigate surrogacy, though that can be very expensive.

In short, there are obstacles and prejudices out there, but there are also people who understand that single people (both men and women) can make great parents. If you're serious about becoming a father even if you can't find a partner, don't write yourself off just yet!

Originally Posted by Glug

My friend is a leader for the student LGBT community (and there are loads of trans people there). I think that by doing it he's unwittingly making a statement that transgendered people aren't serious about what they want. He scans as female less than 1/3rd of the time usually, but combined with women's clothing the scan probably goes the other way. I think it undermines his own best interest.

And I'm saying, who are you to decide what's in his best interest? If he wants to crossdress, that's his business. If he's not actively hurting himself (i.e. wearing women's clothes because he's suddenly having trouble with being trans, which doesn't seem to be the case) or other people (i.e. telling another FtM off for wearing men's clothes) then you've no right to tell him he shouldn't. All he's doing his crossdressing. The fact that he wasn't born with a penis doesn't change that.

As for sending messages to the other trans people in the group -- well, I don't know any of them, but I doubt that most of them mind. Especially since there are "loads of" other trans people, so they have other examples or role models if they need one. "Sure, Bob likes to wear dresses sometimes, but Jimmy over there wouldn't be caught dead in a dress. I guess it's okay for me to do either!" Again, I don't know the people in the group, so I can only guess, but that's how it seems to me.

He should wait a couple of years to solidify his intentions before making people question them again.

What makes you think that people wouldn't question him in a few years?

And I know how upset he gets when people get it wrong.

Well, see, that's something you can actually respond to. If you were to see him get upset over people getting it wrong, and you know they got it wrong because of his clothes, you could point it out to them. "Why do they keep thinking I'm a girl?" "Dude, you're wearing a dress." Because yeah, some people would make a mistake there.

Anyway, as his friend, the best thing you can do is support him, even if you don't agree with all his choices. He needs that more than he needs your commentary on his clothing.

[Totally Guy]

*Whimpers* I'm so sorry.

[Danne]

Oops. Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as pissed off. *offers plate of fresh baked digital cookies*

Edit: No need to apologize. You clearly have your friend's best interests at heart. It's just, I once had a friend laugh at me for wearing a skirt (not in a mean way, and she wasn't trying to be hurtful, but it stung). We can wear whatever we want, same as anyone else, yeah? But perhaps I got a little overly defensive.

[Coidzor]

Originally Posted by Quincunx

What wrench, Coidzor? Being male is being born into the biological nihil, not being born female. Further, is it a wrench or a lockpick upon the chains of biology, learning how to create in independence?

What does reproduction have to do with it? Much less the research being done into making babby with two ova.

Though if the biology bit was only a red herring, I'm going to take that as a yes to that side-query of mine.

[Viera Champion]

@Dracons: Lets start off with some philosophical ranting.

Love isn't all about sex, or looks, or stuff like that. It's about kindness, friendship, caring, stuff like THAT. Truth be told, any girl who won't go out with you just because of how you look is a worthless little b%#$& anyways an doesn't deserve someone as good as you. Psh... If love was all about looks, I would have a very difficult time getting a girl. While at a youger age, ranging anywhere from just out of college to pre-teen age, the only thing people seem to care about is looks and sex. Wanna know why? Because everyone knows those relationships won't last. You're young (it's ironic since I'm younger) and full of hormones. It's natural. But saying that you will never find anyone who won't love you for who you are is ludicrous.

Also, two issues arise. First, you refuse to believe that you are anything more than an ugly monster, no matter what people tell you. That sounds like a serious self image problem.

Also, you said that you don't even know why you're alive. Life isn't all about love. You need to understand that. If it was than there wouldn't be war or crime or any of that stuff. But this and your self image problem seem like serious emotional problems, and I suggest that you get some professional help.

[Serpentine]

It's worth repeating, I think, also, that his looks really aren't that bad. Combine the disorder-induced droopy eye with the right attitude, and you've got a killer combination. Trouble is turning an unfortunate disfigurement into a point of pride... I don't know how someone would make that mental shift.

[Quincunx]

Coidzor: Without being willing to put forth effort into a legacy and/or making meaning, you still run the chance of dropping children. Reproduction is the minimal-effort legacy and rebuke to nihilism. Bacteria can do it. (Yes, a single-celled organism can repudiate some of the best human brains have to offer.)

Originally Posted by Eloi

"National Negative Nellies Night" (Added Alliterative Appeal!)

I like it!

[Coidzor]

Originally Posted by Quincunx

Coidzor: Without being willing to put forth effort into a legacy and/or making meaning, you still run the chance of dropping children. Reproduction is the minimal-effort legacy and rebuke to nihilism. Bacteria can do it. (Yes, a single-celled organism can repudiate some of the best human brains have to offer.)

Ah, yes. You don't matter as long as the off-chance someone on down the line of your genes does. Or simply accepting evolution at its face and for only its face.

[Phae Nymna]

The thought of children terrifies me. I'm afraid I'd raise them imprinted with the errors of my parents like my parents have done to me. Or rather, my parents have often behaved identically to their parents who they vilify for raising them poorly. I hope I wouldn't make their mistakes, but I fear I might overcorrect for the problems.

I actually would love to adopt. Or become a foster parent. Not to a newborn or a toddler, but instead to a teenager. I feel like, with my peculiar mash of culture, family history, and personal ethic, I could really raise a teenage once I'm older. I feel like I would fail miserably with a child age 0-14, but with a 14 to 18 year old, I would know just how to treat them to make life a little easier. If not a little more fun.

That's my take on children.

I'm in one of my longing summer moods where the only things on my mind are frosted miniwheats and some twisted libido. It makes me want people for their bodies, but it's additionally some sort of mental attraction. It's like I want their body so I may join with their mind. I think I'll go get some sleep and maybe I'll watch Were the World Mine tomorrow night.

That movie always soothes my troubles.

[npc revolution]

Hello.

My name is Npc revolution and I might be bi.

That is all.

[Rauthiss]

Welcome, NPC!

[Coidzor]

Welcome, How's it treating you?

[Thufir]

Originally Posted by Phae Nymna

I actually would love to adopt. Or become a foster parent. Not to a newborn or a toddler, but instead to a teenager. I feel like, with my peculiar mash of culture, family history, and personal ethic, I could really raise a teenage once I'm older. I feel like I would fail miserably with a child age 0-14, but with a 14 to 18 year old, I would know just how to treat them to make life a little easier. If not a little more fun.

Whereas I think most people would prefer to avoid the teenage years since those are the time when people are likely to be most messed up and confusing.
You are a strange person, Walrus.

[Delta]

Originally Posted by npc revolution

Hello.

Welcome to the club, npc!

[Eloi]

Originally Posted by Thufir

Whereas I think most people would prefer to avoid the teenage years since those are the time when people are likely to be most messed up and confusing.
You are a strange person, Walrus.

True, but people thinking that means a lot of teenagers don't get adopted. Thus you're a frickin' awesome person, Nymna.

[npc revolution]

Thanks guys, I feel welcome.

[Dogmantra]

Originally Posted by npc revolution

Thanks guys, I feel welcome.

You are officially a cool kid.

[npc revolution]

Thanks, I'll probably post something about my "troubles" soon. But as for now, I'll just watch approvingly.

[Danne]

Originally Posted by Eloi

True, but people thinking that means a lot of teenagers don't get adopted. Thus you're a frickin' awesome person, Nymna.

This. So many older kids don't get adopted. And then they get chucked out of foster care/the orphanage when they age out of the system, and end up as prostitutes/drug addicts/criminals/parents to more orphans. Not sure if I'd have the strength to help one, but I have so much respect for the people who do.

---

Hi NPC! Welcome!

[Phae Nymna]

Originally Posted by Eloi

True, but people thinking that means a lot of teenagers don't get adopted. Thus you're a frickin' awesome person, Nymna.

After a long day during which my own mother accuses me of jeopardizing her livelihood after I tried and failed to fix the internet, and after telling a woman in her forties (one of my teachers no less) not to use the word gay like she had and so forth... Well, what I'm attempting to say is, thanks. That makes me feel really great.

Also, the whole "Uh-scuse, don' be using gay as a pejorative up in heah!" got resolved and she gave me a really sweet apology and explained how she had genuinely meant gay in the sense of homosexuality, but it just wasn't the appropriate item of vocabulary in the situation. All is well.

[Danne]

Oh dear. Sounds like an awful day. I hope you're feeling better today.

[Phae Nymna]

Originally Posted by Danne

Oh dear. Sounds like an awful day. I hope you're feeling better today.

Oh, well actually, today has been positively peachy! I got a barrage of compliments on my work in all my classes and I watched a totally amazing sunset. HOORAH!

In other news, I thought that Minnesota (State) Senator Paul Koering's casual dinner date with a pornstar is not only adorable, but a good example that:

A) Gays are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.
B) Politicians are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.
C) Pornstars are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.

Phae has had a very good day.

[Danne]

Good to hear.

And your last point made me lol. But very true, all three points.

[golentan]

I don't know about C, most of them have unusually proportioned physiques.

And also gays are a relatively small minority, and so are not normal in the strictest sense of the word.

Not that any of that really matters. I think too much has been made of "And people group A are just like us, and so should be treated just like us." I think a far superior attitude is "People of Group A are people. And they're different, otherwise we wouldn't have to qualify them as being Group A. So we should treat them as people, and let them go off and do Group A things in their own Group A way as they see fit, as long as they're not stringing up folks from Group B or claiming that Group C are not people."

It makes me sad when folks say "We have to treat people the same because we're all the same on the inside." We're not. If we were, it would be boring. It's an excuse to not do more than scratch the surface of a person, or fit everyone into a mold in a different way. It's far more interesting acknowledging we're different for whatever reasons, moving on past that, and probing deeper to learn about the other guy's insides.

... That sounded differently in my head than when I wrote it, but I can't actually think of a better way to phrase it.

[PairO'Dice Lost]

Originally Posted by golentan

... That sounded differently in my head than when I wrote it, but I can't actually think of a better way to phrase it.

I think what you're trying to say is that when people say "We should treat people of group A like people because..." there should be no because, we should treat people like people on general principle. Close enough?

[golentan]

Originally Posted by PairO'Dice Lost

I think what you're trying to say is that when people say "We should treat people of group A like people because..." there should be no because, we should treat people like people on general principle. Close enough?

Yeah. But also that we should then try to find out why they're group A.

My first reaction to meeting someone outside 'the norm' is usually "You're absolutely bizarre! That's cool! I'm going to poke and prod and question and if necessary take your mind/body apart and see what makes it tick. Don't worry, I'll put it back together afterwards." I think it's better than assuming they're like me. Not least because the idea of another me running around is enough to make me wet myself, but still.

[Lix Lorn]

Originally Posted by Phae Nymna

In other news, I thought that Minnesota (State) Senator Paul Koering's casual dinner date with a pornstar is not only adorable, but a good example that:

A) Gays are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.
B) Politicians are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.
C) Pornstars are perfectly normal people and should be treated as such.

Can I sig that?

[Eloi]

Originally Posted by golentan

Yeah. But also that we should then try to find out why they're group A.

My first reaction to meeting someone outside 'the norm' is usually "You're absolutely bizarre! That's cool! I'm going to poke and prod and question and if necessary take your mind/body apart and see what makes it tick. Don't worry, I'll put it back together afterwards." I think it's better than assuming they're like me. Not least because the idea of another me running around is enough to make me wet myself, but still.

I highly doubt people like to be interrogated about their lifestyle, if I'm being honest with you. I don't think people in general like to be put on the spot for much of anything, some people do, some people don't, but as a general rule I don't agree with that.

[Serpentine]

Pfffft. People* love talking about themselves


* Some

[Delta]

Originally Posted by Serpentine

Pfffft. People* love talking about themselves

This.

Don't tell them you want to interrogate them, just give them a chance to talk, and chances are, they will