[Steam] Thread XXXI: Hot Medic-Heavy Action!

[memnarch]

As soon as misinformation appears on an article, another editor will remove or correct it. Wikipedia editors are very diligent in their work. Generally, if you see something cited, it's correct info. They don't allow information to actually exist on the site without a citation unless it's speculated to be true. In that case, a [citation needed] tag is added.

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B:You're reading a lot into what I was saying. I meant that I had a source that said sega, but one source can be wrong, or misleading. Hence asking for your source, because I was not sure if it was a mistake or if you had a different source.

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I see these two paragraphs and I can't help but think of Citogenisis.

[Tavar]

As soon as misinformation appears on an article, another editor will remove or correct it. Wikipedia editors are very diligent in their work. Generally, if you see something cited, it's correct info. They don't allow information to actually exist on the site without a citation unless it's speculated to be true. In that case, a [citation needed] tag is added.

I have personally found information that is false, or pages that have been vandalized. Yes, it's corrected pretty soon, but I do not think you could honestly say that it happens "a soon as misinformation appears"

I would also question the latter statement, as I have seen sentences without citations(or citation needed tags) on there, thus I'm not sure how you're getting the idea that EVERY SINGLE THING ON THERE is sourced.

[shadow_archmagi]

I can't speak for the other posters, but if *my* tone comes off as hostile it's just a result of Triscuitable derailing the thread *again* to talk about his perceived indignities.

[Crimmy]

So Spelunky, Guacamelee and Papers, Please came out today. Skullgirls coming out on the 22nd. All four games are totally worth getting.

Spelunky I have on the Xbox. It's awesome.
Guacamelee and Skullgirls I've wanted for a long time.

What is Papers, Please about?

[Tavar]

Spelunky I have on the Xbox. It's awesome.
Guacamelee and Skullgirls I've wanted for a long time.

What is Papers, Please about?

You're an immigration officer in a fictional dystopia country, and your aim is to allow legal immigrants across the border(by checking the papers) while stopping people from crossing illegally.
TRailer

Total Biscuit review(for the beta)


My turn, though: what's Guacamelee?

[memnarch]

Another Papers, Please review.

Guacamelee is a metroidvania like game where you play as a luchador (mexican wrestler) and one of the first things that happens to you after you go to try and save the girl you love is that you die. The game then goes on to have a dimension swap mechanic where you switch between "dead and alive". It's also got a number of funny references according to a friend whose played it and enjoyed it on the PSvita.

[Triscuitable]

You're an immigration officer in a fictional dystopia country, and your aim is to allow legal immigrants across the border(by checking the papers) while stopping people from crossing illegally.
TRailer

Total Biscuit review(for the beta)


My turn, though: what's Guacamelee?

You forgot the part about the moral dilemmas you encounter. My personal favorites?

Spoiler

Show

The husband with the right papers and his wife he tells you about with bad ones. Do you let her in for a big penalty? Or deny her entry?

Alternatively, a girl who fears that a man behind her is trying to force her into prostitution. Do you deny him entry for her wellbeing, or let him in?

[Rawhide]

Well, look at what you wrote.

I said "word choice goes a long way". I'm referring to the tone. What I read made it seem like you were saying "can you confirm this? I already confirmed it was Sega, but please, explain your reasoning." It came off as rude to me.

There was nothing wrong with what Tavar wrote. It did not come off as rude to me. There was nothing wrong with the tone.

I don't want to get all red-texty, but can you please drop this? It is completely off-topic to the thread.

[Triscuitable]

I don't want to get all red-texty, but can you please drop this? It is completely off-topic to the thread.

I never was angry or spiteful to anyone. If I came off as such, you have my apologies. I'm just a cynical person who reads into things. Blame my education.

[Trixie]

Bet you can't find more expensive game on Steam

[Tebryn]

Bet you can't find more expensive game on Steam

You obviously haven't heard of Planetary Annihilation

[Trixie]

What, it comes with space flight too?

[Tebryn]

Ya, they launch you into the Sun.

[Triscuitable]

You obviously haven't heard of Planetary Annihilation

Don't buy that, by the way. Not initially, at least. Wait a year or so after launch to see if they're still supporting it; UberEnt, like HiRez Games, has a bad habit of ditching games (Super Monday Night Combat and Tribes: Ascend) in favor of "greener" pastures (Planetary Annihilation and SMITE).

[Tebryn]

Even if the game interested me I am not paying 89.99 (Now 69.99) for an Alpha/Beta. I've paid around 30 because frankly I think the indie market could easily charge that for a game without batting an eye and a good deal of them (looking at you Delvers Drop, Spelunky, FEZ, La-Mulana and others) deserve it. But 89.99 just because your Kickstarter guys paid that? I get it, you don't want your Kickstarter funders to feel like they're getting the raw deal when you're charging 30 bucks for Alpha when they paid 80 or 90 bucks but it's also not like they're not getting anything else with that deal. It's not just the Alpha/Beta they're getting. OST's and other perks that someone buying it on Early Access just isn't going to get.

It's a crappy sort of situation to be in from a developers stand point because you're screwed if you do and screwed if you don't. It's one of the reasons I feel "Early Access" is just not a good idea on Steam. On top of my utter distaste for Greenlight and the fiasco that was Paranuticaul Activity (which people should go vote on because it totally deserves to be Greenlit), Steam is only my preferred platform for getting games because it's the most popular service out there and Desura is even worse.

[Triscuitable]

It's a crappy sort of situation to be in from a developers stand point because you're screwed if you do and screwed if you don't. It's one of the reasons I feel "Early Access" is just not a good idea on Steam. On top of my utter distaste for Greenlight and the fiasco that was Paranuticaul Activity (which people should go vote on because it totally deserves to be Greenlit), Steam is only my preferred platform for getting games because it's the most popular service out there and Desura is even worse.

Early Access is good when you do it right, like StarForge. It's essentially 50% off for a pre-order of the final game that you can play as they make it. Currently, it's not so great (poorly optimized, very few options, confusing menus, etc.), but it shows promise, and I'm not bothered by the $10 investment I made.

[memnarch]

Early Access is good when you do it right, like StarForge. It's essentially 50% off for a pre-order of the final game that you can play as they make it. Currently, it's not so great (poorly optimized, very few options, confusing menus, etc.), but it shows promise, and I'm not bothered by the $10 investment I made.

Minecraft is another excellent example.

[Tebryn]

Early Access is good when you do it right, like StarForge. It's essentially 50% off for a pre-order of the final game that you can play as they make it. Currently, it's not so great (poorly optimized, very few options, confusing menus, etc.), but it shows promise, and I'm not bothered by the $10 investment I made.

How much was it on their site? I imagine 10 dollars as well?

Minecraft is another excellent example.

You'll note I specifically said "On Steam". If you buy it from the developer on the Developers site it's totally different. That may seem an arbitrary distinction but it's for the express reason above. If you want to get a game that's just not developed but want to support it? You go and do that directly, Steam takes 30% of all profits from sales. You could argue that they're making more for being on Steam and that may be true, I'd like to see the numbers myself, but the Steam Community is a fickle thing. When they hear the game isn't up to par they're just going to wait for it to come out. Giving the 10 dollars to the developer fully is still a better investment if you think the game has promise. They at least get all of the money that way. Especially for the Indie Developers who make up Early Access.

[Forbiddenwar]

I think it depends on the state of the game on early access. There are some games that show up with most of the gameplay and mechanics pretty much done, but lacking content. In this state, the game is playable and may be a great $10 experience, even though it is unfinished. This game is worth getting in Beta. As more content is added and the gameplay is fine tuned then the game, when it is released, is worth even more. Buying it early then, is just a sound investment, if you are planning on buying it anyway. KSP is here, and I think Nekro will be as well.

But then there are games which have content, but not necessarily the gameplay and mechanics in a workable state. Such games are not a good value at any price. (From what I've seen, Planetary Anhililation might fit in this category)

Why Kickstarted games go to Steam for Early Access/Beta program?
It's not just visibility. Kickstarters tend to offer 'Beta' to supporters already. If more kickstarter money can go into game development and less into the server architecture and account system management that is needed to provide Beta Access to funders, then it is a win-win for both Steam (who gets 30% of FUTURE SALES), and the developers (More time and money making the game and less on beta program management), and for the consumers (Better game)

[Krade]

So... I was wondering: what kind of person would actually buy the Train Simulator games? The newest version + all DLC weighs in at about $200 if you buy the bundle. I can't imagine how this "game" could possibly be worth that much.

[factotum]

The same sort of person who'd spend thousands building a model railway track in their garage, presumably!

[Grif]

The same sort of person who'd spend thousands building a model railway track in their garage, presumably!

But but but but... it's all virtual.

Unlike a real-life train set.

[factotum]

But but but but... it's all virtual.

Unlike a real-life train set.

But it's also more realistic, in a way, because you've got real trains and real tracks being simulated--plus it's a lot cheaper!

[Eldan]

And you don't need a lot of space or time to set it up.

[hobbitkniver]

Yeah, I have never understood this. An exorbitant price will stop many people from buying it, but will not stop anyone from pirating it.

[Morty]

So, I've been thinking about how to develop my Dark Souls character... it would appear that I've either wasted the points I invested in Strength or the ones I invested in Dexterity, depending on how I end up going about it. Dexterity 16 won't help me if I go into greatswords and Strength 16 won't help me if I go into straight swords. Oh well.

[Triscuitable]

Yeah, I have never understood this. An exorbitant price will stop many people from buying it, but will not stop anyone from pirating it.

Not that it would have stopped most people from pirating it in the first place. There is very little to no correlation between piracy and pricing; a lot of publishers think there is, and thus treat pirated copies as "lost sales". Ubisoft notoriously began their awful DRM policies in 2010 because of that way of thinking.

[hobbitkniver]

Not that it would have stopped most people from pirating it in the first place. There is very little to no correlation between piracy and pricing; a lot of publishers think there is, and thus treat pirated copies as "lost sales". Ubisoft notoriously began their awful DRM policies in 2010 because of that way of thinking.

The question of whether or not pirated games should be considered lost sales is not really related to pricing. I'm really having a hard time understanding how saying what amounts to, "charging more will not stop piracy" means that I both believe that pirated games are lost sales and that my "way of thinking" believes in heavy DRM. How do you think you understood so much about me from that single line of text I wrote that you can characterize my opinions as a way of thinking?

[Triscuitable]

The question of whether or not pirated games should be considered lost sales is not really related to pricing. I'm really having a hard time understanding how saying what amounts to, "charging more will not stop piracy"

You're generalizing. What I said was "the consumer who wouldn't have purchased the product will pirate it, and the consumer who will purchase the product will buy it. Price does not affect it in the long run."

means that I both believe that pirated games are lost sales and that my "way of thinking" believes in heavy DRM.

You're inferring that from something I didn't say.

How do you think you understood so much about me from that single line of text I wrote that you can characterize my opinions as a way of thinking?

I didn't.

[hobbitkniver]

You're generalizing. What I said was "the consumer who wouldn't have purchased the product will pirate it, and the consumer who will purchase the product will buy it. Price does not affect it in the long run."



You're inferring that from something I didn't say.



I didn't.

As long as no harm was meant, I guess I really shouldn't have been bothered. I think I misunderstood your meaning in some ways.