Our Time Loop is Different: The Awesomeness that is "Mother of Learning"

[Starwulf]

It’s uhhh certainly iconic. But after reading a character like Zorian I can only imagine the sneering pseudo intellectual elitism of HPMoR’s Harry to be a letdown. Especially since MoL walks that fine line between presenting magic as something to be studied and understood while also keeping it magical and just a bit mysterious and beyond understanding that HPMoR just sort of says is stupid.

Yeah, I've heard a lot of bad stuff about HPMoR, most of it along the lines of what you just said, I don't think I could deal with that kind of tone in a story for very long.

[ayvango]

Despite being not too rational and psychological HPMoR is still fun. It has expressive language and memorable scenes. And very nice newspaper headings like "BOY-WHO-LIVED GETS DRACO MALFOY PREGNANT".

Draco groaned. "Not a guy. A girl. A ten-year-old girl, can you believe it? She went nuts after her mother died and her father, who owns this newspaper, is convinced that she's a seer, so when he doesn't know he asks Luna Lovegood and believes anything she says."

Not really thinking about it, Harry pulled the ring on his next can of Comed-Tea and prepared to drink. "Are you kidding me? That's even worse than Muggle journalism, which I would have thought was physically impossible."

[Dragonus45]

I'll admit i was worried about the pacing going into the final chapters, but clearly I should not have been. This has been just about perfect, the final couple of paragraphs gave me chills.

[paddyfool]

A lot of things seem to be going almost too well for our protagonists (wraith bombs aside).

Waiting for the other shoe to drop.

[Ibrinar]

It is possible that they realized this is what he would do given a sibling to a shifter child that has magic training and it is a trap. Kidnapping the prospective heir of a shifter clan seems odd when searching for soft targets. Though I guess shifters and shifter children in the right age range are pretty rare.

[Dragonus45]

It was mentioned back in the loop that her brother was a prodigy. I think he may just be a better option for sacrifice then just anyone.

[paddyfool]

Given how much Silverlake has studied the primordial, and the close contact she and Red Robe have had with it, they may not even need the shifter children.

[paddyfool]

New chapter is up. The big battle is building.

Major players / tools not yet seen:

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QI
Most of the demons
Red robe (beyond a simulacrum)
Silverlake
The wight bombs
The senior cultists

The angel(s)
The aranea
Any of Zach's simulacrums

Speculation: teleporting the mansion was at least in part motivated by sudomir seeking reinforcement from QI and the ibasan army. Although it could also have been done to menace the city with wight bombs...

We'll see in a month's time or so.

[Leewei]

Fun read! I'm very much looking forward to the next one.

Zorian's planned counter for the undead dragon had quite a bit of panache.

[paddyfool]

I enjoyed the latest update :-)

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Although I'm wondering if Jornik may not have been the dude in the red robe that came out to the battlefield with QI and Silverlake. Could equally have been Sudomir. All the red robed figure has been shown to do is throw some lightning around and activate the wraith bombs...

Equally, "Silverlake" could very easily be her familiar, and who knows which if any of the QIs is the real one?

Question: how close to thread necro does it get when this thread updates on a monthly basis with the story?

[Leewei]

I don't think we're crossing a line, but I'm not a mod, either.

Great to see another entertaining update.

Spoiler: I especially loved ...

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Zorian no-selling both the dragon spell and the wraith bombs. Versatility and preparation are his strong suits, and he puts them to use very effectively.

[Rynjin]

I think there's a 90 day grace period on necros, so you should be good.

I think at this point I'm kind of waiting for it to be over to catch up, since we're in like the last 10 chapters or so, right?

[Dragonus45]

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QI’s increasing frustration with his allies is my favorite part of this whole arc. His line about how he expected more of literal time travelers was a literal lol moment for me.

[Douglas]

I think there's a 90 day grace period on necros, so you should be good.

I think at this point I'm kind of waiting for it to be over to catch up, since we're in like the last 10 chapters or so, right?

45 days, but it's only been 43 so it's (barely) under the limit. After that, you should ask a mod for approval before reviving a thread.

The extent and cleverness of Zorian's preparations are fun to see, and the counter for the wraith bombs was well done, building on established elements that I hadn't thought of how they'd apply to the problem.

I doubt the presentation of who the real QI, Jornak, and Silverlake are is false. QI wouldn't want to risk his crown on a mere simulacrum, and the other two are showing the weaknesses of how they used the time loop. Silverlake just didn't have enough time looping to get any really spectacular benefit, so she mostly has only the skills she already had before - which is still pretty impressive by a normal mage's standards, but not compared to the true giants of this battlefield. Jornak, meanwhile, focused more on how to gain allies and change things than on his personal mage skills. His most important contribution by far is the presence of Oganj. To be fair, it's a pretty damn big contribution, likely even bigger than matching Zach's combat prowess would be, but it's less personally impressive.

It'll be interesting to see what Eldemar's military manages to do this time. They've been thoroughly outclassed in previous encounters, but that was when they were just chasing down a theft or trying to stop a random mage battle in the middle of nowhere, treating all participants as hostile. This time they're rallying against a massive invasion, with one side definitively friendly. There's no way they're bringing anything less than all available force, and teaming up with the side that summoned a bunch of angels makes them more like tiebreakers than having to face such threats alone.

[paddyfool]

I'd imagine that we'll be seeing a significant chunk of the Eldemarian military, but that not all of it may be transported by air or immediately mobilised, and that there will be many important locations, such as the capital, that they wouldn't want to leave entirely unguarded in any case.

Incidentally, there's also been a significant update to the worldbuilding wordpress at the end of August: https://motheroflearninguniverse.wordpress.com

EDIT: If they survive to the end of the main story arc, what do you see Zach and Zorian doing with the rest of their lives? My speculation:

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Both should be set for life financially on the back of splitting the assorted treasure troves they know about and haven't yet raided between them.

Both should, in theory, be able to finish this arc reasonably in the good graces of the angels, church, eldamarian military and university. Those who are aware of their feats, aside from the angels, may well be a little in awe of them.

Zach should quite easily be able to regain control of his House, should he so wish, and to rebuild its fortunes. As a battlemage, his talents might best be suited to being a soldier, mercenary, or monster hunter, but given his interest in medical magic and its effect on his family I wouldn't be surprised if he joins forces with Kael in researching a cure for the Weeping, possibly sponsoring the latter's further alchemical research.

Zorian could have many goals to fulfil. He may try to redeem the reputation of Mind Magic, improve Human:Aranea relations and possibly even Aranea:Aranea relations, sort out his messed up family, sponsor Kirielle's studies etc. Ultimately, his ability to focus on studies and research, and his ability to help rebuild Cyoria, may make him very well equipped to be a professor at the university at some point in the future, possibly focusing on mind magic, although I doubt his views of the average student will be much more positive than Xvim Chao's.

Not sure either of them have any convincing romantic hooks going forwards; it seems fairly likely that Zach would continue to pursue this side of life once the fate of the world is no longer at stake, but I'm not sure about Zorian, whatever his feelings are visavis Taiven.

EDIT: The biggest change to the world at large from the events of the time loop may well be the opening of the gates between continents. The political impacts of that, especially if the Aranea that can open the gates end up allying with a specific human faction, may be very interesting.

[Dragonus45]

45 days, but it's only been 43 so it's (barely) under the limit. After that, you should ask a mod for approval before reviving a thread.

The extent and cleverness of Zorian's preparations are fun to see, and the counter for the wraith bombs was well done, building on established elements that I hadn't thought of how they'd apply to the problem.

Yea its been positively Sandersonian in how its handled its magical escalation, which is about the highest compliment I think I can give really.

I doubt the presentation of who the real QI, Jornak, and Silverlake are is false. QI wouldn't want to risk his crown on a mere simulacrum, and the other two are showing the weaknesses of how they used the time loop. Silverlake just didn't have enough time looping to get any really spectacular benefit, so she mostly has only the skills she already had before - which is still pretty impressive by a normal mage's standards, but not compared to the true giants of this battlefield. Jornak, meanwhile, focused more on how to gain allies and change things than on his personal mage skills. His most important contribution by far is the presence of Oganj. To be fair, it's a pretty damn big contribution, likely even bigger than matching Zach's combat prowess would be, but it's less personally impressive.

Jornak got the normal time loop experience one he managed to subdue Zach, one where he largely dealt with optimizing a static situation with little to no improvisation needed as time went on. Zorian however was a paranoid aggressive plotter almost from day one and is much better at it to boot. I don't think Jornak would ever manage to match him.

It'll be interesting to see what Eldemar's military manages to do this time. They've been thoroughly outclassed in previous encounters, but that was when they were just chasing down a theft or trying to stop a random mage battle in the middle of nowhere, treating all participants as hostile. This time they're rallying against a massive invasion, with one side definitively friendly. There's no way they're bringing anything less than all available force, and teaming up with the side that summoned a bunch of angels makes them more like tiebreakers than having to face such threats alone.

I think Eldemar's military is largely going to be late to the party outside of some griffon riding red shirts until someone starts busting out artifacts from the vaults.

[tyckspoon]

EDIT: If they survive to the end of the main story arc, what do you see Zach and Zorian doing with the rest of their lives? My speculation:

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Zorian's interested in basically everything, at this point, and the biggest effect on him of leaving the time loop is going to be having to deal with time advancing and no longer being able to comfortably say 'ok, this time around I'm going to spend the next three months practicing artificing, then the next loop is Soul Defense practice.' So I suspect his first big project is going to be continuing and refining his study of the principles of time dilation and the Black Rooms, possibly trying to replicate the actual time-loop chamber without needing deific levels of power to run it.. or at least creating a Black Room situation that is a comfortable environment and reasonable simulation of some part of the world so it's less claustrophobic to live inside of dilation. Then he can continue studying whatever catches his fancy until he's the world's foremost expert on basically everything, and not just the things he thinks he has been forced to learn in order to not die.

Also that captured dragon fireball is totally getting dumped on somebody else. Bets on what he does with it? Blows up another dragon with it? Uses it as an artillery shell to overwhelm Iasku Mansion's wards?

[paddyfool]

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Zorian's interested in basically everything, at this point, and the biggest effect on him of leaving the time loop is going to be having to deal with time advancing and no longer being able to comfortably say 'ok, this time around I'm going to spend the next three months practicing artificing, then the next loop is Soul Defense practice.' So I suspect his first big project is going to be continuing and refining his study of the principles of time dilation and the Black Rooms, possibly trying to replicate the actual time-loop chamber without needing deific levels of power to run it.. or at least creating a Black Room situation that is a comfortable environment and reasonable simulation of some part of the world so it's less claustrophobic to live inside of dilation. Then he can continue studying whatever catches his fancy until he's the world's foremost expert on basically everything, and not just the things he thinks he has been forced to learn in order to not die.

Also that captured dragon fireball is totally getting dumped on somebody else. Bets on what he does with it? Blows up another dragon with it? Uses it as an artillery shell to overwhelm Iasku Mansion's wards?

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I'm not sure how predictable he is in that regard. He could, of course, do something in this line, particularly by repeating the previous use of the Imperial Orb for a bigger and better Black Room if he so wished. But I doubt if that would be all of his ambitions... given how far he's come in dimensionalism, he may also want to muck about replicating and improving QI's Gates. Or further improving his golems / general spell formulae. Or he might even take Zach's advice and apply his advanced shaping skills to learning medical magic now that he has no more monthly health resets. He's definitely intending to do something about his primary body's physical strength and stamina, whether it be by enhancements, training or both.

And then, of course, there will be a lot of people who'll have a lot of questions for him... and plenty of people will want to learn from him, be it about Mind Magic (although he could maybe refer such requests on to Aranea tutors), spell formulae, or whatever else.

He's going to stay busy.

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Small thought for the battle ahead: What if Zorian manages to use his mind magic to take control of Oganj? So far, we haven't seen the dragon mage get close enough to him for this to happen, but that doesn't mean it won't...

[paddyfool]

Target date for the final installment has been postponed until December :-(

(Apologies if I got anyone excited by posting)

[Dragonus45]

Target date for the final installment has been postponed until December :-(

(Apologies if I got anyone excited by posting)

When I saw the thread got updated, my heart went aflutter and I literally started doing my happy dance...

[Douglas]

*Ahem*

The final chapters, including epilogue and afterword, are up. Discussion of how awesome they are can now commence.

[Ibrinar]

Was a good end but I hope this "My current idea is that it wouldn’t be nearly as long or grand as the original, and would mostly focus on showing the aftermath of the original and what the characters do in their everyday life. A sort of extended epilogue, more slice-of-life than a grand mystery of the original." happens. I want to see how some relationships develop now that they aren't stuck in a loop and stuff.

[paddyfool]

It was indeed a good finish. I rather like how Zorian's new social and personal development are lampshaded in the epilogue - from being a recluse at the beginning, he's developed into something of a teacher and a leader at the end.

Worth noting that the worldbuilding blog is still ongoing: https://motheroflearninguniverse.wordpress.com

[Dragonus45]

Was a good end but I hope this "My current idea is that it wouldn’t be nearly as long or grand as the original, and would mostly focus on showing the aftermath of the original and what the characters do in their everyday life. A sort of extended epilogue, more slice-of-life than a grand mystery of the original." happens. I want to see how some relationships develop now that they aren't stuck in a loop and stuff.

Yea that sounds amazing, plus there is a lot of meat there for a sequel and I really just want to know more about this otherwise fascinating world and it’s people. And it’s monsters. Especially it’s spiders.

[paddyfool]

Yea that sounds amazing, plus there is a lot of meat there for a sequel and I really just want to know more about this otherwise fascinating world and it’s people. And it’s monsters. Especially it’s spiders.

If you liked the spiders in this, may I recommend you "Children of Time" by Adrian Tchaikovsky? Possibly the best sci fi spiders ever written.