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2017-12-25, 06:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- In my library
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
In all honesty though, most people don't care. My girlfriend noticed nothing wrong with the bombers in TFA.
Spoiler: Rambling about my SF writingI'm wiring a novel/selection of short stories I'm currently calling The Ioite Cache (will be uploading one to my blog once I've rewritten it), where I've added a story in early on that changes spaceships because most people don't care. Early on spaceships use a variety of realistic reaction drives, but because people don't want stories about characters spending months to get anywhere one of the first reverse engineered alien technology is a reactionless drive (they thought out was an artificial gravity generator). While there's an ongoing plot thread about the attempted suppression of the drive (at least before force fields are developed) it also allows a 'three days to mars' feeling that more people are used to from source stories.
A layer plot thread is that they can only reverse engineer what they are close to understanding anyway, the crashed alien probes they have access to have several still functional wormhole drives and FTL radios, but humans can't even work out how to activate them and are reduced to colonising space via STL ships for hundreds of years. So they have hypermetric drives and advanced medical technology, but are hopelessly delayed on anything to do with time or space bending. Stasis and FTL (warp drives of the Alcubierre drive model) are developed shortly before the incredibly hostile aliens are met, and the story ends with an FTL arkship fleeing the destruction of humanity's empire. A massive sphere with a scaled up hypermetric drive capable of exciting matter and shifting it into a form that'll create a warp bubble, which was considered flat out impossible before alien technology was found.
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2017-12-25, 07:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2013
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
My impression was that there was a giant array of kyber crystals behind the disc, that could be damaged, especially since the things are super volatile. Not sure if that's still canon, but the Rebels have the plans, so they'd know exactly where to strike for best effect, and in the unlikely event they couldn't take out the laser, they could always target Tarkin/The Emperor's command station instead.
Re the Executor, the loss of the bridge is probably not the only damage, remember, they're taking concentrated fire from the entire rebel fleet at the time.
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2017-12-25, 07:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Going by the newcanon, there's definitely kyber crystals in there somewhere - it would appear going by Wookieepedia, that there's 8 focusing crystals - one for each beam generated by the disc.
We do see fire trailing from the engine section as the dive continues.Last edited by hamishspence; 2017-12-25 at 07:43 PM.
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2017-12-26, 01:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2016
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
You have completely unrealistic expectations.
Given that the Executor seems to lose engine power or otherwise becomes unable to resist the gravitational pull of the Death Star, id suggest that there was more than just a loss of command going on with the crash.
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2017-12-26, 02:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
The Executor goes from 'bridge destroyed' to 'impact with Death Star' in something like 15 seconds. It's shockingly fast. It's quite possible that whoever the officer in the auxiliary bridge was didn't get their password input in time. The reality is that ships of that class simply aren't intended to operate in close proximity to objects larger than themselves. The Executor would have absolutely survived the incident if it hadn't slammed into the Death Star. Aaron Allston went so far as to restage the exact same scenario -an Executor-class star dreadnaught with it's bridge catastrophically destroyed - minus a giant metal ball to slam into in the EU in order to make this precise point.
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2017-12-26, 04:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2007
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Everything down to even some Correlian Corvettes has a secondary bridge. But given how those systems likely work even with a few seconds too few while also taking fire even a few seconds delay was probably too late to balance every system properly(Engines, shields, weapons to fire) since every secondary operator would need to know what was being done on the bridge exactly at the moment it went down but also the key problems that'd occurred in those handfuls of seconds.
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2017-12-26, 04:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
From the way Incredible Cross Sections: The Force Awakens portrayed it with the Finalizer's secondary bridge being one of the ways that the class was an improvement on the Executor, it would appear that
"being able to cope well with having the primary bridge taken out"
is supposed to be a new thing - that the Executor's loss at Endor is seen by the First Order as a harsh lesson that they have learned from.Last edited by hamishspence; 2017-12-26 at 04:37 PM.
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2017-12-26, 09:06 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
I mean, how well can you really expect a flagship to cope with having its command staff taken out? Barring some unusual circumstance, the commander of the fleet is probably going to be on the bridge of their flagship in a battle, you know, commanding it, so theres only so much they can do to compensate for that loss.
“Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”
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2017-12-26, 09:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2012
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- Tharggy, on Tellene
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
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2017-12-26, 11:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2013
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Depends on which bridge you're talking about. There's a few (flag bridge, signal bridge, etc).
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2017-12-28, 09:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2016
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
I agree. It would have worked better if she had dropped back into normal space just in time to crash into the bridge of the other ship. Or had rematerialized inside the other ship in such a way as to break the ship by bursting and disrupting things due to the problems raised by two things trying to exist in the same place at once, instead of just blasting right through it
"If you want to understand biology don't think about vibrant throbbing gels and oozes, think about information technology" -Richard Dawkins
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2018-01-02, 01:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2012
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Personally, I think they should have had Leia do the suicidal dive. It would have been a fitting, heroic end for her character arc. It could have established that only Jedi have the prescient reflexes to revert to realspace at the precise moment to cause the damage and/or time the jump precisely enough for the hyperspace wake to do maximum damage. And it would have allowed the pink-haired lady to assume leadership- setting up future conflicts with Poe.
Keeper of the 49 Rules.
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2018-01-02, 01:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2005
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
That was also my expectation - letting her depart the franchise on a high note of action and heroism, in contrast to Han's death for shock value and Luke's peaceful dissolution.
It makes me worried for the character in Episode IX, because of Carrie Fisher (RIP)'s unexpected death. They're either going to have to unceremoniously kill her offscreen in between movies, a horribly unsuitable fate for Leia, or else resort to that creepy-as-hell CGI facemasking technique long enough to kill her off onscreen.NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
Hell, It's About Time: Wings of Liberty
Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat: Heart of the Swarm
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2018-01-02, 03:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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- Manchester, UK
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
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2018-01-02, 04:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Leave Jedi Brick out of this! He's at least as force sensitive as the next inanimate object.
I'm sadly reminded of Lensman, where a ship moving at FTL velocities is explicitly less dangerous than a ship moving at taskforce velocities, to the point that switching off your FTL drive next to anything is dangerous, but you can switch it on to ignore collision damage (if you're willing to deal with your previous velocity when you switch it off). Feels a bit strange, but it works out much better as the technology was mapped out in Galactic Patrol and the uses and abuses remain constant.
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2018-01-03, 08:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2012
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Actually, there is lots of evidence that Han was force sensitive:
http://www.cracked.com/blog/12-times...ut-knowing-it/Keeper of the 49 Rules.
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2018-01-03, 08:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Washington D.C.
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Cracked article? Really? The first two points (which is all I cared to read) have him using mind tricks on a Hutt (which we later learn is impossible) and hitting a target just a few feet away while blind (despite that we are constantly being told that he is slowly regaining his sight). Cracked does not know what "evidence" means. If they do having any good examples, those are still circumstantial at best.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2018-01-03, 10:06 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
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2018-01-03, 11:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Yeah, while Han is certainly lucky enough and has fast enough reflexes to potentially be Force Sensitive, there's nothing definitive either way. 'Han is Force Sensitive' is a plausible theory, in that at least in Legends canon everybody apart from droids tended to be at least slightly Force Sensitive, but he certainly doesn't have the mindset to be anywhere as FS as a Jedi even of he had the raw potential (which he likely doesn't have).
Remember, being FS isn't a binary switch (although it also isn't a scale), so Han can still be Force Sensitive without showing any outward signs. So in my belief saying 'X is Force Sensitive' is useless, partially because most people will be, and partially because Han would likely never act on it.
Now if Han was strong in the Force, that would be a different matter.
I wouldn't be surprised if they have a scene they can use at the beginning of EIX with Leia getting off the Falcon, then partway through her death is told through dialogue, and at the ending we get a funeral for her. But I'll admit it's slightly less likely than 'Opening Crawl: The RESISTANCE has successfully escaped the clutches of the FIRST ORDER. However PRINCESS LEIA died on the Falcon's escape flight...'
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2018-01-03, 12:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2005
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
I seem to remember one Force-sensitive droid in Legends, actually.
NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
Hell, It's About Time: Wings of Liberty
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My Life For Aiur? I Barely Know 'Er: Legacy of the Void
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2018-01-03, 12:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
“Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”
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2018-01-03, 12:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
Yup - that was in the Star Wars Tales comics, which, at least early on, were specifically non-canon (though a few early Tales comics were canonised later, that story wasn't one of the canonised ones).
The newcanon has kept the "he did that malfunction on purpose because he realised how important R2-D2's mission was" thing - but dumped the name and force-sensitivity - in the From A Certain Point of View short story collection.
He also still functions after that malfunction (only being temporarily disabled, not being completely destroyed by it) - and survived the attack on the Jawa sandcrawler as well- the story ends with him heading off in search of a master to serve.Last edited by hamishspence; 2018-01-03 at 12:36 PM.
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2018-01-03, 12:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2005
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Wars_Tales_1
Dumb even by Legends standards, but without the Elseworlds brand it was technically canon.NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
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2018-01-03, 12:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
The article for the actual short story opens with a "this is non-canon to the legends continuity" disclaimer.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Skippy_the_Jedi_Droid“Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”
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2018-01-03, 12:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2005
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
NOW COMPLETE: Let's Play Starcraft II Trilogy:
Hell, It's About Time: Wings of Liberty
Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat: Heart of the Swarm
My Life For Aiur? I Barely Know 'Er: Legacy of the Void
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2018-01-03, 01:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Washington D.C.
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2018-01-03, 01:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
"And if you don't, the consequences will be dire!"
"What? They'll have three extra hit dice and a rend attack?"
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2018-01-03, 01:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
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2018-01-03, 05:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
All of this is explainable, particularly point B. We know for a fact there is some oxygen in space - the oxygen that got sucked out of the bridge with her when it was destroyed. There was enough there for a roomful of people in fact (RIP Ackbar). So in a moment of desperation, her latent Force powers/telekinesis activated, gathered some of it around her followed by propelling her back inside, and she saved herself.
If the above is too incredible for you, then fine, we all have our own lines to draw for that sort of thing. But at the very least, you can't chuck it in the bin as being completely impossible.
As for "gravity bombers" - doesn't magnetism exist in space?Plague Doctor by Crimmy
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2018-01-03, 08:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2016
Re: Rant about Terrible Spaceships in Sci-Fi/Sci-Fantasy: Last Jedi *SPOILERS*
"If you want to understand biology don't think about vibrant throbbing gels and oozes, think about information technology" -Richard Dawkins
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