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2010-03-13, 09:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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[3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Dang, I'm on a homebrew binge. Please review and comment!
The Tactician
That's the plan. Got it?
The tactician is a master of battlefield control. While a wizard might kill things and a fighter might hit things, the tactician will position his allies and opponents into the optimum positions for battle. The Tactician's unique combination of battlefield prowess with minor spellcasting abilities makes it a unique choice for any leader of combat.
Inspiration: I like the movement abilities that a 4e druid gets. Let's translate them to 3.5!
Game Rule Information
Alignment: Tacticians are typically lawful, since it requires much study to know optimum battle schemas.
Hit Die: d6.
Starting Gold: As Paladin.
Skill Points: 4+Int mod, x4 at first level.
Skills: The Puppeteer’s class skills (And the key abilities for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Knowledge (All skills, taken individually) (Int), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int)
The Tactician
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special
1st|+0|+0|+0|+2|Force Movement (10 ft.), Tactical Strike +1d6
2nd|+1|+0|+0|+3|Halt Movement
3rd|+2|+1|+1|+3|Tactical Strike +2d6
4th|+3|+1|+1|+4|Force Movement (20 ft.)
5th|+3|+1|+1|+4|Like a Ghost, Tactical Strike +3d6
6th|+4|+2|+2|+5|Hesitate 3/day
7th|+5|+2|+2|+5|Force Movement (30 ft.), Multiple Force Movement, Tactical Strike +4d6
8th|+6/+1|+2|+2|+6|Aura of Adversity (5 ft.)
9th|+6/+1|+3|+3|+6|Halt Action, Tactical Strike +5d6
10th|+7/+2|+3|+3|+7|Force Movement (40 ft.)
11th|+8/+3|+3|+3|+7|Aura of Adversity (10 ft.), Tactical Strike +6d6
12th|+9/+4|+4|+4|+8|Hesitate 5/day
13th|+9/+4|+4|+4|+8|Force Movement (50 ft.), Tactical Strike +7d6
14th|+10/+5|+4|+4|+9|Advanced Tactics
15th|+11/+6/+1|+5|+5|+9|Force Movement (60 ft.), Tactical Strike +8d6
16th|+12/+7/+2|+5|+5|+10|Aura of Adversity (30 ft.)
17th|+12/+7/+2|+5|+5|+10|Silent Watcher, Tactical Strike +9d6
18th|+13/+8/+3|+6|+6|+11|Hesitate at will
19th|+14/+9/+4|+6|+6|+11|Force Movement (70 ft.), Tactical Strike +10d6
20th|+15/+10/+5|+6|+6|+12|Master Warmaker
[/table]
Class Features:
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Tacticians are proficient with all simple weapons, one martial weapon of their choice, and light armor.
Force Movement (Su): A tactician may spend a move action to move another creature with 10 ft. per class level up to the distance indicated. An unwilling target of this ability is granted a Will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier to resist this effect. If the movement would result in harm to the creature (Moving into a pool of acid, for example) the creature gets a +6 bonus to its will save.
Tactical Strike (Ex): Whenever a tactician strikes a creature that has been moved with his Force Movement this turn or the turn before, he can add the indicated dice to the damage dealt by the attack.
Halt Movement (Su): A number of times per day equal to his int modifier, a tactician may spend an immediate action to stop a creature's movement. The creature may resist this with a will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier. If stopping movement would result in harm to the creature (stopping above a spiked pit, for example) the creature gets a +6 bonus to its will save. A tactician need not ready an action to be able to do this.
Like a Ghost (Su): Whenever a tactician would be granted an attack of opportunity, he may instead take a 5 foot step.
Hesitate (Sp): The number of times per day indicated, a tactician may cast Hesitate as a spell-like ability as a wizard of caster level equal to his class level.
Multiple Force Movement (Su): A tactician may move more than one creature with his Force Movement ability by dividing up the total movement in 5 ft. increments.
Aura of Adversity (Su): A burst of the radius indicated around the tactician is treated as difficult terrain by all of his foes.
Halt Action (Su): A tactician may use a use of his Halt Movement ability to stop a creature's standard action. The creature may resist this with a will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier.
Advanced Tactics (Ex): Whenever a tactician moves an ally with his Force Movement ability, that ally may gain Tactical Strike equal to the Tactician's until the end of their turn.
Silent Watcher (Su): A number of rounds per day equal to his class level, a Tactician may turn himself intangible, gaining the incorporeal subtype. These rounds need not be used together, and turning incorporeal is a free action. All of a tactician's abilities still function when incorporeal.
Master Warmaker (Su): A number of times per day equal to his Int modifier, a tactician may move any number of creatures within a 30 foot radius burst to any other point within that radius. The creatures are all moved simultaneously and provoke no attacks of opportunity.
(Image from 3.5 Player's Handbook)Last edited by Rauthiss; 2010-04-14 at 09:05 AM.
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2010-03-13, 09:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Puppeteer (A beguiler-style caster; PEACH)
What's wrong with standard Beguiler casting? There's no reason to break from it, especially to give a class more spells. The sorcerer should still be near the top...giving more high level spells than the sorcerer gets shouldn't be done.
Secondly, don't give such a huge DC increase. That's what Spell Focus is for. Instead, give other, flavorful abilities like the Beguiler gets. Maybe Telepathy, or Detect Thoughts at will...that sort of thing. A flat DC increase of that much is to powerful, and isn't flavorful at all.
The class as it stands is potent...and bland. Drop some of that raw power, and add some areas of interest.
No longer valid, as the class itself has completely changed.Last edited by Djinn_in_Tonic; 2010-03-16 at 08:56 AM.
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2010-03-13, 09:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Puppeteer (A beguiler-style caster; PEACH)
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2010-03-13, 10:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Puppeteer (A beguiler-style caster; PEACH)
Ingredients
2oz Djinn
5oz Water
1 Lime Wedge
Instructions
Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.
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2010-03-13, 10:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Puppeteer (A beguiler-style caster; PEACH)
darn,
here was me hpoing for the stat-out of a Pierson's Puppeteer* my emphasis
http://dmreference.com/SRD/
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/
Things that don't kill me make me strong
Things that do kill me leave me dead
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2010-03-15, 04:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Puppeteer (A beguiler-style caster; PEACH)
I miss Sense Motive within class skill. Maybe some Mindbender abilities (in Complete Arcana and Tome and Blood)
Inspiration: This is actually an old old old class I had homebrewed for a tabletop campaign. It was basically my version of an enchantment warmage/beguiler type that wasn’t a bard.
However i like this mind-controller mindbreakerI am willing and able to evaluate and critique homebrew material. PM me a link if you want an evaluation or a critique. If this applies to you too, put this in your sig.
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2010-03-16, 07:41 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
The tactician is ready for review! Rip me apart, you know you want to.
On a separate note, I'm considering upping his BAB to 3/4. Thoughts?Homebrew Hoard
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2010-03-16, 08:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Unbalanced Strike is a weird name; sounds like the Tactician is the one who is unbalanced.
On the other hand, Tactical Strike does sort of have this ring to it...
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2010-03-16, 08:50 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Now, this is more flavor than anything I suppose, but couldn't a high-level tactician potentially say "Everything that fails a Will save runs off a cliff/ into the bubbly pit of acid/ into the angry dragon's lair."?
It could be easily fixed by saying that they can't be force moved into direct harm or by giving a bonus to the will save in such cases. But as I said, mostly a flavor thing-- no matter how good you are at squad tactics, chances are it probably won't make sense for your enemies to spontaneously commit suicide.
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2010-03-16, 09:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
@DragoonWraith: Derp derp derp, you are right.
@Jack - I think I'll give them a bonus on will saves, like I did for halt movement.Homebrew Hoard
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2010-03-16, 11:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
move another creature with 10 ft. per class level up to the distance indicatedHomebrew
Please feel free to PM me any thoughts on my homebrew (or comment in the thread if it's not too old).
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2010-03-16, 11:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Tacticians are proficient with all simple weapons, one martial weapon of their choice, and light armor.
Force Movement (Su): A tactician may spend a move action to move another creature with 10 ft. per class level up to the distance indicated. An unwilling target of this ability is granted a Will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier to resist this effect. If the movement would result in harm to the creature (Moving into a pool of acid, for example) the creature gets a +6 bonus to its will save.
Tactical Strike (Ex): Whenever a tactician strikes a creature that has been moved with his Force Movement this turn or the turn before, he can add the indicated dice to the damage dealt by the attack.
Daze (Sp): A Tactician may cast Daze as a spell-like ability at will as a wizard of caster level equal to his class level.
Halt Movement (Su): A number of times per day equal to his int modifier, a tactician may spend an immediate action to stop a creature's movement. The creature may resist this with a will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier. If stopping movement would result in harm to the creature (stopping above a spiked pit, for example) the creature gets a +6 bonus to its will save. A tactician need not ready an action to be able to do this.
Like a Ghost (Su): Whenever a tactician would be granted an attack of opportunity, he may instead take a 5 foot step as an immediate action.
Suggestion (Sp): The number of times per day indicated, a tactician may cast Suggestion as a spell-like ability as a wizard of caster level equal to his class level.
Multiple Force Movement (Su): A tactician may move more than one creature with his Force Movement ability by dividing up the total movement in 5 ft. increments.
Aura of Adversity (Su): A burst of the radius indicated around the tactician is treated as difficult terrain by all of his foes.
Halt Action (Su): A tactician may use a use of his Halt Movement ability to stop a creature's standard action. The creature may resist this with a will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the tactician's class level + the tactician's Int modifier.
Advanced Tactics (Ex): Whenever a tactician moves an ally with his Force Movement ability, that ally may gain Tactical Strike +1d6 until the end of their turn.
I can add more bonus damage with level 1 spells.
Silent Watcher (Su): A number of rounds per day equal to his class level, a Tactician may turn himself intangible, gaining the incorporeal subtype. These rounds need not be used together, and turning incorporeal is a minor action. All of a tactician's abilities still function when incorporeal.
Master Warmaker (Su): A number of times per day equal to his Int modifier, a tactician may move any number of creatures within a 30 foot radius burst to any other point within that radius. This ability functions as the Dimension Door spell, except used on other creatures.
In short, this class is very poor. It's a martial class with bad proficiences and horrible BAB, with a horribly sub-par damaging ability and a movement ability that can hardly be used offensively and doesn't move much even if you use it to help your allies. The only real features are the capstone, which if it negates actions is broken, and the ability to sometimes negate enemy actions, which is useful, but not enough to drag this out of T6.
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2010-03-16, 12:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Milskidasith has it right (and just saved me a lot of time). I'm also puzzled by the combination of spells and martial abilities...it seems like this is trying to be a martial class, but you stuck spell-like abilities on for some reason. They don't seem to fit (nor does teleportation or becoming incorporeal, in my mind). Perhaps consider martial maneuvers (Setting Sun and White Raven might be useful), and adding more "mundane" (although not nerfed) tactical abilities?
Ingredients
2oz Djinn
5oz Water
1 Lime Wedge
Instructions
Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.
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2010-03-16, 12:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Raise the BAB, add more tactical strike damage (like the rogue progression, probably), and let allies you move with force movement get the full bonus.
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Please feel free to PM me any thoughts on my homebrew (or comment in the thread if it's not too old).
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2010-03-16, 08:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
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2010-03-16, 08:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
I don't think the pseudo sneak attack is fitting for the class. Perhaps grant the extra damage to allies as well?
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2010-03-16, 08:59 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
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2010-03-17, 09:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Bump for hopeful commenting. :3
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2010-03-18, 05:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Point of possible interest: That image is from either the 3.0 or 3.5 PHB or DMG originally. I think 3.0, as if it was 3.5 there would be more comments, and I think those are the only versions I got hard copy.
My games:
Have you ever wondered How to Succeed in Evil?
Thanks licoot for the awesome Pip avatar!
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2010-03-19, 07:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
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2010-03-19, 10:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Another thing to think about, the Field Officer from d20 future gets some pretty cool abilities with leadership and spending his action points to give bonuses to his team-mates.
I'm not sure how well it would fit in, but it's a thought.What D&D Character would I be?
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Lawful/Good Human Wizard/Sorcerer (2/2)
Str - 14
Dex - 17
Con - 15
Int - 16
Wis - 15
Cha - 18
Hmmm.. Not too shabby. I think I'd do pretty well. Who knows?
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2010-03-19, 10:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
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2010-03-19, 11:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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2010-03-19, 11:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
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2010-03-19, 11:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Personally, I'm a great fan of action points. They allow PCs to avoid dying from bad rolls, attempt truly heroic feats, provide a way to revise existing feats to give extra effects with action points (eg. "A character with Weapon Focus can roll d10s instead of d6s when spending an action point to improve an attack roll or critical hit confirmation roll with that weapon").
The one real flaw in the system is that the action point recharge mechanic sucks hard if you make any attempt to deviate from the standard 13 1/3 encounters per level-up.
What exactly is it about them that you dislike?
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2010-03-19, 11:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
To me, action points have always created a conflict of interest - if I save them for when I make a bad roll, I tend to feel they've been wasted on bad rolls, while I'm always reluctant to use them for good rolls in case I need them for bad rolls. In addition, I dislike the rules for gaining them - I feel that is one of the things they did very right in 4e.
If you'd like to continue the discussion, I'd prefer it be done via PM, as to avoid clogging the thread with off-topic discussion.Homebrew Hoard
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2010-03-22, 09:57 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Bumping for hopeful comments.
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2010-04-01, 11:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
</bump>
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2010-04-08, 11:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Bumping fro spring comments.
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2010-05-29, 01:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: [3.5 Base Class] The Tactician (Currently PEACHable)
Any other thoughts, all? I'd appreciate the input!
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