D&D 5e Subclass Contest Chat Thread

[theVoidWatches]

Thanks for the feedback - I think you're right that it's leaning towards combat more than social abilities, but I'm not too bothered by that. Bards lean pretty heavily towards social abilities already, after all.

I've added a boost to the capstone in giving you the ability to reroll the d6 for gaining inspiration points, as well as giving you a full 1d6 instead of just 1 Awe Point on initiative rolls.

Plautus was an ancient Roman playwright, and was one of the first whose plays acknowledged the audience and left actors the freedom to interact with the audience to a certain extent - in other words, he was the first to play to the audience in the way that the subclass is all about.

[nickl_2000]

Thanks! I actually just threw the whole thing together last night sort of out of nowhere. The thing I'm most unsure of is the wording on Gaze Beyond the Veil, but I think it'll be alright as is for now. I also thought of adding a bit to Gaze Beyond the Veil to let them get some insight on the creature/object's future, but I decided not to try and tackle that hairy beast. Any insight (heh) on how I could do that without becoming broken are welcome.
Also, should I limit Shared Insight to one creature at a time, or is it fine as is?

I think it is fine the way it is honestly. Although I might simplify it down even more in that you don't need to spend the action to connect with the friendly minds. Just allow telepathic communication and add the intuition point with friendly, willing creatures. The communication aspect is still less powerful than the Ghostwise Halfing or Warlock feature.


As for gaze beyond the veil, you could tighten up some of the wording. There are definitely a few cases where you could use it instead of the "single creature or object." I would not give it an aspect that allows you to predict the future. That is asking a DM to predict what they players are going to do (always a bad idea) or not give them as much control over what happens in the campaign (even worse idea). Honestly, I think it is good the way it is currently.

[Nicrosil]

Feedback!

Spoiler: College of Plautus

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I like it! The effects the Awe points give you are powerful, but it's tempered by the difficulty in obtaining them. In fact, it might be a bit too hard to get Awe points? Well, I'm going back and forth on it, but the more I think about it, the more I feel like it's balanced. I like the optional nomination rule as well (especially since the DM can veto). Overall, it looks like fun!

Spoiler: Way of the Elemental Bands

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Looks interesting! I understand why you made a new pool of points rather than ki points, to avoid the pitfalls the original elemental monk falls into, but it is a lot to keep track of. Pushing and spending the points is very thematic, but it also seems kind of complicated. Say I'm level 20, and I just finished a long rest. I get 12 points, split evenly among each of my bands, so that's, say, 3 in fire, 3 in wind, and 2 in everything else. If I want to cast immolate, I need 6 points in fire and wind. So I can't spend any points, because doing so would remove them until I finish a rest. Instead, I would need to use a lot of turns to cast the elemental ribbon cantrip/use the Arms like X feature to move the points where I'd need them. After casting immolate, I'd have 6 points in lightning, and none in my other bands. If I want to cast hold person, I need 3 points in fire and 3 in water, so I'd need to go through the process of shuffling points around again. Is that right, or am I misreading this? Also, is there a limit to how many points you can have at a time? The abilities themselves seem fine, it's just the point shuffling mechanic that's throwing me off. Overall it looks really cool, but it's a lot to keep track of.

Spoiler: Barbarian Path of the Bloodied

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Looks good! No real complaints here, though personally I'd switch the bonuses you get at 4 BPR and 6 BPR; a +1 to hit bonus at level 4 feels off for some reason. Also it doesn't specify if that's just for melee weapon attacks, or all attacks. Also also, is there anything preventing an ally from punching you a lot before battle to build up BPR? I don't know if there would be any problems with it if that were the case, since rage only lasts so long, but it's something to keep in mind.

More inbound!

[nickl_2000]

Feedback!

Yay feedback :)

Looks good! No real complaints here, though personally I'd switch the bonuses you get at 4 BPR and 6 BPR; a +1 to hit bonus at level 4 feels off for some reason.

I'll take your gut there. I'm not tied into the order on those, switching is fine.

Also it doesn't specify if that's just for melee weapon attacks, or all attacks.

Nope, I chose that specifically. I want my barbarian to have choices. And a really, really angry barbarian throws a dagger at someone much harder than a non-angry person :)

Also also, is there anything preventing an ally from punching you a lot before battle to build up BPR? I don't know if there would be any problems with it if that were the case, since rage only lasts so long, but it's something to keep in mind.

More inbound!

Yup "Whenever an opponent causes you to lose hit points you also gain a blood rage point (BRP)."

At this point I'm depending on the DM to adjudicate what an opponent is and what one isn't. This is part of the reason I only made it last for the rage. You can't abuse it to excessively when it only last for 1 minute.

[RickAsWritten]

My entry, the Irradiated Fighter, is up. I wanted to pretty much make Sickening Radiance as a subclass, as it's one of my favorite spells. It's got a couple nods to other post-apocalyptic influences as well. I tried to keep it balanced at first blush, but there may be a few things that are a little off. Feedback is welcomed as always. Thanks.

[BerzerkerUnit]

Irradiated Fighter will likely take one of my votes, I really like it. Honestly, I think you should call it Spellscarred or Mournlander to tie it directly to a campaignsetting. Radiation always makes me think of the Hulk and there’s no real Hulk about this. You can stick with the magical calamity theme but also tie in the Star of Ill Omen, fiendish curses etc.

Feedback: perpetuate might be too good if you don’t cap the amount of clicks it can apply since at level 7 you could be applying 2 clicks per round. That makes the later ability to swap clicks for exhaustion really harsh I think, potentially halving speed and accuracy of a boss on round 3.

[Phhase]

Does anyone have more pointers on Oath of the Enshaedn?

[Fnissalot]

Spoiler: Way of the Elemental Bands

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Looks interesting! I understand why you made a new pool of points rather than ki points, to avoid the pitfalls the original elemental monk falls into, but it is a lot to keep track of. Pushing and spending the points is very thematic, but it also seems kind of complicated. Say I'm level 20, and I just finished a long rest. I get 12 points, split evenly among each of my bands, so that's, say, 3 in fire, 3 in wind, and 2 in everything else. If I want to cast immolate, I need 6 points in fire and wind. So I can't spend any points, because doing so would remove them until I finish a rest. Instead, I would need to use a lot of turns to cast the elemental ribbon cantrip/use the Arms like X feature to move the points where I'd need them. After casting immolate, I'd have 6 points in lightning, and none in my other bands. If I want to cast hold person, I need 3 points in fire and 3 in water, so I'd need to go through the process of shuffling points around again. Is that right, or am I misreading this? Also, is there a limit to how many points you can have at a time? The abilities themselves seem fine, it's just the point shuffling mechanic that's throwing me off. Overall it looks really cool, but it's a lot to keep track of.

I think you are reading it correctly. That was the idea of how it would work. It is insightful to hear someone else discuss it!

Elemental ribbon cantrips is 1/turn but can be done without worry over time outside of combat. At level 5 you can move 4 points per turn with attacks through arms, and at 11 you can move 8 points per turn. So after doing the immolate, to do hold person you would need to first do 9 attacks (3 turns) while to cast warding wind would "only" need 4 attacks (1 turn).

The current amount of points lets you at level 20 cast between 1 5th level spell, 1 2nd level, and 2 1st levels per short rest or 11 1st level spells.

That said, you should probably be free to arrange them however you want at the end of a rest if kept as it is now. And I need to simplify it a bit.

[theVoidWatches]

Feedback, finally!

Spoiler: Way of the Elemental Bands

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This seems like a lot, and too complicated for a subclass. I'd like to see it as a full class, though - maybe as a Wu Jen? I don't have any specific feedback other than 'simplify' though. A simpler version might give you bonuses depending on how many points are in each band (maybe you get a passive bonus based on which band currently has the most points) and allow you to push them to another band with active use - you would have to continually vary your ability use as the points circle around.

Spoiler: Path of the Bloodied

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Is 6 BRP meant to be a +1 to attack rolls?
I generally like this - it motivates you to tank by rewarding you for taking hits rather than increasing your ability to do so, which is neat.

Spoiler: Oath of Light

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Can you change Luminous Points to spell points more times than you have Channel Divinities? I would suggest moving that into the Deity's Light feature so it can be made clear. As the other channel divinity maybe rip off the Holy Weapon that the Devotion paladin gets, investing light into a weapon to make it more powerful.
What kind of attack roll does Hurling Smite use - a ranged weapon attack, or a ranged spell attack?
Burning Aura should probably do Radiant damage.

Spoiler: Combo King Fighter

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I don't like the Rival feature. While it definitely fits the flavor, mechanically you've somehow gained an ******* who just supernaturally shows up to help you (despite nominally being a rival). This should be a roleplay thing, not a mechanical benefit.
I think it would be cool if your combo points were maintained until you were hit by an attack or went a turn without attacking. This would allow for more expensive finishers that might end up even more overtly supernatural, but would be difficult to pull off as they would probably require careful maneuvering to be able to avoid hits while still building your combo.

Spoiler: Path of the Spellbound

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I have nothing to say about this except that it's sad that the sorcerer doesn't get this many metamagic options. I love it!

Spoiler: Oath of the Enshaden

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In the title of the oath it's called the Enshaedn, which I assume to be a typo.
The title in general feels off. Oath of the Shadow, Oath of the Darkness, or Oath of the Night all feel appropriate, but Enshaden doesn't feel right.
I feel like they should get Shadow Blade as an oath spell.
Instead of requiring Shade Points to cast their domain spells, why not let them spend Shade Points to boost their spells? Or at least reduce the price. You get so few Shade points, and the costs are so relatively high...

Spoiler: The Great Dragon

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Seems kind of boring, but it works.
Breath of the Ancestor is gonna be crazy strong - reduce it to half your warlock level d6s, and make it a 1d6 cooldown instead. As is it's a 1/combat nuke, but I think it should instead be an alternate attack.
Instead of coming out as a cone, Breath of the Ancestor should be whichever shape your ancestor has.
Should probably change all the "ancestor"s to "patron"s.

Spoiler: Guilder

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I'm sorry, but I hate this. This is such a boring archetype and it's so reliant on DM fiat for what's available.

Spoiler: The Circle of Eyes

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Form of a Thousand Eyes feels strange to me. Do you maintain that form? What stats does it have? Sharing Portent is cool, but I suggest modifying this slightly - allow the character to spend a single use of Wild Shape to momentarily assume this form and see a glimpse of the future. One wild shape, one portent. Let it be used twice per long rest.
Generally speaking this is neat, but Intuition Points could probably get another use or two.

Spoiler: Irradiated

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I really like having the system be that you can use as many points as you want, but it gets dangerous and even deadly before long.
Other creatures having rad clicks could stand to be a bit more interesting. Maybe each time they start a turn, they take necrotic damage and radiant damage equal to the number of clicks they have, and their clicks drop by one. Add a smite-esque effect where you can give yourself a click to give your enemy a click on hit, and you've got a nice slow-burn effect that seems appropriate for radiation.

[Fnissalot]

Feedback, finally!

Spoiler: Way of the Elemental Bands

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This seems like a lot, and too complicated for a subclass. I'd like to see it as a full class, though - maybe as a Wu Jen? I don't have any specific feedback other than 'simplify' though. A simpler version might give you bonuses depending on how many points are in each band (maybe you get a passive bonus based on which band currently has the most points) and allow you to push them to another band with active use - you would have to continually vary your ability use as the points circle around.

Ok, even more insight into me overdoing the base of this subclass.

Current plan on simplifying it:
You have 2*proficiency elemental points.
You are in an elemental stance.
Depending on the stance you are in, you have different options of spells or abilities.
Each stance will have a passive effect that is active as long as you remain in that stance, a ribbon cantrip, and a set of abilities that spend elemental points. You can only use an ability that cost as much as your proficiency bonus or less.
At the end of your turn if you have used an ability of your stance, you change elemental stance to the next one in the circle.

[BerzerkerUnit]

Feedback, finally!

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Spoiler: Combo King Fighter

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I don't like the Rival feature. While it definitely fits the flavor, mechanically you've somehow gained an ******* who just supernaturally shows up to help you (despite nominally being a rival). This should be a roleplay thing, not a mechanical benefit.
I think it would be cool if your combo points were maintained until you were hit by an attack or went a turn without attacking. This would allow for more expensive finishers that might end up even more overtly supernatural, but would be difficult to pull off as they would probably require careful maneuvering to be able to avoid hits while still building your combo.

[

Spoiler: Guilder

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I'm sorry, but I hate this. This is such a boring archetype and it's so reliant on DM fiat for what's available.

Spoiler: Irradiated

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I really like having the system be that you can use as many points as you want, but it gets dangerous and even deadly before long.
Other creatures having rad clicks could stand to be a bit more interesting. Maybe each time they start a turn, they take necrotic damage and radiant damage equal to the number of clicks they have, and their clicks drop by one. Add a smite-esque effect where you can give yourself a click to give your enemy a click on hit, and you've got a nice slow-burn effect that seems appropriate for radiation.

Thanks so much for your feedback!
The Rival mechanic is designed to model relationships seen in a lot of manga and anime. technically, you are the Rival, your counterpart appearing out of nowhere fresh as a daisy, smacking your foe, chiding you, and escaping scot free is what motivates you to recover, tenuous a situation as that may be. But it’s enough to reset your death counter and push the fight to a conclusion, maybe even restrain or prone a foe depending on the Finisher they use.

I had thought about having 5+ point Finishers and different mechanics for losing combo points as you describe, but the reality is a Tabaxi with the Mobile feat or MC swashbuckler could rack up a mountain in a short period of time at no risk.

I also felt it was a trap option, I wanted the combos to be every other turn to every turn and that meant balancing them more or less against Hex and Hunter’s Mark and smite spells. Saving up for some twelve dragon fist attack on round 5 when most foes are already on the ropes or down would feel like a waste. I also wanted them all available from level 3 on and having to either create scaling damage dice or allow 3rd level fighters to occasionally meteor swarm wasn’t going to work.

Re: Guilder
I agree, a list of what you can buy at those levels to prevent DM fiat would be good.

Radiation fighter:
They already have a mechanic that applies clicks, I agree that something that makes foes take radiant and Necrotic damage (or radiant and poison/acid) per click might be cool.

Something that stimulates healing in allies (at the cost of maybe useless mutations or exhaustion/poisoned condition) would be cool too.

[Phhase]

Feedback, finally!


In the title of the oath it's called the Enshaedn, which I assume to be a typo.
The title in general feels off. Oath of the Shadow, Oath of the Darkness, or Oath of the Night all feel appropriate, but Enshaden doesn't feel right.
I feel like they should get Shadow Blade as an oath spell.
Instead of requiring Shade Points to cast their domain spells, why not let them spend Shade Points to boost their spells? Or at least reduce the price. You get so few Shade points, and the costs are so relatively high...

Nah, just me being dumb and stylistic. You'd think they'd get Shadow Blade, but it deals psychic damage, which I feel is a little at odds with the whole Don't Cause Terror thing.

Did you catch the part where your Shade is equal to your Charisma SCORE? You might be right though, so I reduced the cost of replacing a shot to just the spell slot's level rather than double and doubled Shade recovery. I just wanted to avoid the class becoming Warlock, since you get some shade back on a short rest.

[theVoidWatches]

I think I automatically read it as Charisma Modifier. Which, honestly, is also absurd, but in the opposite direction. It should probably scale somehow. I suggest giving Shade Points equal to your Paladin level.

[nickl_2000]

Feedback, finally!

Spoiler: Path of the Bloodied

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Is 6 BRP meant to be a +1 to attack rolls?
I generally like this - it motivates you to tank by rewarding you for taking hits rather than increasing your ability to do so, which is neat.

Yup, I changed it to make it more obvious and use standard language.

That was part of what I wanted to make here. You are a tank as a barbarian, your main goal in life if to take abuse and make sure the squishies don't. So, why not reward you for doing and that make you better as you do it.

[Phhase]

I think I automatically read it as Charisma Modifier. Which, honestly, is also absurd, but in the opposite direction. It should probably scale somehow. I suggest giving Shade Points equal to your Paladin level.

That's why I made the costs so high, and the restore so low. I kind of liked the pool being (more or less) static, so that lower levels you cast more spells, but as you unlock more uses for Shade you kinda branch out (Nightnail 5 enemies, Shadowsight, etc.), but Level + bonus could work too. Iunno. Maybe I could add an option to boost the Smite with Shade? Thoughts on domain spells?

[sengmeng]

Re: The Great Dragon
Seems kind of boring, but it works.
Breath of the Ancestor is gonna be crazy strong - reduce it to half your warlock level d6s, and make it a 1d6 cooldown instead. As is it's a 1/combat nuke, but I think it should instead be an alternate attack.
Instead of coming out as a cone, Breath of the Ancestor should be whichever shape your ancestor has.
Should probably change all the "ancestor"s to "patron"s.

Thanks for feedback; you're the first to look at it after the pact boon, invocations, and metamagic were added.

Yeah, I agree on the boring. Making it less like the draconic bloodline would help, I'm sure, but logically, why would it be significantly different?

Is a once per combat nuke necessarily bad? As is, it's a longer recharge than a dragon or half dragon's breath weapon, maybe slightly ahead on damage, but not much. I may change it if anyone else has similar opinions.

The word "ancestor" shows up because their direct draconic ancestor doesn't necessarily match the patron's color/type (who are supposed to be god kings/queens like Bahamut or Tiamat).

Thanks!

[SleeplessWriter]

Feedback, finally!

Spoiler: The Circle of Eyes

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Form of a Thousand Eyes feels strange to me. Do you maintain that form? What stats does it have? Sharing Portent is cool, but I suggest modifying this slightly - allow the character to spend a single use of Wild Shape to momentarily assume this form and see a glimpse of the future. One wild shape, one portent. Let it be used twice per long rest.
Generally speaking this is neat, but Intuition Points could probably get another use or two.

Thanks for the feedback. No, you don't maintain the form beyond the ritual where you get the portents, so no stats. Fixed it to make that a little clear, and also added the ability to choose to expend either one or two wild shape when you perform the ritual to get an equal number of portents. Forces players to be strategic about it, but losing one short rest's worth of wildshape isn't that hard to replace if you do it at the beginning of the day before breaking camp/leaving the inn/what-have-you. Probably only an issue when pressed for time, so DM/Party dependent there.
I also added another way to use intuition points at 10th level, though I'm still kinda unsure whether two points is high enough a cost to limit it reasonably. That'll probably be fine, though. I also limited shared insight to a single creature that way forewarned wouldn't put the power level over the top, but I removed the range on the pseudotelepathy to make that a bit more useful too.

I also attempted to clear up the wording on gaze beyond the veil, hopefully I didn't just mangle it.

One more thing, I have another contest theme idea: Bring Out Your Dead! (Tong!), necromancy themed subclasses.

[Fnissalot]

Elemental bands monk has been overhauled to simplify it. I changed some of the elemental features. There is no interaction with Ki points currently, so that is something I will have to look at, and I think it has a bit too much spell-casting currently for my taste. Do you think it is simplified enough and is anything too unbalanced?

I will read through and comment on the other sub-classes after work.

[nickl_2000]

Just realized that I hadn't given feedback on this one yet.

Spoiler: Martial Archetype – Irradiated

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I love the flavour text describing this subclass. It lends really well to certain character concepts and could turn really fun in a long term game where the DM plays along. Also, I like how this makes the points a bad thing instead of a good. It's different than how the rest of use have done it and I like the mechanic.

Clicks of Radiation
"For each click gained above your Fighter level, you must make a Constitution save against your Radiation DC" - It's a little bit odd that as you level it actually becomes harder to pass the save (well I guess it would stay level, but still the DC is higher as you level). I may actually look at setting the DC based on the total amount of clicks you have, so it gets more dangerous as you get more clicks above the soft max. 13 + #click above level would likely work..

Perpetuate - Based on wording it sounds like they only get a click if they move within 5 of you or end their turn there. What happens if you move within 5ft of them and they move away before the end of the turn? Do they have to make a save? I do worry this is a little bit overpowered, but I would have to see it in play to know for sure.

Irradiator
Injection- What is the effect of the Radiation Click? Is it the same as perpetuate? Or is it the same as you have as a PC? Just needs to be defined here. Also, is it intented that you can do this with a ranged attack? Does it make sense that you can inject radiation into someone from 300 feet away with an arrow?


Reactor - You forgot to add a level here.
I think you may be overusing exhaustion a little bit. I understand that it is a capstone, but you have the ability to give exhaustion in multiple different ways. Stacking them together could make it so you can drop someone with a few turn without ever having done any damage to them. I would prefer to see exhaustion removed from this and another effect added instead (just an opinion).

[BerzerkerUnit]

Sorry for the delay, here's some Feedback:

College of Plautus

Spoiler:

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I haven't watched prowrestling in years, but I can see the appeal of having a PC that keeps holding their hand to their ear waiting to see how the crowd chimes in.

First, maybe make a requirement that 5 creatures need to be present. Even hostile creatures can count, otherwise what crowd are you playing to on a stealth run or doing survival checks to chase the bad guy.

This also brings us to the major concern. I can see it being very possible as is that you may go entire sessions not generating Awe. Depending on 20s rolled or reducing a creep to 0 for a class that isn't combat oriented and a subclass that isn't making it combat oriented is rough. Even the skill roll thing I could see getting tedious as the player endlessly asks for rolls on every possible knowledge check or double doing every other PC's skill schtick in the hope of getting a 20 so they can accumulate some points.

The level 6 feature needs a phrase saying it comes at 6. I see it as a little boring because it's just lifting features from other classes. Note: that's entirely subjective, I don't see any balance issues except for the problem of maybe never having any points.

Recommendation: maybe have some kind of If it Bleeds it Leads feature so you get a point the first time you damage a foe after rolling initiative and the first time you're injured after rolling initiative or a Tag Team feature that gives you a point when you use or receive the Help Action.

Goodluck!

Elemental Bands Monk

Spoiler

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Hmmmm. I know this is reaching for a fix to 4 elements monk from the PHB. In that respect I think it hits the mark on diversity of options.

That said, I'm not sure I'd want to play a class that has 2 separate pools of resources (elemental and Ki) and kind of requires a flowchart round to round (and I love sorcerers that have slots and points, but they're still static). It also seems really limited in how much elemental stuff you can do before you're just punching since you have so few points). Maybe if there was a bonus action to Spend Ki to buy elemental points it would seem more open. At 2 ki per point with a note you can't go over your maximum it would add some flexibility the mandatory elemental change warrants.

If I'm reading it right, the forced change after using a Band feature might take you to a subpar options for immediate circumstances forcing you to just punch or something when you really want a specific elemental feature.

Good luck!

Blood Rage Barbarian

Spoiler

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It doesn't seem unbalanced since it's caps are level based. As an alternate RAGE HARDER to the Berserker I think it's a success.

That said, so many incremental boosts might feel like a chore to track. Maybe you could experiment with "buying" the features you want for a certain number of points (maybe 1/2 - 1/3 their current thresholds). Or chunk them together into 1, 5, 11, 17 blocks so it mirrors tier. Then the player doesn't have to track all those widgets and update their sheet every turn.

Complexity aside, what does this guy do out of combat? Barbarians are maybe the most straight combat class and every feature here is combat oriented. I see you removed a medicine thing, adding something like that in as you learn to treat your own minor scrapes would be something. Maybe add an Herbalism Kit or Brewer's Tools proficiency and a trick to make your own combat drugs ala Maenads or Juicers.

Good luck!

Oath of Light

Spoiler

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I like that spell list and the basic concept is fine. I'd like to see the tenets of the Oath, maybe some stuff about rooting out corruption and banishing fear by defeating roaming monsters.

Recovering your Luminous points should require you to at least rest in light otherwise you're just always topped off every hour. May also want to make it "While resting or performing light activity in an area of Bright Illumination you regain Luminous Points.

Since you can spend them like a sorcerer for slots, but your points come back far more easily, I'd recommend reducing it to Half Paladin level (as they are half casters).

Not sure I like a flash grenade that also restores your points as a feature. It also comes at a level that's usually more defense oriented for you and the party. Maybe some sort of Hearth Aura "creatures in 10 feet of you always feel as if they are in the light of a cozy fire, they are immune to climate hazards due to extreme cold and have resistance to cold. As a reaction you can grant advantage to a creature in the aura making a save against cold damage."

Also, no non combat utility though I know paladins are usually bad at that.

Good luck!

More to come!

[theVoidWatches]

College of Plautus
I haven't watched prowrestling in years, but I can see the appeal of having a PC that keeps holding their hand to their ear waiting to see how the crowd chimes in.

First, maybe make a requirement that 5 creatures need to be present. Even hostile creatures can count, otherwise what crowd are you playing to on a stealth run or doing survival checks to chase the bad guy.

There's a note that you need at least one person present who can see or hear you. I know from experience that theater people only need one person to be playing to an audience.

This also brings us to the major concern. I can see it being very possible as is that you may go entire sessions not generating Awe. Depending on 20s rolled or reducing a creep to 0 for a class that isn't combat oriented and a subclass that isn't making it combat oriented is rough. Even the skill roll thing I could see getting tedious as the player endlessly asks for rolls on every possible knowledge check or double doing every other PC's skill schtick in the hope of getting a 20 so they can accumulate some points.

I see what you mean, and I would like to give more ways to get Awe. I did add Nomination as an optional rule, and I think the class would work best with it being used - it's optional more so the DM can prevent it from being overused than because I think it'll be problematic. I like your idea of If It Bleeds It Leads, and might add something similar.

The level 6 feature needs a phrase saying it comes at 6. I see it as a little boring because it's just lifting features from other classes. Note: that's entirely subjective, I don't see any balance issues except for the problem of maybe never having any points.

There is a quote saying that it comes at 6th level, it's just not the first thing in the feature.

[BerzerkerUnit]

Another feature idea for the College of Plautus might be something where you direct the ill will of the crowd at a foe, Dog Pile or something where maybe as a specific upgrade to vicious mockery you can use a bonus action to deal bonus psychic damage based on your allies’ Cha bonuses or something? Minimum 1 per ally?

[Fnissalot]

Sorry for the delay, here's some Feedback:


Elemental Bands Monk

Spoiler

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Hmmmm. I know this is reaching for a fix to 4 elements monk from the PHB. In that respect I think it hits the mark on diversity of options.

That said, I'm not sure I'd want to play a class that has 2 separate pools of resources (elemental and Ki) and kind of requires a flowchart round to round (and I love sorcerers that have slots and points, but they're still static). It also seems really limited in how much elemental stuff you can do before you're just punching since you have so few points). Maybe if there was a bonus action to Spend Ki to buy elemental points it would seem more open. At 2 ki per point with a note you can't go over your maximum it would add some flexibility the mandatory elemental change warrants.

If I'm reading it right, the forced change after using a Band feature might take you to a subpar options for immediate circumstances forcing you to just punch or something when you really want a specific elemental feature.

Good luck!

More to come!

The diagram has been removed since before you wrote this in order to streamline it. Right now it is two static pools (elemental and ki), and a stance which controls what abilities you have at your disposal for the current turn. Initially I was thinking about calling the subclass the way of the primal ouroboros for how you will be running around this circle of elements, but that made it feel super esoteric and unclear what it was about when I talked with my gaming group about it. The current 4 elements monk only gets a super small selection of abilities and they cost way too much Ki for you to want to use them. This gets access to more abilities, but you only have access to 20% of them on any turn. The negative side of this is that you might need to spend four turns doing things to get into the stance you need for a specific spell, which is not the whole world to me at least, and I don't think any of the spells I gave it would be needed that extremely?

Just curios, do you think it would be better to "at the end of your turn, after you used an elemental ability, roll a d6, on a 1-5 change to the corresponding subclass (1 earth, 2 wind, 3 fire, 4 lightning, 5 water) and on a 6 choose which stance you want to enter."? It would be less deterministic but you might get more quickly to the element you would want. I personally prefer the deterministic approach, especially to monks; they don't feel so wild, random, or chaotic.

That said, it might have to few points in the early levels, and I want to find a way to weave ki points into it. Maybe it should always be on a short rest, and having a level 6 ability that combines into ki-points would be cool.

Its amount of elemental points(and how many spells at lowest or highest level that is) compared to eldritch knight, since it gets its subclass at level 3. It has 21 spells known (not counting the other abilities not directly casting a spell) but limited to its stance in what it can cast, eldritch knight only has 13. (That said, it is more closely related to a half-caster take on the warlock with spell points. If it would start at level 2, it would unlocks spell slots at the same speed as paladin and ranger, and regains spell(elemental) points on short rests after 6 level.)

Level	Eldritch Knight	Elemental Bands
3	2 *lv1	4 points (2 lv 1)
4	3*lv1	4 points (2 lv 1)
5	3*lv1	6 points (3 lv1 to 2 lv 2)
6	3*lv1	6 points/short (3 lv1 to 2 lv 2)
7	4*lv1, 2*lv2	6 points/short (3 lv1 to 2 lv 2)
8	4*lv1, 2*lv2	6 points/short (3 lv1 to 2 lv 2)
9	4*lv1, 2*lv2	8 points/short (4 lv1 to 2 lv 3)
10	4*lv1, 3*lv2	8 points/short (4 lv1 to 2 lv 3)
11	4*lv1, 3*lv2	8 points/short (4 lv1 to 2 lv 3)
12	4*lv1, 3*lv2	8 points/short (4 lv1 to 2 lv 3)
13	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 2*lv3	10 points/short (5 lv1 to 2 lv 4)
14	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 2*lv3	10 points/short (5 lv1 to 2 lv 4)
15	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 2*lv3	10 points/short (5 lv1 to 2 lv 4)
16	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 3*lv3	10 points/short (5 lv1 to 2 lv 4)
17	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 3*lv3	12 points/short (6 lv1 to 2 lv 5)
18	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 3*lv3	12 points/short (6 lv1 to 2 lv 5)
19	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 3*lv3, 1*lv4	12 points/short (6 lv1 to 2 lv 5)
20	4*lv1, 3*lv2, 3*lv3, 1*lv4	12 points/short (6 lv1 to 2 lv 5)

[BerzerkerUnit]

Knowing now that you're balancing against Eldritch Knight helps me make some sense RE: the spell availability.

I'm not sure I have enough of a grasp on your target to provide any more input than I have. That doesn't mean it needs to change, just that it doesn't appeal to me in its current incarnation.

I don't want to belabor the point, but a class option that forces you out of what might be a neutral or good set of abilities to deal with the immediate scenario into what might be less desirable or just inapplicable set of abilities is something I can't rightly grok. Wild Magic I get, sometimes you get good, sometimes bad, and both recharge an ability and other abilities are about luck bending or damage boosting.

This is a bevy of elemental abilities which you'll only have access to 1/4 of the time. Compared to a 4 elements monk, where I get a small number of abilities, but I know exactly what I have and can use them whenever I need them, even comboing some in the same turn.

I'm one guy though, I might just be on the outskirts of the bellcurve.

[Fnissalot]

College of plautus
Some weird written things that probably just is miswritten. (each time you each time you)
I like the idea of rhetorician or orator. I am not sure about the implementation though. The rate of accumulation of awe points will be very hard to balance and is hard to say something about without testing it. I think it might risk in some campaigns to never reach its potential due to how the table plays, while others will get it up there after a few rounds and can them spend them freely without care. Outside of that, it feels like it mostly is a lot of passive buffs and very few active options, which might make it feel like fighter champions etc.

Path of the bloodied
FYI, I read BRP as burp. Other than that, it is clean and cool. I would probably add something that does not correlate with rage (possibly out of combat or ribbon) just to even it out a bit as it is very centered around one thing (rage) right now. Maybe you can spend the BRP temp. hit points to gain a buff on intimidation (since you are drenched in blood)? I think the point accumulation will work very well in this implementation also! Good job!

Oath of light
I, personally, don't like the use of the word light when it comes to the cleric domain, and I find a bit of the same issue with this. I think a light focused subclass do not need to be focused around fire. At least you have not included anything about enlightenment.
Burning aura might be too good, the automatic damage in such a big range for such a long time (I would probably make it require concentration or limit it to 1 minute). At the same time, it is similar to the desert storm herald and people thought that was weak.
Beacon of light does not currently affect your light points in any way.

Combo King Fighter
As the combo point feature is worded right now, you can not spend points you get the same turn as you must do it when you take the attack action. Is that intentional?
I still think rival is a very funny ability even if it has weird effects on the narrative of the game.
The risk of losing a combo is rather high (due to numbers on a die), and I am not sure the abilities are worth the risk. You should pretty much always cash in your points as you will most likely loose them otherwise. I think it will feel super-frustrating to play this as you will so often lose your combo without getting anything for it. Furious strikes, signature slash, and red comet are great and probably the only finishers I would ever use. Getting a free hit that deals "less" damage is great.

Path of the Spellbound
Cool! I don't have so much to add. I think tearing surge could teleport first and then surge, as it would fit better with a barbarians role (not fleeing). And arcane surge could add your rage damage (or be d4+rage damage) to be more thematic.

Oath of Enshaedn
You get a lot of points early which could easily be abused. Getting that much more spells out (even if they are domain spells) is strong at level 3. Also, you might not get more points at later levels, and then you won't feel like you are improving in the same way. You only get more expensive powers without getting to do them more. It feels weird to me that you get as many points as your score but regen according to the modifier. I think this class has a lot of strong stuff going on but that would be ok if the points scaled better.

Great Dragon Patron
Does what it says, feels more draconic than the sorcerer version due to the pact, invocations, and new metamagic option. Feels very close to its original but I shouldn't say something as I try to remake a subclass as well.
Energy substitution might need a slight buff (make it affect the spell on your next turn as well?)

Guilder
I don't get what is going on or the intent of it =S

Circle of eyes
It is more or less divination druid? Cool! I like the aesthetic of it. Gaze beyond the veil is a bit lacking for a lvl 14 feature that costs 3 points unless I am missing the point of it?

Irradiated
I like the idea but a lot of the abilities are rather weirdly constructed and some might be very powerful.
It is unclear when you get reactor.
Perpetuate is a pre-deployed, AoE counterspell. I think it is a very mess as it is written right now, and it is strong enough that the subclass maybe shouldn't get that many abilities at that level.
Extraction forces exhaustion on enemies, which is crazy, and it can force multiple levels of it as well.

[nickl_2000]

Sorry for the delay, here's some Feedback:


Blood Rage Barbarian

Spoiler

Show

It doesn't seem unbalanced since it's caps are level based. As an alternate RAGE HARDER to the Berserker I think it's a success.

That said, so many incremental boosts might feel like a chore to track. Maybe you could experiment with "buying" the features you want for a certain number of points (maybe 1/2 - 1/3 their current thresholds). Or chunk them together into 1, 5, 11, 17 blocks so it mirrors tier. Then the player doesn't have to track all those widgets and update their sheet every turn.

Complexity aside, what does this guy do out of combat? Barbarians are maybe the most straight combat class and every feature here is combat oriented. I see you removed a medicine thing, adding something like that in as you learn to treat your own minor scrapes would be something. Maybe add an Herbalism Kit or Brewer's Tools proficiency and a trick to make your own combat drugs ala Maenads or Juicers.

Good luck!

[B]College of plautus

Path of the bloodied
FYI, I read BRP as burp. Other than that, it is clean and cool. I would probably add something that does not correlate with rage (possibly out of combat or ribbon) just to even it out a bit as it is very centered around one thing (rage) right now. Maybe you can spend the BRP temp. hit points to gain a buff on intimidation (since you are drenched in blood)? I think the point accumulation will work very well in this implementation also! Good job!

The people have spoken, sounds like I needed one additional ability that is useful out of combat or elsewhere. So, I added in one more ability at level 3.

Frightening Facade
Bloodragers have a reputation in the world for being tough and quick to anger, and just looking at your scars and wounds it is obvious you are one of them. As such, most people are easily swayed to your side rather than risk experiencing your blood rage. At level 3 you may use your constitution modifier in place of your charisma modifier when making a check for persuasion or intimidation, and you gain proficiency in one of the two skills.

[theVoidWatches]

College of plautus
Some weird written things that probably just is miswritten. (each time you each time you)
I like the idea of rhetorician or orator. I am not sure about the implementation though. The rate of accumulation of awe points will be very hard to balance and is hard to say something about without testing it. I think it might risk in some campaigns to never reach its potential due to how the table plays, while others will get it up there after a few rounds and can them spend them freely without care. Outside of that, it feels like it mostly is a lot of passive buffs and very few active options, which might make it feel like fighter champions etc.

Yeah, I don't know if I have the accumulation rate set up well at all. I might swap out 1d6 Awe Points to 1d4 now that there are more ways to get them, but I'm not sure.

It definitely depends on table play style, but doesn't everything?

Having passive buffs as the primary bonuses is intentional. Bards are full casters and aren't going to suffer from a lack of options, like Champions do. And since this is a backwards resource where you get them over time, there were two ways to handle it - either mostly passive buffs as you get them, or you get them by using active abilities and they're bad for you (like the Irradiated subclass Rick made). I preferred passive buffs, personally.

[BerzerkerUnit]

Combo King Fighter
As the combo point feature is worded right now, you can not spend points you get the same turn as you must do it when you take the attack action. Is that intentional?
I still think rival is a very funny ability even if it has weird effects on the narrative of the game.
The risk of losing a combo is rather high (due to numbers on a die), and I am not sure the abilities are worth the risk. You should pretty much always cash in your points as you will most likely loose them otherwise. I think it will feel super-frustrating to play this as you will so often lose your combo without getting anything for it. Furious strikes, signature slash, and red comet are great and probably the only finishers I would ever use. Getting a free hit that deals "less" damage is great.
ll.

Thanks for the feedback!
I don’t see anything that prevents you from using combo points the turn you get them except they can’t be used with attacks of opportunity. Admittedly, at level 3 you would need to use two weapon fighting, make your off hand attack first, hit, and then use your attack action attack as a Finisher, so heavy weapon and bow fighters do have to wait till level 5, but then you can attack and finish every round if you like. And keep in mind, all finishers are weapon based, so swapping between weapons as needed is totally viable (especially since several finishers are improved when you release your weapon!)

And gambling for 3 successful attacks over two turns might seem a challenge at level 3, but it becomes very likely at level 11, and nothing requires you to combo a single opponent, you can action surge to slap around the boss’ low Cr minions to generate a bunch of points and then make 3 Skullsplitters or whatever on the boss.

[Fnissalot]

Thanks for the feedback!
I don’t see anything that prevents you from using combo points the turn you get them except they can’t be used with attacks of opportunity. Admittedly, at level 3 you would need to use two weapon fighting, make your off hand attack first, hit, and then use your attack action attack as a Finisher, so heavy weapon and bow fighters do have to wait till level 5, but then you can attack and finish every round if you like. And keep in mind, all finishers are weapon based, so swapping between weapons as needed is totally viable (especially since several finishers are improved when you release your weapon!)

And gambling for 3 successful attacks over two turns might seem a challenge at level 3, but it becomes very likely at level 11, and nothing requires you to combo a single opponent, you can action surge to slap around the boss’ low Cr minions to generate a bunch of points and then make 3 Skullsplitters or whatever on the boss.

Based on how it is written right now, you spend points for finishers when you take the attack action, so you need to do so before rolling any attack and you cannot do finishers on bonus action attacks.

[BerzerkerUnit]

To my knowledge, there is nothing in the rules as written mandating when you take the bonus action attack from Twf. Crawford’s (IMO ridiculous) assertion about shield mastery is bad and I think where this reasoning comes from.

As it has been ruled at every table I’ve played at on the west coast and hawaii, You declare what you’re doing before you resolve. That declaration is a commitment to do what you’ve declared and if it becomes irrelevant, you do nothing.

Example: I’m gonna Attack, (saying this triggers Twf) I make my bonus action off hand attack. Orc falls. I can stab the corpse or direct your main hand attack at another foe you can reach or move within reach of. If that was the last foe or no other enemies are in range you do nothing with your main hand or action, you cannot choose to dodge at that time.

Example 2: 2 wpns, warcaster, I declare attack, I attack with main hand wpn, enemy dies, I can either attack another foe with off hand wpn, move and attack, or choose to cast a bonus action spell. Because I chose to save the Twf Attack for last, I now have options on what I can do with the bonus action.

There are reasons to do either, maybe you have a magic weapon, maybe you want your lower damage off hand dealing with the kobold in front of you so your higher damage main hand (or multiple attacks) deal with the dragon 20 feet away.

I have never seen “off hand attacks always come after” as a valid interpretation or seen it implemented by a DM (I can’t speak to what other players may have chosen to do at the table, I only keep track of so much).

So, Combo Points And Finishers, as written here in its draft form, work as I’ve described given what I’ve seen as the most common interpretation of the RAW. Further even if you choose your interpretation, your issue dissolves at level 5 when you can make multiple attacks with your action and if you insist that that part is unclear, then I will be reviewing the text for a second draft before voting time later this month, but the intent is explicitly to allow any fighter at level fighter to attack and finish each round if desired from 5th on.