Results 151 to 178 of 178
-
2012-01-27, 02:04 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2011
- Location
- Amsterdam
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
dear Arcano...(see i made a D&d joke with you name :P)
speak for yourself..
I have been reading this strip from somewhere 2005 on and I think it only became better..
The first thing I always do at work is get coffee and check this site..and I hope to continue this for quite the while.
I frankly am allready getting scared of the empty feeling when Oots might come to an ending..
Just like you finished a good book...the big: 'and what now'...Last edited by Snurk; 2012-01-27 at 02:04 PM.
-
2012-01-27, 02:06 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2008
- Location
- Sweden
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
I won a thread. Am I pathetic to list that in my signture? Yes. Of course I am.
Awesome avatar is awesome. And made by yldenfrei.
-
2012-01-27, 02:11 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Not wanting to derail this further, but... I started reading it right after it began and quit after a few weeks because I did not find it interesting. A year ago (or so) I peeked in again and stayed. They have been telling a very good, catching story and I stayed for this.
In regard to the giggles, the comic clearly falls short when compared to its roots (DM of the Rings) but as a story, I really enjoy it.
-
2012-01-27, 02:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
- Location
- Chicago
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
-
2012-01-27, 02:51 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
I think that OoTS is one of the most interesting and thought provoking webcomics out there. The plot is excellent, the characters mostly 3 dimensional and the humour/action/art almost always good at least. Now there have been some strips that are not good IF READ IN ISOLATION but more often than not rereading them after a few weeks when you can see the whole arc redeems them somewhat. Is it perfect.......no. Is it very good........yes.
Now the fantasy epic plot is not entirely original I know. But for me the biggest factor in making something a favourite is the characters. I began reading during the Darth V arc and, I will be honest, I had not liked hir all that much. But the growing desperation, the need for power, the changes that influence even current strips in ways both subtle and prominent and the strength of the writing and art all convinced me to give V another chance. Elan's growth from useless annoyance to central character and 2nd main protagonist of the strip (IMO) has been wonderful to behold. Roy has always been a favourite of mine and the way he has grown over time has been good to see. Haley too has only become more interesting. The strip where she speaks to Roy's corpse is still an amazing character piece. Even Durkon and Belkar (the 2 least interesting) have had some good moments.
The characters of the OoTS are what keep me coming back is what I am trying to say. They are 3 dimensional. The friendships seem real. It is rare, if ever, that someone seems out of character. People who began as somewhat humourous cliches about DnD and who acted as foils for rule based jokes are now some of the most (lacking a better term) human characters in existence. A change that began as early as the 14th Strip. And the explorations of ideas of Good, Evil, Desperation and misguided hope through such people as Redcloak and Miko are some of the most compelling I have ever read.
For me the OoTS has not been a story driven webcomic at any point in it's life. From about the 60th strip it has been a Character driven strip. Granted there is a strong plot with clear actions. However it has always been the choices and actions of the characters that has driven events forward the most. It is not about "the Plot" but about the people and how they react to the world around them. Whether it is making jokes about the absurd DnD world they live in, laughing together at the trials they face, or simply facing evil as a team the real power of the comic is the characters. There is a reason the comic is named, the Order of The Stick. This is their story.
Sincerely.
Omergideon.If I cared about this, I would probably do something about it.
-
2012-01-27, 02:55 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2008
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
You do realize that the change from a comic based on jokes about DnD to a more plot-centric comic occured around 700 strips and 8 years ago, right? This isn't something that's just happened recently.
I don't like it and I've got my reasons for it which I stated above. No one has to agree with me and I in no way think that I am "right" about this (one can't be!). But I know that I'm not the only one who thinks that way. In fact most of the people I recommended OotS to stopped reading after a while or just check back occasionally. And they all told me that the reason for this is that it gets boring after a while.
If Rich is happy with the way his comic evolves and if he can make a good living out of it, then my best wishes to him. It's just not working for me and that's kind of sad, but you can't make it right for everyone.Last edited by dps; 2012-01-27 at 10:21 PM.
-
2012-01-27, 03:05 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
This comic is barely cryptogram related anymore!
If Rich doesn't immediately give Haley her speech impediment back, I fear he will lose all the cryptogram lovers he picked up way back when.
I used to meticulously work out each and every cryptogram (each comic used a different key!) and now what am I expected to do? Subsist on plot, characters, and D&D rule jokes!?
"Rpqrji fn rj fhfik!"
-
2012-01-27, 04:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2011
- Location
- USA
-
2012-01-27, 05:34 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
- Location
- Chicago
- Gender
-
2012-01-27, 06:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2011
- Location
- Wisconsin, USA
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Well, considering that it's got liches, dragons, paladins who Smite Evil, underpowered bards, powerful magic users, undead, levels, skill points, spell lists, arcane and divine casters, otyughs, and so on, I can't see how you can say that it's not a D&D comic any more.
Yes, it's not about rule jokes at this point. But it's still totally infused from end to end with 3rd edition D&D rules.Spoiler
So the song runs on, with shift and change,
Through the years that have no name,
And the late notes soar to a higher range,
But the theme is still the same.
Man's battle-cry and the guns' reply
Blend in with the old, old rhyme
That was traced in the score of the strata marks
While millenniums winked like campfire sparks
Down the winds of unguessed time. -- 4th Stanza, The Bad Lands, Badger Clark
-
2012-01-27, 06:28 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2004
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
As part of your defense of plot-oriented webcomics over gag-a-day ones, you are pointing at a webcomic which is at least as plot-oriented as OotS and saying it's bad because the jokes you looked at without the context of having read the rest of the webcomic weren't funny.
Do you see the irony yet?Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
-
2012-01-27, 11:41 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
- Location
- CT,USA
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Oh, you took what I posted to it's logical exaggeration. One I never made. That's the problem. I strongly doubt anything on the page I read needed "context" to get. I got them, I also got the origin of the
jokereference. I don't find blatant references funny, that's all.
You also think I have some sort of vendetta against gag-a-days. Apples and oranges. One is one and the other is the other. Anyone with eyes can see Darths has a plot it follows. My first reaction when I saw the page was "Oh, they're at New Hope now?" They were still in the prequels last I looked. Having a plot is a big part of the comic, like DM of the Rings or any Abridged Series. Even some Edit Series have some loose timeline going on.
I should have posted more of his post. Here it is:
Often after reading the newest strip I'm like "Well, that wasn't really satisfying, maybe the next strip gets better." And the fact that we have to wait days, if not weeks, for a new strip just emphasizes this feeling. If there'd still be a "one strip, one joke"-basis, it wouldn't be a problem, but often the strips are at best remotely funny. You could argue that driving the plot forwards demands that, but I think that's not true. There are other comics out there that achieve both telling an ongoing story and still being funny nearly every single strip, while being updated on a regular (if not daily!) basis (right now I'm thinking of Darths and Droids, perfect example IMO).
Your perfect example is a double derivative copy-pasta work who's best joke in the latest strip was a reference to a third work. It didn't even make any sense.
- Rich does all his own art. Darths takes screenies
- Rich created the characters and the story without a 35 year old script to fall back on. Rich has often mentioned not wanting to use D&D as a crutch. Darth & Droids is the opposite extreme of this as everything hinges on what is available from someone else along with the minimum rule set joke requirements.
- While he writes and draws as he goes and other setbacks he still delivers more than most. Most webcomics give you a page per update, Rich often gives 2 per update. He gives even more when it's a combat heavy set of pages so as to not bog down the pace with weeks of what amounts to 10 seconds of time passed.
My complaint was not that Darths & Droids is bad but that OotS can almost be objectively considered to be more work than the example given in almost all aspects. Still, we are somehow supposed to fault it for taking longer to develop than a comic that takes a fraction of as much time to produce.Last edited by FatJose; 2012-01-27 at 11:46 PM.
Deviantart
Youtube
SpoilerEvery few years, the yank moviegoing public is greeted with a movie that instantly earns the desirable tag of "One of the Scariest Movies Ever Made!" This designation accustomed be reserved for less than the foremost special of terror tales — psychotic, The Exorcist, Alien — however currently, it is a catch phrase combat, Saw, The Descent, Paranormal Activity, Insidious, Sinister — the list goes on. (But no Jack and Jill? What the hell?) -A Wise Adbot
-
2012-01-28, 03:43 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
If you'd read my post again, you may note that I never compared OotS to D&D in anything art/work related. I just explained that it's perfectly possible to have an ongoing story while still doing gags on a quite daily basis. That it's more work to draw something like OotS doesn't surprise. That's why D&D is updated regularly every 3 days and OotS maybe once per week, sometimes not even that.
And your point is?
And I never said you should. Why has everyone who doesn't agree with you always to be some kind of missionary?
I just wanted to show my sympathy for the starting post since I also regret that OotS isn't as funny anymore (at least in my opinion). It's still a good comic, that's why I'm still here reading it and posting on these boards. And yes, it's obvious that OotS has a strong fanbase, no matter how many people stop reading it, I never disputed that. But that's no reason for not being allowed to voice opinions against the comic and/or Richs decisions without being branded as a heretic, to put it drastically.
I don't even want Rich to drop the plot, it's no bad thing that he drastically improved the comic in this regard. In fact quite the opposite. I just think it's a pity he doesn't do as much gags as he used to. This does in no way have to have an impact on the plot.
-
2012-01-28, 05:05 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2010
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
It does. Plot demands in-depth interaction between known and developed characters. That means the Giant has already done a lot of the gags that could be relevant to their interactions. On a more general level, a darker and more involved plot necessarily means a de-emphasis on gag-a-day writing. It's not a perfect zero-sum game, but you simply can't maintain the mood of a story arc while constantly interrupting yourself with gags.
-
2012-01-28, 06:22 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
-
2012-01-28, 07:36 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2004
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Fellow, you're not getting this. As someone who has read the entire webcomic, I am telling you that the things you referred to on that page need context to get, and that the things you've said about them indicate not understanding (more specifically, believing you understand and not actually understanding) what they're references to in that webcomic. Lines on that page may have originally come from Lethal Weapon, but that's not their point there.
Say you don't believe me, if you want, but please quit dodging the point.
<snipped because I am quite unwilling to get involved in any way in an argument over relative webcomic quality here>Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
-
2012-01-28, 08:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
You do realise that the characters in Darth & Droids have "little" to "nothing" to do with the original characters George Lucas wrote? They are basically entirely new characters living in the same setting. They act different, they are different, and they are used to tell a different story.
The fun and parody comes from the fact that we know how the characters actually are and what they said in the movies and that this now totally works out differently because we have different characters (looking the same and being based on the same idea).
-
2012-01-28, 08:26 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
- Location
- Gotham City
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
None of your critiques of Darths and Droids really have anything to do with Darths and Droids. You are setting up a straw man to compare with OOTS. If you want to make a comparison, you should use a comic that you've actually read on a regular basis. To be honest, I also don't think your claim that Darths and Droids "takes a fraction of the time" to produce in comparison to OOTS holds any water.
But I presume you were trying to make a point about OOTS that got lost in all of this. Could we return to that aspect of the discussion (i.e. to being more on-topic) at this stage? Your Darths and Droids line of reasoning isn't really going anywhere so maybe it is time for a different tack."And yet, will we ever come to an end of discussion and talk if we think we must always reply to replies? For replies come from those who either cannot understand what is said to them, or are so stubborn and contentious that they refuse to give in even if they do understand." - St. Augustine
The Index of the Giant's Comments | Thanks, Bradakhan, for the avatar!
-
2012-01-28, 08:58 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2010
- Location
- You can't catch me anyhow
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
The last few strips have been more D&D accurate than every strip that proceeds them combined.
I dont see what the problem is.Last edited by Doxkid; 2012-01-28 at 08:58 AM.
-
2012-01-28, 09:04 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
In fact in light of the wisdom expressed by these posters I am incensed that I have been tricked into reading a comic so heavily based on the evil game of Dungeons and Dragons. PLEASE! Giant make it even more character based and get rid of these disgusting references
Oh and the nudity and sex too. Kids read this comic!
More on the point i think this thread has reached its end IMHOI Am A:Neutral Good Human Bard/Sorcerer (2nd/1st Level)
Ability Scores:
Strength-14
Dexterity-11
Constitution-16
Intelligence-16
Wisdom-12
Charisma-16
-
2012-01-28, 09:10 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
- Location
- CT,USA
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Funny thing is I'm not the one who brought it into discussion. It was brought in to bash OotS if anything.
There isn't anything bashing Darths in my last post. That people still see it as that isn't my problem anymore. I shouldn't have to lick a comic's boots to show I don' hate it either. I know "what" it is. I'm not insulting it for being that but I'm not proclaiming its glory from the mountain top. If people can only translate opinions as Awesome and Garbage that's their deficiency.Deviantart
Youtube
SpoilerEvery few years, the yank moviegoing public is greeted with a movie that instantly earns the desirable tag of "One of the Scariest Movies Ever Made!" This designation accustomed be reserved for less than the foremost special of terror tales — psychotic, The Exorcist, Alien — however currently, it is a catch phrase combat, Saw, The Descent, Paranormal Activity, Insidious, Sinister — the list goes on. (But no Jack and Jill? What the hell?) -A Wise Adbot
-
2012-01-28, 09:30 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2004
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
-
2012-01-28, 09:33 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2011
- Location
- Wisconsin, USA
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Well, there are a few people, such as myself, who see what you're talking about. And yes, I agree with all of your points. There was indeed nothing bashing Darths and Droids in your last post.
In fact, all you stated was that it was in fact plot based (as the OP seemed to be asserting it wasn't), and that it is not showing signs of being a stunning gag-a-day strip (which the OP seemed to be asserting it was).
All you stated, from what I can see, that it doesn't show up OotS the way the OP was suggesting, and is in fact more plot driven and less gag-a-day than he asserted. Basically, you were just defending OotS a bit, without really saying anything against Darths -- just pointing out that a) it's technically easier to produce, and b) doesn't display the supposed traits that were ascribed to it as marking out its "superiority" to OotS quite as clearly or strongly as was argued.
I don't get why half the posters in here are gnashing their teeth like you directed deadly insults at it, either. All you've been saying is that it's not as valid as a criticism of OotS as it was made out to be, in your opinion.Spoiler
So the song runs on, with shift and change,
Through the years that have no name,
And the late notes soar to a higher range,
But the theme is still the same.
Man's battle-cry and the guns' reply
Blend in with the old, old rhyme
That was traced in the score of the strata marks
While millenniums winked like campfire sparks
Down the winds of unguessed time. -- 4th Stanza, The Bad Lands, Badger Clark
-
2012-01-28, 09:34 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
-
2012-01-28, 09:37 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Redcloak is breaking the rules! Well, thats shows there ARE rules to break, right?
Still DnD, folks. Move along nothing more to see here.
Seriously, this discusion is a quite a bit pointless. Watch out before you start anything nasty. Like refering to Adolf
-
2012-01-28, 09:47 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2010
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Meh, the mantle leveled Redcloak up in moments and dumped a whole bunch of knowledge in his head. So what if a few custom spells could have been part of that, or even if he took the time to research some (like Durkon is)
What spells the characters know is the least rules-important issue of the strip and of the game. Stuff like being unable to teleport to safety because you're trapped in a dimension lock, or not knowing when another character uses a supernatural ability - both of which lead directly to a character's death - that's the kind of rules info that's actually plot-relevant.Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
-
2012-01-28, 11:15 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2011
- Location
- sad
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
Well, considering that it's got liches, dragons, paladins who Smite Evil, underpowered bards, powerful magic users, undead, levels, skill points, spell lists, arcane and divine casters, otyughs, and so on, I can't see how you can say that it's not a D&D comic any more.
Yes, it's not about rule jokes at this point. But it's still totally infused from end to end with 3rd edition D&D rules.SpoilerThis is the thief who likes to hoard,
That loves the bard with the puppet Lord
That admires the fighter with the green-hilted sword,
That employs the Wizard, whose bird is ignored,
That has the gender unexplored
That intrigues the Halfling, usually bored,
That slew a mountain of the goblin horde,
That follows the cleric,
That serves the lich,
That seeks the gate,
That guards the snarl,
That lives in the prison the gods built.
guess what I was gone but now I'm back
-
2012-01-29, 05:59 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: This comic is barely D&D related anymore
I am 37 years old. Do you think that when I think about the next 40 years of my life, that I want to spend them making D&D webcomics? No. Of course not. This is my life, not a hobby. This isn't some lark that I'm doing during college that I'll forget about when I get a real job. This is the start of what I hope will be a career that will last the rest of my life. This is how I put food on the table for my family. Eschewing plot and character for a lifetime of easy cracks about Spot checks is not a career. It's pathetic. And it wouldn't last.
If I'm going to be a writer for a living, then there was ALWAYS going to be a point where I needed to put away the sillier gags and start writing a worthwhile story. Whether that was during OOTS or in between the transition from OOTS to whatever I do next, it was going to happen, or else OOTS becomes just a flash-in-the-pan that is forgotten when the rules it satirizes fade from public consciousness. I don't even think I'm there yet, but at least I've started trying.
What it comes down to is that I prioritize my overall development as a writer over the short-term enjoyment of that small minority of current readers that only want to see rules-based spoofs. Because most of the people who only want to read rule jokes are already gone. And because there are more people in the world who enjoy good fiction than enjoy good jokes about D&D, and I'm in this for the long haul.
That said, let's keep away from Mr. Morgan-Mar's webcomic and any bashing thereof. Or my schedule, for that matter.Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
~~You can also support The Order of the Stick and the GITP forum at Patreon.~~