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  1. - Top - End - #691
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    Now I'm curious if there are Zebra unicorns and Zebra pegasi.
    Would be kinda weird, wouldn't it? But I guess it's possible.

    I know some people see Zecora and zebras in general as perhaps having some magic, but I like to think that she's just dealing in herbal, completely natural remedies.

  2. - Top - End - #692
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    Now I'm curious if there are Zebra unicorns and Zebra pegasi.
    In one of The Wizard of Oz books there is a pigasus who magically forces its riders to speak in rhyming jingles. Maybe the zebra use them to get around so often that they forget to stop talking like that once they're off.
    Last edited by Kindablue; 2011-08-07 at 02:50 PM.

  3. - Top - End - #693
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    Would be kinda weird, wouldn't it? But I guess it's possible.

    I know some people see Zecora and zebras in general as perhaps having some magic, but I like to think that she's just dealing in herbal, completely natural remedies.
    I'm open to anything when it comes to the capabilities of races; Zecora's got something going on, that's for sure.
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  4. - Top - End - #694
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    Now I'm curious if there are Zebra unicorns and Zebra pegasi.
    Maybe some sort of equivalent. May not be equine though.

  5. - Top - End - #695
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Kindablue View Post
    In one of The Wizard of Oz books there is a pigasus who magically forces its riders to speak in rhyming jingles. Maybe the zebra use them to get around so often that they forget to stop talking like that once they're off.
    Heh, I like that idea

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    I'm open to anything when it comes to the capabilities of races; Zecora's got something going on, that's for sure.
    Sorry, I should probably say that I'm open to non-unicorn magic. It's my favourite explanation (if one is needed) for Pinkie Sense among other things.

    I just don't see Zecora as being all that magical, and zebras as essentially earth ponies.

  6. - Top - End - #696
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    Anyway, all I'm saying is, Twilight would have had a much better argument if she simply said she didn't believe in Pinkie's sense because Pinkie is not a unicorn and thus can't have magic. And the same for curses, Zecora couldn't do anything curse-like because Zecora is not a unicorn. Any claims of curses done by non-unicorns must be nothing but pony tales. Makes sense.
    Maybe there is just a strict distinction between magic and curses? Magic is always glowy and immediate. You horn glows - Rarity's mane turns green. Curses are underhanded and delayed. The witch doesn't need to even have a horn to curse you, and the result does not manifest until later. If curses are established as a staple impossible spell example since "magic 101" (like perpetual motion in non-pony physics), then Twilight's response is quite understandable.

  7. - Top - End - #697
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fizmat View Post
    Maybe there is just a strict distinction between magic and curses? Magic is always glowy and immediate. You horn glows - Rarity's mane turns green. Curses are underhanded and delayed. The witch doesn't need to even have a horn to curse you, and the result does not manifest until later. If curses are established as a staple impossible spell example since "magic 101" (like perpetual motion in non-pony physics), then Twilight's response is quite understandable.
    I still prefer to think that Twilight's just picky about her terminology.
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  8. - Top - End - #698
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by fizmat View Post
    Maybe there is just a strict distinction between magic and curses? Magic is always glowy and immediate. You horn glows - Rarity's mane turns green. Curses are underhanded and delayed. The witch doesn't need to even have a horn to curse you, and the result does not manifest until later. If curses are established as a staple impossible spell example since "magic 101" (like perpetual motion in non-pony physics), then Twilight's response is quite understandable.
    I think that's basically my point, yes. Except perhaps the last part.

    I don't think curses or at least curse-like effects need to be impossible, if you're a unicorn. Seems obvious that Twilight could do a lot of things that would seem like a curse to the recipient.

    I think when the ponies talk about curses, they're talking about magical-like effects with a non-magical origin, and that's what Twilight is or should be objecting to. If she's objecting to the effects themselves being impossible, then she's just plain wrong.

  9. - Top - End - #699
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    I think that's basically my point, yes. Except perhaps the last part.

    I don't think curses or at least curse-like effects need to be impossible, if you're a unicorn. Seems obvious that Twilight could do a lot of things that would seem like a curse to the recipient.

    I think when the ponies talk about curses, they're talking about magical-like effects with a non-magical origin, and that's what Twilight is or should be objecting to. If she's objecting to the effects themselves being impossible, then she's just plain wrong.
    And I'm fully willing to think she's just plain wrong.
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    And I'm fully willing to think she's just plain wrong.
    I don't think that's what she's arguing... or, I like to think Twilight is actually quite intelligent and smart, so she'd know. Maybe she just failed to explain herself (lots of intelligent people struggle mightily to explain their abstract thoughts), or the writers just could have done better (in hindsight, which we know is always easy)

  11. - Top - End - #701
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Perhaps she's just not willing to believe in an effect neither she, nor any unicorn she has never met has produced? The only pony to use magic for an explicitly evil purpose is Nightmare Moon, after all.

    Speaking of evil, here are evil versions of the Mane Six, featuring Angel with a goatee of villainy (I guess he would be called Devil in this case?).

    http://ponibooru.413chan.net/post/view/42475

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    I think Twilight is like Wimp Lo from Kung Pow. Celestia deliberately gave her out dated books and lied to her about how magic works because she thought it would be funny.
    Last edited by Kindablue; 2011-08-07 at 04:09 PM.

  13. - Top - End - #703
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    Now I'm curious if there are Zebra unicorns and Zebra pegasi.
    I'll do you one better:
    Spoiler
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    Also, random image I wanted to post (warning - huge):
    Spoiler
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    Dat face


    Re: Magic/Curses - I would say that the issue is partly that Twilight has a specific and picky terminology when it comes to magic, but I think this makes sense considering she's studied it extensively and it is treated along the lines of 'arcane science' (the way magic is also treated for D&D wizards) rather than some dark pact (like Pathfinder witches) in the show. I also think Twilight is making a blanket statement here and is trying to defend Zecora, so she may not be striving for supreme technical accuracy either.
    Last edited by the_druid_droid; 2011-08-07 at 03:25 PM.
    This Machine Surrounds Hate And Forces It To Surrender

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    DD, your unicorn is stronger, prettier, and higher-ranking than mine, and her secret lab has a better name than mine. THERE SHALL BE NO QUARTER.
    Ponythread Learns to Draw!

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    Bleeeeh! Alfalfa Monster!


    Avatar by Aruius

  14. - Top - End - #704
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RdMarquis View Post
    Perhaps she's just not willing to believe in an effect neither she, nor any unicorn she has never met has produced? The only pony to use magic for an explicitly evil purpose is Nightmare Moon, after all.
    I don't feel that intent (good or bad) has to be part of the picture.

    If definitions are the problem, here's my take on magic vs. curses:

    Magic is whatever unicorns do. Its exact nature, limits and so on are apparently known, at least to some degree, by the inhabitants of Equestria, but not to us in the real world. For our purposes, however, it can do anything the writers decide it can do, so effectively it can do anything we can imagine. The only real limit we need to care about is that only unicorns can do it. This may be proven wrong later, but we assume that the ponies of Equestria believe this, whether or not it's true.

    A "curse" is something magic-like done without magic, something that can not be explained by magic, most likely because the one doing it isn't a unicorn. Other terms might fit this definition (I can't think of any right now), and "curse" is just one example of this. You could say "curse" is an example of something "supermagical" (as in supernatural).

  15. - Top - End - #705
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    I don't feel that intent (good or bad) has to be part of the picture.

    If definitions are the problem, here's my take on magic vs. curses:

    Magic is whatever unicorns do. Its exact nature, limits and so on are apparently known, at least to some degree, by the inhabitants of Equestria, but not to us in the real world. For our purposes, however, it can do anything the writers decide it can do, so effectively it can do anything we can imagine. The only real limit we need to care about is that only unicorns can do it. This may be proven wrong later, but we assume that the ponies of Equestria believe this, whether or not it's true.

    A "curse" is something magic-like done without magic, something that can not be explained by magic, most likely because the one doing it isn't a unicorn. Other terms might fit this definition (I can't think of any right now), and "curse" is just one example of this. You could say "curse" is an example of something "supermagical" (as in supernatural).
    But then how did the joke plant work? Wouldn't that be a curse, if had a magical effect without a unicorn origin? She ended that episode still believing that curses aren't real, IIRC.
    Last edited by Kindablue; 2011-08-07 at 03:34 PM.

  16. - Top - End - #706
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RdMarquis View Post
    Perhaps she's just not willing to believe in an effect neither she, nor any unicorn she has never met has produced? The only pony to use magic for an explicitly evil purpose is Nightmare Moon, after all.

    Speaking of evil, here are evil versions of the Mane Six, featuring Angel with a goatee of villainy (I guess he would be called Devil in this case?).

    http://ponibooru.413chan.net/post/view/42475
    Why... why is Rarity dressed in Trixie's cloak and hat? And Twilight in her gala dress?

    That kinda makes a disturbing amount of sense actually.

  17. - Top - End - #707
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Kindablue View Post
    But then how did the joke plant work? Wouldn't that be a curse, if had a magical effect without a unicorn origin? She ended that episode still believing that curses aren't real, IIRC.
    Ah, yes, sorry, should probably have a definition for "herbal" or "natural" stuff in there. So curses are examples of things that are both supermagical and supernatural I guess.

    Personally I like to think that Poison Joke is a magical creation, by a certain tricky moon goddess That's my explanation

  18. - Top - End - #708
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    I know some people see Zecora and zebras in general as perhaps having some magic, but I like to think that she's just dealing in herbal, completely natural remedies.
    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    I'm open to anything when it comes to the capabilities of races; Zecora's got something going on, that's for sure.
    Maybe she does ritual magic? The ponies needn't know this is even possible, so Twilight would never have read about it. Or perhaps she was just being anal about semantics.

    EDIT: I failed at teh speling.
    Last edited by Nomar; 2011-08-07 at 03:43 PM.

  19. - Top - End - #709
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Geez, everypony.

    A Midnight Nightmare Ending Discussion:
    Spoiler
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    Way to be...basically evenly split on the two options that I was *seriously* considering.

    Option 'B' really is a non-starter because, as previously stated, just exceptionally poor timing. It simply would not work in this environment anymore.

    But to be almost evenly split on options 'A' and 'C'!

    ...Don't make me make this a multiple choice ending.

  20. - Top - End - #710
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by EsperDerek View Post
    It's on her deviantART, one of the many responses that she's done, but I don't honestly have the link myself on hand.



    Geez, Inkwell, that's amazing. You even gave it an awesome background and everything, you did a positively spectacular job.

    But Five AM, Inkwell!? Really!? Have you not slept?!
    I got about an hours worth of sleep. Insomnia and Inspiration are both cruel mistresses. But can't argue with the results.

    Quote Originally Posted by EsperDerek View Post
    She is her aunt, and both of them realize it. But when Midnight was *a lot* younger, she referred to Celestia as her 'Gammy', and it delighted the Princess so much she kept encouraging it.

    In an OOC reason, it's sort of a reference as how Celestia acts as Twilight's 'mother' figure, ergo, any child Twilight would have, she would act as her 'Grandmother' figure.

    (Blame Inkwell for that. He came up with it.)

    And thanks, everypony, for the compliments. I never really expected to extend this, this far when I did the first one, it started as just a small thought in my brain.

    I'm trying to figure out the conclusion, but the problem is, I have three options and I'm not sure which one I actually want to select.
    Yes, the whole 'Gammy Cestya' thingie was my fault. It was just so cute that I couldn't resist.

    As for my vote as to Midnight's eventual condition, I will show my vote in a bit. With a picture. Because it needs to be drawn to give the full effect for what I'm voting for.

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by InkwellPony View Post
    I got about an hours worth of sleep. Insomnia and Inspiration are both cruel mistresses. But can't argue with the results.



    Yes, the whole 'Gammy Cestya' thingie was my fault. It was just so cute that I couldn't resist.

    As for my vote as to Midnight's eventual condition, I will show my vote in a bit. With a picture. Because it needs to be drawn to give the full effect for what I'm voting for.
    Alright, but it's still my job to scold you about lack of sleep, you know.

    And..I guess I'm waiting to see this picture?

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by EsperDerek View Post
    Alright, but it's still my job to scold you about lack of sleep, you know.

    And..I guess I'm waiting to see this picture?
    Yes you are! -(Evil cackle, thunderclap, and petting his black cat Percious)- Yes, you have fallen into my evil plot... of... making you wait... for yet... more... fanpictures of...

    Darnit, you tricked me into drawing more fanpictures for you, didn't you?

    Grrr...

    And yes, my black cat is named Percious (Pronounced Persius) due to a mispelling that I liked on her adoption papers. Admittedly, I could have named her 'Hey, you little black b****' for how well she responds to it.

  23. - Top - End - #713
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Nomar View Post
    Maybe she does ritual magic? The ponies needn't know this is even possible, so Twilight would never have read about it. Or perhaps she was just being anal about semantics.

    EDIT: I failed at teh speling.
    I'm open to alternative magics, as I said about non-unicorn magic in general. But I don't see a problem with semantics here, even though Twilight fails to state her definitions clearly.

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    At the risk of negativity, what's everyone's least favorite episode? Mine is Owl's Well That Ends Well.
    I've got to go with Party of One as my least favorite episode. I'll admit it was very well put together, but it took my favorite pony and broke her. it doesn't help at all that this scene (among other things) hits on the idea that the reality one perceives might not be the actuality of the universe; a concept which subtly freaks the kidneys out of me. If you ignore my negative reaction to that scene, I'd probably rate that as one of favorites, if not my absolute favorite.
    Quote Originally Posted by tonberrian View Post
    WANT. WANT WANT
    - First, find words Gadora is about to say
    - Second, STEAL THE HELL OUT OF THEM
    Quote Originally Posted by InkwellPony View Post
    Eat this, Skull-boy! Showin' off your skull armada? Well face off against my fully functional space vessel!

    Spoiler
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    The Alicorn Class Starship PNY-1401, designation Aurora!


    And I can state that it is officially 20% cooler than any vessel you can throw at me! -(Grins wickedly)-
    On second thought, now that I've seen the sun and moon there, I don't know that I want that. If starships require that either Celestia or Luna be sealed away- wait. Clearly the ship was built to rescue the both of them from their unjust banishments. Okay, this is back in the WANT category. (But who banished them?)
    Quote Originally Posted by Castel View Post
    I know I said I didn't like it the first time I saw it, but Pinkie Keen is OK because:

    Spoiler
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    Honk.
    You argue most eloquently.
    Quote Originally Posted by darthbobcat View Post
    Now I'm curious if there are Zebra unicorns and Zebra pegasi.
    I nominate rhinoceroses for the role of African unicorns. Because it's funny.

    More seriously, without hitting up appropriate mythologies, I'd have to nominate the gazelle as a unicorn analogue.

  25. - Top - End - #715
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by InkwellPony View Post
    Yes you are! -(Evil cackle, thunderclap, and petting his black cat Percious)- Yes, you have fallen into my evil plot... of... making you wait... for yet... more... fanpictures of...

    Darnit, you tricked me into drawing more fanpictures for you, didn't you?

    Grrr...

    And yes, my black cat is named Percious (Pronounced Persius) due to a mispelling that I liked on her adoption papers. Admittedly, I could have named her 'Hey, you little black b****' for how well she responds to it.
    Yes, you've fallen into my cunning trap of...inspiring your creativity?

    Darn me?

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadora View Post
    I've got to go with Party of One as my least favorite episode. I'll admit it was very well put together, but it took my favorite pony and broke her. it doesn't help at all that this scene (among other things) hits on the idea that the reality one perceives might not be the actuality of the universe; a concept which subtly freaks the kidneys out of me. If you ignore my negative reaction to that scene, I'd probably rate that as one of favorites, if not my absolute favorite.

    - First, find words Gadora is about to say
    - Second, STEAL THE HELL OUT OF THEM

    On second thought, now that I've seen the sun and moon there, I don't know that I want that. If starships require that either Celestia or Luna be sealed away- wait. Clearly the ship was built to rescue the both of them from their unjust banishments. Okay, this is back in the WANT category. (But who banished them?)

    You argue most eloquently.

    I nominate rhinoceroses for the role of African unicorns. Because it's funny.

    More seriously, without hitting up appropriate mythologies, I'd have to nominate the gazelle as a unicorn analogue.
    Well, I don't see a reason to distribute the unicorn/pegasus stuff among different species. It's not like there are real life unicorns and pegasi that we're having to build the scheme as an analogy of it.

    Though now that I think about it, since ungulates all seem to be able to talk, Africa-equivalent might be the single most diverse place on the planet, just by the number of species present.
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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gadora View Post
    On second thought, now that I've seen the sun and moon there, I don't know that I want that. If starships require that either Celestia or Luna be sealed away- wait. Clearly the ship was built to rescue the both of them from their unjust banishments. Okay, this is back in the WANT category. (But who banished them?)
    Actually, I think the "Earth" also has continents resembling an alicorn's head. Who would that be?

    More seriously, without hitting up appropriate mythologies, I'd have to nominate the gazelle as a unicorn analogue.
    Wow. There's a wiki for everything. Quite comprehensive one in fact. The sad thing is, I'd love to consume that information, but won't have the time now. Where was it 3 years ago

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    This should probably be posted here:
    Fluttershy is Chasing Rainbows

    It's a little more post-rock and minimalist than I usually like, but good.

    This is good too:
    At The Gala (Instrumental Orchestra)
    At The Gala (Orchestra Vocal Edition)

    Derpy comics:
    Spoiler
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    Last edited by Kindablue; 2011-08-07 at 04:50 PM.

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    I'm open to alternative magics, as I said about non-unicorn magic in general. But I don't see a problem with semantics here, even though Twilight fails to state her definitions clearly.
    I was trying to express two separate lines of thought there, and one didn't quite make it through.

    The idea was that Twilight is the only pony in the group who didn't grow up in or near ponyville, and also the only one who didn't react to Zecora with fear — fear of evil magic specifically. To me, that suggested a local superstition (the existence of curses as a specific kind of magic) that Twilight doesn't share, so that's what she might have meant with curses not existing.

    And now that I typed it all up I think I made things more complicated than necessary. A much simpler explanation is that Twilight was in a state of panic and grasping at straws.

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    Default Re: My Little Pony XIX: I Emptied Your Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by EsperDerek View Post
    Yes, you've fallen into my cunning trap of...inspiring your creativity?

    Darn me?
    My vote: Anything that leads to...

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    Nightmare Moon Shoulder Devil Pony. ^^

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