LGBTAitP #28: Come Taste the Rainbow!

[gunnar11]

@Laura: Congratz!

There shouldn't be, no. However, colloquial, a mental disorder means you're mentally deficient/insufficient. You are less than a normal person. Until that changes, "Mental Disorder" is a sort of social death-sentence if people find out you're disordered before they really get to know you. And it's not helpe by people using mental disorders as a shield from repercussion. the number of times I've heard "You can't get mad at me for being a prick, I have ADD/Asperger's/bipolar disorder/etc.!" is beyond easy count.

What I don't understand is why people can't just be fine with it.
Never heard: Sure, I've a mental disorder. I'm transgender, AND F*CKING PROUD OF IT TOO!

But a perfectly ordered bookshelf could be disorderly, if you're obsessive and/or compulsive enough!

Aren't they the same most of the time?
I feel compulsive, even though technically I'm only obsessive, having OTD.

So, how about that nonbleak stuff, eh? Anyone hug a puppy recently?

No, though I managed to hug 10 kittens at the same time!

...

Then one died :smallsad:

Nah, Claire is 24 and her brother is 21, so that makes being twins a bit hard.

Hahaha, three year lasting birth xD

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The segment was a report about tests of infant morality. They studied hundreds of infants, ages 3 months to five months, to see if they had any predispositions to morality or immorality (basically, "good" or "bad").

The first experiment was to see if infants could recognize nice and mean behavior, and which they preferred. They showed infants a puppet show where one stuffed animal (a tiger) was trying to open a box, while two other stuffed animals (dogs), identical save for the color of the shirt they wore, watched. First, one of the dogs helped the tiger open the box. Then, the scene replayed, but the other dog slammed the box shut while the tiger tried to open it. When the infants were offered both dogs to play with, over 80% of them chose the helpful/"nice" dog over the "mean" dog.

So, chalk one up for the good of humanity! Our natural instinct, at least so far, appears that we prefer those who treat others kindly!

The next experiment was very similar, but started differently. In it, the tiger was playing ball with two bunnies. One bunny played, passing the ball like it was suppose to, but the other kept the ball, then ran away. Then, the first experiment repeated, except it was the mean bunny that was trying to open the box. The result was that, once again over 80%, the infants preferred the "mean" dog, the one who slams the box shut, when the person trying to open it was mean themselves.

That's another point! A basic form of justice, where we feel mean people should be punished!

But it's not all good news. The last experiment is the one that's most relevant here: first, they offered the infant a choice between two snacks: Cheerios, and graham crackers. Then, they showed two cats, one eating Cheerios, and the other graham crackers. Then, the first experiment again, with the cat who prefered the snack the infant didn't trying to open the box. The result (this time I believe it was 87%) was that the children prefered the "mean" dog, hinting that they wanted the person who was different from them punished.

So, that could hint that bigotry, the dislike of those who are different or "other," is as much a part of our core as generosity and justice.

That is AWESOME
That is AWESOME
That is AWE- oh... uhmmm... Why do we do that?
Faith in humanity is lost...
Good thing Hope is my Virtue.

In other news, my sister will be coming home from college in a few days, and so I'm going to talk to her about what's going on. Hopefully she'll take it well...

Good luck!

Even if that wasn't the case, and she was presenting as female, can we be sure he wasn't picking up on male cues or pheromones or something like that? Or maybe he's just homoflexible - 99% of the people he fancies are men, and this is the 1% exception.
Or, maybe, he was mistaken, and he's actually bi.

Or, those americans did what they always do (no trying to unsult anyone):
Extrapolate everything.
"He's bisexual you say? Isn't that like homosexual?"
-Well, yeah, but he's heterosexual too...
"Yeah, yeah, gay, that's what I said"

[supernerd]

So, how about that nonbleak stuff, eh? Anyone hug a puppy recently?

I'm half together with a guy in Arizona.

[Coidzor]

I'm half together with a guy in Arizona.

Half, eh? Good luck.

Or, those americans did what they always do (no trying to unsult anyone):
Extrapolate everything.
"He's bisexual you say? Isn't that like homosexual?"
-Well, yeah, but he's heterosexual too...
"Yeah, yeah, gay, that's what I said"

Our journalists are usually a bit better than that.

I honestly have no idea what an unsult would be, either.

[Tychris1]

Half, eh? Good luck.



Our journalists are usually a bit better than that.

I honestly have no idea what an unsult would be, either.

A singular insult maybe? Like if Uno and Insult got together.

Well, that'd be a rather strange card game actually, not a singular insult. Hmmmm

[KenderWizard]

I agree with everything Kenderwizard just said. Also, thank you.

Yay! Also, welcome!

Humans are actually remarkably neophilic, maybe the most neophilic species there is. That's kind of our niche.

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

[The Succubus]

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

If nothing else, at least it gives the relatives something to talk about at the funeral. >.>

[noparlpf]

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

And that's why it's a miracle we've survived as a species. Personally, my mum bet money I wouldn't survive to eighteen.

[Dust Bunny]

Is there room for a straight-but-not-narrow dust bunny on this thread?

[Astrella]

In other news, my sister will be coming home from college in a few days, and so I'm going to talk to her about what's going on. Hopefully she'll take it well...


~Phoenix~

Hope it goes well!

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I've been doing... ok, I guess. Really unmotivated and stuck with a great sense of ennui - for instance I've been meaning to post an update for the last week here but just haven't been able to.

I think my Dad may have found out my GF and I have split, which will require some explaining. He's coming here middle of next month so that will be the time I think - will have to talk to my brother beforehand and try and figure something out.

Got the number for an endo as well, but haven't called them yet. I dunno, just feeling really uncertain at the moment - like I won't pass or I should wait or something. Still going to electrolysis and therapy, but just can't seem to find the time or energy to go the next step (still need to find someone to do throat surgery etc).


On a cheerier note, some more fashion pics (not the best but I was in a rush and pretty sick):

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*hugs*

Those feelings of ennui are annoying. I mean, I'm not going to claim mine are the same but that complete lack of wanting to do anything is something I recognize. You should call! Don't wait, just get it out of the way! I sat around about making appointments a long time too. >.>

Also that's an awesome coat and that dress looks really good on you.

I have long wondered why natural and normal have become cornerstones of acceptability in so many cultures. Since before we were the lone human species on the at-the-time unnamed planet, we were diverting from our ancestral nature and the customs of our peers. When the planet was named Gaea, we wore woven cloth where fur once was, shaped rocks to monuments of our accomplishments and formed tribes larger than any other mammal. When continents met, we travelled across the seas on artificial leviathans, sent heavy iron roaring through the air for our combat and lighted the sky with colour for our celebrations. In just the few centuries since, we have harnessed lightning itself, the power of medicine and broken the cage of our atmosphere. All by rejecting the conventions of old and further bending nature, and these peeps want us to stop here? At the gates of brighter futures still? O_o*

That was nicely written.

Always reminds me a bit about this and how there's a huge backdraft against any change:

*snip*

Aah, Touhou, neat!

Glad you had a good time at the support group! I don't really have a real life one except for the activities with my trans youth group but that are mostly people my age so I don't really have the whole range of age thing going on.

Oh, with regards to your aunt, there's this really nice series of blog posts out there about a woman dealing with her wife coming out as a trans woman and they're very kindly written so they might be helpful? They're called 'Unwrapping the Onion'. Hope it goes well!

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What do you think of Martin's response? On a scale of 1 to 5?

On a more general note, what would you want for reaction when coming out to someone? Hugs? Nod and then get on with business?

Well, I think it was a pretty good reaction. Maybe a bit underwhelming but considering it's Marten he likely didn't want to go all 'foot in mouth' on her. And he's accepting which is the most important part.

As for reactions, I guess it would depend on how well I know them and what sort of person they are.

What I don't understand is why people can't just be fine with it.
Never heard: Sure, I've a mental disorder. I'm transgender, AND F*CKING PROUD OF IT TOO!

There are people like that. I try to be not caring about it. It's more about the huge amount of societal stigma attached to it. Considering how easily people deny trans* people's identities with it or who's acceptance only stretches out to tolerating 'those poor deluded fools' out of pity...

[Ravens_cry]

Why do wigs have to be so expensive? Thrift stores can provide most other necessitates besides consumables, but the only wigs I ever see are left overs from Halloween or what look like the hides of old rats. And I need a wig, trust me.

[Unbeknownst]

And that's why it's a miracle we've survived as a species. Personally, my mum bet money I wouldn't survive to eighteen.

I have no idea how I did. I mean, why did I think it was a good idea to jump out of a two+ story treehouse?

[Dust Bunny]

Why do wigs have to be so expensive? Thrift stores can provide most other necessitates besides consumables, but the only wigs I ever see are left overs from Halloween or what look like the hides of old rats. And I need a wig, trust me.

My son got one as a gift from some friends in theater. (My son's FtM. He loves long hair--got that from me with my down-to-the-middle-of-my-back ponytail, but he doesn't like his hair, color or texture.)

I'm not sure I'd trust a wig from a thrift store.

[noparlpf]

I have no idea how I did. I mean, why did I think it was a good idea to jump out of a two+ story treehouse?

Why not? Gravity is just a theory.
(I'd probably say two-plus storeys is a little high, myself. I try to limit myself to under five meters, a bit lower if the ground is hard or unstable.)

Then there was that time I electrocuted myself (they tell little kids not to play with power outlets; I was fifteen), or the time I dropped an icicle bigger than I am on my leg. Or the time the handhold I had on a low cliffside I was bouldering on cracked off and only narrowly missed my head as I fell off.

[Ravens_cry]

My son got one as a gift from some friends in theater. (My son's FtM. He loves long hair--got that from me with my down-to-the-middle-of-my-back ponytail, but he doesn't like his hair, color or texture.)

I'm not sure I'd trust a wig from a thrift store.

Lucky woman.

[turkishproverb]

Yesh~ a puppy is a puppy, no matter what chronological progression tries to say.

I...love this sentence.

[Serpentine]

I'm half together with a guy in Arizona.

Which half?

[the_druid_droid]

Must. Draw. This. Some. Time. O_O

Do it! I for one am quite fond of steam/cyborg/techno ponies.

"Occasionally"? I'm pretty sure every other word out of my mouth in lab is an expletive.

Well, it's a relative measure.

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

For some reason, my mind's gone terrible places with this. They really shouldn't let me out of the house.

Is there room for a straight-but-not-narrow dust bunny on this thread?

Welcome!

Why do wigs have to be so expensive? Thrift stores can provide most other necessitates besides consumables, but the only wigs I ever see are left overs from Halloween or what look like the hides of old rats. And I need a wig, trust me.

I think this is probably a crafting quality issue. Humans are very good at picking up on facial features and hair and noticing when they don't look quite right. As a result, it's hard to make a convincing wig without expensive materials and/or significant time invested.

Why not? Gravity is just a theory.

Yeah, but it's got a bad attitude.

I'm half together with a guy in Arizona.

Wh-

Which half?

-dang

[Coidzor]

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

And now I have the flashbacks to Dexter's Lab and Dee Dee.

[Lix Lorn]

I get that a lot

Part of the appeal.

So, how about that nonbleak stuff, eh? Anyone hug a puppy recently?

SLIMES.
I like slimes!
I could link you to my slime stuff, but not on the forum.

Must... Resist.... Making a "Of Mice and Men" pun.....

Stupid mice. Stupid men. Stupid steinbeck.

On a more general note, what would you want for reaction when coming out to someone? Hugs? Nod and then get on with business?

Always hugs. Always.

[Astrella]

I'm half together with a guy in Arizona.

Ooh, congratulations!

Is there room for a straight-but-not-narrow dust bunny on this thread?

Hi hi, and welcome. :)

-----

Also it's transgender day of remembrance tomorrow, does anyone have any special plans?

[Tychris1]

But...... I like Steinbeck......

And after having 3 people come out to me i've just kind of resorted to shrugging, saying ok, and asking what we should eat today. This normally ends with a kind of weirded out friend or in the 2nd case the friend demanding for a more dramatic response.

[noparlpf]

I think I usually shrug and say something like, "Huh, that's cool. [insert tangential thought here]"

[turkishproverb]

Is there room for a straight-but-not-narrow dust bunny on this thread?

*waves*

Hi!

[supernerd]

Half, eh? Good luck.

Thanks, and my logical part is trying to play it down, due to various limitations.

Which half?

The half that makes me think I can handle a long distance relationship.

Wh-



-dang

Just... See above. I've got a weird way of explaining things. I can't handle a long distance relationship, and I'm trying not to get too into it. Kida really hard though...

Ooh, congratulations!

Thanks! While I'm not sure about the 1500+ mile distance, it's nice to feel all warm and fuzzy and special.

Is there room for a straight-but-not-narrow dust bunny on this thread?

Why certainly!

[Coidzor]

And after having 3 people come out to me i've just kind of resorted to shrugging, saying ok, and asking what we should eat today. This normally ends with a kind of weirded out friend or in the 2nd case the friend demanding for a more dramatic response.

I've had I think one person come out to me and I still don't know if it was a joke because everyone on campus had thought that he was an openly gay man from the beginning of our freshman year together. I think I ended up apologizing for my lack of reaction because I'd thought he was already out of the closet and was perfectly OK with it which is why I agreed to go in on a suite with him and a couple of other guys that next year. I may or may not have awkwardly thanked him for trusting me enough to tell me and I'm almost positive I made a remark that I was pretty sure that the majority of the campus and certainly everyone that we both knew would be just fine with him.

I suppose technically there were two more, but it's hard to really react to a status on facebook in a meaningful way and in the other case their online persona was always presented as genderqueer anyway, so there's not a whole lot to react to when they've decided to adopt an out-and-out male persona rather than one that was as androgynous as possible. Everyone else was pretty much just openly living it.

Closest thing to a surprise was finding out the girl I had been pursuing was bi when her facebook showed she had started dating another woman shortly after I'd realized I just might be falling in love with her. Bit of an awkward conversation after that, as she was apparently worried that I'd hate her for being bi as had apparently happened to her with a number of her guy friends.

[Serpentine]

Well, with coming out responses... Yesterday an acquaintance I knew as a girl made a status that heavily implied they were some sort of non-cis. I linked them to QC and asked whether it meant that was extra-relevant (they share a name), they said yes, I said I assumed (based on the status) they were FtM, they said genderqueer actually, I asked about preferred pronouns, they said they, and I said I'd try to remember. That was it.

[Darklady2831]

Also it's transgender day of remembrance tomorrow, does anyone have any special plans?

It is, isn't it...
Huh, I've got ideas, but... I dunno.

[SiuiS]

And the solution to the bisexual but monogamous paradox is found.

What paradox?

Update on me:

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I've been doing... ok, I guess. Really unmotivated and stuck with a great sense of ennui - for instance I've been meaning to post an update for the last week here but just haven't been able to.

I think my Dad may have found out my GF and I have split, which will require some explaining. He's coming here middle of next month so that will be the time I think - will have to talk to my brother beforehand and try and figure something out.

Got the number for an endo as well, but haven't called them yet. I dunno, just feeling really uncertain at the moment - like I won't pass or I should wait or something. Still going to electrolysis and therapy, but just can't seem to find the time or energy to go the next step (still need to find someone to do throat surgery etc).

Momentum, luv. Momentum. If you can keep it up, it's easier. But once you sit down and rest getting up is that much harder. Sisyphus thrives on keeping it rolling, he's got to be a master of kinetic physics by now.

I know Keep On Trucking is terribly generic advice, but it's all I have I'm afraid.

On a cheerier note, some more fashion pics (not the best but I was in a rush and pretty sick):

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Daaaang, that's a dress. I'm actually pretty jealous on that one, and the sort of peacock feathering embroidery at the neckline, very tasteful.

The second picture looks a lot like my XBL avatar, actually, so I got a chuckle out of that.

Humans are actually remarkably neophilic, maybe the most neophilic species there is. That's kind of our niche.

As in, plural for really likes new things? A bunch o newophiliacs? Or some form of saying theyre neophobic?

Plushies

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I couldn't find a good picture of the plushies that I have, but this picture is a pretty good approximation Flandre's the blonde, Remilia is the bluenette*

oooh~
I am intrigued by the term bluenette. I like it!

The support group was really good. *Everyone there was really nice, and even though, like all groups, it seems to have its hierarchies and internal dynamics, the vast range of people along the spectrum of transition and across the range of ages and circumstances that were there seemed to help it be less of a free-for-all in pursuit of personal validation than it would be otherwise. *As an aside for Zorg, one of the prettiest ladies there was about 6 feet tall, and both she and her wife were absolutely lovely people. *I even got from her the name of a hairstylist who apparently does great work for trans people. *I don't think I've been in a place so unabashedly optimistic and accepting in a very long time. *That's not to say everyone was perfect or anything, but since I've only gone once, I don't want to rush to negative judgments like I usually do.

As far as my aunt goes, it's not that I think she'll react horribly or anything, or I wouldn't come out to her. *It's just my family is reasonably religious and so I'm a little worried about what she'll think. *She's one of the kindest people I know, and I can't imagine her hating me for it, but I do expect to have to clear up a lot of worry and misconceptions, and I don't know how clearly I'll be able to explain myself.

That sounds really nice Actually. The closest spot I've got for something like that is San Francisco, and they are known for being very... Cliquish.

Well he wasn't 100% sure, but I think from what he sort of told me it was a combination of my general non-manly aesthetic sense in ponies and plushies, always playing female characters in games and being a little uncommonly knowledgeable even for a collector of useless knowledge when trans people came up in conversations about politics and/or media. *But then again, I let myself do and demonstrate those things in part with the purpose of lessening the shock when I came out to him, so I was actually happy that he wasn't surprised.

Hmm. Makes sense. I've actually had the opposite, where subtle hints prompt the flames of gender normative aggression to flare up. I'm probably gonna end up forgetting an showing up to a family function in a dress at some point, to prompts of "the $&!*" at worst and "who are you, and why are you with my son's girlfriend" at best.

I would remark on the manliness of ponies, but that quickly becomes a morass. XD

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What do you think of Martin's response? On a scale of 1 to 5?

Totally thought this was about out werewolf game. I was all boggled.

On a more general note, what would you want for reaction when coming out to someone? Hugs? Nod and then get on with business?

Understanding, or an attempt at such. Don't really are about the emotional response, so long as the other person is willing to wrap their head around it before making a judgement.

Understanding is sort of my thing. I don't even really acknowledge arguments which cannot come from an "I understand but don't agree" frame.

"Occasionally"? I'm pretty sure every other word out of my mouth in lab is an expletive.

You drive up the average, balanced out by most scientists thinking instead of subvocalizing. ;D

what I don't understand is why people can't just be fine with it.
Never heard: Sure, I've a mental disorder. I'm transgender, AND F*CKING PROUD OF IT TOO!

No idea, really.

Although, I dunno. I find trans and Cis to be kind of superfluous distinctions, personally. Cisman and transman are both a man. I can't get my head around being proudly trans, because theoretically trans is being uncomfortable and wanting to change. Being comfortable beig uncomfortable is a disconnect. So being proud of being transsexual seems... Against transsexuality? I dunno. It's not a coherent thought really.

Aren't they the same most of the time?
I feel compulsive, even though technically I'm only obsessive, having OTD.

Hm. I think obsession is about motive, and compulsive is about action. You can obsess over something without really acting, and toucan do something compulsively without obsessing, I believe. But the similarity in end product is there.*

No, though I managed to hug 10 kittens at the same time!

Awesome!

...

Then one died :smallsad:

Much less awesome. But it'll reincarnate eventually, so we're good.

Or, those americans did what they always do (no trying to unsult anyone):
Extrapolate everything.
"He's bisexual you say? Isn't that like homosexual?"
-Well, yeah, but he's heterosexual too...
"Yeah, yeah, gay, that's what I said"

Nah, they wouldn't have gotten that far.

"Isn't he homosexual, too?"
"Well, y—"
"I SAID HE IS HOMOSEXUAL DAMMIT DON'T ARGUE"

"Ooh! Look! A thing! That wasn't there before! Let's touch it!"

And that's how Equestria was made!

I have no idea how I did. I mean, why did I think it was a good idea to jump out of a two+ story treehouse?

Personally, my brother told me my dumbo ears would come through for me.

What I really want to know is how a three year old an six year old got on the roof.

Part of the appeal.

SLIMES.
I like slimes!
I could link you to my slime stuff, but not on the forum.

Hmm. Okay, I'll try and get an IM program actually working this week.

[Coidzor]

What paradox?

Don't think paradox is the term, but I don't quite know what words I'd use to describe it. Mostly seem to run into it as a paranoid fear by the non-bi, non-pan partner of a bisexual or pansexual individual or a subject of gossip by busybodies that there must be some kind of tension because a bisexual's sexual needs aren't being met if they're only having sex with one sex.

...Yeah, I could probably have phrased that better and in a non-cumbersome fashion, but hopefully that was clear enough. :/

Thankfully I've run into it more often in fiction than in reality, but I've run into it there too...

[Kindablue]

What paradox?

The one where you assume words always retain their literal etymological meanings. Twosex/onemarriage. (It was a dumb joke.)