Worm 2 is on the way

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler: Flare 2.6

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Predictably Vicky is part of the new team now. Sorta.
These guys are so going to crash and burn...

Also, could Tristan/Byron have put a hit on his twin?

And the whole two people one body thing...
Could Circus be a Case 70?
If I recall correctly they were female in costume and male out of costume.
That seems to fit Tristan's description of his their own situation.

Spoiler: Flare 2.7

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The description of Tristan and Byron switching makes my Circus was a C70 somewhat more likely I think.

The best solution to being so spread out might be to get some base to live in, like the Undersiders had.

And good thing Rain has a friend outside the group.
Or not, considering his situation and the changed circumstances...

But it seems Lisa hasn't changed one bit...
Insulting Vicky, taking over a town...

Unfortunately the context is not looking very good.
I'm pretty sure this will end very badly.
For both sides of the conflict...

Glory Girl taking the kids to war against Tattletale and company won't help things either.

Spoiler: Flare 2.7

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I don't think TT actually took over the town. My theory is that the current rulers of the town contacted TT and payed her to tell them what she knew about Glory Girl.

Now TT being TT, she also couldn't resist provoking Glory Girl. I don't think it's part of some crazy plan to get Glory Girl's team to try and fix that neighborhood, TT just likes messing with people.

[Rater202]

Spoiler: Flare 2.7

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I don't think TT actually took over the town. My theory is that the current rulers of the town contacted TT and payed her to tell them what she knew about Glory Girl.

Now TT being TT, she also couldn't resist provoking Glory Girl. I don't think it's part of some crazy plan to get Glory Girl's team to try and fix that neighborhood, TT just likes messing with people.

Spoiler

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I've got my own theory and two from the comments.

Mine is that she just remembers Glory Girl as Demolition "Cape Brutality" Dallon and lacks enough info to know that Vickey's grown past that and just doesn't want black and white mralizing, excessiveforce employing, collateral damage causing capes where she operates.

The comments are either "deliberately provoked Vickey to see how she reacts and gets data to figure out what she's like now" or "reverse psychology becuase Vickey might be useful in some plan she's got," with Speculation that Lisa has become a significantly less evil version of Coil.

I mean, last we heard she had her eyes set on taking down teacher and Miss Militia and Bitch had a way of contacting her so unless things went super south I don't think she's gonna be one of the bad guys,
but it was implied that she helped with the Fume Hood thing as a controlled pressure release attempt so she's not gonna be a full fledged goody goody, either.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler

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I've got my own theory and two from the comments.

Mine is that she just remembers Glory Girl as Demolition "Cape Brutality" Dallon and lacks enough info to know that Vickey's grown past that and just doesn't want black and white mralizing, excessiveforce employing, collateral damage causing capes where she operates.

The comments are either "deliberately provoked Vickey to see how she reacts and gets data to figure out what she's like now" or "reverse psychology becuase Vickey might be useful in some plan she's got," with Speculation that Lisa has become a significantly less evil version of Coil.

I mean, last we heard she had her eyes set on taking down teacher and Miss Militia and Bitch had a way of contacting her so unless things went super south I don't think she's gonna be one of the bad guys,
but it was implied that she helped with the Fume Hood thing as a controlled pressure release attempt so she's not gonna be a full fledged goody goody, either.

Spoiler

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Looking at the last chapters Tt definitely plans to use Vicky and the kids someway.

And judging by Crystalclears Interlude she's trying to (re)establish a greater powerbase.
Sierra is very likely to be in contact with her and I doubt she's the only candidate.

Speaking of the interlude, those theocracy guys mean trouble sooner or later. I'm betting my hat on it.
Although the guys in charge aren't very smart.
You don't threaten god slayers with war.
You strike hard and fast with all you got and pray that's enough.

Anyway, looking at Tt's talk with Victoria she gave her quite a few freebies.
Both by showing some of her hand- although she most likely has more cards up her sleeve and got new ones out of this -and by giving genuinely good advise.
Through subtext maybe, but I think Vicky and co caught it.

With in turn means Lisa has some new pawns on the board.

But between those three familiar faces I really want to see what the rest of the gang is up too.
Rachel's still out ranging I guess, going farther and farther from the spreading Moloch, but some of the others probably stuck around.
And there's no way I believe they're all doing their own thing.

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler

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Looking at the last chapters Tt definitely plans to use Vicky and the kids someway.

And judging by Crystalclears Interlude she's trying to (re)establish a greater powerbase.
Sierra is very likely to be in contact with her and I doubt she's the only candidate.

Speaking of the interlude, those theocracy guys mean trouble sooner or later. I'm betting my hat on it.
Although the guys in charge aren't very smart.
You don't threaten god slayers with war.
You strike hard and fast with all you got and pray that's enough.

Anyway, looking at Tt's talk with Victoria she gave her quite a few freebies.
Both by showing some of her hand- although she most likely has more cards up her sleeve and got new ones out of this -and by giving genuinely good advise.
Through subtext maybe, but I think Vicky and co caught it.

With in turn means Lisa has some new pawns on the board.

But between those three familiar faces I really want to see what the rest of the gang is up too.
Rachel's still out ranging I guess, going farther and farther from the spreading Moloch, but some of the others probably stuck around.
And there's no way I believe they're all doing their own thing.

Spoiler

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God slayers is giving them a lot more credit then they deserve. Ignoring the interdimersional capes that didn't stick around afterwards, they still pretty much needed Taylor to do almost everything to beat Scion. The only other people who really effectively fought Scion of their own initiative was the Undersiders. Their bodies may have been used to fight Scion, but they'll never reach that level of coordination and cooperation again.

We know Imp is doing her thing with Heartbreaker's kids. And we know all of them decided to work together to kick down whatever alliance Teacher is trying to set up, though I don't know if they know Teacher is behind it.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler

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God slayers is giving them a lot more credit then they deserve. Ignoring the interdimersional capes that didn't stick around afterwards, they still pretty much needed Taylor to do almost everything to beat Scion. The only other people who really effectively fought Scion of their own initiative was the Undersiders. Their bodies may have been used to fight Scion, but they'll never reach that level of coordination and cooperation again.

Spoiler

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Little g.
But yeah, without Taylor breaking her brain it wouldn't have ended as well.

Spoiler: Glare 3.2, 3.3

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Well, that was concerning.
Those guys are going to crash and burn so hard it isn't funny anymore.

The guys fresh out of the asylum shouldn't be the most functional and stable party-members.
The really scary part is that I have no idea who will snap first.

But the capture the flag game was cool.
Especially Ashley (if she insist on Damsel of Distress again I'll start calling her Dood. And suggest a penguin theme for her costume.) moving across the battlefield Bakugo style.
Even if her power's too dangerous to use directly against people that opens a few interesting options.

Tristan and Byron are a nice combo too.
One stops you with Labyrinth style terrain changes and if you get through that the other can tag in for a instant tsunami.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler: Glare 3.4

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Rain is officially terrifying.
What works on goats works on other Capes as well.
Or on innocent bystanders...

Also, sure Vicky, everything is Tt's fault.
Way to steal Taylor's infamy.

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler: Glare 3.4

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Rain is officially terrifying.
What works on goats works on other Capes as well.
Or on innocent bystanders...

Also, sure Vicky, everything is Tt's fault.
Way to steal Taylor's infamy.

Spoiler: Glare 3.4

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Tattletale's consistently overblown reputation makes me laugh. It's at halfling with a pebble levels now.

She interacted with that person at one point and then they died! Clearly it's her fault!

[Kantaki]

Spoiler: Glare 3.4

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Tattletale's consistently overblown reputation makes me laugh. It's at halfling with a pebble levels now.

She interacted with that person at one point and then they died! Clearly it's her fault!

Spoiler: Glare 3.4

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Well, if you listen to Vicky Tt planned the whole mess that are the events of the original Worm.
Every event part of a devious plot to take over the multiverse.
I think she might be a little bit biased.

Admittedly, going by other masterminds it isn't unreasonable to assume Lisa was in charge, but that description sells the other Undersiders and several other mayor players seriously short.

You know, like the Nine. Or the Endbringers. Or Vicky herself.
So many people contributed to the things that she brings up, it's almost unfair Tattletale gets all the fame.

I wonder what she'll say when she hears all the nice things Glory Girl said about her.
Assuming she bugged Vicky of course. Which she totally would do, even if it's just to get a reaction.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler

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When the Bonesaw created clone of a villainess- who still identifies as a villain no less -is (one of) the least concerning member of your new hero team you know it's time to drop them yesterday.

Between the Byron/Tristan mess, with the alleged hits on teammates (and each other?) and the wonderful relationship to former allies, Rain apparently lying about mayor stuff- like seriously underselling his powers* -and Kenzie raising all sorts of alarms, not to mention Sveta and Chris (and Ashley of course)**, I'm honestly surprised they didn't crash and burn already.
And now Victoria of all people is mentoring them.

Speaking of Vicky, nice to see her dad's trying to mend things after messing up.
A shame her mother is still trying to rush things...

But I have to say, the Warden's headquarters are really cool. The knight imaginary is very appropriate. With the emergent Cape feudalism and all that.
Oh, and also because it's a ideal heroes should strive for.

And the first guys our protagonists are up against are time-manipulators?
Should be fun.
Between Clockblocker, Phir Se, Grey Boy and (to a degree) Coil those kind of powers always were fun.
And I mean, closed off timelines? Sweeping the area with time... stops? slowing? bending? And who know what offensive users they have?
Sounds like a real headache.
Really hope we'll get a Interlude for them.

*Really, if this is one the days his powers are waning I don't want to see them waxing.
**Who, while they have massive issues too, are a lesser concern compared to the other teammembers

[Kantaki]

Spoiler: Interlude 4.a

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Well, that was something.
Rain's past is seriously messed up.

I guess now we can at least guess why his Cluster wants him worse than dead.
Understandable if it is true.
Although, if they want im to suffer a fate worse than death- or at least before death -they should just leave him with his people.

Also, the Fallen revelation was perfect.
That dawning realization just what is wrong with Rain's "family" until the preacher outright said it.

The sad part is they still might be a step above the Merchants.
A very, very small step mind you, but still...

Still, I hope Rain and Erin get out of this fine-ish.
As much as that's possible.

And finally, this chapter provides a good reason why they just should've let Scion wreck the multiverse.
E.T.3. I mean, nothing against E.T., but it really doesn't need a Sequel, much less two.
Also, if a Fallen thinks it's bad that should tell you something.

[Rater202]

Spoiler

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And finally, this chapter provides a good reason why they just should've let Scion wreck the multiverse.
E.T.3. I mean, nothing against E.T., but it really doesn't need a Sequel, much less two.
Also, if a Fallen thinks it's bad that should tell you something.

Spoiler

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According to PRT Quest, OJ was the Terminator on Earth bet.

The rabbit hole goes deep, mia amiko.

[endoperez]

There's a new chapter! A bit late, maybe?

It has some... Implications. Not much new stuff, but a few more hints at some ominous future plot point.

And a reference to a very, very old memory, too! The bank she's talking about is a Worm reference. Took me a moment to place it.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler

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Well, those chapters were impressive.

The Fallen got more horrifying, didn't think that would be possible.
But creepy hallucinations observing people?
That did it.

Unsurprising that Rain (O'Fire)- the only good thing about the Fallen are the rad names. -and his girlfriend are getting more desperate.

Also, it seems Skitter shouldn't have stopped at maggots in the eyes back then...

And it seems the universe decided that if Team Therapy won't escalate Hollow Point it will have to find someone else.
Interesting that LoveLost isn't mute.
Between her, Chris and the Advance Guard lady this will turn into a real shouting match.

[BRC]

Spoiler

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So, there seems to be a deliberate contrast being set up here with regard to Hollow Point and Brockton Bay, as far as you have a community that is being effectively run by a group of "reasonable" Supervillains.

In Brockton Bay, the Undersiders were providing disaster relief, while Prancer and his crew seem to be running a generalized protection racket, but they're working from a similar place. A group of Villains take over territory, under the argument that, since they're not being too disruptive, the Heroes should just leave them alone.

We saw the events of Brockton Bay from Taylor's perspective, and got the constant refrain of "Why are you [the Heroes] Hassling us? We're not the big threats". And the Unreasonable Authority Figures saying "No, you're supervillains, we can't just let you take over a city", and pushing back against the idea of legitimizing the villains in this way.

[J-H]

Mama Mathers is freakily powerful if she can perceive anything her images see and hear. And they can communicate, too!
Less offensive power than Taylor, but much greater range as far as Thinker classifications go. Good multitasking as well.

The Fallen continue to be more and more messed up - in ways that are completely believable based on the behaviors of cults and barbarians around the world. I feel bad about Rain & Erin, but she's not willing to leave and staying would be worse for him... the "best case" would involve him surviving, becoming more of a murderous cultist, and then raising his family in that environment.

Ugh.

[Dragonus45]

Mama Mathers is freakily powerful if she can perceive anything her images see and hear. And they can communicate, too!
Less offensive power than Taylor, but much greater range as far as Thinker classifications go. Good multitasking as well.

The Fallen continue to be more and more messed up - in ways that are completely believable based on the behaviors of cults and barbarians around the world. I feel bad about Rain & Erin, but she's not willing to leave and staying would be worse for him... the "best case" would involve him surviving, becoming more of a murderous cultist, and then raising his family in that environment.

Ugh.

The specific set up here reminds me of various warlords around the world who make extensive use of kidnapped child soldiers. Very chilling.

[Kantaki]

This can only end in tears...
Well, more tears.

Rain's cluster continues to be a bunch of jerks- and he's definitely right that they didn't get that from him.
I mean I can understand wanting him dead, but when he offers himself and the actual core of the Fallen with the only request being not to hurt innocents and their reaction is „Yeah no. We'll will definitely hurt them. Just cause it makes you suffer.”?
They're no better than the guys actually responsible for the mall.

And the situation between Rain and Erin?
Well played Mama Mathers.
Between her and Elijah the poor never had a choice, even if her family weren't a factor.
Friggin Masters.

That Rain seeks out the help of March might even be the intended outcome.
Also, now that Foils clustermate is involved I expect more tragedy.

[Forum Explorer]

Is it weird that I think that Rain made the wrong decision? Though maybe that's because I'm not sure what his actual goals are.

I thought they were:

1. Survive
2. Save Erin
3. Kill Snag and Love Lost. Maybe Cradle as well.
4. Kill Mama Mathers (this might be part of step 2, but I'll give it it's own category)

But I feel like his actions here are counter productive at best. Pissing off the Fallen isn't going to save anyone, and will lower his chances of survival. Though running helps. But that will also make it much harder to kill Mama Mathers. And pretty much impossible to save Erin.


Also I don't think Rain's offer was sincere. Else he'd been more tempted by Cradle's demand to kill himself.


But anyways, who wants to take bets on who is going to die? My money is on Lovelost. I also think this is going to be a breaking point for the group. That we will get to see why Mrs Yamanda is so worried that the group is going to fail.

[BRC]

Is it weird that I think that Rain made the wrong decision? Though maybe that's because I'm not sure what his actual goals are.

I thought they were:

1. Survive
2. Save Erin
3. Kill Snag and Love Lost. Maybe Cradle as well.
4. Kill Mama Mathers (this might be part of step 2, but I'll give it it's own category)

But I feel like his actions here are counter productive at best. Pissing off the Fallen isn't going to save anyone, and will lower his chances of survival. Though running helps. But that will also make it much harder to kill Mama Mathers. And pretty much impossible to save Erin.


Also I don't think Rain's offer was sincere. Else he'd been more tempted by Cradle's demand to kill himself.


But anyways, who wants to take bets on who is going to die? My money is on Lovelost. I also think this is going to be a breaking point for the group. That we will get to see why Mrs Yamanda is so worried that the group is going to fail.

Eh, I'd say they're

1) Save Erin
2) Survive (His Self-Loathing is high enough that I wouldn't call this a priority)
3) Escape the Fallen
4)Take down the Fallen

Killing the other Cluster members is really only a priority because they're hellbent on killing him. I don't think he bears them any specific animosity, that or his self-loathing and guilt are enough that he doesn't blame them.


Now, let's look at his options.

Rationally speaking, If he Accepts Erin's offer, he's given up any chance of escape from the Fallen, either for him or for her. She refuses to abandon her family, who have thoroughly drunk the Kool Aide at this point. This "Live at the Edge of town" solution is a halfway compromise that will end with them both being sucked into the Fallen. From Rain's perspective, "Saving" Erin Means not just keeping her alive, but keeping her out of the Fallen. So, accepting means giving up on her getting away from the Fallen.

I don't want to say he'd rather see her dead than part of the Fallen, but either option is probably unthinkable for him. He loves her because she's NOT Fallen.


Emotionally Speaking? This was basically his worst nightmare. Erin having given up and accepted being one of the Fallen. Everything he dreamed about, given to him in the worst way possible.

[Forum Explorer]

Eh, I'd say they're

1) Save Erin
2) Survive (His Self-Loathing is high enough that I wouldn't call this a priority)
3) Escape the Fallen
4)Take down the Fallen

Killing the other Cluster members is really only a priority because they're hellbent on killing him. I don't think he bears them any specific animosity, that or his self-loathing and guilt are enough that he doesn't blame them.


Now, let's look at his options.

Rationally speaking, If he Accepts Erin's offer, he's given up any chance of escape from the Fallen, either for him or for her. She refuses to abandon her family, who have thoroughly drunk the Kool Aide at this point. This "Live at the Edge of town" solution is a halfway compromise that will end with them both being sucked into the Fallen. From Rain's perspective, "Saving" Erin Means not just keeping her alive, but keeping her out of the Fallen. So, accepting means giving up on her getting away from the Fallen.

I don't want to say he'd rather see her dead than part of the Fallen, but either option is probably unthinkable for him. He loves her because she's NOT Fallen.


Emotionally Speaking? This was basically his worst nightmare. Erin having given up and accepted being one of the Fallen. Everything he dreamed about, given to him in the worst way possible.

I think Escape the Fallen basically requires killing Mama Mathers.


If he truly accepts Erin's offer, yes, I agree with you. But I think the only way to Save Erin at this point is to kidnap her and her family and forcibly pull them out of the Fallen. As well as killing Mama Mathers. And having them all grouped up in a single house on the outskirts of town would make that much easier. It might also help keep Erin safe during the upcoming war. A 'soft' betrayal, where he gets the team to pull Erin and her family out during the fight to keep them safe. Then you just 'forget' to bring them back.


I do agree with you though, this has to be one of Rain's worst case scenarios, particularly after his 'day'. I certainly don't blame him for freaking out and leaving Erin behind. But I do think it was the wrong decision to make.

[J-H]

When did Flechette/Foil get retconned to being part of a cluster trigger?
I didn't think those were even a thing until after the Golden Man got blasted across all the dimensions.

[Rater202]

When did Flechette/Foil get retconned to being part of a cluster trigger?
I didn't think those were even a thing until after the Golden Man got blasted across all the dimensions.

Never.

You're thinking of Broken Triggers.

[Dragonus45]

When did Flechette/Foil get retconned to being part of a cluster trigger?
I didn't think those were even a thing until after the Golden Man got blasted across all the dimensions.

She was always part of a cluster, but it was the kind of thing that showed up more in various questions Wildbow answered then it did in the story proper.

[Present 2.0]

When I heard the News about Valefor being stronger now because of the maggots in his eyes, my first Thought was "Thanks, Taylor!".

Now I can't help, but imagine "Thanks, Taylor!" as a common swear in Gimel like "Thanks, Obama!" here(I hope I can reference that without it counting as political) and I find the idea hilarious.

5.6:

Interesting, that they don't want to get Valkyrie in there. "Valkyrie cannot engage THAT Group of Fallen." Since this is the Simurgh-Group, that propably means, they're afraid of the Possibility of Mind Controlled Valkyrie and that they don't think, that she is 100% safe from that with their Abilities.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler: Interlude 5.x

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Well, isn't this interlude just full of good news...

Cauldron is still around and they haven't changed one bit.
Well, the faction we see.
That another splinter's run by Teacher doesn't make things better.
Also, Number Man found a wife.
Who has good chances to take over the world City.
Not that the Undersider minion would be a much better option.
Nor is Mr. Nieves for that matter*.

Between the two Cauldrons I'm very curious what will cause trouble first, Teacher having an army and enough vials to build another or Citrine and Number Man trying to seize power.

No seriously, if you're locked in a cage with wolves you really shouldn't antagonize one of them. Much less after telling her you know what she is.

Also, can someone explain what Space Marines and Cauldron have to do with each other?
Because I've recently seen one of those guys with a oddly familiar symbol on his armor.

[Rakaydos]

Also, can someone explain what Space Marines and Cauldron have to do with each other?
Because I've recently seen one of those guys with a oddly familiar symbol on his armor.

"Ultramarines" have a stylized U on their armor, because they're "ultra-marines"
"Cauldron" case 53s has a stylized pot (or cauldron) tatooed on them.

The Greek Omega is commonly used for this stylization, because it's a fancy upside down U.

[Kantaki]

"Ultramarines" have a stylized U on their armor, because they're "ultra-marines"
"Cauldron" case 53s has a stylized pot (or cauldron) tatooed on them.

The Greek Omega is commonly used for this stylization, because it's a fancy upside down U.

Makes sense. Although the thought that Cauldron and the Imperium are connected somehow is kinda amusing.

Looking at the arc names it seems Ward is getting dark.

Spoiler: 6.2 Pitch

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Oh well, things definitely could go better.
A siege is easily one of the worst outcomes for Team not-Fallen.
Made worse by the Fallen having infiltrated both heroes and villains.

Since the time bending guys turned out to be Khonsu worshippers I guess there are cultists of the twins just waiting to reveal themselves.
Looking at the way Tohu and Bohu operated that doesn't bode well...
I just hope they didn't recruit Missy...

In other news Chris just got more suspicious after Rachel and Imp mentioned that video.
Also, Rachel is the best big sister.
Someone has to handle Aisha I guess...

[Tyndmyr]

She was always part of a cluster, but it was the kind of thing that showed up more in various questions Wildbow answered then it did in the story proper.

“Hey, Flechette,” Kid Win called across the room, “You’ve got a bunch of powers, right?”

She turned in her seat, “Sure.”

“Anyone else get powers at the same time you did?”

“Not that I know of.”

“Could someone nearby have gotten their powers, without you knowing? Way things played out? Did any capes show up around the same time as you?”

Flechette frowned, “Yeah. A rather persistent villain.”

Don't think it's a spoiler, more of intentional, waaaay earlier foreshadowing.

[Forum Explorer]

So speculation time.

Spoiler

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Spoiler: Pitch 6.4

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Why do you think Tattletale told Victoria where Rain was? Is Rain already too far gone, or is she washing her hands of Cradle? Or is it idle sentiment from when Sveta worked with Taylor?

I kinda think she's playing the long game and trying to win over Victoria's group, even if she won't ever win over Victoria herself.

[Kantaki]

Spoiler: @Forum Explorer

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Before reading today's chapter* I would have said Tt helped because she wanted Rain alive because she needs Team Therapy** for her long term plans, but couldn't not help the Cluster because she needs them too and/or they could just find another Thinker who wouldn't try to keep Rain alive which could mean loosing the therapy group as a asset.

*Afterwards...I would say pretty much the same thing.
**I don't think loosing him would have been good for the team's cohesion or their willingness to work with Lisa.

Spoiler: Pitch 6.8

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Well, that was ominous.
Between Tt's "war starting in a week" comment and the Crowleys' "hell of a show" I'm guessing the Fallen will attack some Earth Cheit citizens.

And looking at Tattletale... trying to fix everything herself, twisting arms to get people to cooperate... she reminds me of someone.

Her endgame for our favorite Cluster is interesting.
I wonder who messed with it. Teacher? Number Man?

Or maybe Cradle just took a long look at the Empress and, like Foil, decided messing with this stuff is a bad idea.
(Which, considering the thing in the fifth section of their dreamspace, is likely true.)

Also, I'm shipping Looksee and Chicken Little now.

Speaking of Aiden, Unkindness would've been a great name.