Why the gnome hate?

[Salbazier]

I'm just curious. Why it seems that there are many people who dislike them (consider them annoying, ect)? I've read it has something to do with kender (and I even don't what kender is except that they are from Dragonlance)

[Inhuman Bot]

Kenders = short, annoying, kleptomaniacs.

[Keld Denar]

Personally, I like gnomes. They aren't one of the best races, but they are pretty strong and versatile with the +2 Con. They also have some awesome choises, especially the amazing Shadowcraft Mage.

[Gnaeus]

Kender aren't gnomes, they are closer to halflings.

I love the gnomes too, especially casters.

[FoE]

I don't mind gnomes now as they are in 4E, where they were made into Fey to differentiate them from dwarves. But before, they were basically "dwarves lite," except that they were more adept at magic, drank a bit less and were more greedy.

Kender are a whole other ball of wax. Kender are thieving little magpies whose habit of "borrowing" other peoples' stuff is justified because their great curiousity. It's not that kender's fault he took your magic ring — he's just being curious!

[Myth]

Whisper Gnomes are one of the best non LA races for 3.5, and a Gnome is used for the Infinite Shadow Dragons build. Svinfeblin (Deep Gnomes) are a decent LA race which get SR and some other nice abilities.

I think I like them. The only one I don't like is Jan Jansen and his turnip jokes

[LibraryOgre]

Jealousy .

[Salbazier]

Well, I know most people don't hate gnome (especially those who love to play illusionist) it just that some post I read lately seems to indicatet that there's common dislike of gnomes among some people. Maybe I use too strong title

[Keld Denar]

Nose envy?

[Myshlaevsky]

Whisper Gnomes are one of the best non LA races for 3.5, and a Gnome is used for the Infinite Shadow Dragons build. Svinfeblin (Deep Gnomes) are a decent LA race which get SR and some other nice abilities.

I think I like them. The only one I don't like is Jan Jansen and his turnip jokes

"You know, this reminds me of that time, waaaaay back..."

I quite like gnomes. At least, I don't dislike them. However I do prefer kobolds.

[Hyudra]

Gnomes don't really have a distinct racial identity. They're a middle ground between two or three PHB races, and there's not really any existing material to draw from in terms of figuring out how to act (or to use as a starting point for your own character's personality).

They're just pretty bland.

[Choco]

Personally, my hatred of gnomes comes exclusively from WoW. Gnomes and Night Elves in that game have a HUGELY disproportionate amount of @$$hole players among their ranks. So even though WoW gnomes and D&D gnomes really don't have much to do with each other, I now hate them simply because they share the same name

[Cicciograna]

Personally, I'm fond of them. Their dual nature of magic-lovers and alchemists/scientists/engineers makes them versatile (fluffwise); mechanically, they have nice features, with those nifty spell-like abilities, plus they're Small and this is often good.

One of my favourite PCs was a Gnome Illusionist who pissed off all of his comrades with cruel pranks: once I rolled a natural 20 on the Alchemy check (3rd Edition) to craft a "Potion of diarrhea" and managed to pour it on the rations of the ranger of the group. He passed the following 3 days in the wild as "Nature made a particularly urgent call"!

[gallagher]

well, i always figured that people didnt like them because they are the only race in the PHB that didnt show up in the LOTR movies (i know many a people who only watched the movies cuz the books are "too outdated" in language)

[Dragosai]

Gnomes are the hobos of fantasy. OK joking aside I think "most" gamers dislike gnomes because they are always played the same way. Now I know what I just wrote will spew forth several dozen posts about wait I played my gnome like this or like this, I don't care. 99% of the time any given gnome in an RPG is role played in one of the same half dozen ways, it's just been done to death. It's like the character who becomes a hero do to his/her/its beloved peasant village being destroyed, let it go, move on, find another shtick.

[Salbazier]

BTW, anybody knows why they made gnome race anyway? All other race are classics.

[Pronounceable]

Dunno. I hate them because they're gnomes. Being a DnDish gnome, or even having the name gnome (like the guys with pointy red hats) is grounds enough to be loathed, despised, hated, ridiculed and exterminated far as I care.

I stand by my right to hate and refuse to stoop to meaningless rationalizations,

a Gnome Illusionist who pissed off all of his comrades with cruel pranks: once I rolled a natural 20 on the Alchemy check (3rd Edition) to craft a "Potion of diarrhea" and managed to pour it on the rations of the ranger of the group. He passed the following 3 days in the wild as "Nature made a particularly urgent call"!

I think "most" gamers dislike gnomes because they are always played the same way.

...even when they could be considered valid.

[Ravens_cry]

Personally, I like the Pathfinder gnome fluff a lot, what with their connection to all things fae.
I also want to play a gnome in greasepaint, three fingered white gloves and wielding a large wooden mallet.
Th-Th-Th-Th-Th-... That's all, folks!

[Chaelos]

This.

This is why I hate gnomes.

[JeenLeen]

A friend of mine printed out what looked like a common saying "Friends don't let friends play gnomes." I don't know where it got it and I haven't heard it elsewhere, so I assume it never became a popular meme, but I've also heard of this dislike of gnomes.

I don't get it. -2 Str, +2 Con is a good deal, and some SLAs are nice even if they're not often useful. Sure, dwarves have +2 to saves against magic, but gnomes still seem a decent spellcasting race.

[Teron]

Gnomes don't really have a distinct racial identity. They're a middle ground between two or three PHB races, and there's not really any existing material to draw from in terms of figuring out how to act (or to use as a starting point for your own character's personality).

They're just pretty bland.

And when they do have a distinct identity, it's usually a goofy, one-note prankster or mad scientist one, which tends to get grating.

As usual when this topic comes up, though, I'll say that Eberron gnomes are pretty cool.

[Ravens_cry]

The reason the gnome haters I know said they hate gnomes is basically because they aren't in one of the primary D&D source books, Lord of the Rings. It had half orcs in the form of Uruk-Hai, or possibly others, halflings are basically hobbits, or at least the sneaky, stealthy parts, elves and dwarves are obvious.
But no gnomes.

[Salbazier]

And when they do have a distinct identity, it's usually a goofy, one-note prankster or mad scientist one, which tends to get grating.

As usual when this topic comes up, though, I'll say that Eberron gnomes are pretty cool.

Everything in Eberron is made of cool and win (yes, this is hyperbole)

[Bayar]

Go read about Kurtulmak's ascension in the Races of the Dragon. Garl Glittergold and his no good trope of lazy ass bastards who think that "I just made a joke by commiting genocide over your whole race LOL" is ok and good.

Kobolds are considered evil but Gnomes are ok ?!? WHAT THE **** IS THAT PILE OF FETID HERESY ?!?



Eberron gnomes and whisper gnomes are ok though.

[Bharg]

The thing is gnomes are somewhere between halflings and dwarfs.
Of course halflings and dwarfs are hated, too, but gnomes...
They're just too big to be considered cute (halflings) anymore and not strong enough to defend themselves (dwarfs).

[Lord Vampyre]

Alright, yes I have a strong dislike for gnomes. It all stems from 2nd edition, when they were mostly illusionists. Every time I played an elf, the DM would have some irritating gnome play pranks on my uptight and self-righteous character.

I generally plotted on ways to wipe gnomes from existence. It safe to say that I never got the chance. And even though my animosity towards the little buggers has lessened, I still reserve some contempt for the little ones.

With that said, I have seen some really great gnome characters played. I just can't seem to wrap my brain around actually playing one.

[LibraryOgre]

The reason the gnome haters I know said they hate gnomes is basically because they aren't in one of the primary D&D source books, Lord of the Rings. It had half orcs in the form of Uruk-Hai, or possibly others, halflings are basically hobbits, or at least the sneaky, stealthy parts, elves and dwarves are obvious.
But no gnomes.

Read "Three Hearts and Three Lions" by Poul Anderson. Hugi is called a dwarf, but he's much closer to the conception of a gnome.

Early on, the gnomes did suffer somewhat from a lack of identity, but I think they'd found a pretty good one by the end of 2e (especially as Dragonlance faded from prominence as a game world). They were pranksters, yes, but also nature-loving, curious, and social, with the added dimension of not having goddesses and not being quite sure why (in fact, it was something their deities refused to talk about). 3e shoved them harder towards the fey, somewhat blurred the lines between forest and rock gnomes, and diluted a lot of what made them interesting the first place.

[chiasaur11]

Go read about Kurtulmak's ascension in the Races of the Dragon. Garl Glittergold and his no good trope of lazy ass bastards who think that "I just made a joke by commiting genocide over your whole race LOL" is ok and good.

Kobolds are considered evil but Gnomes are ok ?!? WHAT THE **** IS THAT PILE OF FETID HERESY ?!?

Agreed.

Kobolds are totally justified in pursuit of that particular genocide.

Also, they mindwipe criminals, if I remember right, which is messed up.

[Lord Vukodlak]

Go read about Kurtulmak's ascension in the Races of the Dragon. Garl Glittergold and his no good trope of lazy ass bastards who think that "I just made a joke by commiting genocide over your whole race LOL" is ok and good.

Kobolds are considered evil but Gnomes are ok ?!? WHAT THE **** IS THAT PILE OF FETID HERESY ?!?

By your logic Drow should be good and surface Elves evil because Loith's story of her fall differs from the one Corellon tells. Why do you believe the Kobold's version of the tale? If someone burned down an orphanage and told you "Those orphans attacked me" would you believe him? No you wouldn't so why trust the tale told from the point of view from the Kobolds?

There are a few other versions of that tale, in one Kurtulmak intended to play a great joke. He invited all other racial deities for a great feast where he would tell them a tale, at the end he would pull out a ornate stone trigger and bury the assembled deities alive.

Garl came upon the cavern and pulled out the stone burying the kobold in his own trap. Either to see if it actually work or simply to laugh in Kurtulmak's face.

So which tale is more likely the one told my gnomes or the one told my kobolds. Based only on the races typical reputation and alignment.

Another version of the tale has Garl collapsing the cave while Kurtulmak was hosting Asemodeus. The archdevil was not pleased.

Really why believe the legend told by an evil race?

[Shademan]

gnomes are always somewhat of a joke in my campaigns. yets I couldn't imagine NOT having them around.