Iron Chef Optimization Challenge IX

Private-Prinny · 08-02-2010, 11:00 AM

Basically, a challenge to create an optimized, flavorful character, using a "Secret Ingredient" of a particular PrC, different for each contest. You will need to present your build at at least one of the following points: 5th level, 10th level, 15th, 20th, and a "sweet spot" that you feel is the high point of the build. Feel free to present as many of these as you like, and please give a rundown of the build's abilities and playability at all of the levels you didn't show. The rules are as follows:

Menu: For most challenges, the "special ingredient" will be drawn from Core plus Completes. There will, from time to time, be special challenges that showcase secret ingredients from other books--for example, the XPH.

Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden because I hate 'em.

Cooking Time: Contestants will have until Monday, August 9th to create their builds and PM them to the Chairman, Private-Prinny. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying.

Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of Secret Ingredient.

Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.

Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is an automatic point lost in this category. Other things that will cause lost points here are excessive multiclassing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, will lose you points.

I am going to have to ask the contestants to PM me about any disagreement with the judges. Under no circumstances is a contestant to defend themselves inside the thread, lest the thread come close to being locked again.

Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when anonymising the entries!

Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry.

Spoiler

NAME OF ENTRY

Level	Class	Base Attack Bonus	Fort Save	Ref Save	Will Save	Skills	Feats	Class Features
1st	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
2nd	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
3rd	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
4th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
5th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
6th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
7th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
8th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
9th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
10th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
11th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
12th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
13th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
14th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
15th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
16th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
17th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
18th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
19th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities
20th	New Class Level	+x	+x	+x	+x	Skills	New Feats	New Class Abilities

Code

Spoiler

For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)

Spoiler

For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.

Speculation: Please don't post or speculate on possible builds until the "reveal," in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.

Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners.

So! Who wants to sign up as a contestant, and who wants to sign up as a judge? Looking for about 5 judges and as many contestants as feel like playing!

This week's Secret Ingredient is...

Complete Adventurer's Animal Lord!

Allez optimiser!

Judges
9mm
Keld Denar
Ozymandias9
true_shinken

Contestants
Adumbration
Amphetryon
BooNL
Chineselegolas
Cieyrin
dextercorvia
Draz74
Eladriel
IdleMuse
Natael
OMG PONIES
The Vorpal Tribble

Past Competitions

Iron Chef I (Entropomancer)
Iron Chef II (Psibond Agent)
Iron Chef III (Cancer Mage)
Iron Chef IV (Stonelord)
Iron Chef V (War Chanter)
Iron Chef VI (Master of Masks)
Iron Chef VII (Green Star Adept)
Iron Chef VIII (Pyrokineticist)

dextercorvia · 08-02-2010, 11:10 AM

I'll try again. This secret ingredient sure has a lot of options.

Keld Denar · 08-02-2010, 11:42 AM

I'll judge again if you found my previous judging acceptable. Here's my criteria:
My Criteria
Originality: Does the submission use unexpected sources or material? Does it avoid over-used qualification methods? Does it use the secret ingredient in an unusual or clever way? This section is an amalgam of the build itself and how the build is presented.

Power: What tier is this build? Does the inclusion of <Secret Ingredient> actually make this build more powerful? Is the build well-optimized? Are there any noticable saggy spots where the build underperforms? Is the build versatile (able to respond to a variety of challenges, both combat and non-combat), on top of any specialized tricks it may contain. Does the build use large amounts of LA and/or RHD that could lead to a slow start? Be as detailed as possible. If there is something your build does that is powerful, yet not completely obvious, you should probably expand upon it.

Elegance: Does your build progress well? Does it avoid flaws and variant rules (not including published Alt Class Features like Racial Subs)? Do you avoid overly dipping classes like cleric 1 that are obviously for bonus feats/class abilities? Does your build subscribe to various power break points if it doesn't complete a PrC? Do you avoid using Taint and Dark Chaos shuffling? Other judges might, but I have no problem with a player drawing from a multitude of sources. As far as I'm concerned, if material in a source book improves your submission, use it, excluding certain material from books like Savage Species, Ghostwalk, Serpent Kingdoms, and the like, but that's mostly because of the material, not the source that it comes from. This section is the one most affected by your back story and build presentation, but the submission itself is still very important here. PLEASE CITE ALL SOURCES USED!

Use of Secret Ingredient: How important is the secret ingredient in this build? Would you refer to the build as being A <Secret Ingredient>, or are you just splashing the PrC in there? Does the flavor of the build fit that of the PrC? Do you use the PrC in a clever, synergistic or powerful way? Do the special abilities of the secret ingredient augement or are augemented by other abilities in the build? If you didn't use all levels of the secret ingredient (and you don't always have to), do you have good reasoning why not, and did you exit at an acceptable power break point? This section is an amalgam of the build itself and how the build is presented.

IdleMuse · 08-02-2010, 12:06 PM

Definitely up for this, will be competing again, and well done to Private-Prinny for again picking a cool, flavourful class that's nonetheless off the beaten track.

I'm reading through it now, I just winced at the awful version of semi-Pounce catlords get.

Amphetryon · 08-02-2010, 12:07 PM

Once more (at least) as a contestant, for me.

The Vorpal Tribble · 08-02-2010, 12:21 PM

Put me in as a possible judge.

I have an awesome concept, which despite all that, is not especially optimized. If I can't figure out how to optimize it I'll judge.

BooNL · 08-02-2010, 01:11 PM

I have been away for a while and I haven't played DnD in months.

Put me down as a contender, but I can't promise I'll submit an entry. I'll try my best though.

Animal Lord, interesting...

Edit: I've decided to take something terrible and try to optimize the hell out of it. Be wary!

Ozymandias9 · 08-02-2010, 02:02 PM

I'm in to judge this one.

My Judging Criteria:

All scores start at a base of 3.
Points are awarded or deducted in increments of .5
Minimum and maximum scores are 1 and 5 respectively, per contest rules.
For each category, the best preforming submission will be given an additional .5 points (assuming it's not already at 5).

While I do have a specific set of expected builds and power levels for this competition, I will not be revealing them in advance: I don't want to discourage certain builds simply because they might take a small hit in Originality or Power (especially since some of my favorite builds in this contest have had a category or two where they were somewhat lacking).

Category Criteria
These represent a base list his I will consider for all contestants-- ad hoc points may also be awarded as deemed necessary):

Originality:

Spoiler

Power:

Spoiler

Elegance:

Spoiler

The stated contest rule regarding flaws is in effect: a build that uses them will lose 1 point.
A build that uses elements poorly thematically suited to the build as a whole will lose at least 0.5 points (cf. the contest's notes on elegance, specifically the cloistered cleric example). This is not limited to classes-- for example, feats with strong thematic elements may also qualify.
A build that uses elements exceptionally well thematically suited to the special ingredient will gain at least 0.5 points
Submissions that rely on elements that a conservative DM is likely to find questionable will lose 0.5 points (early entry cheese, for example). Submissions that rely on elements that a conservative DM is likely to outright ban will lose an additional 0.5 points (wish abuse, genesis, etc.).
A build where there seems to be some reason behind the order in which classes are taken will gain 0.5 points. One where there seems to be a lack thereof will lose 0.5 points. This need not mean strictly patterned or piecewise, but if I can't find a reason why you're breaking the Special ingredient progression for 2 levels of something you don't touch again till 20, and you don't present one, you'll be docked here.
A submission could be reasonably role-played as non-disruptive character will gain 0.5 points. A submission that could be reasonably role-played for a particularly wide range of characters will net an additional 0.5 points.
A submission that I would expect only to be non-disruptive in a game with very light role-playing emphasis or for a particularly narrow set of characters will lose 0.5 points (builds that could only reasonably work as antagonists qualify here). A submission that I would expect to be disruptive in most play will lose an additional 0.5 points.
A submission that has notable rules errors will lose 0.5 points. A submission that is made significantly less functional because of such an error will lose an additional 0.5 points.
A submission that would be expected to significantly enrich a persistent game world/game table will be awarded between 0.5 and 1 points (examples from past contests which would qualify: Akal Saris's "Noxius, the Immortal Plague" and "Old Lob," Draz74's "Jereth")
A note on story submission: A character story is not strictly necessary for me. However, should a small story (or character notes) be submitted, I will look at them as a possible proof of concept for the points above related to role-playing and playability. It should be noted that a story that is exceptionally detailed may, if anything, detract from this point-- an extreme level of detail could (but does not always) indicate that the build may only fit a narrow range of characters similar to the one presented in the story. The quality of writing, while appreciated, will not affect score.

Use of Special Ingredient:

Spoiler

Arbitrarity · 08-02-2010, 03:56 PM

I'll set something up again. I stress waaay too much over these.

Yaaaay, table!

Have I ever mentioned how much I loathe multiclassing penalties?

aethernox · 08-02-2010, 04:23 PM

I believe that I would finally like to compete in this challenge.

Also, excellent call on the table.

true_shinken · 08-02-2010, 05:42 PM

I'm willing to judge this time, if at all possible.

9mm · 08-02-2010, 06:04 PM

I think I'll have time to judge again.

My Criteria
Originality: Does the submission use unexpected sources or material? Does it avoid over-used qualification methods? Does it use the secret ingredient in an unusual or clever way? This section is an amalgam of the build itself and how the build is presented.

Power: how well do I feel the build does what you say it can do? how does these abilities interact inside an actual game? I DO NOT look at the tier structure for base lines; but I do apply it's principles; so the lower you'd rank on the ToS tier system (where -2 is pun-pun), the higher your skill here will be.

Elegance: Does it avoid variant rules (not including published Alt Class Features like Racial Subs)? Do you avoid overly dipping classes like cleric 1 that are obviously for bonus feats/class abilities? Does your build subscribe to various power break points if it doesn't complete a PrC? Do you avoid using Taint and Dark Chaos shuffling? Other judges might, but I have no problem with a player drawing from a multitude or even ALL sources. As far as I'm concerned, if material in a source book improves your submission, use it, excluding certain material from books like Savage Species, Ghostwalk, Serpent Kingdoms, and the like, but that's mostly because of the material, not the source that it comes from. This section is the one most effected by your back story and build presentation, but the submission itself is still very important here. PLEASE CITE ALL SOURCES USED!

Use of Secret Ingredient: How important is the secret ingredient in this build? Would you refer to the build as being A <Secret Ingredient>, or are you just splashing the PrC in there? Does the flavor of the build fit that of the PrC? Do you use the PrC in a clever, synergistic or powerful way? Do the special abilities of the secret ingredient augement or are augemented by other abilities in the build? If you didn't use all levels of the secret ingredient (and you don't always have to), do you good reasoning why not, and did you exit at an acceptable power break point? This section is an amalgam of the build itself and how the build is presented.[/quote]

Also note the following: I expect participants to explain IN DETAIL everything you feel your build can do, and failure to do so will result in a lot of 0-2s in all scores.

true_shinken · 08-02-2010, 08:02 PM

This is my judging criteria:

Originality: Anything that surprises me will give you a high score here. However, I tend to be surprised by things that don't surprise other people and things that surprise other people tend to not surprise me. So... yeah. This is where my judgement comes "from the heart". Even if I'm surprised in a bad way, you might get points here.
Power: Is your build good in most fights? This is the core of the power category for me. If you are too specialized, you'll lose points. If you are good outside combat, expect a bonus here as well. If you're just good outside combat, expect something like a 1 or 1.5.
Elegance: If I look at just your class statblock, does it make sense from a fluff point of view? I care for fluff in prestige classes. If you use stuff from 'variation' sidebars, stuff from different settings or if you refluff something... expect a hit here. I like clean, simple builds. If your build is clean and simple, expect more points here.
Use of Secret Ingredient: Does the PrC fit the concept? Is it integral to the build's mechanics? Would another class in the build work better if leveled more than the secret ingredient? Basically, if your build screams "SECRET INGREDIENT" expect a 5 here. If it does not... well...

Ozymandias9 · 08-02-2010, 11:19 PM

I've updated my prior post with mu judging criteria.

Private-Prinny · 08-02-2010, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozymandias9

I've updated my prior post with mu judging criteria.

Thank you for using precedents from past competitions as a reference point. BTW, the character-turned-vestige was Noxius, the Immortal Plague, Akal Saris's entry in Iron Chef III (Cancer Mage).

Ozymandias9 · 08-02-2010, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Private-Prinny

Thank you for using precedents from past competitions as a reference point. BTW, the character-turned-vestige was Noxius, the Immortal Plague, Akal Saris's entry in Iron Chef III (Cancer Mage).

Lol. So I'm citing him twice for that point? I was afraid of that. I also added an example from the MoM competition to that element.

Edit: As a note, I made a couple slight changes since I first posted the criteria. Any changes to the linked post after August 3rd, 5:09am GMT, however, should be cosmetic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by true_shinken

Elegance: If you use stuff from 'variation' sidebars, stuff from different settings or if you refluff something... expect a hit here. I like clean, simple builds. If your build is clean and simple, expect more points here.

Obviously, since I'm judging and not competing in this one, it's not going to directly effect me for this contest: but out of curiosity, is you preference here merely against sidebars (like the unarmed Swordsage adaptation) or does it include the in text adaptation sections (such as, say, making moving shadow magic mysteries to a smoke theme)?

Chineselegolas · 08-03-2010, 06:16 AM

I'm competing again. Never even looked at Animal Lord before, always seemed too confusing.

Amphetryon · 08-03-2010, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arbitrarity

Yaaaay, table!

Have I ever mentioned how much I loathe multiclassing penalties?

Quoted for truth!

aethernox · 08-03-2010, 06:34 AM

Honestly, there are just too many viable options.

It's both fantastic and utterly infuriating.

BooNL · 08-03-2010, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aethernox

Honestly, there are just too many viable options.

It's both fantastic and utterly infuriating.

Yeah, but there's a couple that just jump out, real no-brainer picks.

I'm trying to come up with creative ways to enter the class and while you can get in via a lot of means, most of the better ones are pretty obvious

The Vorpal Tribble · 08-03-2010, 08:18 AM

Ok, got it, officially entering.

Natael · 08-03-2010, 08:47 AM

I'll try to try it again. Got bit lost with some of the abiguity of the pyro's powers, but looking at this, seems straight forward, and interesting. Neat concept at least.

Arbitrarity · 08-03-2010, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BooNL

Yeah, but there's a couple that just jump out, real no-brainer picks.

I'm trying to come up with creative ways to enter the class and while you can get in via a lot of means, most of the better ones are pretty obvious

Indeed. I'm wondering if I should skip the obvious synergy that I can see, and take something else.
Sure, it fits nicely, and evenly, but it's a bit too obvious, and I expect to see at least 2 entries with the same entry.

On the other hand, I don't really think about how to enter a class. I think "What does this class facilitate" "What unique abilities does it have" "How can I get the best use out of those features" "How can I make use of every available feature"

Amphetryon · 08-03-2010, 09:39 AM

The real trick, to me, is finding 'what does this class do that no other PrC can do as well or better.'

The Vorpal Tribble · 08-03-2010, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amphetryon

The real trick, to me, is finding 'what does this class do that no other PrC can do as well or better.'

In the case of this one not sure there really is. My main goal is 'how to make it seem cooler and better than it actually is'

Keld Denar · 08-03-2010, 10:26 AM

Anyone else hoping for an anthropomorphic were-bear bear totem bearbarian bearlord build? Seriously, after reading through bearlord, the only thoughts in my head were "MOAR BEARS THAN YOUR BUILD HAS ROOM FOR! SNAKE EYES!!!!!!!!!!"

Draz74 · 08-03-2010, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amphetryon

The real trick, to me, is finding 'what does this class do that no ordinary Druid can do as well or better.'

Fixed that for you.

Arbitrarity · 08-03-2010, 10:48 AM

That's an interesting way of thinking about it, and very true. Hmmm.

Adumbration · 08-03-2010, 11:34 AM

Well, it does have full base attack bonus progression. But I think that's about it, really.

Joining as a contestant, although I doubt I'll be able to come up with a particularly high-power character.

Arbitrarity · 08-03-2010, 11:35 AM

Eh. I'll take the thematic obvious build. It will be stylish and have synergy