I think what we're dealing with here is Zeno's portal. It took him only a few pages to get halfway there; then a few more to get three-quarters of the way there. By 2014 Parson will be only a few fractions of an inch away, yet he still won't be able to pass through.
Don't you feel the growing tension?
Don't you see the ensuing drama?
Don't you seat on the edge of your chair?
Don't you catch the meaning... of... all... zzzzzzzzzzzsnortzzzzzzzz....
__________________
Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes. (W.Withman)
Things that increase my self esteem:
Spoiler
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiyanwang
Great analysis KA. I second all things you said
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeYounger
Great analysis KA, I second everything you said here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryu_Bonkosi
If I have a player using Paladin in the future I will direct them to this. Good job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grimbold
THIS is proof that KA is amazing
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairO'Dice Lost
Killer Angel, you have an excellent taste in books
Avatar removed, work in progress...
Last edited by Killer Angel : 10-11-2012 at 02:51 AM.
Reason: to add the quote
A) I fail to see how this should have been obvious. Maybe if she'd used "they're too cheap" rather than "you're too expensive" then maybe I could understand that. Now, however, it's a blunder borne of overconfidence that almost made me see why people hated her so much (so I heard) in Book 1.
B) Granted, but if she insults them like that, it just got upgraded from a reasonably certain probability (especially since she's one captive with one stolen dwagon, might not be considered important to an archon) to a certainty (a runaway insulted Charlescomm! How dare she! Charlie will hear about this!).
A) Firstly, I presented an alternate view of the situation, it doesn't need to be obvious to be possible >.> In answer, Because Jillian was making note of the high probability that Haffaton was too poor to afford the Archons. This means either that the Archons charge too much, or that Haffaton is very poor. Jillian was probably making note of the latter, since it is reinforced by what she's seen of Haffaton and the former is less important to the war.
B) The Archons worship Charlie unconditionally, and she was important enough to try to negotiate a buying price from Haffaton. He knows.
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The Unknown Word: 30AP (3/29), Onore: 2 Acts (5/16)
A) Firstly, I presented an alternate view of the situation, it doesn't need to be obvious to be possible >.> In answer, Because Jillian was making note of the high probability that Haffaton was too poor to afford the Archons. This means either that the Archons charge too much, or that Haffaton is very poor. Jillian was probably making note of the latter, since it is reinforced by what she's seen of Haffaton and the former is less important to the war.
B) The Archons worship Charlie unconditionally, and she was important enough to try to negotiate a buying price from Haffaton. He knows.
A) Noted. But Jillian specifically notes both, in a highly derogatory and flippant way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jillian
“They’re too poor! And you guys charge way too much.”
B) I guess. I think my point is mostly that if Jillian had played it a little more diplomatically, she could have avoided pissing them off.
__________________ The Minds of Almantha: My world (in progress). PEACH if you've got the time!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zap Dynamic
I want to create a world that is full of possibility, and one of the best ways to handle it is by creating a bunch of stories that haven't yet been finished.
In my posts, smilies generally correspond to my expression at the time. As an example, means "huh?" and "Hmm..". Also, "Landis" is fine.
B) I guess. I think my point is mostly that if Jillian had played it a little more diplomatically, she could have avoided pissing them off.
Jillian is not diplomatic in any way, shape or form. Never has been (remember her "Here's fine. Now's good." in response to Ansom's offer for them to eat in his tent way back at the beginning of Book 1?), probably never will be--so quite why you're expecting her to show any signs of diplomacy here is beyond me.
Jillian is not diplomatic in any way, shape or form. Never has been (remember her "Here's fine. Now's good." in response to Ansom's offer for them to eat in his tent way back at the beginning of Book 1?), probably never will be--so quite why you're expecting her to show any signs of diplomacy here is beyond me.
'cause she's a fugitive in an enemy territory, and diplomacy is different from cautiousness. In this case, she adopted the latter.
I know it's not the same thing, but Jillian knows how to keep a low profile.
__________________
Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes. (W.Withman)
Things that increase my self esteem:
Spoiler
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiyanwang
Great analysis KA. I second all things you said
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeYounger
Great analysis KA, I second everything you said here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryu_Bonkosi
If I have a player using Paladin in the future I will direct them to this. Good job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grimbold
THIS is proof that KA is amazing
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairO'Dice Lost
Killer Angel, you have an excellent taste in books
It's Castle Heterodyne all over again. That damn story arc took forever as well. For different reasons, but the result is the same.
yeah, Rob does some great work, but his pacing can be painful. It's the downside of having a story with a lot of subtlety and competing factions. I"m sure it will read much better when it is all compiled and we can read it quickly, but right now we're stuck with a weekly update schedule.
Hmm. Cloth Golems. What if they run into those Red Dwagons first? Can we say "Burn Baby Burn"?
Spoiler
Cloth and stuffing don't burn any better then skin and fat. Arguably in fact a cloth golem being animated solely by magic is less vulnerable to fire since they don't need to worry about blood or fluid loss.
What I find interesting is Ace's remark about pulling "the non-dittoed items" from the corpse. Obviously he's going to want to remove any original items that were not/couuld not be duplicated, but if we take that to mean that he left the "dittoed" items behind, does that mean he ignored items for which duplicates were created, or that he ignored items that are [magically created] duplicates.
If the former, why? The copies that Duplicately now has should vanish along with him at the end of the turn, and thus be lost to the side. If the latter, how did the original Slately end up with them, rather then the copies?
__________________ ChowGuy - The LaChoy Dragon - Servant of the Tiger and disciple of the Wanderer The Hall of Wonders - HeavenGames Fantasy Role Playing and Creative Writing Forum.
Cloth and stuffing don't burn any better then skin and fat. Arguably in fact a cloth golem being animated solely by magic is less vulnerable to fire since they don't need to worry about blood or fluid loss.
Spoiler
Burn? As in actual damage per second? Yeah, probably, but chance to ignite goes to cloth. Flesh doesn't catch fire easily that I know of (otherwise hamburgers would be a horrible fire hazard), but cloth goes up like kindling. If the reds have a breath like napalm, supplying a continually burning substance to the target, they'd balance out, but for raw fire the golems would be burning a lot longer than flesh units.
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Ah, yes. "Art", an abstract term capable of turning products corrupted by laziness and arrogance into masterpieces that are not merely immutable, but inherently justified.
So by your thinking next time I reach into a hot oven I should use my bare hand, because my cloth oven mitt is more likely to burst into flames? Yeah... right...
In point of fact, said oven mitt has over the years developed a number of scorched patches but remains perfectly serviceable. Had my hand developed a similar number of second and third degree burns I'd be in a world of hurt, in more ways then one.
__________________ ChowGuy - The LaChoy Dragon - Servant of the Tiger and disciple of the Wanderer The Hall of Wonders - HeavenGames Fantasy Role Playing and Creative Writing Forum.
So by your thinking next time I reach into a hot oven I should use my bare hand, because my cloth oven mitt is more likely to burst into flames? Yeah... right...
In point of fact, said oven mitt has over the years developed a number of scorched patches but remains perfectly serviceable. Had my hand developed a similar number of second and third degree burns I'd be in a world of hurt, in more ways then one.
Ah. I see the disconnect here. You're saying cloth can be made to be fire resistant while I'm saying it isn't consistently so. Yes, it is true that with the right fabrics and processes it is possible to make something that doesn't catch fire. That is a specific case rather than a general rule, however.
Also, there is also a difference between insulating a hand from ambient heat and not catching fire when exposed to an open flame. I'll grant that I doubt an oven mitt would fire, of course. An awful lot of effort is put into reducing the flammability of fabrics as much as possible these days.
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Ah, yes. "Art", an abstract term capable of turning products corrupted by laziness and arrogance into masterpieces that are not merely immutable, but inherently justified.
Ah. I see the disconnect here. You're saying cloth can be made to be fire resistant while I'm saying it isn't consistently so. Yes, it is true that with the right fabrics and processes it is possible to make something that doesn't catch fire. That is a specific case rather than a general rule, however.
No, the disconnect is you're saying that "fire damage" to a unit requires actual combustion/incineration of that unit. What I'm saying is that a flash burn from a open flame (like say Dragon Fire) is likely to be cause more debilitating damage to a flesh unit then to a cloth one that may see no more then minor discoloration of the surface. Fire damage that causes actual charring of a cloth unit (but still leave it largely intact and functional) will likely cause fourth degree burns (penetrating muscle) and immediate incapacitation/croaking of a flesh unit.
__________________ ChowGuy - The LaChoy Dragon - Servant of the Tiger and disciple of the Wanderer The Hall of Wonders - HeavenGames Fantasy Role Playing and Creative Writing Forum.
No, the disconnect is you're saying that "fire damage" to a unit requires actual combustion/incineration of that unit. What I'm saying is that a flash burn from a open flame (like say Dragon Fire) is likely to be cause more debilitating damage to a flesh unit then to a cloth one that may see no more then minor discoloration of the surface. Fire damage that causes actual charring of a cloth unit (but still leave it largely intact and functional) will likely cause fourth degree burns (penetrating muscle) and immediate incapacitation/croaking of a flesh unit.
Not really. I'm saying there's two elements. Straight up trauma from direct contact with flame, and continuous damage via ignition. From my first post I've agreed with your assertion on the direct contact portion, but suggested that you had neglected the ignition element and that could potentially more than make up for any difference in the prior category.
Put another way:
Flesh unit: Heavier damage from initial fire, does not catch fire.
Cloth unit: Moderate damage from initial fire, may catch fire.
Overall effect: Cloth unit is more vulnerable, depending on the flammability of the cloth and the duration and damage over time attributed to ignition.
Addendum: Rendered moot in case of fire attacks such as napalm, where target is exposed to constantly burning material regardless of actual ignition.
__________________
Ah, yes. "Art", an abstract term capable of turning products corrupted by laziness and arrogance into masterpieces that are not merely immutable, but inherently justified.
You're ignoring the fact that the point of combat is not in general to reduce an enemy to ashes, but merely to croak or incapacitate that enemy before he can do the same to you. In that sense, your "initial damage" is far more important then your "time duration" damage. If, as you appear to concede, the cloth units have a better chance of surviving the initial blast, they have a better chance of winning the battle, which makes them the correct unit of choice to lead the attack.
Once the battle is won, any units not destroyed/croaked can regenerate at the start of the next turn. If the battle is lost, it doesn't matter how long it took to cook you.
(Note: it's not actually clear if golems do regenerate, but we know from book 1 they can be healed by magic so it's a fair assumption.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calemyr
Put another way:
Flesh unit: Heavier damage from initial fire, does not catch fire. May be incapacitated immediately.
Cloth unit: Moderate damage from initial fire, may catch fire and eventually be destroyed.
(italics mine)
ETA: er... heh... make that Boldface mine
Overall effect: Cloth has better chance of surviving by winning battle.
__________________ ChowGuy - The LaChoy Dragon - Servant of the Tiger and disciple of the Wanderer The Hall of Wonders - HeavenGames Fantasy Role Playing and Creative Writing Forum.
You guys are taking about two different things. Skin is not flammable but it does burn when exposed to high heat. Like wise cloth is flammable but less easily damaged by heat. Many oven mits are insulated, just like the cloth golem's "fluff". If these clothese golems where just a thin layer like a Kite you'd have a point but they have insulation.
yeah, Rob does some great work, but his pacing can be painful. It's the downside of having a story with a lot of subtlety and competing factions. I"m sure it will read much better when it is all compiled and we can read it quickly, but right now we're stuck with a weekly update schedule.
I think that it's because he writes with the published book in mind, rather than as a webcomic (as opposed to, say, OOTS, which tries to put either a gag or a major plot development in every page because they're designed to be read at a slow rate.) Erfworld is, I think, pretty clearly meant to be read as a completed story, which just happens to be getting released as a webcomic as it gets written. This plot arc would be tense and exciting buildup if we were reading it all at once.
(Castle Heterodyne is a good reference, because Girl Genius is the same way -- not surprising, given how it was originally a print comic.)
Last edited by Aquillion : 10-20-2012 at 01:14 PM.
Castle Heterodyne was inexcusable even without taking the intended medium into account. But that's another story. I do agree that the current issue likely stems from the comic being intended for print - in a complete book, this scene will be intense, with lots of overlapping plots and shifts... which sadly makes it tedious to read when we get one page a week.
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One good thing about the long update schedule; It gives us a chance to dissect everything about the current page. For example: The battle bears, cloth golems, etc. that Ace is stacking with. I count 1 tankeroo, 2 G-RAFs, 1 or 2 LFNs (one's hidden behind a battlebear, but you get the point), and 4 battlebears. 8 (or 9) units. A stack is 8 units. What's Ace going to displace?
__________________ The Minds of Almantha: My world (in progress). PEACH if you've got the time!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zap Dynamic
I want to create a world that is full of possibility, and one of the best ways to handle it is by creating a bunch of stories that haven't yet been finished.
In my posts, smilies generally correspond to my expression at the time. As an example, means "huh?" and "Hmm..". Also, "Landis" is fine.
One good thing about the long update schedule; It gives us a chance to dissect everything about the current page. For example: The battle bears, cloth golems, etc. that Ace is stacking with. I count 1 tankeroo, 2 G-RAFs, 1 or 2 LFNs (one's hidden behind a battlebear, but you get the point), and 4 battlebears. 8 (or 9) units. A stack is 8 units. What's Ace going to displace?
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Last edited by NEO|Phyte : 10-20-2012 at 05:36 PM.
__________________ The Minds of Almantha: My world (in progress). PEACH if you've got the time!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zap Dynamic
I want to create a world that is full of possibility, and one of the best ways to handle it is by creating a bunch of stories that haven't yet been finished.
In my posts, smilies generally correspond to my expression at the time. As an example, means "huh?" and "Hmm..". Also, "Landis" is fine.
I'm starting to wonder if Jillian never actually escaped and if this is all some sort of dream induced by the glass casket...seems a bit coincidental she'd happen to bump into Goodminton of all places!
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Re: Erfworld, The Thread.
means "huh?" and "Hmm..". Also, "Landis" is fine.
Bad to the Bone!
Miko Miyazaki : Strip #120 - #464 : R.I.P.
